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942767……All evil will be punished with everlasting destruction through Flaming Fire (intense Judgment) not literal fire , this scripture does not cancel out what Jodi has quoted and if it does we then have a contradiction in scripture right. And where do you put this, “For i saw the lord coming with ten thousands of His saints to execute Judgment in the earth and to (CONVINCE) ALL the (UNGODLY) of their UNGODLY DEEDS the have UNGODLY Committed”. Why (CONVINCE) anyone Just burn them Up in a literal Hell fire, According to what you believe it's to late to convince anyone of anything , He will just came and burn up all the UNGODLY. Which will be all that are not with him. Will the Saints be given flame throwers and start from one end of earth and burn everyone up until no one is left seeing the People Left are ALL UNGODLY> Sorry i can by a Loving and Mercifully GOD Literally Burning up His creation in a literal Fire without any chance of salvation in the future. The picture in scripture is that even though people in there first life on earth were disobedient to God , God will raise them up and teach them through Strong Judgments to change there ways.
If you care to look up the word for everlasting you will find is does not mean the same as our everlasting means, it come from the Greek word eon and means an age not eternal as you would like it to mean. Many commentators verify this.
love and peace to you 942767 and yours……………….gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 06 2008,19:14) Jodi,
Where does scripture say God works His Spirit into men?
Nick I already gave the scripture.Here it is again,
Eze 37:12 Therefore prophesy and say to them, 'Thus says the Lord God: “Behold, O My people, I will open your graves and cause you to come up from your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. 13 Then you shall know that I am the Lord, when I have opened your graves, O My people, and brought you up from your graves. 14 I will put My Spirit in you, and you shall live, and I will place you in your own land. Then you shall know that I, the Lord, have spoken it and performed it,” says the Lord.' “14 I will put My Spirit in you, and you shall live, and I will place you in your own land. Then you shall know that I, the Lord, have spoken it and performed it,” says the Lord.'
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 07 2008,14:54) 942767……All evil will be punished with everlasting destruction through Flaming Fire (intense Judgment) not literal fire , this scripture does not cancel out what Jodi has quoted and if it does we then have a contradiction in scripture right. And where do you put this, “For i saw the lord coming with ten thousands of His saints to execute Judgment in the earth and to (CONVINCE) ALL the (UNGODLY) of their UNGODLY DEEDS the have UNGODLY Committed”. Why (CONVINCE) anyone Just burn them Up in a literal Hell fire, According to what you believe it's to late to convince anyone of anything , He will just came and burn up all the UNGODLY. Which will be all that are not with him. Will the Saints be given flame throwers and start from one end of earth and burn everyone up until no one is left seeing the People Left are ALL UNGODLY> Sorry i can by a Loving and Mercifully GOD Literally Burning up His creation in a literal Fire without any chance of salvation in the future. The picture in scripture is that even though people in there first life on earth were disobedient to God , God will raise them up and teach them through Strong Judgments to change there ways. If you care to look up the word for everlasting you will find is does not mean the same as our everlasting means, it come from the Greek word eon and means an age not eternal as you would like it to mean. Many commentators verify this.
love and peace to you 942767 and yours……………….gene
Hi Gene:Be not deceived God is not mocked for whatsoever a man soweth that shall he also reap.
The ungodly will surely be convinced of their ungodly deeds as they are being destroyed. There is no contradiction.
Quote Mat 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. Quote Hbr 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, Hbr 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Hbr 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Hbr 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Hbr 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance [belongeth] unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Hbr 10:31 [It is] a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Verse 10:26 states that if a man sins wilfully after he has received knowledge of the truth, there remains no more sacrifice for sins.
God Bless
Hi Gene:
Here are some verses for your consideraton:
Quote Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of [these] little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. Mar 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
God Bless
Quote (Jodi @ Dec. 07 2008,15:32) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 06 2008,20:23) PUT Jodi?
HUH?
