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Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
So you do realize that the scripture doesn't say that believing in God Almighty is less than believing in Jesus whom God sent, right?Quote (chosenone @ June 27 2009,16:30) bd, you say “all mankind WILL NOT be saved”, yet scripture says that all mankind WILL be saved! 1Tim.4:9-11 …9 Faithful is the saying and worthy of all welcome
10 (for for this are we toiling and being reproached), that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind,
11 especially of believers. These things be charging and teaching.Blessings.
If all mankind will be saved then good is equal to evil and we have no moral basis not to sin. The scripture does not support this belief.Matthew 13:41-43 (King James Version)
41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Matthew 13:49-51 (King James Version)
49So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
50And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Luke 13:27-29 (King James Version)
27But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
28There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
Quote (bodhitharta @ June 27 2009,17:08) Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
So you do realize that the scripture doesn't say that believing in God Almighty is less than believing in Jesus whom God sent, right?
Man, you walk a crooked mile.Georg
Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,01:53) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 27 2009,17:08) Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
So you do realize that the scripture doesn't say that believing in God Almighty is less than believing in Jesus whom God sent, right?
Man, you walk a crooked mile.Georg
How so?Is God greter than his servant? Jesus said that no servant is greater than his master.
Are you saying that if the one sent tells me to worship the one who sent him and I do what the one sent tells me to do that somehow that is wrong?
Did Jesus tell you to worship him or his Father?
It has pleased the Father to exalt His only begotten Son, who after humbling Himself, the Father has chosen to set Him above all powers and authority. Scripture is also clear that we are to worship God even from the mouth of Jesus
Quote
Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.' “
but some scriptures do seem to indicate that Jesus while always urging others to worship the Father, and there is no record of His seeking it, He did however allow men to worship Him.Quote
Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.”Suddenly Jesus met them. “Greetings,” he said. They came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him.
When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted.
Then they worshiped him and returned to Jerusalem with great joy.
Then the man said, “Lord, I believe,” and he worshiped him.
And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says, “Let all God's angels worship him.”
Scripture also seems to be quick to point out if worship was inappropriate:
Quote
At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, “Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.”
My opinion is that scripture is clear that the Son is not greater or even equal to the Father. He always has an attitude of submission, dependence, and worship towards the Father and instructs us to do likewise. Who am I to argue with my Lord.Wm
Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
bod…Where in the bible do you read that Jews don't have to believe in the gospel? And where did I say all Israel will be saved, even if they reject the gospel? And I thought Nick was a spinner.
Even my friends would not receive salvation by believing what I believe, am I the savior? this is foolish talk, should I be surprised it comes from you?
Either you try to confuse me, or you are so confused you don't know what you're saying.
Is this your way of avoiding responding to the scriptures I gave you?Georg
Quote (bodhitharta @ June 27 2009,17:13) Quote (chosenone @ June 27 2009,16:30) bd, you say “all mankind WILL NOT be saved”, yet scripture says that all mankind WILL be saved! 1Tim.4:9-11 …9 Faithful is the saying and worthy of all welcome
10 (for for this are we toiling and being reproached), that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind,
11 especially of believers. These things be charging and teaching.Blessings.
If all mankind will be saved then good is equal to evil and we have no moral basis not to sin. The scripture does not support this belief.Matthew 13:41-43 (King James Version)
41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Matthew 13:49-51 (King James Version)
49So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
50And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Luke 13:27-29 (King James Version)
27But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
28There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
You say “If all mankind will be saved then good is equal to evil and we have no moral basis not to sin. The scripture does not support this belief”.We are ALL sinners, there is “none righteous”. Are some “more evil” than others? In human wisdon we might say “yes” some are more evil than others, but scripture says “we are ALL sinners”. BUT …in 2Cor.5:18-19
18 Yet all is of God, Who conciliates us to Himself through Christ, and is giving us the dispensation of the conciliation,
19 how that God was in Christ, conciliating the world to Himself, not reckoning their offenses to them,Notice “ALL” have been declared “righteous” through the sacrifice of our Lord and saviour Christ Jesus, He (God), sees our sin no more.
You see, “all is of God”, we cannot save ourselves by doing “this” or “that”. Those who think they are saved by their own actions decieve themselves.
