lord and god equal terms

Participant

Hi TT,
God's messenger is also the God who gives Himself messages?
How odd.
Mystery Babylon.

February 3, 2010 at 5:18 am#175301

Participant

Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 02 2010,20:17)

Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 02 2010,08:07)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 02 2010,05:14)

Hi TT,
So do tell us how the words are interchangeable in 1Cor 8.
Or should we just trust your insights?

Hi Nick,

Lord means “owner” and of course Jesus is “owner”; because his Father is “HolySpirit”(GOD)!
LORD in the Old “Testament”=117, is translated from God's Name [יהוה].
They are NOT interchangeable and this CAN be proven, only in TT's mind are they.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

ED J,

We're waiting for you to prove it.
The terms look interchangeable to me.

thinker

Hi Thinker,

Here is your “PROOF”!
[Κύριος] kü-rē-ŏs means “Lord” or “Owner” and is akin to the Hebrew word [אדני] Âdônây meaning “Lord” or “Owner” as well.

There are five words for “GOD” the Greek (all are pronounced Thēôs); they are…
Four (4) of these are “plural” forms of the word; only one (1) is used in “singular” form.

1) θεος
2) θεου
3) θεω
4) θεον

5) θεε

Greek: Thēôs: Supreme Divinity, Exceedingly GOD,
Hebrew [אל] ĔL: Supreme Deity, Exceedingly GOD, Almighty.

Do you “deny” these words carry different meanings?
They are NOT interchangeable!

“YHVH is GOD”=117

YHVH is God's Name([יהוה]) transliterated into English; transliterated means sounds(phonics).

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

February 3, 2010 at 5:25 am#175302

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 03 2010,09:32)

Hi TT,
God's messenger is also the God who gives Himself messages?
How odd.
Mystery Babylon.

Hi Nick,

Rev.13:1: And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea,
having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns,
and upon his heads ['i am' the name of blasphemy].

Rev.17:5: And upon her forehead was a name written, ['i am' MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT],
THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

February 3, 2010 at 3:03 pm#175411

Participant

ED J said:

Quote

Hi Thinker,

Here is your “PROOF”!
[Κύριος] kü-rē-ŏs means “Lord” or “Owner” and is akin to the Hebrew word [אדני] Âdônây meaning “Lord” or “Owner” as well.

ED J,

The name “Jehovah” translates into the new testament as “kurios” (or Lord).

The ministry of the forerunner of Christ prophesied by Isaiah:

3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness:

“ Prepare the way of Jehovah;
Make straight in the desert
A highway for our God. Isaiah 40:3

The fulfillment by John the Baptist:

1 In those days John the Baptist came preaching in the wilderness of Judea, 2 and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand!” 3 For this is he who was spoken of by the prophet Isaiah, saying:

“ The voice of one crying in the wilderness:

‘ Prepare the way of the Lord;
Make His paths straight.’” Matthew 3:1-3

Note that Isaiah was speaking about JEHOVAH. John the Baptist said that Isaiah was speaking about Christ (“this is He”). The word “kurios” (Lord) is the Greek translation of the Hebrew YHWH (Jehovah).

thinker

February 3, 2010 at 6:41 pm#175447

Participant

Hi TT,
Translates as??
Only by the deliberate distortion of the translators albeit for reasons of the fear of writing YHWH.

Come on.

February 3, 2010 at 7:15 pm#175458

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 04 2010,05:41)

Hi TT,
Translates as??
Only by the deliberate distortion of the translators albeit for reasons of the fear of writing YHWH.

Come on.

It was John the Baptist who said that Isaiah was speaking about Jesus.

thinker

February 3, 2010 at 7:34 pm#175460

Participant

Hi TT,
Indeed God visited His people
in the vessel of His Son.

February 3, 2010 at 8:10 pm#175472

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 04 2010,06:34)

Hi TT,
Indeed God visited His people
in the vessel of His Son.

Nick,
The apostle John used “kurios” (Lord) for Jehovah. John the Baptist said that Isaiah's prophecy concerning Jehovah was speaking about Jesus.

thinker

February 3, 2010 at 8:15 pm#175474

Participant

Hi TT,
And indeed YHWH came in the vessel of His Son.
He will do so again at the return of the Saviour Lord.

February 3, 2010 at 8:26 pm#175481

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 04 2010,07:15)

Hi TT,
And indeed YHWH came in the vessel of His Son.
He will do so again at the return of the Saviour Lord.

So God did become incarnate! So Jesus was more than one merely sent. He was God having come.

Amen!

thinker

February 3, 2010 at 8:29 pm#175483

Participant

Hi TT,
Indeed God was in Christ and should be in you if you are in Christ.[Eph3.19]

But Jesus existed as a man and was not just a body for God.

February 3, 2010 at 8:34 pm#175486

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 04 2010,07:29)

Hi TT,
Indeed God was in Christ and should be in you if you are in Christ.[Eph3.19]

But Jesus existed as a man and was not just a body for God.

Half truth Nick. A half truth is a falsehood. The Father was in the Son and the Son was in the Father.