Jodi,
Not even all Israel is true Israel so extending such a concept to the heathen is follyQuote (942767 @ Dec. 06 2008,20:54) Hi Gene: Here are some verses for your consideraton:
Quote Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of [these] little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. Mar 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
God Bless
Yes, the fire is not quenched UNTIL CHANGE IS CREATED.So you don't believe in an ALMIGHTY God, who's Will is what is done?
2 Peter3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
1 Timothy 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 06 2008,21:01) Quote (Jodi @ Dec. 07 2008,15:32) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 06 2008,20:23) PUT Jodi?
HUH?
Jodi,
Not even all Israel is true Israel so extending such a concept to the heathen is folly
Acts 15:16 'After this I will return And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins, And I will set it up; 17 So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord, Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name, Says the Lord who does all these things.'Jodi……..useless they Just don't get it, the sad part to all of this is that some day they may have to give account of all the Harsh thing said by them about God. Even Jesus life and words was not to condemn any one saying the son of man came (NOT) to condemn the world But that the world through Him might have life and life more abundantly. These fear mongers don't even read where they will have their part of the Lake of Fire (intense Judgments) of God themselves. Out of the hundreds of Positive scripture quoted Here I don't recall Nick or 942767 using any of them in there post. One thing i Have noticed All who believe Salvation is a matter of their “FREE WILLS” seem to have the same attitude and that is most will be burned up in a literal fire, except them of course they are more then willing to makes an exception for themselves.
love and peace to you and yours Jodi……………gene
Quote (Jodi @ Dec. 07 2008,16:03) Quote (942767 @ Dec. 06 2008,20:54) Hi Gene: Here are some verses for your consideraton:
Quote Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of [these] little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. Mar 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
God Bless
Yes, the fire is not quenched UNTIL CHANGE IS CREATED.So you don't believe in an ALMIGHTY God, who's Will is what is done?
2 Peter3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
1 Timothy 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Hi Jodi:The scripture states that worm does not die niether is the fire quenched.
The worm will eat until there is not more there to eat up, and God will not quench the fire it will burn until it burns everything up.
I believe what the scripture states that God is not willing that any man should perish, but that all come to repentance, but there is God's will and then there is man's will. If man does not want to repent, and be saved, God will not force himself on him or anyone. He will cause circumstances that may cause a man to make the right decision, but no, He will not force His will on anyone.
God desires that all men be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth, and that is why the gospel is to every creature.
God Bless
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 07 2008,16:25) Jodi……..useless they Just don't get it, the sad part to all of this is that some day they may have to give account of all the Harsh thing said by them about God. Even Jesus life and words was not to condemn any one saying the son of man came (NOT) to condemn the world But that the world through Him might have life and life more abundantly. These fear mongers don't even read where they will have their part of the Lake of Fire (intense Judgments) of God themselves. Out of the hundreds of Positive scripture quoted Here I don't recall Nick or 942767 using any of them in there post. One thing i Have noticed All who believe Salvation is a matter of their “FREE WILLS” seem to have the same attitude and that is most will be burned up in a literal fire, except them of course they are more then willing to makes an exception for themselves. love and peace to you and yours Jodi……………gene
Hi Gene:Perhaps if you preach the truth man will take heed and repent and be saved.
Quote 2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.Quote Eze 33:2 Son of man, speak to the children of thy people, and say unto them, When I bring the sword upon a land, if the people of the land take a man of their coasts, and set him for their watchman:
Eze 33:6 But if the watchman see the sword come, and blow not the trumpet, and the people be not warned; if the sword come, and take [any] person from among them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at the watchman's hand.God Bless
942767……..Repentence to given by God Thats the OLD COVENANT, Which we are (NOT) under < "for you brethren have (NOT) come unto that mountain to (FEAR) as THEY did. So why did they come to that mountain?. it was to FEAR so fear would control them and they would not sin. This is the SAME religion YOU and NICK teach. A religion of FEAR.
