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This quote caught my eye.
[“It is natural to desire a clear-cut definition that would enable us to trace a sharp line of demarcation between magic and religion. Theoretically speaking, we are convinced that they cannot mean the same thing and we are loath to trace them to a common origin. We think of religion as the symbolic expression of our highest moral ideals; we think of magic as a crude aggregate of superstitions. Religious belief seems to become mere superstitious credulity if we admit any relationship with magic. — Ernst Cassirer ]
So for the sake of argument: I say: loaves and fishes, healing the sick, water to wine, it's all just magic.
The same can be said between magic and technology as per Clarke's Third Law,
“Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic”. Try explaining how a copier machine works to a child or even an adult with no engineering or science education, in the end the explanation sounds like magic.Hi Enoch's Author
By cancelling terms in your post above you make the following relationship:
religious belief = mere superstitious credulity
I for one would not be disagreeing with you!
Stuart
Looking back at the Magic man the seduced the earth, destroying Natural Life?
Isa 14:16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, [and] consider thee, [saying, Is] this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
[That] made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; [that] opened not the house of his prisoners?
All the kings of the nations, [even] all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.Magic…
1.The art that purports to control or forecast natural events, effects, or forces by invoking the supernatural.2.
a.The practice of using charms, spells, or rituals to attempt to produce supernatural effects or control events in nature.
b.The charms, spells, and rituals so used.3.The exercise of sleight of hand or conjuring for entertainment.
4.A mysterious quality of enchantment: “For me the names of those men breathed the magic of the past” (Max Beerbohm).
The gospel of John Invents the antichrist, which is able to call fire from heaven….REVLATIONS
Has HE REALLY GOT POWER TO COMMAND HEAVEN?
This IS insane… TO WRITE SUCH brain twists and turns, in codes? calling IT THE WORDs OF GOD how out write confusing the magic
yet unless we come to that all power is given to every life, Magic is wisdom… the power to control and invent the future.
and in the wrong hands it destroys also…GovermentsA mysterious quality of enchantment: “For me the names of those men breathed the magic of the past” (Max Beerbohm).What happened to the old religions?
I don't know. Television killed it. We have better miracles.(Max Headroom)
Quote (Stu @ June 17 2008,18:50) What happened to the old religions?
I don't know. Television killed it. We have better miracles.(Max Headroom)
Im Waiting for the GET Smart Movie to arive soon
Lets grab s pop corn and book an arm chair at the theater
hmmm Max abd 99 hit 2008charity
So….
Where are we?
I was secretly hoping the connection between magic and the miracles might drift the way of he Mormon religion. A religion of course started by a magician.Quote (charity @ June 17 2008,19:34) Quote (Stu @ June 17 2008,18:50) What happened to the old religions?
I don't know. Television killed it. We have better miracles.(Max Headroom)
Im Waiting for the GET Smart Movie to arive soon
Lets grab s pop corn and book an arm chair at the theater
hmmm Max abd 99 hit 2008charity
Hi Charity what is this new Avtar of your? Its funny.Visual Magic that is scientific
Imagin the feeling of seeing the first visual Image on in photo print. that would send the primitive into fear of all things possible?That’s why I Have My AVATOR…..gollamudi..Stuart has a Magic way of demanding a reallity. He increases my vision, and helped me out of some set thinking. and hes way to smart to have come from an ape!!!!
And we all need to evolve out of the accent dwelling NatureMagic first we have to Know or understand where Magic has overcome us?
Magic has to be something real…or least then it is still in its prophetically inventing stages…where Magic is designed upon Magic…the bible being the book of enoch revealed? or magicually swewed up.round three… And its open sesame on the revelations ideas for inventors?
causing it to rain or turn to desert? (Antichrists) are Christians, allowed in heaven, to shut it or open it up, just like Satan going all round…..BIBLE PROSE TO THE revealed Nature of evil in all men! and how we are capable of being a beast!
Will some one break that spell, One with power to understand?Hope that meets the requirements of the threard.. Enoch.
charity
Quote (Enochs author @ June 18 2008,00:02) So….
Where are we?
I was secretly hoping the connection between magic and the miracles might drift the way of he Mormon religion. A religion of course started by a magician.
Both magic and religious miracles make claims for things that have not actually happened.With magic you just know the illusion is not reality and you are challenged to work out how it was done or appreciate the skill of the illusionist. If magic was real, people would not attend magic shows!
