- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (toby @ Jan. 30 2012,14:58) Hi Mikeboll. I think you know exactly what Gene is saying. 'God is not the God of the dead'
When I said “everyone”, I meant every living person. Isn't Jehovah still the God of Satan – whether or not Satan serves Him?Isn't said that God makes the sun shine and the rain fall on the wicked as well as the righteous?
Jesus calls him the Lord of heaven and earth, right?
Mike……….Why are you doing this, you unlike Pierre Know, full well know what we are saying and it is in accordance with scriptures and you Know that , so why not just agree on it for a change, Why must you seek to argue about everything we post even with scriptures to prove out points? Let me quote JESUS again one last time thou art the ” ONLY” ” TRUE” GOD Now go and figure out what “ONLY” and “TRUE” Means and remember Mike it is not us you are arguing with but Jesus' own words. IMO
peace and love………………………………………….gene
Hi Mikeboll, while I don't agree with everything Gene says in regard to his views on certain aspects of Scriptural matter, I fully agree with him on the last post.
To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
I have yet to see any PROOF from any scripture that Show any MORPHING Process at all> Trying to force text and contexts to convey what is not “CLEARLY WRITTEN” is no PROOF of ANYTHING> IMO
peace and love to all…………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 02 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING? I have yet to see any PROOF from any scripture that Show any MORPHING Process at all> Trying to force text and contexts to convey what is not “CLEARLY WRITTEN” is no PROOF of ANYTHING> IMO
peace and love to all…………………………………………………gene
gene
why is it that anyone as to prove what is spelled in black and withe into the scriptures ,
the problem is how can we make people accept the scriptures the way it is written
how can a brain full of opinions read anything just as it is written ?? that s the real problem for them not for us.
Pierre
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 01 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.Jesus, as a sentient being, had glory alongside his God before the world began. There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 02 2012,16:37) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 01 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.Jesus, as a sentient being, had glory alongside his God before the world began. There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it?
MikeQuote There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it? THIS IS THE QUESTION?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 02 2012,09:37) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 01 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.Jesus, as a sentient being, had glory alongside his God before the world began. There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it?
Mike……….so now you have quote your so call PROOF TEXT? Now tell me can i say that all so If GOD has predestined me for Glory , can i also like Jesus say I had that Glory with Him before i even came into existence or would that mean I was already in existence in Glory with Him before i was Born on this earth. You lack of understand is that that Glory was a predestined Glory Not a PAST GLORY He actually Had before He came into existence on this earth. Why do you think Jesus said (AND “NOW” FATHER GLORIFY ME” with the GLORY I HAD (this Glory was a preplanned Glory by GOD the FATHER) JESUS WAS JUST ASKING FOR IT TO TAKE PLACE (NOW) He would not have said (NOW) if that were not the case MIKE>Gene, I don't agree with you on 'Glory before the world began' but it IS an interesting point.
There should have been an 'Again' somewhere in that sentence.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2012,20:30) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 02 2012,09:37) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 01 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.Jesus, as a sentient being, had glory alongside his God before the world began. There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it?
Mike……….so now you have quote your so call PROOF TEXT?
Yes Gene,One of the more than 60 proof texts we've compiled for you.
Quote Now tell me can i say that all so If GOD has predestined me for Glory , can i also like Jesus say I had that Glory with Him before i even came into existence………
No Gene, you couldn't. You could not have HAD that glory alongside God unless you were actually THERE to have it.You could say that God has glory waiting for you; but you could not say you've already enjoyed that glory in the past.
Toby………Yes if Jesus had already experienced that glory he would have said something like restore to me again the glory I had before, But he did not say that. There is more, we are told in Hebrews that “MAN” has been put over of all of GOD Works, This is a general statement about man kind, but it goes on th say we do not yet see him over all of God works but what do we see?, we see the MAN Jesus who was like us made lower then the angels and Has (NOW) received that Preplanned GLORY and HONOR GOD intends for every man. He was the First from man kind to achieve that Glory and Honor. IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………gene
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 05 2012,01:11) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 03 2012,20:30) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 02 2012,09:37) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 01 2012,10:08) To ALL………..Question (IS) can anyone PROVE Jesus preexisted his berth on earth as a SENTINEL BEING?
