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Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 19 2010,22:48) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 19 2010,15:39) hi Davidfun i know EDJ is a lost cause he is full of is own thoughts and ways learned from men,he will get a man's reward.
Pierre
Hi Terraricca,Matt.7:1-2 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged:
and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJyou cut scriptures ,you should read more,
this is only to apply if i would do the same things you do.
read corinthians 1/2
I try in all my might not to teach lies to people and to me what is not in scriptures is out and from men.
Pierre
Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 19 2010,13:14) Hebrews 7:28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but
“The word“(HolySpirit) of the oath, which was since the law,
maketh the Son(Jesus Christ), who is consecrated for evermore.AKJV Bible
LORD of Hosts (Rev.11:15 / Rom.8:29)
…His Hosts: Jesus and ALL of His brethren!Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Hi Terraricca,This Post is for you!
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (terraricca @ Aug. 19 2010,15:39) hi Davidfun i know EDJ is a lost cause he is full of is own thoughts and ways learned from men,he will get a man's reward.
Pierre
Hi Terraricca,Where is 'your' proof? (Ex.20:16 / Deut.5:20 / 1Tm:5:18-20)
Rev.12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come
salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ:
for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Aug. 20 2010,00:54) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 19 2010,15:39) hi Davidfun i know EDJ is a lost cause he is full of is own thoughts and ways learned from men,he will get a man's reward.
Pierre
Hi Terraricca,Where is 'your' proof? (Ex.20:16 / Deut.5:20 / 1Tm:5:18-20)
Rev.12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come
salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ:
for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
edjyou really think you are a brother of Christ ,and distort the scriptures the way you do ?
this is more addressed to you.
Pierre
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 19 2010,14:26) Pro 9:7 He who corrects a scoffer gets dishonor for himself, And he who reproves a wicked man gets insults for himself. Pro 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you, Reprove a wise man and he will love you.
The Professor
Hi David,Hey, that's what I said Here on Aug. 19 2010,09:29.<– Third Post from top
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2010,15:43) Martain, In Romans 3:13 we are told that those that either have not entered or do live according to the covenant of the spirit of righteousness are spoken of in scripture with the words:
Romans 3:13(NIV) reads:
Quote Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit.”These words are true as they are corrupt or bias blinds them to the error of their ways. Sometimes these ignorant or corrupt individuals are translators of scriptures and/or other times just those who interpret them. We should always test what we hear, see, and choose to believe to make sure it is truly from God.
If we hunger and thirst for righteousness we will hear God and be able to determine what is from God and what is not but if we do not then we will be blind for the truth will be hidden from us.
I find this discussion unimportant because I listen to God and God tells me that Jesus is our King because he is the one of us human beings that God chose to rule over all of heaven and earth. It is important that we believe Jesus is tempted just as we are since it is a foundation stone of our faith that God will enable us to overcome the world. If you interpret any part of scripture in a way that destroys that foundation stone then you are working at the behest of the evil one.
I have referred to a neuter as a “he” instead of an “it” many times in my life and I knew what I was speaking of. I have also called a male “it”. The fault in John 1 comes if one assumes the “he” is Jesus.
A more legitimate question “is does the context support the conclusion the “he” or “it” in John 1 refer to Jesus? If it does then a second question is whether or not that is the only possible person, place, or thing it could be referring to?
The overriding question is still whether your chosen interpretation is consistent with the true message of Jesus the Anointed or if it instead harms that teaching?
I am in agreement with you on this post.Kerwin……….I agree with martian right on brother. John is the most distorted scripture in the bible. Col 1:16, is another the word (By) is written In in about 20 places there and only Once written (BY). So they assume it means Jesus created everything or God Didi it (by) Jesus. Pure assumption on there parts. True understanding of scriptures both old and New do not support the Trinitarian or Preexistences postilions at all.IMO
peace and love……………………….gene
To all,
I misunderstood what Gene said and have no need to be extraneous and reword what I already did as the first post was correctly understood.