We should “thank God”, for it is by Him, through His Son “Christ Jesus”, that is “THE SAVIOUR OF ALL MANKIND”. (1Tim4:9-11).
Blessings.
Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,05:47) Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
bod…Where in the bible do you read that Jews don't have to believe in the gospel? And where did I say all Israel will be saved, even if they reject the gospel? And I thought Nick was a spinner.
Even my friends would not receive salvation by believing what I believe, am I the savior? this is foolish talk, should I be surprised it comes from you?
Either you try to confuse me, or you are so confused you don't know what you're saying.
Is this your way of avoiding responding to the scriptures I gave you?Georg
Romans 11:26 says “All Israel shall be saved”
Romand 11:28 says “As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sake”Doesn't that mean that All of Israel even the enemies of the gospel will be saved?
I really don't mean to confuse anyone and I really enjoy all the wonderful interaction here.
If I have not responded to a scripture you gave me I apologize, I may have felt I responded to it.
I have asked several times were Jews going to hell for not believeing in Jesus but no one will answer me with a yes or no.
The point is important because If they are not going to hell(where there will be gnashing of teeth and torment according to Jesus) Then they will receive salvation without believing in Jesus and if that is the case salvation must be based on something other than belief in Jesus.
Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,06:02) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,05:47) Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
bod…Where in the bible do you read that Jews don't have to believe in the gospel? And where did I say all Israel will be saved, even if they reject the gospel? And I thought Nick was a spinner.
Even my friends would not receive salvation by believing what I believe, am I the savior? this is foolish talk, should I be surprised it comes from you?
Either you try to confuse me, or you are so confused you don't know what you're saying.
Is this your way of avoiding responding to the scriptures I gave you?Georg
Romans 11:26 says “All Israel shall be saved”
Romand 11:28 says “As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sake”Doesn't that mean that All of Israel even the enemies of the gospel will be saved?
I really don't mean to confuse anyone and I really enjoy all the wonderful interaction here.
If I have not responded to a scripture you gave me I apologize, I may have felt I responded to it.
I have asked several times were Jews going to hell for not believeing in Jesus but no one will answer me with a yes or no.
The point is important because If they are not going to hell(where there will be gnashing of teeth and torment according to Jesus) Then they will receive salvation without believing in Jesus and if that is the case salvation must be based on something other than belief in Jesus.
You say “The point is important because If they are not going to hell(where there will be gnashing of teeth and torment according to Jesus) Then they will receive salvation without believing in Jesus and if that is the case salvation must be based on something other than belief in Jesus”.Because they (Jews), have rejected thier “Messiah”, does not mean they will not accept Him in the future, See Hebrews 8:8-13
Heb.8:8-13 8 For, blaming them, He is saying, “Lo! the days are coming,” the Lord is saying, “And I shall be concluding with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah a new covenant,
9 Not in accord with the covenant which I make with their fathers In the day of My taking hold of their hand To be leading them out of the land of Egypt, Seeing that they do not remain in My covenant, And I neglect them,” the Lord is saying,
10 “For this is the covenant which I shall be covenanting with the house of Israel after those days,” the Lord is saying: “Imparting My laws to their comprehension, On their hearts, also, shall I be inscribing them, And I shall be to them for a God, And they shall be to Me for a people.
11 And by no means should each be teaching his fellow citizen, And each his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord!' For all shall be acquainted with Me, From their little to their great,
12 For I shall be propitious to their injustices, And of their sins and their lawlessnesses should I under no circumstances still be reminded.”
13 In saying “new,” He has made the former old. Now that which is growing old and decrepit is near its disappearance.Notice this scripture is to “the house of Israel and with the house of Judah” (the Jews), it is yet in the future.
So the answer to your question is… No, the Jews will not go to Hell. Nore will anyone else for that matter.
Blessings.
Quote (chosenone @ June 28 2009,06:17) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,06:02) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,05:47) Quote (Cindy @ June 27 2009,13:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 26 2009,16:54) Quote (Cindy @ June 26 2009,16:34) Perhaps this will answer your questions. Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Rom 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
Rom 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.You also need to understand that “hell”, is nothing more than a hole in the ground, a “grave”.
