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Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2010,10:30) Hi KW,
He spoke truth in spiritual terms.
Men infer.
Jesus used a human language to express spiritual truth and also expected his hearers to understand those truths he merely inferred.notice I did not write “spiritual” a secound time but merely infered it by the context of what I stated and the word “truths” which I did write.
Quote (kerwin @ June 08 2010,15:46) Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2010,10:30) Hi KW,
He spoke truth in spiritual terms.
Men infer.
Jesus used a human language to express spiritual truth and also expected his hearers to understand those truths he merely inferred.notice I did not write “spiritual” a secound time but merely infered it by the context of what I stated and the word “truths” which I did write.
Kerwinshow us a example
Pierre
Quote (kerwin @ June 08 2010,03:19) Pierre, You posted me on March 26 and for some reason I did not respond at that time. My apologies.
I believe your concern that when interpreting scriptures men who infer what it means can read into scripture false revelations which are not from God but rather from the ruler of this world.
That does not make seeking that God does not infer but only that Satan chooses to misuse the practice of reading inferences in the same way he misused prophecy.
God chooses to use human languages in scripture and inferences are common in human languages as much is left unsaid that the speaker or writer assumes his hearer will understood by what is said either at the time or at another time. One example of the later is many scriptures which state anything is possible for God do not include the words but doing evil. Scripture omits those words because it assumes anyone who knows God knows he cannot commit evil.
For this reason those who delete those inferences from God's word are falling into one of the Devil's snares.
It is thus only when we are guided by God that the truth will be revealed to us. Trust in God. Trust in his Son.
Your fellow student,
Kerwin
Kerwinit can come from the mind of men, that is what God says.
Pierre
Pierre,
I agree there are many that claim God stated something when God did not state it but that is no excuse to “throw the baby out with the dirty bathwater”.
I provided an example from Luke 8:19-21 on the previous page.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2010,11:36) Hi KW,
You inferred that.
But you should know the language of the Spirit.
In this case you are inferring what that means. It is a bit vague but it seem obvious you are speaking about me inferring the word “spiritual”. If you are not then please clarify what you mean. Thank you.Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2010,12:42) Hi KW,
You must define what is spiritual in intellectual terms?
It has already been done since you seem to consider properly using and understanding a human language intellectual.If the improper language use is a matter of style there is most likely no harm done as long as what is meant is clear. On the other hand, to disreguard that implications are part of language use leads to error and thus is foolish. It is wise to avoid such error when seking to teach or exchange spiritual ideas.
As for me asking you to clarify what you meant it is called good communications and therefore avoids miscommunicating your thoughts to me. I have trouble calling good communications an intellectual pursuit.
Nick Hassan,
Why do you choose to add to what God states. God does not claim he does not infer. That is your claim. In fact if we take Jesus at his word then God does infer as Jesus infered from Exodus 3:6 that there is a resurection from the dead. It is the Sadducees who took your view that such inference is sinful and thus they concluded there is no resurection.
I challenge you to read Exodus 3:6 and point to where it explicitly states there is no resurection from the dead. You cannot do it as that tenet is only implied in that scripture.
Judge for yourself if Jesus who inferred or the Sadducees who did not who know God's ways.
Hi KW,
Why should you put what is spiritual through your intellectual filter?
Jesus knows the Spirit's words and reveals them.
No inference is helpful or requiredHe taught in Lk 20.34-40 that those spoken of in Ex 3.6 were yet alive to God because they had been blessed of the abiding and living Spirit of God.
Nick Hassan,
You are correct that Jesus concluded that there is a resurection of the dead based on the fact that those individuals mentioned “were yet alive to God because they had been blessed of the abiding and living Spirit of God”. Reaching a conclusion based on the facts is one definition of the word infer.
What do you think infer means?
Hi KW,
His teaching is plain so why do think you need inference?
All we need is the same Spirit he was blessed with and it is still accessible in him.[Acts 2.39]Nick Hassan,
At time Jesus did speak clearly but not always as John 16:29 shows us. He answers why he choose not to speak clearly in Matthew 13:13 and surrounding verses.
As for inferences they are not considered unclear to those who can reach valid and sound concclusions based on the facts. For those whose reasoning skills are limited it may be another thing.
I admit that it would be interesting to study how basic reasoning skills effect ones understanding of the gospel.
I do not believe you lack reasoning skills.
I am also attempting to make sure we speak of the same thing when we speak of “inferences” as we could be using different definitions for the word “infer.
Quote (kerwin @ June 09 2010,17:29) At time Jesus did speak clearly but not always as John 16:29 shows us. He answers why he choose not to speak clearly in Matthew 13:13 and surrounding verses. As for inferences they are not considered unclear to those who can reach valid and sound concclusions based on the facts. For those whose reasoning skills are limited it may be another thing.
Quite right Kerwin. I have a challenge for those who claim inference is an illegitimate tool in the interpretation of scripture:-Exposit Revelation chapter 13 verse by verse. One rule though – no inference allowed.
Anyone up to it?
Hi KW,
Spiritual language is of facts too.
Certainly philosophical and theological approaches to these words will not bring understanding
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