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Mike…………Who said Jehovah was there , I said His SPIRIT WAS, have you forgot Mike?…… Not by power or strength, but (BY) MY SPIRIT says the Almighty. And again GOD (IS) A SPIRIT Mike if you understood what Spirit really was, this would make sense to you easily. IMO
peace and love………………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 05 2012,17:50) Mike…………Who said Jehovah was there , I said His SPIRIT WAS,
So then you agree that Jehovah Himself was not really dwelling inside the flesh body of Jesus?Mike…………I believe GOD is Spirit and live in all creation to sustain it life. I don't see Yahweh or Jehovah as a Person like a Man or angel i see him as Omnipresent, All Powerful, All Knowing, Knowing the end from the very beginning of all things. As far as an individual being goes it does seem from scripture he may be, but then again seeing no one have ever seen him as such how can i make that assumption. When i pray i pray as if i am in his presence and in my minds eye i see him as a single being, or Person. I believe he is always present both in and out of his creation by his spirits that go out from him into all the earth, the act as His eyes , but there is more becasue Spirit is Just spirit and can impute (INTELLECT) to us but there is the other part and that “POWER”, I Believe Yahweh or Jehovah has the Power to execute his will on all thing in existence both Spirits and Matter.
I don't see God who is (SPIRIT) as the LORD or YAHWEH , because it say “HEAR O ISREAL THE LORD ” OUR GOD' IS “ONE LORD” OR YAHWEH,
Jesus reckoned God and the Father like they are one, But he said later the He spoke about the Father in a Proverbial language that means in “Fictitious illustrations”. But a time would come when he would show us plainly about the FATHER, so until then it may be just all speculations going on about this.
There is a statement in Revelations that says in the days of these two witness that the MYSTERY of GOD should be known. I can't recall exactly where it is right now but if you like i can find it. So this all shows there is a Mystery surrounding the LORD Jehovah or Father himslef. The disciples wanted to know this also and once ask Jesus to show them the Father and Jesus' answer was “How long have in been with you and your say Show me the Father” the Father is (IN) Me he said over and over, and Thomas seemed to think the presents of the FATHER was there when he said “MY LORD (AND) MY GOD”.
We all still have much to learn i believe.
peace and love……………………………………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 06 2012,10:28) We all still have much to learn i believe.
I can't argue with that, Gene.
peace,
mikeTo all…………Has anyone heard from our brother Kerwin lately, I know he had Major Kidney problems. We should all pray for him, i fear he may have taken a turn for the worse.
peace and love to you all…………………………………………….gene
Mike……….Thanks God does Hear our Prayers brother.
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………gene
Mike ………..That also is true. He does consider our motives and respect for him when in his presence. I know there is Both Goodness and Severity with GOD. I have tasted both, And the saying “smite a fool and the simple are made wise” always applies with our GOD. WE need to all be real somber when we come before him.
peace and love………………………………………………..gene
To All………………Back to the subject ….I maintain Jesus was NOT a MORPHED Being from another existence prior to his berth on this earth. He was prophesied to come into existence from the beginning he was in GOD Plan and Purpose for man KIND all along from the very start of the Creation of Man. He was from the seed of Jesse and King David, Just as he said he was .
Many Prophets prophesied about him coming through existence through his brethren the Isrealites and did, as Jew He was the Prophesied Messiah that was “TO COME” nothing in scripture say he preexisted his berth on this earth at all. Just another false religious teaching brought into existence first by the Gnostic's then the Trinitarians and then the Preexistences like the JW'S and others here. All these have there origins in MYSTERY PAGAN TEACHINGS of Man GOD”S and MORPHING PROCESSES. Pure pagan Thought from the very start. IMO
peace and love to you all…………………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 16 2012,10:57) To All………………Back to the subject ….I maintain Jesus was NOT a MORPHED Being from another existence prior to his berth on this earth. He was prophesied to come into existence from the beginning he was in GOD Plan and Purpose for man KIND all along from the very start of the Creation of Man. He was from the seed of Jesse and King David, Just as he said he was . Many Prophets prophesied about him coming through existence through his brethren the Isrealites and did, as Jew He was the Prophesied Messiah that was “TO COME” nothing in scripture say he preexisted his berth on this earth at all. Just another false religious teaching brought into existence first by the Gnostic's then the Trinitarians and then the Preexistences like the JW'S and others here. All these have there origins in MYSTERY PAGAN TEACHINGS of Man GOD”S and MORPHING PROCESSES. Pure pagan Thought from the very start. IMO
peace and love to you all…………………………………………………………gene
geneQuote .I maintain Jesus was NOT a MORPHED Being from another existence prior to his berth on this earth no one cares for your opinion ,and so disregarded,if you have any scriptures that we may consider many would be happy to look at it and test it against all of Gods word.
