Mikeboll64 vs francis

[942767]

Quote (Kangaroo Jack Jr. @ Jan. 28 2011,04:00)

Marty said; Quote No Jack, this is a diversion.  What does the word “baptize” mean? Read the post again sir and assimilate it. Keith said; Quote Marty Yoiu didn't answer the question? Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus? Keith, Marty won't answer me either. Mike's tactics are rubbing off. Jack

Hi Jack:

Are you interested in arriving at the truth so that we can teach the people God's Word in truth or are you trying to win, you say “the Trinitarians can't win if”, some contest so that you can take home some sort of prize or wear it on your sleve or chest.

I asked you a simple question, and so, I will ask it again: What is the meaning of the word “baptize”?

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 27 2011,13:11)

Hi WJ: God is the Father of Jesus by His Spirit, and he is also my Father by that same Spirit, and yours if you have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Love in Christ, Marty

Marty

Why are you evading answering the question? You have said the Holy Spirit is a “He” and inferred that the “He” is the Father. If so…

“Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“

“Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“

WJ

[Kangaroo Jack Jr.]

Marty said:

Quote

I asked you a simple question, and so, I will ask it again:  What is the meaning of the word “baptize”?

Marty,

I answered you sir! You're acting like Mike now.

Here it is again:

Quote

True baptism is that which “thoroughly changes the character, state, or condition of any object, is capable of baptizing that object; and by such change of character, state, or condition does, in fact, baptize it” (Classic Baptism, James Dale, pp. 352-354) This is not to be confused with the outward ritual which cannot change the character of an individual.

Either deal with it or be quiet!

Jack

[Kangaroo Jack Jr.]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 28 2011,05:18)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 27 2011,13:11) Hi WJ: God is the Father of Jesus by His Spirit, and he is also my Father by that same Spirit, and yours if you have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Love in Christ, Marty Marty Why are you evading answering the question? You have said the Holy Spirit is a “He” and inferred that the “He” is the Father. If so… “Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“ “Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“ WJ

Keith,

Marty is losing. He is evading both of us.

Jack

[francis]

I put a response into the wrong thread, so I took it out and put it in the other thread. Sorry.

[mikeboll64]

Yeah, but Keith's title isn't confusing at all is it?    Jack just did the same thing last night, but accidentally posted it in the debate instead of here.    

Yet Keith got all mad at me for having t8 move this one from the debate section to help stop the confusion!      

mike

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2011,18:47)

Yeah, but Keith's title isn't confusing at all is it?    Jack just did the same thing last night, but accidentally posted it in the debate instead of here.     Yet Keith got all mad at me for having t8 move this one from the debate section to help stop the confusion!       mike

Hey Mike

You are lying against me. I wasn't mad, try again.

WJ

[Kangaroo Jack Jr.]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 28 2011,10:47)

Yeah, but Keith's title isn't confusing at all is it?    Jack just did the same thing last night, but accidentally posted it in the debate instead of here.     Yet Keith got all mad at me for having t8 move this one from the debate section to help stop the confusion!       mike

Yeah Mike it was an accident. So why do you bring it up? With two threads having the same title it was bound to happen. I had always posted in “Member Profiles” so you should know it was an accident.

You've just got to make a federal case out of things don't you? Did your parents not give you attention when you were growing up?

Jack

[mikeboll64]

Hey Keith,

You SEEMED mad about it to me, judging from your posts.  So you can say I am “mistaken”, but don't say I'm “lying”.

Do you notice how Francis cried about what he ASSUMED was me saying he was dishonest?  And he did that after lecturing me many times about ASSUMING we can read other's minds.

Yet look at what he's been saying:

More likely what is happening is that I am UNTWISTING what you are saying… not twisting what you are saying.

To be honest, to me, your attitude is not an example of being intellectually honest…

…it goes to the very heart of whether or not you are going to be intellectually honest…

I thought I was debating a thinker who was intellectually honest…

…clearly indicates that you appear to be disingenious…  

…you are pretending ignorance…

 Wow!    It's a good thing my skin isn't as thin as his!  

Keith, in the words of your hero, Francis:

To make assumptions about someone you don't know anything about, is horrendous.

So don't assume I was lying just because I'm a horrendous person who assumed you were mad, okay?  

peace and love,
mike

[mikeboll64]

Jack, go back and read the context of Francis' post.  Then read WHO I was ribbing by bringing your error up.  Hint for the mentally slow:  It WASN'T you at all.

Btw, wasn't it smart of me to move this thread out of the debates section, Jack? It was even MORE confusing then.

mike

[SimplyForgiven]

Mike said

Quote

Okay, that should cover the diversions. Are you ready to show me how it is ABUNDANTLY CLEAR that Heb 1:8 calls Jesus “God Almighty”? Or do we have yet more lawyer haggling to do before we can actually debate?

Note his whole post doesnt even refute francis logic.
I think Mike only cherry picks through peoples post.

[Kangaroo Jack Jr.]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Jan. 28 2011,14:36)

Mike said Quote Okay, that should cover the diversions.  Are you ready to show me how it is ABUNDANTLY CLEAR that Heb 1:8 calls Jesus “God Almighty”?  Or do we have yet more lawyer haggling to do before we can actually debate? Note his whole post doesnt even refute francis logic. I think Mike only cherry picks through peoples post.

