Gospel of Matthew

[Towshab]

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 27 2007,18:10)

Come on Towshab, I don't want to see you leave. If for no other reason than I like the way you have given me a whole new respect for the biblical knowledge of david. Believers should not fear discourse with non believers if they are truly grounded in their faith. It should permit them to prove the error in the non believer's thinking. Tim

I can get this. That was what I thought I'd find here but I think I've been shown that this is more like a community than a real religion debate forum. I know you all debate and get heated but mostly is has to do with various Christian beliefs, not anything opposed to Christianity.

If the moderators can make private forums that people can access by invitation only I would be willing to continue. But I'd like for the threads to be private. Can ikonboard do that?

I know there are some who come to this board for encouragement and I realize that I present things that won't be encouraging to them. Since I am new I don't want to keep them from enjoying the community they enjoy.

[kenrch]

Mat 28:6  He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.

Mar 16:6  And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

Luk 24:3  And they entered in, and found not the body of the Lord Jesus.

Joh 20:5  And he stooping down, and looking in, saw the linen clothes lying; yet went he not in.
Joh 20:6  Then cometh Simon Peter following him, and went into the sepulchre, and seeth the linen clothes lie,
Joh 20:7  And the napkin, that was about his head, not lying with the linen clothes, but wrapped together in a place by itself.
Joh 20:8  Then went in also that other disciple, which came first to the sepulchre, and he saw, and believed.

No contradiction.  The tomb was found empty in all the gospels!  

I don't want to insult your inelegance but:  Did the apostles die, crucified, decapitated for a lot of bunk that they KNEW were false?!

1Co 15:14  And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
1Co 15:15  Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
1Co 15:16  For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
1Co 15:17  And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
1Co 15:18  Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
1Co 15:19  If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.

Sir you must have done something really GOOD to deserve such an temptation OR you were a book Christian not knowing the LORD on a personnel level.

I really don't believe anyone who has known Jesus the Christ ever denies Him.  I have met people who backslide but always return to the Lord.  Thus the saying “once saved always saved”.

Mat 28:11  Now when they were going, behold, some of the watch came into the city, and shewed unto the chief priests all the things that were done.
Mat 28:12  And when they were assembled with the elders, and had taken counsel, they gave large money unto the soldiers,
Mat 28:13  Saying, Say ye, His disciples came by night, and stole him away while we slept.
Mat 28:14  And if this come to the governor's ears, we will persuade him, and secure you.
Mat 28:15  So they took the money, and did as they were taught: and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day.

Do you openly deny Christ?  I won't say you cannot be saved.  Only God knows your heart.

But you should repent.

Isa 59:1  Behold, the LORD's hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, or his ear dull, that it cannot hear;
Isa 59:2  but your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden his face from you so that he does not hear.
Isa 59:3  For your hands are defiled with blood and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies; your tongue mutters wickedness.

Did you have a relationship with Jesus?

May God and His Son have mercy on your soul.

God bless and help you,

Ken

[kejonn]

Hi gang,

Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. He has pointed me to many things but I've also appealed to him as well. Be patient with him because he went through similar situations as me. It is surprising to see the number of ppl who are trying to shed their selves of pagan influences. Sadly, it seems that many on this board are not.

I hope that you folks realize that he is just a human like any of us and is subject to emotions getting the best of him.

LG&LP,
Kevin

[Is 1:18]

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32)

Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua.

I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this:

“For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21)

[Stu]

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 28 2007,11:10)

Come on Towshab, I don't want to see you leave. If for no other reason than I like the way you have given me a whole new respect for the biblical knowledge of david. Believers should not fear discourse with non believers if they are truly grounded in their faith. It should permit them to prove the error in the non believer's thinking. Tim

…or allow themselves to be convinced of the falsehood of their superstitions?

Stuart

[942767]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42)

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21)

Amen to this brother Isaiah.  How can anyone who is born again and therefore, has the Spirit of God dwelling within who testifies to the truth of His Son and His Christ ever want to quit serving him after all the suffering that he went through in our behalf.

God Bless

[kejonn]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 27 2007,20:42)

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21)

I guess all people are different. In all of my years as a Christian, even before questioning the trinity, I ALWAYS placed God first. Yeshua was my role model and brother. I can honor him but my real relationship has always been with God.

As I study more and more of the Tanach, I learn more about the new testament as well. It really is odd, but it just works that way for me.

People should realize that the first Christians were Jews. They were not Gentiles. That is why I felt the need to get into the Tanach — to get a Jewish viewpoint.

Seriously — and this is important — who do you think of more in your walk, Jesus or God? Jesus, as shown in the NT, always glorified God. What should that tell you about how you are to be in your own life?