Pierre
Terricca……………I and other have produced hundreds of them but you have yet to acknowledge any other them or test them either.
So in that sense we could careless what you say also, Seeing you can't back up what you say with any Scriptures at all even though you falsely accuse other of doing that, when in fact that is exactly what you do. If you believe Jesus was a “MORPHED” BEING then Produce the PROOF instead of JUST MOUTHING OFF ABOUT IT. I don't mean forcing the text to meet you DOGMAS as you so desperately try to do. IMOpeace and love………………………………………………………………gene
gene
HERE ARE A FEW SCRIPTURES ,I DO NOT SHOW ANY OPINION ;SO COULD YOU SHOW ME SCRIPTURES THAT SAYS WHAT YOU SAY WITHOUT YOUR OPINION ADDED.???
Proverbs 8:22-31 NIV
22 “The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works,
before his deeds of old;
23 I was formed long ages ago,
at the very beginning, when the world came to be.
24 When there were no watery depths, I was given birth,
when there were no springs overflowing with water;
25 before the mountains were settled in place,
before the hills, I was given birth,
26 before he made the world or its fields
or any of the dust of the earth.
27 I was there when he set the heavens in place,
when he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep,
28 when he established the clouds above
and fixed securely the fountains of the deep,
29 when he gave the sea its boundary
so the waters would not overstep his command,
and when he marked out the foundations of the earth.
30 Then I was constantly at his side.
I was filled with delight day after day,
rejoicing always in his presence,
31 rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.Proverbs 30:4 NIV
4 Who has gone up to heaven and come down?
Whose hands have gathered up the wind?
Who has wrapped up the waters in a cloak?
Who has established all the ends of the earth?
What is his name, and what is the name of his son?
Surely you know!Micah 5:2 NIV
2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clans of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times.”Isaiah 11:1 NIV
A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse; from his roots a Branch will bear fruit.Isaiah 11:10 NIV
In that day the Root of Jesse will stand as a banner for the peoples; the nations will rally to him, and his place of rest will be glorious.Matthew 22:41-46 NIV
41While the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them, 42″What do you think about the Christ? Whose son is he?”
“The son of David,” they replied.
43He said to them, “How is it then that David, speaking by the Spirit, calls him 'Lord'? For he says,
44″ 'The Lord said to my Lord:
“Sit at my right hand
until I put your enemies
under your feet.” ' 45If then David calls him 'Lord,' how can he be his son?” 46No one could say a word in reply, and from that day on no one dared to ask him any more questions.John 1:1-3 NWT
In [the] beginning the Word was, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in [the] beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence.John 1:9-12 NIV
9 The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him. 11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him. 12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—John 1:14 NIV
14The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the only begotten, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.John 1:15 NWT
15 (John bore witness about him, yes, he actually cried out—this was the one who said [it]—saying: “The one coming behind me has advanced in front of me, because he existed before me.”)John 3:13 NIV
13No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.John 3:16-19 NIV
16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.John 5:19-20 NIV
19 Jesus gave them this answer: “Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does. 20 For the Father loves the Son and shows him all he does. Yes, and he will show him even greater works than these, so that you will be amazed.John 6:32-33 NIV
32 Jesus said to them, “Very truly I tell you, it is not Moses who has given you the bread from heaven, but it is my Father who gives you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is the bread that comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”John 6:35 NIV
35 Then Jesus declared, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never go hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty.John 6:38 NIV
38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me.John 6:41-42 NIV
41 At this the Jews there began to grumble about him because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42 They said, “Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, ‘I came down from heaven’?”John 6:46 NIV
No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father.John 6:48-51 NIV
48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your ancestors ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died. 50 But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.”John 6:62 NIV
62What if you see the Son of Man ascend to where he was before!John 8:12 NIV
When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”Terricca……………..Amazing NOT so much of ONE SCRIPTURE says JESUS was a MORPHED ANGELS or for that MATTER a MORPHED BEING of ANY KIND, In fact what you posted Proves He came from the Roots of JESSE That alone Should have told you where Jesus came from. He was never “MORPHED” from any FORM to a MAN, HE was a decedent of JESSE and KING DAVID also HE was of the TRIBE of JUDAH. And quoting Scripture that have nothing to do with Jesus Like the wisdom Parts that say wisdom is personified as a SHE only shows you are trying to force the text to say Jesus was the wisdom spoken of in Prov 8:22-31, even more shows how you are twisting scriptures to meet your dogmas. Posting all kind of scriptures that don't even mention a MORPHING Process or even agreeing with what you say then saying your are scriptural about what you say is JOKE at BEST. IMO
peace and love……………………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 15 2012,11:31) Terricca……………I and other have produced hundreds of them but you have yet to acknowledge any other them or test them either.