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2010,15:43) Martain, In Romans 3:13 we are told that those that either have not entered or do live according to the covenant of the spirit of righteousness are spoken of in scripture with the words:
Romans 3:13(NIV) reads:
Quote Their throats are open graves;
their tongues practice deceit.”These words are true as they are corrupt or bias blinds them to the error of their ways. Sometimes these ignorant or corrupt individuals are translators of scriptures and/or other times just those who interpret them. We should always test what we hear, see, and choose to believe to make sure it is truly from God.
If we hunger and thirst for righteousness we will hear God and be able to determine what is from God and what is not but if we do not then we will be blind for the truth will be hidden from us.
I find this discussion unimportant because I listen to God and God tells me that Jesus is our King because he is the one of us human beings that God chose to rule over all of heaven and earth. It is important that we believe Jesus is tempted just as we are since it is a foundation stone of our faith that God will enable us to overcome the world. If you interpret any part of scripture in a way that destroys that foundation stone then you are working at the behest of the evil one.
I have referred to a neuter as a “he” instead of an “it” many times in my life and I knew what I was speaking of. I have also called a male “it”. The fault in John 1 comes if one assumes the “he” is Jesus.
A more legitimate question “is does the context support the conclusion the “he” or “it” in John 1 refer to Jesus? If it does then a second question is whether or not that is the only possible person, place, or thing it could be referring to?
The overriding question is still whether your chosen interpretation is consistent with the true message of Jesus the Anointed or if it instead harms that teaching?
Kerwin………Again a well written a good and sound Post brother. In order for a person to get thens right in there minds there are two basic things they need to understand and that is that Jesus is (NOT A GOD) and that He (DID NOT PREEXIST) his berth here on earth as a being of any kind. These two are fundamental in having a proper relationship with GOD the FATHER and Jesus Christ our Lord. We have some here that have not even started to come our of those false teachings and we have some who may reject the Jesus is a GOD thing, but still hang on to Jesus' Preexistence teaching, they are what i call half way out , but are failing to come all the way out of the Apostate Churches teachings. Well at least they can not say they were not witnessed to.Peace and love to you and yours brother…………………….gene
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 18 2010,06:44) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 09 2010,10:10) martian………..Right on, God and His Word are one and the same thing, just as our words and us are the same thing. The word of God is an (IT) and (IT) is GOD, and the word (IT) was (IN) Jesus by the Christos or anointing. The false teaching of the Trinity is indeed supported by the False teaching of the Preexistence of Jesus As the (word) being a separate person from GOD HIMSELF> peace and love to you and your martian………………………gene
Gene,To continue with your reasoning:
God and His Will are one and the same thing.
Extrapolating from this: We are created by God's will, we are evil, we are God or God is evil.
Is there ever a “word” of truth coming from you?
From what I read you are saying that the “word” is God Himself and is NOT a separate person in John 1:1-3
Once again:
Jhn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
How many “people” are here? Two
Identify them. Word, God
How do we know? The word WITH shows that Word was WITH God.Now if you don't agree with verse 1 we have:
Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.
How many “people” are here? Two
Identify them. He, God
How do we know? The word WITH shows that He was WITH God.
When? In the beginning.Jhn 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
Who is the Creator? Him.
Who is Him? He who was WITH God.
Who was WITH God? The Word. HaDabar.The Professor
Ps Verses 14-17 unravels the mysterious Him = Jesus
Jesus is our Creator but NOT NOT NOT our God.
Davidbfun,
You stated,
“God and His Will are one and the same thing.”Indeed they are. Your will is you, and my will is me.
“Extrapolating from this: We are created by God's will, we are evil, we are God or God is evil.”
Were you created by God's will? Adam and Eve were formed, made and created by God's will. You and I, on the other hand were the product of your father and your mother, my father and my mother. Did God directly have anything to do with your conception or mine? No, not like God did when Adam and Eve came to be. Of course, maybe my parents had nothing better to do one day, and they ended up making me.
