magic..

[NickHassan]

Hi cato,
Does Jung know truth better than the one who is truth?
Psychology is man's attempt to rationalise the work of demons among men.
Spirits without bodies who seek men to dwell in and despoil.

Jesus just cast them out and set men free

[seek and you will find]

Quote (Cato @ April 08 2008,02:42)

Quote (Not3in1 @ April 07 2008,15:35) Back on the topic of MAGIC…. Magic is appealing.  When I was a kid, I loved the Wizard of Oz.  Nowadays the kids are crazy for Harry Potter.  I wonder, is there a difference between what we thought was harmless as a kid (Wizard of Oz) and HP?  I confess that I wouldn't let my kids get drawn into the whole HP thing.  To this day my kids have not read any of the books or seen the movies.  But recently I watched two of the movies and I thought they were really good!  Nervous laugh….. [Mandy, My take, most of what we call magic, the Harry Potter and the like, is harmless fantasy, I see no evil in Harry Potter or the wizard of Oz I see looking at them, as such, pure paranoia.  Harry Potter has brought millions of kids to reading instead of TV and Video games and the stories are well crafted and have basic moral lessons.   As for real magic, I think there is such a thing, which I believe is akin to advanced Jungian psychology.  It deals with the changing of mental states of consciousness.  I think it is morally neutral, and conerns manipulation of forces.  Good or evil would stem from the applications of such, like in any type of energy.  Many taboos stem from the ability to harm yourself or others when the foolish or malevolent try to pry open the doorways of their minds without training or knowledge.

Cato! I have to disagree with you that H. Potter is harmless. I have not seen the movie just heard about it, and what I heard was enough for me and our Grandchildren to stay away from it. The wizard of Oz is in no comparison to H. Potter.
Peace and Love Mrs.

[kejonn]

I do not know of a single incidence of anyone provoked to violence after reading Harry Potter or watching a HP movie, but history is full of radical fundamentalists killing people in the name of the various Abrahamic religions. If you are open-minded enough, check out VICTIMS OF THE CHRISTIAN FAITH.

[NickHassan]

Hi KJ,
Are you getting muddled with the work of the whore again?

[kejonn]

The whore used the same book you used. That's where they got the idea to kill pagans, Jews, and others. Christians ever killed other Christians when they disagreed. All in the name of God.

[NickHassan]

Hi KJ,
indeed.

[Cato]

Quote (Not3in1 @ April 08 2008,05:44)

Cato, The practice or entertainment of magic of any kind is forbidden in the bible.  So, I guess you have to determine what part of the bible is OK and what part you can ignore.  This is tough work.  The bible – can it be followed to a “T”?  More importanly, shoud it?

For all those who say magic is forbidden in the Bible explain the following exceptions:

In Genesis 44, Joseph's household manager refers to a silver drinking cup  “As morning dawned, the men were sent on their way with their donkeys.  They had not gone far from the city when Joseph said to his steward, “Go after those men at once, and when you catch up with them, say to them, 'Why have you repaid good with evil? Isn't this the cup my master drinks from and also uses for divination? This is a wicked thing you have done.' ”  These passages show that Joseph engaged in scrying. This is an ancient occultic method of divination in which a cup or other vessel is filled with water and gazed into.  

Numbers 5:16 describes a ritual like, black magic, that the Hebrew Priest would perform on a woman if her husband suspected that she he had committed adultery.  ” 'The priest shall bring her and have her stand before the LORD. Then he shall take some holy water in a clay jar and put some dust from the tabernacle floor into the water. After the priest has had the woman stand before the LORD, he shall loosen her hair and place in her hands the reminder offering, the grain offering for jealousy, while he himself holds the bitter water that brings a curse. Then the priest shall put the woman under oath and say to her, “If no other man has slept with you and you have not gone astray and become impure while married to your husband, may this bitter water that brings a curse not harm you. But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have defiled yourself by sleeping with a man other than your husband”- here the priest is to put the woman under this curse of the oath-“may the LORD cause your people to curse and denounce you when he causes your thigh to waste away and your abdomen to swell. May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells and your thigh wastes away.”
     