The Father worked through the Son and the Son worked through the Father.

thinker

February 4, 2010 at 12:30 am#175558

Participant

Hi TT,
Yes Jesus was in God.
But He was not the God he was in.

Yes God was in Jesus.
But Jesus was not the God that was in him.

What was it you said about half truths?

February 4, 2010 at 12:30 am#175559

Participant

Hi TT,
You too can have God in you and be enjoined with Him through His Son.
But you will never be that God either.

February 4, 2010 at 1:33 am#175566

942767

Participant

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 02 2010,18:29)

Quote (942767 @ Feb. 01 2010,18:21)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 02 2010,07:33)

Quote (942767 @ Feb. 01 2010,04:25)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 31 2010,18:27)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 30 2010,04:56)

Hi thinker, and WJ:

Jesus told us who was “his” God as well as “ours”. Don't you believe him?

Jhn 20:17 Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say to them,'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to MY GOD AND YOUR GOD' “

I am not trying to bail Nick but you out.

Love in Christ,
Marty

Marty

The scriptures call Jesus God, do you believe this?

Interesting, the scripture you quote, for in the same chapter Jesus didn't correct Thomas and give him the same information but instead blessed him when…

Thomas *said unto him*, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. John 20:28, 29

Notice the Narrator John the witness says clearly “Thomas *said unto him*“, there is no wiggle room for any other interpretation.

You can say there is but that would only be inference the very thing that Trinitarians are accused of!

John also is the one that wrote John 1:1 clearly showing Jesus the Word that was with God is God!

You do not have to believe it, but you have no proof that what I say is not true.

The scriptures call Jesus God, and if he is not God then it would be Idolatry, or blasphemy to do so.

If he is “a god” in any sense and not the “True God” (1 John 5:20) then according to the Mosaic Law that would be Idolatry!

Tell me Marty if I call Jesus “my Lord and my God”, am I breaking the scriptures?

Blessings WJ

Hi Brother:

Isn't the following scripture plain to you? It is to me. Jesus said that he was ascending to his Father and our Father and to his God and our God. The is only “One God”.

Quote

Jesus is the express image of God's person. God made man in His onw image, and Jesus is the last Adam. The first Adam was made a living soul. The last Adam is like God in that he is also a spirit of love. He is God in this sense. We have seen God through the works of obedience that he did to His God and our God and His Father and our Father.

Love in Christ,
Marty

Marty

Yes it is plain to me that because of Jesus manhood he has a God.

But that does not at all answer the points that I make does it?

You say…

Quote (942767 @ Feb. 01 2010,04:25)

He is God in this sense.

There is no such teaching in scriptures. He is either God or he is not at all!

To say that anything or any one is a god to you in any sense would be Idolatry unless he is the “True God”. John 20:28, Heb 1:8, Titus 2:13, 2 Peter 1:1, 1 John 5:20, Jude 1:4, 4.

Blessings WJ

Hi WJ:

What points do you not understand, he is the express image of God's person, and we have seen God character manifest through the life that Jesus lived in obedience to God even unto death on the cross.

He told us plainly that he was ascending to his Father and our Father and to his God and our God.

He also said the following in John 17:

Quote

1 Jesus spoke these words, lifted up His eyes to heaven, and said: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify Your Son, that Your Son also may glorify You, 2 as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should[a] give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.3 And this is eternal life, that THEY MAY KNOW YOU, THE ONLY TRUE GOD, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent

There are no other points to consider. The scriptures plainly tell us that Jesus is the Son of God and is God's Christ. There is “only one God”.

Love in Christ,
Marty

Marty

Thank you!

But you are only proving that he is the Son of God!

But you are not addressing that Jesus is also called God!

Yes he is the “Express image of Gods person” [hypostasis] (literally essence or substance). Click here

In other words all the the Father is Jesus is.

Would you say your Father is less human than you, or is he of the same nature or essence as you?

Think about it, you cannot even say that you are the “express image of your Fathers person” can you?

How much more is Jesus in nature God?

Its not hard to understand that they are One in every way, just like the Sun and the Sunrays!

“The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being“, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. Heb 1:3

Blessings WJ

Hi WJ:

You can try to wiggle your way out of this if you want, but Jesus has told us who is our God, and that should be sufficient.

No, I am not just proving that Jesus is the Son of God. God our Father has revealed to humanity through the Apostle Peter in Matthew 16 that he is the Christ the Son of the Living God. I also know who he is because he gave his life for me so that I could have the priviledge and honor of being a son of the Most High God. This does not have to be proven. At least, not to me.

Jesus is the express image of God's person. He is a ma
n who obeyed God's Word without sin even unto death on the cross. It is through the works of obedience to God's Word that he is the express image of God's person.

He said:

Quote

John 14:28
You have heard Me say to you, ‘I am going away and coming back to you.’ If you loved Me, you would rejoice because I said, ‘I am going to the Father,’ for My Father is greater than I.