Christianity demands that people believe at least two ridiculous things. There is no trying to work out how it happened, it is claimed to be literal magic that just must be accepted. There is no human endeavour or joy in that. This is magic that is taken seriously and believed to have actually happened. Why do people turn up to those shows?
Stuart
It is possible to be hypnotized,
Using TV,
The projection of visible Images INTO THE SUBCONSIOUS
Is it possible to be hypnotized with out knowing?
YES! You bet
If your claim is “No”. Then you are most probes, at the top of the casualty List.
Quote (Stu @ June 18 2008,20:10) Quote (Enochs author @ June 18 2008,00:02) So….
Where are we?
I was secretly hoping the connection between magic and the miracles might drift the way of he Mormon religion. A religion of course started by a magician.
Both magic and religious miracles make claims for things that have not actually happened.With magic you just know the illusion is not reality and you are challenged to work out how it was done or appreciate the skill of the illusionist. If magic was real, people would not attend magic shows!
Christianity demands that people believe at least two ridiculous things. There is no trying to work out how it happened, it is claimed to be literal magic that just must be accepted. There is no human endeavour or joy in that. This is magic that is taken seriously and believed to have actually happened. Why do people turn up to those shows?
Stuart
[/QUOTE]
You omitted the magic that is neither illusion nor miracle: The magic that is real that invokes the name of no god.Bet you don't believe in hat.
Quote (Enochs author @ July 08 2008,12:59) Quote (Stu @ June 18 2008,20:10) Quote (Enochs author @ June 18 2008,00:02) So….
Where are we?
I was secretly hoping the connection between magic and the miracles might drift the way of he Mormon religion. A religion of course started by a magician.
Both magic and religious miracles make claims for things that have not actually happened.With magic you just know the illusion is not reality and you are challenged to work out how it was done or appreciate the skill of the illusionist. If magic was real, people would not attend magic shows!
Christianity demands that people believe at least two ridiculous things. There is no trying to work out how it happened, it is claimed to be literal magic that just must be accepted. There is no human endeavour or joy in that. This is magic that is taken seriously and believed to have actually happened. Why do people turn up to those shows?
Stuart
[/QUOTE]
You omitted the magic that is neither illusion nor miracle: The magic that is real that invokes the name of no god.Bet you don't believe in hat.
I'd have to understand what on earth you mean first!Stuart
A singularity that spawned trillions of designs that not even NASA can mimic is the biggest magical miracle of all.
This singularity just appeared and exploded causing shock waves that lumped matter into clumps that became stars and other bodies. On at least one occasion one of these objects spawned trillions of life forms more complex than any robot or aircraft that NASA and the Airforce could come up. One of these life forms became so intelligent that they were able to make computers and create a synthetic universe called cyberspace. Even in this cyberspace the magical miracle of existence could not be reproduced in cyber form from a singularity/pixel.
Stu clearly believes in a type of magical miracle.
But there are many here that do not hold to such magic.
t8! Hello!
The big bang is well supported by evidence.
Stars exist. Stellar evolution is the theory that very succinctly explains their appearance.
Evolution is fact. Natural selection is the robust theory that explains that.
Not a shred of objective evidence contradicts either theory.
No magic is needed. Now tell me that you don't need magic for your conjectures.
You use an imaginary friend in the sky to explain complexity but you cannot say what created the complexity of the creator.
Stuart
A miracle is a sign from God to confirm a message. Magic is hocus pocus toil and trouble and satanic gunk.
Humanist, right?
I challenge you to read, yes, blind faith is not Christianity, blind faith is everything APPOSED to Christianity.
I challenge you to read the first eight chapters of the account of John. I then challenge you to read I don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist by Norman Guisler and Frank Turek.
If you decline I entitle that you are the one with the blind faith. Because Christianity is build on history, and firm foundations, and truth.
Quote (Theologian-and-Apologist @ July 14 2008,12:45) Humanist, right? I challenge you to read, yes, blind faith is not Christianity, blind faith is everything APPOSED to Christianity.
I challenge you to read the first eight chapters of the account of John. I then challenge you to read I don't Have Enough Faith to Be an Atheist by Norman Guisler and Frank Turek.
If you decline I entitle that you are the one with the blind faith. Because Christianity is build on history, and firm foundations, and truth.
How do you conclude Enoch's author is humanist?Stuart
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