Actually, since I was born again, saved, God justified me and made me righteous. As live according to God's will, I demonstrate that God given righteousness.
God did not directly have any thing to do with our conceptions. Our choices do not reflect on God's will. God's will is that we obey His will. As we obey God's will, we live a good, and godly life. As we disobey His words, we do not live as God intended.
We do not reflect God's goodness when we disobey.
“Is there ever a “word” of truth coming from you?”
To the degree and proportion we understand God's will and speak it, we are giving words of truth.
“From what I read you are saying that the “word” is God Himself and is NOT a separate person in John 1:1-3
When you speak words, who is speaking? Are you speaking or is your wife speaking? or your supervisor? You are, no one else. Where do those words originate from as you speak? Your mouth, no one else's. How does your mouth know what to speak? You brain tells it to speak. How does your brain know to do this? Your mind decides to speak and the brain does its job to make the mouth speak.
Your words are you. Your arm is you. Not all of you, but you just the same. Your knee is you, but not all of you. Likewise, your eyes, ears, etc. Your words are not all of you, but they are you just the same. The ideas you express come out in the form of words or in the form of actions. When you walk or talk, it is you, no one else. You can do more than just walk or talk, but it is you alone.
Likewise, God's words are God. There is more to God than just the words of the scripture. There are things God has not made known to us or to Jesus Christ for that matter. God is not only words but actions as well. God's actions are no ones else's, but God's. There are actions that God's word tells us that He will do, but has not done yet. For instance, the book of Revelation. Do we trust God's words that He will do them?
“From what I read you are saying that the “word” is God Himself and is NOT a separate person in John 1:1-3
“The above discussion makes it clear that God's word, logos, is a part of God, they originated with God, they tell us about God. When words leave a person, when you or I give out words from our mouths, now they can be received by anyone who cares to read them or listen to them. We gave our word to others. God gave and gives His word.
God's words were with God, they are God and are with God. All these same were with God in the beginning.
Some times our words are not enough, we must follow them with action. Or sometimes we do not speak, we simply act, we do. We are to be doers of the word. God does His part of the word, we do our part of doing the word.
The “word”, the logos of John 1:1 is not a separate person.
“Once again:
Jhn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. “
Indeed.
“How many “people” are here? Two
Identify them. Word, God
How do we know? The word WITH shows that Word was WITH God.”Here you jump to unfounded conclusion. Word is not referring to a person, but rather “the thought behind the words used.” That is the standard definition for the word, logos.
God's word was with God. Is you word with you? Of course, where else could it be?
God started this whole thing with His words, from our perspective. See Genesis 1:1, In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth…..
The first thing we know about God is His words, and correspondingly His actions.
Was God's word there in the beginning? Yes, God knew what He was going to do and say before He did and said them. Maybe, you too, think about what you do and say before you do and say them? Of course, you do. We are to ponder the path of our feet.
“Now if you don't agree with verse 1 we have:
Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God. “
Funny, John 1:2, does not say that, it says, ” The same was in the beginning with God.”
It does not say “He”. It says, “the same” the word was in the beginning with God.”
God knew what His word was going to say, long before you and I ever existed. Even before Genesis 1:1. God planned ahead, and you know what? He planned our redemption long before Adam and Eve messed up. His plan included His son, Je
sus Christ, who was given the responsibility to redeem us.Ephesians 2:10, ” For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.”
What are the plans that God has for you and I ? What are the works that God before ordained that you and I should walk in? Are we doing them?
You were a part of God's plan, too.
We need Jesus Christ's example to show us how to do our ordained works.
We need to take his example.
We need to get busy.
Romans 12:11, ” Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;”
barley
Quote (barley @ Aug. 21 2010,12:54) Davidbfun, You stated,
“God and His Will are one and the same thing.”Indeed they are. Your will is you, and my will is me.