You die, some one will put you into your hell/grave.
You have to get away from the foolish notion that man is immortal. The bible clearly states, only God is immortal.1Ti 6:16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
Georg
Georg,So here you you seem to fully admit that “All” Israel will be saved even if they reject the Gospel.
So Jews don't need to believe in the Gospel of Jesus in order to be saved, right?
So your enimies do not have to believe what you believe to receive salvation, right?
So why do you preach that salvation can only come through Jesus Christ?
bod…It is not I that preaches that.
Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.I find it naive to think that just because it says “all”, to take that literal and say, no matter what any one does, or doesn't do, he will be saved. There are after all, enough scriptures that teach to the contrary.
God will be in all that obey, to think or say otherwise is just plain foolish.Georg
bod…Where in the bible do you read that Jews don't have to believe in the gospel? And where did I say all Israel will be saved, even if they reject the gospel? And I thought Nick was a spinner.
Even my friends would not receive salvation by believing what I believe, am I the savior? this is foolish talk, should I be surprised it comes from you?
Either you try to confuse me, or you are so confused you don't know what you're saying.
Is this your way of avoiding responding to the scriptures I gave you?Georg
Romans 11:26 says “All Israel shall be saved”
Romand 11:28 says “As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sake”Doesn't that mean that All of Israel even the enemies of the gospel will be saved?
I really don't mean to confuse anyone and I really enjoy all the wonderful interaction here.
If I have not responded to a scripture you gave me I apologize, I may have felt I responded to it.
I have asked several times were Jews going to hell for not believeing in Jesus but no one will answer me with a yes or no.
The point is important because If they are not going to hell(where there will be gnashing of teeth and torment according to Jesus) Then they will receive salvation without believing in Jesus and if that is the case salvation must be based on something other than belief in Jesus.
You say “The point is important because If they are not going to hell(where there will be gnashing of teeth and torment according to Jesus) Then they will receive salvation without believing in Jesus and if that is the case salvation must be based on something other than belief in Jesus”.Because they (Jews), have rejected thier “Messiah”, does not mean they will not accept Him in the future, See Hebrews 8:8-13
Heb.8:8-13 8 For, blaming them, He is saying, “Lo! the days are coming,” the Lord is saying, “And I shall be concluding with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah a new covenant,
9 Not in accord with the covenant which I make with their fathers In the day of My taking hold of their hand To be leading them out of the land of Egypt, Seeing that they do not remain in My covenant, And I neglect them,” the Lord is saying,
10 “For this is the covenant which I shall be covenanting with the house of Israel after those days,” the Lord is saying: “Imparting My laws to their comprehension, On their hearts, also, shall I be inscribing them, And I shall be to them for a God, And they shall be to Me for a people.
11 And by no means should each be teaching his fellow citizen, And each his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord!' For all shall be acquainted with Me, From their little to their great,
12 For I shall be propitious to their injustices, And of their sins and their lawlessnesses should I under no circumstances still be reminded.”
13 In saying “new,” He has made the former old. Now that which is growing old and decrepit is near its disappearance.Notice this scripture is to “the house of Israel and with the house of Judah” (the Jews), it is yet in the future.
So the answer to your question is… No, the Jews will not go to Hell. Nore will anyone else for that matter.
Blessings.
So are you now saying that no one is going to hell no matter what they do?They don't have to believe in Jesus or God or have love in their hearts or anything. So, Atheists can celebrate since they can curse God, blaspheme and do whatever else feels good to them because no one is going to hell according to you.
(40) And We shall present Hell that day for Unbelievers to see, all spread out,-
( سورة الكهف , Al-Kahf, Chapter #18, Verse #100)Mark 9:42-44 (King James Version)
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
(7) When angels take the so
uls of those who die in sin against their souls, they say: “In what (plight) Were ye?” They reply: “Weak and oppressed Were we in the earth.” They say: “Was not the earth of Allah spacious enough for you to move yourselves away (From evil)?” Such men will find their abode in Hell,- What an evil refuge! –
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #97)Matthew 23:32-34 (King James Version)
33Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
(31) Into Hell? They will burn therein,- an evil place to stay in!