Numbers 27:19  “Have him stand before Eleazar the priest and the entire assembly and commission him in their presence. Give him some of your authority so the whole Israelite community will obey him. He is to stand before Eleazar the priest, who will obtain decisions for him by inquiring of the Urim before the LORD.”
1Samuel 28:6  “He inquired of the LORD, but the LORD did not answer him by dreams or Urim or prophets.”
In ancient Israelite religion and culture, Urim and Thummim (Hebrew: האורים והתומים, Standard haʾUrim vəhaTummim Tiberian hāʾÛrîm wəhatTummîm) is a phrase from the Hebrew Bible associated with the Hoshen (High Priest's breastplate), divination in general, and cleromancy in particular. Most scholars suspect that the phrase refers to specific objects involved in the divination.

2 Kings 2:24    
Here we have a prophet of the Lord calling a curse upon children for mocking his baldness no less, “He (Elisha) turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youths.”

Daniel 5:11
'There is a man in thy kingdom, in whom is the spirit of the holy gods; and in the days of thy father light and understanding and wisdom, like the wisdom of the gods, was found in him; whom the king Nebuchadnezzar thy father, the king, I say, thy father, made master of the magicians, astrologers, Chaldeans, and soothsayers;”

Here we have a holy man who willing faced death so as not to violate any of God's laws accepts being not only a magician, but master of magicians.

[NickHassan]

Hi cato,
And God gave us the stars for signs.
Urim and Thummin were used.
Drawing lots showed the will of God too.
It was even used by the disciples.

God uses multiple means to show His plan and His will among His people.
But apart from Him things are not of faith and thus of sin.

[kejonn]

So magic is OK along as the person using it is spoken of positively in the bible?

[NickHassan]

Hi KJ,
God shows what is righteous for His people in his Word.
Outside of that you are on your own.

[charity]

Guided please

The woman at the well was told by Jesus all she had done?

How do we receive this information?

Crystal ball?

God made everything? Or is Satan now become a grand equivalent creator to God, more than just a hindrance.
Magic Made the earth, bible believers, are the greatest magic believers ever created., t even as to fear Harry potter as if he have a real force of power?

[NickHassan]

Hi charity,
The Spirit of God knows the hearts of men.
Proverbs 16:2
All the ways of a man are clean in his own eyes; but the LORD weigheth the spirits.

Jesus was fully blessed in the Spirit of God

Jn3

34For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

We follow him

1Cor 12
4Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.

5And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.

6And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.

7But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.

8For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;

9To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;

10To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

11But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

[charity]

I do not find it difficult to understand the many languages of the books bound together and called the holy bible.
based on Mans Nature, it tells many things
I never expect that it should be all agree, or even, to be forced to fit together, and that was when in falling that together it came clear

[Not3in1]

There is another section in the OT where someone has permission from God to associate with someone who can call on spirits that are dead. One is raised and when he is raised he says something like, “Why are you bothering my rest!”. I can't remember where this is located. But at any rate, we are told in certain areas to avoid people like this – mediums that call on the dead – and then God allows it. Confusing.

[Not3in1]

Hi Charity,

Good to see you sister!

[kejonn]

Quote (Not3in1 @ April 07 2008,23:15)

There is another section in the OT where someone has permission from God to associate with someone who can call on spirits that are dead. One is raised and when he is raised he says something like, “Why are you bothering my rest!”. I can't remember where this is located. But at any rate, we are told in certain areas to avoid people like this – mediums that call on the dead – and then God allows it. Confusing.

It was King Saul, and not while he was in Yahweh's good graces. So at that point he was not doing a good thing . 1 Sam 28.

[NickHassan]

Hi not3,
Should God not allow men to do these things?
God gives everyone choices.
1 Samuel 28:7
Then Saul said to his servants, “Seek for me a woman who is a medium, that I may go to her and inquire of her.” And his servants said to him, “Behold, there is a woman who is a medium at En-dor.”

Galatians 5:20
Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

[Not3in1]

Ah, thanks guys. I knew it was there somewhere.

[Stu]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 08 2008,10:43)

And God gave us the stars for signs.

Hi Nick

Are those the stars he attached to the underside of the firmament? Does god intend us to follow astrology?

Stuart

[NickHassan]

Hi Stu,
Women's weekly version?
No.
Gen1
14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

[Author]

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