Love in Christ,
Marty

February 4, 2010 at 3:23 am#175576

Participant

Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 04 2010,02:03)

ED J said:

Quote

Hi Thinker,

Here is your “PROOF”!
[Κύριος] kü-rē-ŏs means “Lord” or “Owner” and is akin to the Hebrew word [אדני] Âdônây meaning “Lord” or “Owner” as well.

ED J,

The name “Jehovah” translates into the new testament as “kurios” (or Lord).

thinker

Hi Thinker,

Names don't translate into 'titles'?

In Judaism, יהוה is reverenced to the degree that they don’t dare speak GOD’s Name for fear of saying His Name in vain. (Ex. 20:7 / Deut. 5:11)
The spoken use of name-omitting icons was inspired by this fear of saying GOD’s name in vain. The primary icon used for indirectly referencing
יהוה is [אדני] Âd-ô-nây meaning Lord or Owner. The secondary icon used for indirectly referencing הוהי is [ה שם] Hä-Shəm meaning “The Name”.
Name-substitutions have negatively affected people for many generations; producing the uncertainty of how exactly to pronounce GOD’s Name.
The use of name-omitting icons has effectually distanced (יהוה) “GOD” further and further from His Word.

Most English-speaking people either know GOD’s Name as JEHOVAH or not at all.
The AKJV Bible has sometimes replaced [יהוה] YHVH with the correct title, “GOD”.
However LORD in all-capital letters, is predominantly used as the exclusive replacement
for הוהי in the AKJV Bible. LORD is an even less accurate title. This title-substitution occurs over 6,000 times
in the AKJV Bible. An example of this is in Psalms 8:9: “O LORD our Lord, how excellent is thy Name in all the earth!”

Whosoever shall call upon the name of “The LORD” shall be saved.
How then shall they call on in Him whom they have not believed?
And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard?
(Rom. 10:13-14) The identity of יהוה=26 is GOD=26 spoken as YÄ=26.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

February 4, 2010 at 3:24 am#175577

Participant

Quote (thethinker @ Feb. 04 2010,02:03)

ED J,

The ministry of the forerunner of Christ prophesied by Isaiah:

3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness:

“ Prepare the way of Jehovah;
Make straight in the desert
A highway for our God. Isaiah 40:3

1) The fulfillment by John the Baptist:

1 In those days John the Baptist came preaching in the wilderness of Judea,
2 and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand!”
3 For this is he who was spoken of by the prophet Isaiah, saying:

“ The voice of one crying in the wilderness:

‘ Prepare the way of the Lord;
Make His paths straight.’” Matthew 3:1-3

2) Note that Isaiah was speaking about JEHOVAH.

3)John the Baptist said that Isaiah was speaking about Christ (“this is He”).

4) The word “kurios” (Lord) is the Greek translation of the Hebrew YHWH (Jehovah).

thinker

Hi Thinker,

1) Correct.

2) Correct.

3) I see where your confusion stems from; “this is He” is indeed Christ!
But John the baptist doesn't make Jesus' path straight ?
Christ makes JEHOVAH's path straight !

Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 03 2010,16:18)

Hi Thinker,

Here is your “PROOF”!
[Κύριος] kü-rē-ŏs means “Lord” or “Owner” and is akin to the Hebrew word [אדני] Âdônây meaning “Lord” or “Owner” as well.

Ed J

Why do you ignore my proof (listed as #4 in MY POST), pretending it has no relevance?
You discount FACTS pertinent to the subject matter, and instead insert your faulty logic?
Here is a more in depth explanation for you, to help remove the deeply embedded confusion…

4) YHVH is God's Name; that which you posted is incorrect and garbage logic (listed as #4 in YOUR POST)!
YHVH is God's Name transliterated into English; transliterated means sounds(phonics).
Hebrew has No [W] sound, No [J] sound and the symbol ש is pronounced “Sh”.
Someone who corrects should have his or her facts correct also.

GOD’s most sacred Holy Name [יהוה] was given to us directly from the Hebrew language.
Correctly translating Hebrew into other languages can be difficult however.
Some basic linguistical rules need to be considered when translating Hebrew texts.
These include a lack of spacing between words, as a general rule has no written vowels
and the basic direction in which Hebrew is written (opposite: from right to left).
Hebrew word spacing is a modern advent that distinguishes one word from the next,
aiding both translators and multi-linguists alike. Unwritten “implied” vowel sounds
are a concern because, correct pronunciations of Hebrew words are at risk.
GOD’s Name (יהוה) transliterates directly into English as YHVH because the Hebrew alphabet
lacks vowels. Hebrew has No [W] sound, No [J] sound and the symbol ש is pronounced “Sh”.

[יהוה] GOD’s Name [י] Yod [ה] Ha [ו] Vav [ה] Hey …is pronounced YÄ-hä-vā & [יה] YÄ

Theomatics offers proof of this FACT as a second witness(Matt.18:16)…
The “Divine=63” “Deity=63” of “The Bible=63” is “YHVH=63”!

“YHVH is GOD”=117; I can only pray your ears will be open to “Bible Truth”=117.
PSALM 117 “is” [The Bible's Center], AND the “[smallest chapter]” of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

February 20, 2010 at 12:33 pm#179437