( سورة إبراهيم , Ibrahim, Chapter #14, Verse #29)(35) It may be that your Lord may (yet) show Mercy unto you; but if ye revert (to your sins), We shall revert (to Our punishments): And we have made Hell a prison for those who reject (all Faith).
( سورة الإسراء , Al-Isra, Chapter #17, Verse #8)(36) If any do wish for the transitory things (of this life), We readily grant them – such things as We will, to such person as We will: in the end have We provided Hell for them: they will burn therein, disgraced and rejected.
( سورة الإسراء , Al-Isra, Chapter #17, Verse #18)Matthew 5:21-23 (King James Version)
21Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
22But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire
Quote (chosenone @ June 28 2009,05:54) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 27 2009,17:13) Quote (chosenone @ June 27 2009,16:30) bd, you say “all mankind WILL NOT be saved”, yet scripture says that all mankind WILL be saved! 1Tim.4:9-11 …9 Faithful is the saying and worthy of all welcome
10 (for for this are we toiling and being reproached), that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind,
11 especially of believers. These things be charging and teaching.Blessings.
If all mankind will be saved then good is equal to evil and we have no moral basis not to sin. The scripture does not support this belief.Matthew 13:41-43 (King James Version)
41The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Matthew 13:49-51 (King James Version)
49So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
50And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth
Luke 13:27-29 (King James Version)
27But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
28There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
You say “If all mankind will be saved then good is equal to evil and we have no moral basis not to sin. The scripture does not support this belief”.We are ALL sinners, there is “none righteous”. Are some “more evil” than others? In human wisdon we might say “yes” some are more evil than others, but scripture says “we are ALL sinners”. BUT …in 2Cor.5:18-19
18 Yet all is of God, Who conciliates us to Himself through Christ, and is giving us the dispensation of the conciliation,
19 how that God was in Christ, conciliating the world to Himself, not reckoning their offenses to them,Notice “ALL” have been declared “righteous” through the sacrifice of our Lord and saviour Christ Jesus, He (God), sees our sin no more.
You see, “all is of God”, we cannot save ourselves by doing “this” or “that”. Those who think they are saved by their own actions decieve themselves.
We should “thank God”, for it is by Him, through His Son “Christ Jesus”, that is “THE SAVIOUR OF ALL MANKIND”. (1Tim4:9-11).
Blessings.
Christ is saying there is an actual hell that is a fiery punishment. You keep listening to Paul over what Christ says himself but I have shown you that Paul admits he lied to spread the gospel.Jesus didn't say that there was no righteous men in-fact Jesus said he did not come for the righteous but for the sinner
Genesis 15
6 And he(Abraham) believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
Genesis 18:22-24 (King James Version)
22And the men turned their faces from thence, and went toward Sodom: but Abraham stood yet before the LORD.
23And Abraham drew near, and said, Wilt thou also destroy the righteous with the wicked?
This is proof that Lot and all who were spared with him were righteous
2 Samuel 22:20-22 (King James Version)
20He brought me forth also into a large place: he delivered me, because he delighted in me.
21The LORD rewarded me according to my righteousness: according to the cleanness of my hands hath he recompensed me.
22For I have kept the ways of the LORD, and have not wickedly departed from my God.
This is proof David was righteous
Luke 5:31-33 (King James Version)
31And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Jesus himself says their are righteous people
Acts 10:34-36 (King James Version)
34Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
The apostle peter says that fearing God and worshiping God is acceptable to God.
The truth is God has always provided us with tools to be righteous and there have always been righteous men upon the earth.
