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Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 03 2009,13:03) Hi KW,
So please show the common usage of God as LORD in the NT.[excluding OT quotes – altered by scribes]
We are told it is by the Spirit we can say JESUS IS LORD
Acts 8:24(KJV) reads:Quote Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the LORD for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.
Acts 5:19(KJV) reads:
Quote But the angel of the Lord by night opened the prison doors, and brought them forth, and said,
Acts 2:47(KJV) reads:
Quote Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.
Luke 2:37(KJV) reads:
Quote Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.
Luke 1:15(KJV) reads:
Quote For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.
If that is not enough to make the point then I am sure I can find more. It is my understanding that we are supposed to know whom is being spoken of by the context. Our problem is sometimes the whole context is not included in the written words.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 03 2009,13:56) Hi KW,
Thanks.My point is that the ones to whom the words were written knew Jesus as their Lord.
Jesus is the Lord over everything in heaven and on earth but God is his Lord as well as ours. I believe the Spirit is God's Spirit that we receive through obey all the teachings of Jesus the Anointed One.Hi KW,
The Spirit is God's Spirit but given through Christ.
In Christ that given Spirit can be known as the Spirit of Christ.
Even outside of Christ because the Spirit is one the Spirit can be called the Spirit of Christ
The testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy [Rev19]and the Spirit of Christ was in the prophets[1Peter1]
We share in the Spirit Christ was given, so that his body is complete and united in him in that Spirit just as he is in his Father.You know, God will do away with the wisdom of the world?
So why waste time, trying to create a logical understanding of Jesus' deity…(I'm sure this is treading on trinitarianism).
What do we know about Jesus?
He is above men, above angels, above creation, made and unmade….but not above God himself.
Even though he is above all things, he humbled himself and took the role of a serveant to die for the sins of man.
Because of that, he is heir to all things God owns and possesses.
That means, everything God can do, Jesus so too can do within creation.
So whether it means he's the “unique” son of God, or literally “Born” of God… one thing is clear.
He is worthy of worship.
He can forgive your sins
He is given all things by his and our Father.
We are to look to him if we want to reach The Father.———————————————-
What else do you want from him?
what would it matter if you were to die and God told you Jesus is his literal son or unique? Nothing…the outcome would be the same.Quote (RokkaMan @ Nov. 03 2009,11:13) You know, God will do away with the wisdom of the world? So why waste time, trying to create a logical understanding of Jesus' deity…(I'm sure this is treading on trinitarianism).
What do we know about Jesus?
He is above men, above angels, above creation, made and unmade….but not above God himself.
Even though he is above all things, he humbled himself and took the role of a serveant to die for the sins of man.
Because of that, he is heir to all things God owns and possesses.
That means, everything God can do, Jesus so too can do within creation.
So whether it means he's the “unique” son of God, or literally “Born” of God… one thing is clear.
He is worthy of worship.
He can forgive your sins
He is given all things by his and our Father.
We are to look to him if we want to reach The Father.———————————————-
What else do you want from him?
what would it matter if you were to die and God told you Jesus is his literal son or unique? Nothing…the outcome would be the same.
Rokkaman,
This is a very good post and I agree with you! It is so nice to be in agreement about this, I could just give you a holy hug right now.I especially like this point that you made:
Quote He is above men, above angels, above creation, made and unmade….but not above God himself. Thanks,
KathiHi WJ,
You said in another thread.“Do you deny the scriptures that say Jesus is the “Only Son of God”?”
Please show us one.
Hi,
Does anyone else apart from trinitarians agree that it is oK to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God?Jb 38, Gen 6,Ps 89, …
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:29) Hi,
Does anyone else apart from trinitarians agree that it is oK to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God?Jb 38, Gen 6,Ps 89, …
Hi Nick,
I agree that it is ok to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God.Thanks for asking,
KathiQuote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:25) Hi,
Does any bible translate MONOGENES, relating to Jesus, as ONLY?
Why would you WJ and TT?
Most translations render it “Only Begotten Son” of God.STRONG'S G3439 – MONOGENĒS
1) SINGLE OF ITS KIND, ONLY
A) USED OF ONLY SONS OR DAUGHTERS (VIEWED IN RELATION TO THEIR PARENTS)
B) USED OF CHRIST, DENOTES THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 15 2010,13:38) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:25) Hi,
Does any bible translate MONOGENES, relating to Jesus, as ONLY?
Why would you WJ and TT?
