Islam

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,14:23)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 15 2009,13:52) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,12:04) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 14 2009,19:26) Hi BD, So you are yet a stranger seeking protection in the darkness? The door of Jesus remains open. Come in Jesus called himself a stranger. Do you still belong to this world Nick? The world knew him not. If you submit to God you are by definition a Muslim but to you it is only the word “Muslim” that bothers you not the fact that you Submit to God. Always let the truth triumph over your ego. Hi BD, So to submit to God do you submit to the complete authority of the Lord of all, Jesus Christ and his teachings? He never mentioned a prophet coming 500 years later with new teachings. Can you show me a direct revelation of the coming of Jesus and the time he would come?

Hi BD:

Study these scriptures, and they will tell you precisely when Jesus was to come.

Quote

Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, [that] from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince [shall be] seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof [shall be] with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

You cannot be submitted to God except by confessing Jesus as your Lord. This does not mean that you are confessing him as God, but that you are submitted to God through him. Without the blood that he shed for you and I to wash away our sins, we can never have a personal relationship with God.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[NickHassan]

Hi 94,
Jesus is Lord of all.
Saying so does not make it so.
Neither does it introduce you to the one who needs to know you.

[942767]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2009,14:54)

Hi 94, Jesus is Lord of all. Saying so does not make it so. Neither does it introduce you to the one who needs to know you.

Hi Nick:

Quote

Jhn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. Jhn 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Jhn 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (942767 @ June 17 2009,13:27)

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,14:23) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 15 2009,13:52) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,12:04) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 14 2009,19:26) Hi BD, So you are yet a stranger seeking protection in the darkness? The door of Jesus remains open. Come in Jesus called himself a stranger. Do you still belong to this world Nick? The world knew him not. If you submit to God you are by definition a Muslim but to you it is only the word “Muslim” that bothers you not the fact that you Submit to God. Always let the truth triumph over your ego. Hi BD, So to submit to God do you submit to the complete authority of the Lord of all, Jesus Christ and his teachings? He never mentioned a prophet coming 500 years later with new teachings. Can you show me a direct revelation of the coming of Jesus and the time he would come? Hi BD: Study these scriptures, and they will tell you precisely when Jesus was to come. Quote Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.   Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, [that] from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince [shall be] seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.   Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof [shall be] with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.   You cannot be submitted to God except by confessing Jesus as your Lord.  This does not mean that you are confessing him as God, but that you are submitted to God through him.  Without the blood that he shed for you and I to wash away our sins, we can never have a personal relationship with God. Love in Christ, Marty

Okay, so where is the mention of Jesus by name? Don't get me wrong of course Jesus is The Messiah, I simply said he was not mentioned specifically so there is no reason to assume that Muhammad should be mentioned specifically.

I keep saying here that Jesus was sent to the Lost Sheep of Israel, do you know why Jesus was baptized

Daniel 9 (King James Version)

20 And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God;

In other words Jesus was baptized for the repentence of Israel.

Jesus was a light to the gentiles and yes he is “lord” but He is not the Lord God.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
So was your master submitted to the Lord Jesus Christ?
Did he say so?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 17 2009,18:41)

Hi BD, So was your master submitted to the Lord Jesus Christ? Did he say so?

The Quran is not about Muhammad or the life of Muhammad it is the Quran(recitation) it is a Holy Book of clarification and restoration of all the scriptures before it. Keep in mind that the Bible consists of Many, many books throughout a very long period of time. The Quran makes it graspable in a single volume.

Muhammad could not come until after Jesus because The Covenant with Isaac had to be completed first.

Jesus most definitely was a light to Muhammad as God said Jesus would be but Jesus was the Messiah of Israel that the Jews rejected. If you read the Quran you will instantly understand the actual context of the scriptures.

Most of the speculation here on this site is because they do not have clarity of the word of God.

The fact of the gospels is that we know it is true and yet we also know that there is conjecture as we can see that the authors tried to fill in many blanks that they did not or could not know. Tell me were they “inspired” to tell different stories, were they inspired to be “inconsistent” The fact is you will not read in the gospels that God inspired them to write is all down. They gave testimony to the best of their knowledge otherwise all 4 gospels would agree down to the letter but they do not.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
So it clarifies and restores the words of the Son of God?

You do not claim it is of God so why not just enjoy it yourself as it is unnecessary for us.

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 17 2009,16:56)

Quote (942767 @ June 17 2009,13:27) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,14:23) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 15 2009,13:52) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 15 2009,12:04) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 14 2009,19:26) Hi BD, So you are yet a stranger seeking protection in the darkness? The door of Jesus remains open. Come in Jesus called himself a stranger. Do you still belong to this world Nick? The world knew him not. If you submit to God you are by definition a Muslim but to you it is only the word “Muslim” that bothers you not the fact that you Submit to God. Always let the truth triumph over your ego. Hi BD, So to submit to God do you submit to the complete authority of the Lord of all, Jesus Christ and his teachings? He never mentioned a prophet coming 500 years later with new teachings. Can you show me a direct revelation of the coming of Jesus and the time he would come? Hi BD: Study these scriptures, and they will tell you precisely when Jesus was to come. Quote Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.   Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, [that] from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince [shall be] seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.   Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof [shall be] with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.   You cannot be submitted to God except by confessing Jesus as your Lord.  This does not mean that you are confessing him as God, but that you are submitted to God through him.  Without the blood that he shed for you and I to wash away our sins, we can never have a personal relationship with God. Love in Christ, Marty Okay, so where is the mention of Jesus by name? Don't get me wrong of course Jesus is The Messiah, I simply said he was not mentioned specifically so there is no reason to assume that Muhammad should be mentioned specifically. I keep saying here that Jesus was sent to the Lost Sheep of Israel, do you know why Jesus was baptized Daniel 9 (King James Version) 20 And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God; In other words Jesus was baptized for the repentence of Israel. Jesus was a light to the gentiles and yes he is “lord” but He is not the Lord God.