“Extrapolating from this: We are created by God's will, we are evil, we are God or God is evil.”
Were you created by God's will? Adam and Eve were formed, made and created by God's will. You and I, on the other hand were the product of your father and your mother, my father and my mother. Did God directly have anything to do with your conception or mine? No, not like God did when Adam and Eve came to be. Of course, maybe my parents had nothing better to do one day, and they ended up making me.
Actually, since I was born again, saved, God justified me and made me righteous. As live according to God's will, I demonstrate that God given righteousness.
God did not directly have any thing to do with our conceptions. Our choices do not reflect on God's will. God's will is that we obey His will. As we obey God's will, we live a good, and godly life. As we disobey His words, we do not live as God intended.
We do not reflect God's goodness when we disobey.
“Is there ever a “word” of truth coming from you?”
To the degree and proportion we understand God's will and speak it, we are giving words of truth.
“From what I read you are saying that the “word” is God Himself and is NOT a separate person in John 1:1-3
When you speak words, who is speaking? Are you speaking or is your wife speaking? or your supervisor? You are, no one else. Where do those words originate from as you speak? Your mouth, no one else's. How does your mouth know what to speak? You brain tells it to speak. How does your brain know to do this? Your mind decides to speak and the brain does its job to make the mouth speak.
Your words are you. Your arm is you. Not all of you, but you just the same. Your knee is you, but not all of you. Likewise, your eyes, ears, etc. Your words are not all of you, but they are you just the same. The ideas you express come out in the form of words or in the form of actions. When you walk or talk, it is you, no one else. You can do more than just walk or talk, but it is you alone.
Likewise, God's words are God. There is more to God than just the words of the scripture. There are things God has not made known to us or to Jesus Christ for that matter. God is not only words but actions as well. God's actions are no ones else's, but God's. There are actions that God's word tells us that He will do, but has not done yet. For instance, the book of Revelation. Do we trust God's words that He will do them?
“From what I read you are saying that the “word” is God Himself and is NOT a separate person in John 1:1-3
“The above discussion makes it clear that God's word, logos, is a part of God, they originated with God, they tell us about God. When words leave a person, when you or I give out words from our mouths, now they can be received by anyone who cares to read them or listen to them. We gave our word to others. God gave and gives His word.
God's words were with God, they are God and are with God. All these same were with God in the beginning.
Some times our words are not enough, we must follow them with action. Or sometimes we do not speak, we simply act, we do. We are to be doers of the word. God does His part of the word, we do our part of doing the word.
The “word”, the logos of John 1:1 is not a separate person.
“Once again:
Jhn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. “
Indeed.
“How many “people” are here? Two
Identify them. Word, God
How do we know? The word WITH shows that Word was WITH God.”Here you jump to unfounded conclusion. Word is not referring to a person, but rather “the thought behind the words used.” That is the standard definition for the word, logos.
God's word was with God. Is you word with you? Of course, where else could it be?
God started this whole thing with His words, from our perspective. See Genesis 1:1, In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth…..
The first thing we know about God is His words, and correspondingly His actions.
Was God's word there in the beginning? Yes, God knew what He was going to do and say before He did and said them. Maybe, you too, think about what you do and say before you do and say them? Of course, you do. We are to ponder the path of our feet.
“Now if you don't agree with verse 1 we have:
Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God. “
Funny, John 1:2, does not say that, it says, ” The same was in the beginning with God.”
It does not say “He”. It says, “the same” the word was in the beginning with God.”
God knew what His word was going to say, long before you and I ever existed. Even before Genesis 1:1. God planned ahead, and you know what? He planned our redemption long before Adam and Eve messed up. His plan included His son, Jesus Christ, who was given the responsibility to redeem us.
Ephesians 2:10, ” For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.”
What are the plans that God has for you and I ? What are the works that God before ordained that you and I should walk in? Are we doing them?