Bingo!

Major premise: Only God Almighty is the creator
Minor premmise: Jesus is the creator
Conclusion: Therefore, Jesus is God Almighty

Roo Jr.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All

In the Debate with Mike Francis says…

Quote (francis @ Jan. 28 2011,10:43)

Since no one can absolutely and irrefutably prove anything outside of math, then it is clear that I am not going to attempt to absolutely and irrefutably prove that the Trinitarian position is correct.  What I'm going to do is attempt to prove that my position is a far stronger and a far more logical and rational position than your position,  when all the evidence that is avaialbe is taken into fair and impartial consideration.

In response Mike says…

   

Francis:  Nothing can be PROVEN, but I'm going to PROVE my position is stronger!   [end quote]

Mike, do you see why Francis thinks you are being  intellectually dishonest?

First off Francis didn't say … “Nothing can be PROVEN“.

Francis said…

“…no one can absolutely and irrefutably prove anything outside of math…“

Do you see how out of context you can misrpresent someone by leaving a few words out?

Also Francis words were not “I'm going to PROVE my position is stronger!“

Again, you twisted his words, when Francis actually said…

“What I'm going to do is attempt to prove that my position is a far stronger“

That one word “ATTEMPT” that you left out changes the whole meaning of his words.

I don't know Mike, maybe you don't even realize you do this kind of stuff all the time, and that is why Francis has had to “untwist” much of what you say because often you misrepresent the words and meaning of the one you are debating.

This is one reason I created this thread. But of course I know why you moved it. (wait you said you moved it or was it t8 that moved it by your request?)

Anyway, at least examples like this can be brought out to put some light on what is actually happening in the debate.

Things like this is the reason why this thread should have been left in the debates section. Heck t8 could have changed the title, but I know why that won't happen.  

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2011,20:34)

Hey Keith, You SEEMED mad about it to me, judging from your posts.  So you can say I am “mistaken”, but don't say I'm “lying”.

Mike

I think you think everyone is mad at you. But I could be mistaken.

Ok I shouldn't have said lying. Sorry! I humbly apologize.

WJ

[Kangaroo Jack Jr.]

Keith said:

Quote

don't know Mike, maybe you don't even realize you do this kind of stuff all the time, and that is why Francis has had to “untwist” much of what you say because often you misrepresent the words and meaning of the one you are debating.

How could Mike not realize what he does?

Roo

[942767]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 28 2011,05:18)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 27 2011,13:11) Hi WJ: God is the Father of Jesus by His Spirit, and he is also my Father by that same Spirit, and yours if you have received the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Love in Christ, Marty Marty Why are you evading answering the question? You have said the Holy Spirit is a “He” and inferred that the “He” is the Father. If so… “Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“ “Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“ WJ

Hi WJ:

Not your Holy Spirit, if yours is a “Third Person” of a Tri-Une God.  I did not evade your question.  I said that God is the Father of Jesus by His Spirit.  You read the scriptures that Ed posted or at least you said that you did.

And so, what do the scriptures indicate?

I said that the Holy Spirit if God's person, “He” but not a “Third Person”.  

Also in 1 Co. 2 the scriptures compare God and His Spirit knowing His thoughts to your spirit knowing your thoughts, and so now, answer my question to you.  Is your spirit a different person than you?

Here are the scriptures:

Quote

1 Co. 2:10But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 11For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,12:20)

I said that the Holy Spirit if God's person, “He” but not a “Third Person”.

Marty

If the “He” is Gods person then the “He” is the Father. Right?

If not who is “He”?

So once again…

“Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“

“Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“

A simple Yes or No should be your answer.

WJ

[942767]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 29 2011,05:07)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,12:20) I said that the Holy Spirit if God's person, “He” but not a “Third Person”. Marty If the “He” is Gods person then the “He” is the Father. Right? If not who is “He”? So once again… “Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“ “Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“ A simple Yes or No should be your answer. WJ

Hi WJ:

The answer is yes, the Holy Spirit is the Father of Jesus.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi Marty

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,12:20)

Also in 1 Co. 2 the scriptures compare God and His Spirit knowing His thoughts to your spirit knowing your thoughts, and so now, answer my question to you.  Is your spirit a different person than you?

No

But I am not God and I can't say my spirit searches the deep things of Keith. I can't say that I will send my Spirit to someone to dwell in them and be with them forever.

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,12:20)

Here are the scriptures: Quote 1 Co. 2:10But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. 11For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Love in Christ, Marty

And I asked you the question “does the Father search the deep things of God?”

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,13:13)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 29 2011,05:07) Quote (942767 @ Jan. 28 2011,12:20) I said that the Holy Spirit if God's person, “He” but not a “Third Person”. Marty If the “He” is Gods person then the “He” is the Father. Right? If not who is “He”? So once again… “Is the Holy Spirit the Father of Jesus?“ “Is Jesus the Son of the Holy Spirit?“ A simple Yes or No should be your answer. WJ Hi WJ: The answer is yes, the Holy Spirit is the Father of Jesus. Love in Christ, Marty

Marty

Wow how hard was that? Now can you show me where the Holy Spirit is ever referred to as the Father of Jesus?

Can you show me a scripture that says Jesus is the Son of the Holy Spirit?

WJ

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