Hi BD:

I don't suppose that Jesus is mentioned by that name, but much of the OT speaks prophetically of him, and no, I don't suppose that if Muhammad is a genuine prophet of God, that he would not have to be specifically mentioned by name.  However, I know from my association with Muslims in the past that they attributed Deuteronomy 18:15-18 as speaking prophetically of Muhammad.

Quote

Deu 18:15 The LORD thy God will raise up unto thee a Prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken;   Deu 18:16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.   Deu 18:17 And the LORD said unto me, They have well [spoken that] which they have spoken.   Deu 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

But no, this is speaking of someone who would be raised up from the Jews, Deut. 18:15 states “of thy brethren”.

But if Muhammad is preaching that Jesus was not crucified, or that he did not die, then the message is a false message.  In order to be a resurrection from the dead, someone must overcome sin by obeying God even unto death.  The wages of sin is death, and death means separation from God.  If Jesus was not raised from the dead then there is no resurrection, and we are all lost and without any hope of salvation.

Quote

1Cr 15:12 Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?   1Cr 15:13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:   1Cr 15:14 And if Christ be not risen, then [is] our preaching vain, and your faith [is] also vain.   1Cr 15:15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.   1Cr 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:   1Cr 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith [is] vain; ye are yet in your sins.   1Cr 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.

Relative to the baptism of Jesus, he said:

Quote

Mat 3:13 Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.   Mat 3:14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?   Mat 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer [it to be so] now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.   Mat 3:16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, th e heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:   Mat 3:17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

No, Jesus is not the LORD GOD, and that is the problem with those who are teaching the “trinity” in that they are misleading people like yourself by this doctrine.  Jesus never said that he was the LORD GOD, God has revealed to the church who he is and that is:

Quote

Mat 16:13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?   Mat 16:14 And they said, Some [say that thou art] John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.   Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?   Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.   Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed [it] unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

He is the Christ the Son of the Living God, and he is the head of the church and he has been exalted to that position at the right hand of God, and will come to judge the living and the dead.

Quote

Hbr 1:1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,   Hbr 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by [his] Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;   Hbr 1:3 Who being the brightness of [his] glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Quote

Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.   Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.   Rom 14:11 For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.   Rom 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

The blood that Jesus shed will wash away the sins of all that have served God from OT prior to his ministry, and the sins of all that come to God through him from the time of his ministry until he comes for the church, but if he did not shed his blood, then there is no forgiveness of sins.

And so, he is not God, but one cannot have a personal relationship with God unless we are submitted to God through him, and our sins have been washed away by his blood.  There is no other way.  

Love in Christ,
Marty

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 18 2009,07:38)

Hi BD, So it clarifies and restores the words of the Son of God? You do not claim it is of God so why not just enjoy it yourself as it is unnecessary for us.

Nick,

The Quran is the Word of God

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
So you say.
We do not need it thanks.
Why do you need to seek proselytes?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 18 2009,10:35)

Hi BD, So you say. We do not need it thanks. Why do you need to seek proselytes?

I am simply sharing the word of God and also having beneficial contact and relations with other believers.

Are only people that agree with your viewpoint worthy of your time?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Is it the Word of our God?
Doesn't taste like it.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
You are worthy of our time and it is great to speak with you.
But you offer us death over life in your teachings.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 18 2009,12:48)

Hi BD, Is it the Word of our God? Doesn't taste like it.

You haven't tasted it so why criticize?

There is only one God, so what do you mean “Our” God?

(1) And your Allah is one Allah. There is no god but He, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #163)

2) Allah. There is no god but He,-the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permitteth? He knoweth what (appeareth to His creatures as) before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth. His Throne doth extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feeleth no fatigue in guarding and preserving them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory).
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #255)

(3) Allah forgiveth not (The sin of) joining other gods with Him; but He forgiveth whom He pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with Allah, Hath strayed far, far away (from the right).
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #116)

4) They do blaspheme who say: “(Allah) is Christ the son of Mary.” But said Christ: “O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord.” Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #72)

5) They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except one Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #73)

(20) Allah has said: “Take not (for worship) two gods: for He is just one Allah. then fear Me (and Me alone).”
( سورة النحل , An-Nahl, Chapter #16, Verse #51)

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Being forcefed by you gives me a tummyache.
Just the pure words thanks as Jesus is Lord.
None who came later can correct him

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 18 2009,13:45)

Hi BD, Being forcefed by you gives me a tummyache. Just the pure words thanks as Jesus is Lord. None who came later can correct him

You can't always have milk Nick, eventually you need meat.

There is no correction of Jesus where did I do that?

Jesus also said that there is no god but GOD, Jesus said that the Father is THE ONLY TRUE GOD.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 04 2008,12:08)

The biggest difference between the Bible and the Koran in my opinion is that the biblical writers say that Jesus is the son of God and the messiah and the Koran says that he isn't the son of God and that God doesn't have sons. Jesus said that he was the Way the Truth and the Life. The Koran teaches that Jesus is a prophet and Mohamed is a prophet. But look at what is taught in 1John: 1 John 2:22 Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist—he denies the Father and the Son. 1 John 2:18 Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour.

The Quran teaches that Jesus is the Messiah so you have spoke without knowledge.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
It denies our sacred scriptures, even trying to correct them.
That is unwise.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 18 2009,17:34)

Hi BD, It denies our sacred scriptures, even trying to correct them. That is unwise.

No, It simply is a later revelation

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
It tries to correct the sacred scriptures.
Claiming superiority.
To deceive?

[Author]

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