You were a part of God's plan, too.
We need Jesus Christ's example to show us how to do our ordained works.
We need to take his example.
We need to get busy.
Romans 12:11, ” Not slothful in business; fervent in spirit; serving the Lord;”
barley
Hi Barley,Excellent reply!
John 1:1…
In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God.English ↔ Hebrew ↔ Greek
“Word of God”(86) = (אלהים](86] = [ο λογος](86)th Prime Hō Lōgôs
“Word of God” ↔ “God” ↔ “The Word”God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgTo all! The Word of God in John 1:1 is not the Almighty God, it is who became Jesus. God never has been seen or heard. John 5:37 The Word of God however is who became Jesus. The reason I can say that because in
Rev. 19:13 it says this
He was clothed in a robe dipped in blood and His name is called The Word of God.
verse 14 And the armies in heaven clothed in fine linen, white and clean followed Him in white Horses.
verse 15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
verse 16 And on His robe a name is written:” KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
There is not another being that could fit this description at all. He will come again as The Word of God…..
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Baker @ Aug. 21 2010,14:47) To all! The Word of God in John 1:1 is not the Almighty God, it is who became Jesus. God never has been seen or heard. John 5:37 The Word of God however is who became Jesus. The reason I can say that because in
Rev. 19:13 it says this
He was clothed in a robe dipped in blood and His name is called The Word of God.
verse 14 And the armies in heaven clothed in fine linen, white and clean followed Him in white Horses.
verse 15 Now out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should strike the nations. And He Himself will rule them with a rod of iron. He Himself treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
verse 16 And on His robe a name is written:” KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
There is not another being that could fit this description at all. He will come again as The Word of God…..
Peace and Love Irene
Hi Irene,You have a lot of trouble understanding “Rev.19:11-21” is talking about The “HolySpirit”; but I will try to help!
“Father: The Word“ = “HolySpirit“
Isaiah means: (YHVH=63) “Ya is Savior”
(Click Here)Isaiah 63:2-10 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel(Jer.4:30), and thy garments like him
that treadeth in the winefat? I (HolySpirit) have trodden the winepress alone (Rev.19:15);
and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample
them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments(Rev.19:13), and I will
stain all my raiment. For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.
And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine
own arm brought salvation unto me(Job.40:10-14); and my fury, it upheld me. And I will tread down the
people in mine anger, and make them drunk in my fury, and I will bring down their strength(Ez.28:9) to
the earth. I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the LORD, and the praises of the LORD, according to
all that the LORD hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which
he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his loving-
kindnesses. For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Savior.
In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his
pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old. But they rebelled, and
vexed his HolySpirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he(HolySpirit) fought against them.The “HolySpirit” is indeed “The Word”; does this information help you(Irene) to understand? (Mark 4:12)
Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 27:4-5)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 18 2010,04:30) Mke……..So let examine another Lie then………..You and the rest say Jesus was (the) Word of GOD right, You all quote John I:1 as Jesus being (the) word mentioned there right, But as i have brought out before it SAYS (“THE WORD (WAS) GOD”) So how can that be then if JESUS WAS (THE) definite article “WORD”.