Let me give you a good example of Human Nature with out GOD'S Spirit, Its like a cioled spring and when it has no pressur applied to it it will expand all the way , The carnl mind is exactly like that the Lust in it will cause it to increase in evil as the coild spring will if not regulated, So God Put pressure on Human Nature He turned His loving commamdments into Law (forced compliance) and this forced compliance is like putting weight on top of the sprung and pushes it down , Fear works the Same way it cause obedience. But remove the Weight and the Spring goes right back to full expansion, so does the CARNAL MIND. It needs Pressure ie, FEAR.
But the Spiritual Lead Mind does not , it is like some one (GOD) simple removes the force causing it to expand, No fear need to control it Just a new Heart that doesn't Have the Lust in it Just true Love of GOD shed around in it. So no need of FEAR, This why I hod in question you conversion , Because you both seem to always revert back to a fear religion. Nick and 942767, Let move on to perfection, and we know it says (NOTHING) is PERFECTED IN FEAR.
God bless both of you in love and peace………………………..gene
GB,
Sin lives in natural man.
Sin rules there by the choice of the vessel.
The OT law could not clean the inside of the vessel.The blood of Jesus can.[1Peter3]
Take care lest ye fall
Quote (942767 @ Dec. 07 2008,11:07) Quote (Jodi @ Dec. 07 2008,16:03) Quote (942767 @ Dec. 06 2008,20:54) Hi Gene: Here are some verses for your consideraton:
Quote Mar 9:42 And whosoever shall offend one of [these] little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea. Mar 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
Mar 9:46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Mar 9:47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
Mar 9:48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
God Bless
Yes, the fire is not quenched UNTIL CHANGE IS CREATED.So you don't believe in an ALMIGHTY God, who's Will is what is done?
2 Peter3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
1 Timothy 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Hi Jodi:The scripture states that worm does not die niether is the fire quenched.
The worm will eat until there is not more there to eat up, and God will not quench the fire it will burn until it burns everything up.
I believe what the scripture states that God is not willing that any man should perish, but that all come to repentance, but there is God's will and then there is man's will. If man does not want to repent, and be saved, God will not force himself on him or anyone. He will cause circumstances that may cause a man to make the right decision, but no, He will not force His will on anyone.
God desires that all men be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth, and that is why the gospel is to every creature.
God Bless
Hello 942767,It's not God's force, but through His planning and intelligence that God will draw every man into salvation.
Why are you and Nick so quick to write people off? I find it VERY unfortunate that you cannot see the true powers and intelligence of YHWH and His capabilities over man, that you find God's light cannot shine over every dark place.
Revelation 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars–their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
If you read this scripture and the others like it with the given knowledge that God is not willing that any perish, then what I believe we are to understand from it is that it is not people themselves that are cast int the lake of fire, but the people that they WERE are gone forever. There are no more liars, thieves, murderers, sexually immoral people, because all sinful flesh has been burned away, removed and consumed. The only people who make it into the kingdom are righteous people, and God committed all to sin so He would have mercy on all, meaning no matter what sins you committed or how many, no matter how much you loved darkness He would have mercy on all, He would work His Spirit in all to change all.
Seems strait forward to me
-God desires all men to be saved
-God is not willing that any should perish
-God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
-No liars, thieves, murderers..etc, have a place in God's kingdomTherefore God has to destroy the sinful flesh, but not the person. He has to destroy the TYPE of people they are, through shining His light on their darkness.
Do you really believe 942767, that a man's darkness is more powerful then the LIGHT of YHWH? You really believe that our Heavenly Father IS NOT capable of refining His own created creature that He formed from dirt?
Jodi………Amen to that post sis. It is amazing how they just don't get it,
love to you and yours………………….gene
Hi Jodi,
Is every man forcibly drawn to salvation?
Really-is it written?This is
Rom 9
18Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.19Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
21Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
22What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
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