Most translations render it “Only Begotten Son” of God.STRONG'S G3439 – MONOGENĒS
1) SINGLE OF ITS KIND, ONLY
A) USED OF ONLY SONS OR DAUGHTERS (VIEWED IN RELATION TO THEIR PARENTS)
B) USED OF CHRIST, DENOTES THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
WJ
Hi Keith,
Since Monogenes is an adjective, only begotten is what most translations would render it. If translated with the word “son” then the noun meaning “son” is also in the verse.Kathi
Quote (Lightenup @ Jan. 15 2010,13:52) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 15 2010,13:38) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:25) Hi,
Does any bible translate MONOGENES, relating to Jesus, as ONLY?
Why would you WJ and TT?
Most translations render it “Only Begotten Son” of God.STRONG'S G3439 – MONOGENĒS
1) SINGLE OF ITS KIND, ONLY
A) USED OF ONLY SONS OR DAUGHTERS (VIEWED IN RELATION TO THEIR PARENTS)
B) USED OF CHRIST, DENOTES THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
WJ
Hi Keith,
Since Monogenes is an adjective, only begotten is what most translations would render it. If translated with the word “son” then the noun meaning “son” is also in the verse.Kathi
Hi KathiLong time no hear from! Hope you and yours are well and that you had wonderful Holidays!
Most translations do render it that way but not all.
So there is ambiguity over the word “Begotten”, but there is no ambiguity over the word “Mono” Only” which is also an adjective and is the first part of “Monogenes”
In Luke 7:12, 8:42, and 9:38 Monogenes is translated “Only Son” and “Only Daughter” and “Only Child”!
So to say Jesus is the “Only Son of God” is a true statement!
WJ
Quote (Lightenup @ Jan. 16 2010,05:34) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:29) Hi,
Does anyone else apart from trinitarians agree that it is oK to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God?Jb 38, Gen 6,Ps 89, …
Hi Nick,
I agree that it is ok to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God.Thanks for asking,
Kathi
Hi LU,
So by which scriptural authority do you claim this?Monogenes surely neither means ONLY SON nor ONLY SON TO BE BEGOTTEN.
Folks confuse it with GENNAO
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,17:21) Quote (Lightenup @ Jan. 16 2010,05:34) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,13:29) Hi,
Does anyone else apart from trinitarians agree that it is oK to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God?Jb 38, Gen 6,Ps 89, …
Hi Nick,
I agree that it is ok to say Jesus is the ONLY SON of God.Thanks for asking,
Kathi
Hi LU,
So by which scriptural authority do you claim this?Monogenes surely neither means ONLY SON nor ONLY SON TO BE BEGOTTEN.
Folks confuse it with GENNAO
Nick,
Well, put it this way, no other being is a son to God in the same way that Jesus is, therefore that makes Him an only son in the sense that Christ is. All other sons are created or adopted. No other so called “sons of God” are begotten. He is the only begotten son. He was the only son that was begotten and so one could say that He was the only son of God in the begotten sense. It depends on context.You are correct that monogenes doesn't mean “only son” or “only son to be begotten” but that wasn't the question you asked. Monogenes can mean “only begotten son” when the word for son is in the verse too and is the noun that the adjective monogenes belongs with.
Kathi
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,16:06) Hi WJ,
Is there one bible that translates MONOGENES as ONLY when applied to Jesus?
“For God so loved the world that he gave his “one and only” (Monogenes) Son,* that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 NIV“For God so loved the world that he gave his “only” (Monogenes) Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 NLT
“For God so loved the world,* that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 ESV
For God so loved the world that he gave his “only” (Monogenes) Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 RSV
For this is the way God loved the world: He gave his “one and only” (Monogenes) Son, so that everyone who believes in him will not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16 NET
How about another scripture?…
So the Word became human and lived here on earth among us. He was full of unfailing love and faithfulness.* And we have seen his glory, the glory of the “only” (Monogenes) Son of the Father. John 1:14 NLT
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the “One and Only” (Monogenes) who came from the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:14 NIV
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the “only” (Monogenes) Son from the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:14 ESV
There are more!
I am sure this must shake your theology to the core for you believe Jesus was just a mere man like you and I in every way!
WJ
Hi WJ,
If God has only one son then Adam is not a son though Luke says he is.
The Jews are not sons though Deut 14 says they are God's children.
The angels are not sons yet scripture can call them sons.You cannot be a son though scripture offers you that hope.
Look deeper.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 15 2010,18:12) Hi WJ,
If God has only one son then Adam is not a son though Luke says he is.
The Jews are not sons though Deut 14 says they are God's children.
The angels are not sons yet scripture can call them sons.You cannot be a son though scripture offers you that hope.
Look deeper.
NHGood you bring up Adam!
Because Jesus is “The Second Adam”, who is not after the flesh but after “The life giving Spirit” for he is the life and the light of men. He is the beginning (Origin)of a New Creation. John 1:4, 14:6 Rev 3:14
WJ
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