Hi Gene,Good………let's DO examine that lie. It is the modern language translations that render a capital “G” and translate John 1:1 as “and the Word was God”. That was never John's intent as his other writings clearly indicate he knew Jesus was NOT God Almighty Himself. John says Jesus was “the only begotten god”. Now does God Almighty have a beginning? Is God Almighty “begotten” by anyone? John knew full well that Jesus was the Son of God Almighty – not God Almighty Himself, for he said exactly that:
John 20:31 NIV
But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.This is John 1:1 in the actual Greek it was written in:
(GNT+) εν1722 PREP αρχη746 N-DSF ην2258 V-IXI-3S
in beginning wasο3588 T-NSM λογος3056 N-NSM και2532 CONJ ο3588 T-
the word and theNSM λογος3056 N-NSM ην2258 V-IXI-3S προς4314 PREP
word was toward(or with)τον3588 T-ASM θεον2316 N-ASM και2532 CONJ θεος2316
the god and godN-NSM ην2258 V-IXI-3S ο3588 T-NSM λογος3056 N-NSM
was the wordin beginning was the word and the word was with the god and god was the word
You'll notice the word was with THE god, but was (a) god. In the Koine' Greek language, the indefinite article “a” was left out and has to be added by English translators to make sense in our language. This happens twice in John 8:44:
John 8:44
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.Neither of the “a's” I've bolded and underlined are in the Greek text, but are added in every English translation for our understanding. The problem is, the English translations are almost exclusively trinitarian, and none of them want to add the “a” in John 1:1, for they WANT Jesus to be “God Almighty Himself”, and omitting the “a” and capping the “G” makes John 1:1 one of their best “trinity proof texts”.
But you and I know that John called one “god” and said that one was with “THE God”. And based on how the word “god” was used back then, all John was saying was that the Word was “a mighty one” who was with “THE Almighty One” in the beginning.
Now there are many “experts” in the Greek language who will argue this back and forth with many techical terms and “rules of Greek grammar”, but all one has to do is use is the good sense that God gave us. Mikeboll 64 cannot possibly be WITH Mikeboll 64. So therefore, if the Word IS God Almighty, it could not be said that the Word was WITH God Almighty.
I know you don't like the word “god” used about Jesus, but you must face up to the scriptures that have many who are not God Almighty being called “god”. It meant “mighty one”, and Jesus most definitely IS a “mighty one”. And Jehovah Himself foretold through Isaiah that His Messiah would be called “mighty god”, so we knew it was coming.
Are you in agreement with this evidence about John 1:1? If not, let's talk this “lie” out. Because once you understand Jesus was in fact the “Word” who was with God in the beginning, all the rest will fall into place Gene.
peace and love,
mikeHi All,
I've found a verse in Acts that I've never seen mentioned before in relation to John 1:1, and I think it sheds some light on the matter.
Acts 28:6 NIV
6The people expected him to swell up or suddenly fall dead, but after waiting a long time and seeing nothing unusual happen to him, they changed their minds and said he was a god.Like John 1:1, the indefinite article “A” is not in the Greek text here, yet all translations add it because it is clear that Paul was not “THE GOD”, but “A mighty one” because he could be bitten by a poisenous snake and show no ill effects.
And it should be translated the same way in John 1:1, because it is also clear from that context that the Word cannot be “THE GOD” that he is “WITH”.
peace and love,
mikeMIKE………. God and his Word are not separable no more than you and yours words are , you and yours words are one and the same person unless you are (QUOTING) someone else's words, and in that case they would not be your words. And Jesus plainly said the words he spoke were (NOT) his words , but GOD'S WORDS he was relaying to us. Not even to mention If John wanted to mean Jesus there he simply would have written Jesus there , has that ever crossed you mind Mike?.
Another thing, the upper and lower case lettering of the GREEK Writings or English make no difference , Because (ALL) original Greek Text were written in CAPITAL or UPPER CASE LETTERS, and the Lower case littering in Greek did not even exist until 700-900 AD. Check it out before we continue, this discussion OK?. Lets at least come to this understanding before we proceed.
Mike haven't you noticed you have to always try to find some little thing to try to make what the plain reading of the text in context does not really say, doesn't that at least bother you somewhat? like i said before ,”You strain out a gnat and swallow a Camel”. IMO
peace and love………………………gene
Mike……………Jesus said from out of the heart man speaks, His words proceed out from (his) heart, and that is what defiles him, So it is with GOD, He speaks His Words out of (His Heart) and that is what Glorifies HIM and Proves he alone is truly righteous. God and His Words are one and the same thing Mike and GODS WORDS (ARE) SPIRIT and (ARE) LIFE> Jesus Spoke (GODS WORDS) to Us NOT (HIS WORDS).
peace and love………………………………..gene
https://heavennet.net/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=20;t=2103;hl=coptic
For an insanely interesting look at how people living BACK THEN and who actually had an indefinite article in their language, check out that thread above.