Okay Gene,Put your money where your mouth is. Post ONE scripture right now that PROHIBITS Jesus from pre-existing as a spirit being BEFORE he was made in the likeness of a human being.
Post that ONE scripture, and let's see if it really does eliminate the possibility that Jesus pre-existed his flesh.
Mike………..”POSSIBILITY”, Why should i have to produce all those scriptures again, you will just say well does that mean its not “POSSIBLE” for both to be right? And on and on it will go. But then again that is EXACTLY what “MYSTERY RELIGION” IS right? You have these vague unspecific texts and Just force them to say what in FACT they are “NOT” SAYING at all. And when pushed to find a SPECIFIC SCRIPTURE you Can't but come back with this “DOES THAT MEAN IT COULD NOT BE POSSIBLE” , as i have said before Mike pure Garbage. Why should you or Pierre or anyone say anything is true without any Specific Scripture saying it.
I can say Jesus is the root of Jesse and KING DAVID, and that he was JEW, and he would come from the seed of a Women , and He would come from his Isrealite Brothers, and that he was “born” of a women not “MORPHED” in her, and that he is a Second ADAM , all physical existence from Mankind. Yes i can be SPECIFIC, while YOU Cant be becasue you have “NO” PROOF TEXT that say He was a MORPHED ANGELIC BEING of ANY KIND> So you introduce words like “is it Possible though” an expect me to put my faith in those words, that is a JOKE at Best Mike. No i will believe what Scripture “CLEARLY SAYS” about Jesus, and what he himself said 80 or so times that HE WAS A SON of MAN. IMO
peace and love and yours………………………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 20 2012,07:44) Mike………..”POSSIBILITY”, Why should i have to produce all those scriptures again, you will just say well does that mean its not “POSSIBLE” for both to be right? And on and on it will go. But then again that is EXACTLY what “MYSTERY RELIGION” IS right? You have these vague unspecific texts and Just force them to say what in FACT they are “NOT” SAYING at all. And when pushed to find a SPECIFIC SCRIPTURE you Can't but come back with this “DOES THAT MEAN IT COULD NOT BE POSSIBLE” , as i have said before Mike pure Garbage. Why should you or Pierre or anyone say anything is true without any Specific Scripture saying it. I can say Jesus is the root of Jesse and KING DAVID, and that he was JEW, and he would come from the seed of a Women , and He would come from his Isrealite Brothers, and that he was “born” of a women not “MORPHED” in her, and that he is a Second ADAM , all physical existence from Mankind. Yes i can be SPECIFIC, while YOU Cant be becasue you have “NO” PROOF TEXT that say He was a MORPHED ANGELIC BEING of ANY KIND> So you introduce words like “is it Possible though” an expect me to put my faith in those words, that is a JOKE at Best Mike. No i will believe what Scripture “CLEARLY SAYS” about Jesus, and what he himself said 80 or so times that HE WAS A SON of MAN. IMO
peace and love and yours………………………………………………….gene
geneQuote Why should i have to produce all those scriptures again, because in realty you never did produce any ,and please do not
produce MORPHED scripturesPierre
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 19 2012,07:44) Why should i have to produce all those scriptures again…………
I'm asking for ONE scripture, Gene. You say there are many, right? Then post ONE of them for us right here and right now, and let's discuss whether or not that scripture prohibits Jesus from pre-existing his flesh.peace,
mikeMike……..How about this Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy “SEED” and HER “SEED”
Acts 3:22, For Moses truly said unto the Fathers , a “PROPHET” shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of (from) “YOUR BRETHREN”, “LIKE” unto “ME” ………Now tell us Mike was Moses a “MORPHED” Angel or a HUMAN BEING. So how could Jesus be LIKE MOSES if He was a MORPHED Being , he would not truly be LIKE Moses now would He. Mike tell us do you see the words there that God would MORPH a “PREEXISTING ANGEL” any where there?.
Isa 11:10….> And in that day there shall be a root of (from) Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign, of the people……> Who was the Root from Jesse MIKE?
Jesus also himself said he was the Root and offspring of KING DAVID. Mike anyone with any common sense know this is talking about a HUMAN Being NOT a MORPHED ANGEL of ANY KIND. I could produce more and i have many many times contrary to what you falsely accuse me of . All of these show a Human Being not a Morphed anything . So Now you are the one saying you produce scriptures saying Jesus was a Morphed angelic being now produce JUST ONE.Trying to as i haven produced scripture is a absolute LIE MIKE, I have produced more scripture or at least as much as anyone here has ever produced. But you are indeed a typical Preexistences that is for sure thy love to try to ridicule people to try to make other think they know what they are talking about. no matter how wrong they are. Your and Terricaa are very good at dong that. When in fact it is your two who truly lack knowledge of scriptures and what they Specifically say. IMO
peace and love……………………………………….gene
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