To all! I have read some of the post listed here. I like to say this to you. The Jewish People have always been God's People and He will not forsake them. If you read in Romans you will see that God will graft them in again. And finally they will be an example to all, which God wanted do from the beginning. There are also Jews that did become Christians. At the first Pentecost Sunday a multitude received the Holy Spirit. Now to us. Is salvation an Automatic one? IMO no! Why would Jesus on the Sermon on the Mount say what He did, and a couple of month's later changed it. If we walk in the Spirit we will not sin. However John tells us if we think we have not sinned, the truth is not in us. What we have now is a Mediator Jesus Christ who Died for us, He is the perfect Sacrifice, and is sited at the right hand of the Father. We can now go directly to the Throne of God and ask for forgiveness of that sin. In an twinkling of the eye He will forgive that sin. Many believe that they do not have to do anything anymore, but that is IMO not so. Christ is our Savior and when we stay under His Blood we are saved, but just remember that if by human nature we do sin, we know where to go. We do have to strive to become more Christ like though. Let the mind which is in Christ be in you.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,08:05) To all! I have read some of the post listed here. I like to say this to you. The Jewish People have always been God's People and He will not forsake them. If you read in Romans you will see that God will graft them in again. And finally they will be an example to all, which God wanted do from the beginning. There are also Jews that did become Christians. At the first Pentecost Sunday a multitude received the Holy Spirit. Now to us. Is salvation an Automatic one? IMO no! Why would Jesus on the Sermon on the Mount say what He did, and a couple of month's later changed it. If we walk in the Spirit we will not sin. However John tells us if we think we have not sinned, the truth is not in us. What we have now is a Mediator Jesus Christ who Died for us, He is the perfect Sacrifice, and is sited at the right hand of the Father. We can now go directly to the Throne of God and ask for forgiveness of that sin. In an twinkling of the eye He will forgive that sin. Many believe that they do not have to do anything anymore, but that is IMO not so. Christ is our Savior and when we stay under His Blood we are saved, but just remember that if by human nature we do sin, we know where to go. We do have to strive to become more Christ like though. Let the mind which is in Christ be in you.
Peace and Love Irene
So Irene,Jews do not have to believe in Christ, right?
In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
IreneQuote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,10:43) In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
Irene
Wow, it amazes me that for 8 pages no one can say yes or no?Okay then will some Jews go to hell? Perhaps someone who curses God, kills without repenting?
Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,14:56) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,10:43) In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
Irene
Wow, it amazes me that for 8 pages no one can say yes or no?Okay then will some Jews go to hell? Perhaps someone who curses God, kills without repenting?
Do yoy know why I do not judge them/ That is God's Job, not mine.
IreneQuote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,15:10) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,14:56) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,10:43) In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
Irene
Wow, it amazes me that for 8 pages no one can say yes or no?Okay then will some Jews go to hell? Perhaps someone who curses God, kills without repenting?
Do yoy know why I do not judge them/ That is God's Job, not mine.
Irene
Okay, so you are saying that you will not judge Muslims, The Quran or anyone else because you simply do not who is going to hell, is that right?Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,14:56) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,10:43) In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
Irene
Wow, it amazes me that for 8 pages no one can say yes or no?Okay then will some Jews go to hell? Perhaps someone who curses God, kills without repenting?
bod…I have a feeling you are toying with us, simply because of the way you twist what was said.
If you believe any one goes to “hell”, you must also believe man “has” a soul. Since that concept is wrong, so is the idea of a literal “hell”.
So, to finally answer your question, NO, no Jew goes to “hell”.Georg
Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,17:16) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 28 2009,14:56) Quote (Cindy @ June 28 2009,10:43) In all what I wrote, you have to ask me that Question? You answer that yourself. Will all the Truths be taught in the Millenium?
Irene
Wow, it amazes me that for 8 pages no one can say yes or no?Okay then will some Jews go to hell? Perhaps someone who curses God, kills without repenting?
bod…I have a feeling you are toying with us, simply because of the way you twist what was said.
If you believe any one goes to “hell”, you must also believe man “has” a soul. Since that concept is wrong, so is the idea of a literal “hell”.
So, to finally answer your question, NO, no Jew goes to “hell”.Georg
Thank you.Why did Jesus say that man had a soul?
Matthew 10:27-29 (King James Version)
28And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
and what about this statement:
1 Thessalonians 5:22-24 (King James Version)
22Abstain from all appearance of evil.
23And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
are these verses wrong?
bod…
Paul says, there is a spirit in man, we call it a mind, that is the image God has made us in, it is the means to communicate with God. It is also our memory, our understanding, how we behave, it is what makes us who we are. When we die the first time, God will preserve all of this. What Jesus is referring to in Mat. 10:28 is, should you die again in the second death, all this and the body will be destroyed for ever.
Georg
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