The very first translations where they had the word “a” in their langauge, they did include the “a” in the text.
Of course, Greek, Latin, amaraic, etc… the langauges that came before English had no indefinite article, so until the 1500's it wasn't even an option. But of course, just a couple hundred years after the original text was written, the coptic translations included the indefinite article. It was basically Egyptian written in Greek letters with a few letters added.
And here's the kicker:
THEY TRANSLATED THIS WHILE COMMON (KOINE) GREEK WAS STILL SPOKEN AS A LANGUAGE. How did they translate it?
“a god.”
Gene:
Quote Not even to mention If John wanted to mean Jesus there he simply would have written Jesus there , has that ever crossed you mind Mike?.
Revelation 19:11-16 NIV
11I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. 12His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter.” He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:
KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.John doesn't call him “Jesus” in this passage either. But do you refute that it is Jesus he is writing about?
Gene:
Quote Another thing, the upper and lower case lettering of the GREEK Writings or English make no difference , Because (ALL) original Greek Text were written in CAPITAL or UPPER CASE LETTERS
I'll go along with that Gene…….in fact I've posted the same thing before. I posted it because it gives MORE support to my understanding. Without distinguishing between upper and lower case letters, John 1:1 says, “THE WORD WAS WITH THE GOD, AND THE WORD WAS [A] GOD”. So the Word was “god” who was WITH………..THE god. John clearly distinguished between the two by adding the definite article “THE” before only one of them.One was (add the definite article here) THE God. The other was (omit the definite article here which is implied and would later be added by English – and apparently Egyptian – speaking languages) god.
And when we add the indefinite article like we should, one was THE GOD, and the other was A GOD.
Gene:
Quote Mike haven't you noticed you have to always try to find some little thing to try to make what the plain reading of the text in context does not really say, doesn't that at least bother you somewhat?
No Gene. What bothers me is your inate ability to read a scripture and come to an almost opposite understanding of it than a sensible person would.Gene, what exact “WORD” of God BECAME FLESH? Which “WORD” of God dwelled among us had the glory of an only begotten son?
These have been asked and ignored before. Please answer the questions this time.
peace and love,
mikeMike…………..Jesus said GOD was A SPIRIT, he also said the Words He spoke to Us (ARE) SPIRIT and LIFE. He also said those word were (NOT) HIS WORDS. GET IT?. Now if Jesus said GOD (IS) A SPIRIT and then Said those WORDS were SPIRIT , Now ask yourself Is GODS WORD GOD, answer YES IT IS, and they are LIFE also. Now with that simple understand go Back to JOHN 1:1, now Who is the WORD it (IS) and (WAS) GOD, and It is WITH GOD and It was IN the beginning With GOD because it IS Part of GOD it was HIS WORD and that is Part of GOD. Just as your words are Part of YOU. Man i just can't believe how screwed up you people can get over these simple things . Jesus spoke GOD the FATHERS WORD to US he was and is the SPOKESMAN of GOD, but He is NOT the ORIGIN of those WORD so He is NOT the WORDS He SPOKE to US no matte how much he is called the word of GOD , That is only saying He is speaking GODS Words to us not his words, and Nothing MORE. Jesus was not in the beginning with GOD as the WORD, that whole concept is false preexistence teaching of Trinitarians, Which you people have excepted. Mike the funny part of this is you say your are not trinitarians but you keep most there beliefs,of preexistence, that is like the Protestants saying they are not Catholics but keep nearly all there days and beliefs ,customs and practices. It's a Joke at best.
peace and love…………………………………..gene
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