John 17:5
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.Jesus, as a sentient being, had glory alongside his God before the world began. There is your proof Gene – but will you accept it?
Mike……….so now you have quote your so call PROOF TEXT?
Yes Gene,One of the more than 60 proof texts we've compiled for you.
Quote Now tell me can i say that all so If GOD has predestined me for Glory , can i also like Jesus say I had that Glory with Him before i even came into existence………
No Gene, you couldn't. You could not have HAD that glory alongside God unless you were actually THERE to have it.You could say that God has glory waiting for you; but you could not say you've already enjoyed that glory in the past.
Mike ………..If God said it it is a done deal. If he said he has made man a “LITTLE” LOWER then the ANGELS fro the tasting of DEATH but (HAS) CROWNED (all past tense statements) With GLORY and HONOR. It is a GLORY and and HONOR that is already afford MAN> But that HONOR and GLORY is NOT YET RECEIVED by MAN, in general, (ONLY JESUS has attain it)> What it is that (that HONOR AND that GLORY> according to scriptures at least.peace and love to you and yours……………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 04 2012,08:46) Mike ………..If God said it it is a done deal. If he said he has made man a “LITTLE” LOWER then the ANGELS fro the tasting of DEATH but (HAS) CROWNED (all past tense statements) With GLORY and HONOR.
Everything God created has its own glory, Gene. Just because God crowned man with glory does not mean that man was over the angels. The angels have their own glory, which is higher than the glory of man.So the past tense is simply that – a past tense. Man IS lower than angels, and man HAS been crowned with glory – even as he is still lower than the angels.
Gene, you cannot say that you have personally had glory alongside your God before the world began. Jesus could…………..and did.
Mikeboll, what does this mean in John 17: 24: '…Father, I desire that they also whom you gave me may be with me where I am that they may behold my glory which you gave me…' Where was Jesus when he said this? Also, he had just asked God to Glorify him, yet here in this verse he is saying he already has that glory. And we know that that glory is given to him when he is raised up from the dead. Has John got his timings wrong?
Gene, do all the (other) things John writes concerning Jesus not give an aire of a messenger – Jesus delivering the message from God that was given to him. Jesus repeatedly states such as: '…As you sent me into the world…' (From where? There is a choice of Heaven or … Don't know!) and '…For I have given them the words which you have given me…' (who gave Jesus 'the words' and when and how?)
Also, in John 16: 30, the Disciples came to believe that Jesus was indeed 'from God' (As an Embasador is sent forth by a King).
Quote (toby @ Feb. 05 2012,03:54) Mikeboll, what does this mean in John 17: 24: '…Father, I desire that they also whom you gave me may be with me where I am that they may behold my glory which you gave me…' Where was Jesus when he said this?
John 17:13
I am coming to you now, but I say these things while I am still in the world, so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them.Toby, I am about to take a trip to the pristine Galapagos Islands to get away from this slum in which I live. My hope is that you can take time off work and join me where I am.
Now, do I mean for you to join me the slum? Or to join me where I am WHEN I'm in the Galapagos Islands?
Quote Also, he had just asked God to Glorify him, yet here in this verse he is saying he already has that glory.
Jesus was made a little lower than the angels for a while, but still had the glory of God's only begotten Son on earth. Later, he was raised to heaven as “the Son of God with power” (Rom 1:4), where he was hoping to return to the (much greater than lower than the angels glory) he had before being sent in the flesh. But instead, his God exalted him even higher than the great glory he had before the world began.1. Jesus had VERY GREAT glory alongside God before the world began.
2. Jesus was placed lower than the angels, and still had much glory as a human being, but not his original glory of heaven.
3. God exalted Jesus to EXTREME glory upon his ascension to heaven.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