Please people, stop making Yeshua equal with God. He never did, why should you?

LG&LP,
Kevin

[Towshab]

Quote (Stu @ Oct. 27 2007,20:55)

Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 28 2007,11:10) Come on Towshab, I don't want to see you leave. If for no other reason than I like the way you have given me a whole new respect for the biblical knowledge of david. Believers should not fear discourse with non believers if they are truly grounded in their faith. It should permit them to prove the error in the non believer's thinking. Tim …or allow themselves to be convinced of the falsehood of their superstitions? Stuart

Stu,

Are you an atheist, agnostic, or deist?

[Stu]

Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 28 2007,15:01)

Quote (Stu @ Oct. 27 2007,20:55) Quote (TimothyVI @ Oct. 28 2007,11:10) Come on Towshab, I don't want to see you leave. If for no other reason than I like the way you have given me a whole new respect for the biblical knowledge of david. Believers should not fear discourse with non believers if they are truly grounded in their faith. It should permit them to prove the error in the non believer's thinking. Tim …or allow themselves to be convinced of the falsehood of their superstitions? Stuart Stu, Are you an atheist, agnostic, or deist?

Like everyone else on the planet, I am agnostic.
I am deist in the manner of Spinoza, Eintein, Sagan or Dawkins – “god” is a metaphor for the universe's awe-inspiring mysteries that are awaiting investigation, but not anything real.
I don't believe in the Judeo-Christian god, or Baal, or Zeus, or Odin, or Unicorns, tarot cards, astrology or UFOs.

I sometimes resist the word atheist because it is just weird to be defined in terms of something that does not exist. I imagine you don't feel the same way.

I do have fairies at the bottom of my garden that pronounce belief in gods as delusional. They never tell me why, though.

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (942767 @ Oct. 28 2007,14:01)

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21) Amen to this brother Isaiah.  How can anyone who is born again and therefore, has the Spirit of God dwelling within who testifies to the truth of His Son and His Christ ever want to quit serving him after all the suffering that he went through in our behalf. God Bless

Might he come to realise that none of it is actually true, that to be a good person does not require mental slavery of this kind, and that a just god could only judge favourably those who followed the golden rule genuinely, even if they did not have much time for the details of scripture?

Stuart

[Not3in1]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42)

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21)

Amen!

Knowledge is a good thing. But faith is better……

Many things are hidden or unsearchable, but without faith it is impossible to please God (this goes for the God of the OT as well).

Kevin, will there come a day when you consider our dear Lord to be a pagen influence that needs to be shed? I fear you are headed in this direction under the counsel of a stranger to God. The water is about to boil…..JUMP!

[Not3in1]

Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 28 2007,11:22)

If the moderators can make private forums that people can access by invitation only I would be willing to continue. But I'd like for the threads to be private. Can ikonboard do that?

John 3:20

Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.

But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.

[charity]

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,14:53)

quote=kejonn Seriously — and this is important — who do you think of more in your walk, Jesus or God? Jesus, as shown in the NT, always glorified God. What should that tell you about how you are to be in your own life? Please people, stop making Yeshua equal with God. He never did, why should you? LG&LP, Kevin

LG&LP,Kevin

so glad you obey Christ in the first and greatest commandment, Love God with all your heart and mind and soul. “This is how we shall know one another”

Some how people feel that to make Jesus a brother is too lower him beneath his royal name, he came as A KING, LOWLEY AND TO BE RECONIZED, discovered,
and in that he said don't tell anyone who I am, for flesh and blood can't reveal this to each other, it must come by the spirit God, but yet flesh and blood still lead the way, and tell each other who he is, and the mind and heart, are at war, and the people are not transformed, they have not obeyed him anyway, righteousness can never be acused

God bless you Kevin,

turning our backs.. on a teaching that has prevailed to place Christ… instead of find him in all his risen glory..worthy to follow after him

LG&LP

charity

[Towshab]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 28 2007,01:35)

Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 28 2007,11:22) If the moderators can make private forums that people can access by invitation only I would be willing to continue. But I'd like for the threads to be private. Can ikonboard do that? John 3:20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.

I'm sorry, but I am not trying to hide anything. I just figured that I could carry this on with those who are interested without disrupting the others on the board. Some have already said (you being one of them) that I am here to attack people's faith, and someone else told me that this board was like a community for its members. I read some parts of some other threads and saw the truth in this. It made me feel bad because my purpose is not to hurt people. You may not agree but all of what I present is from your bible and Jewish scriptures.

If you feel I am hiding or fearing I can continue. I have no fear of what my faith is. If you call me evil then be prepared to call your 'old testament' evil because I can show where Jesus is not the Messiah from them.

This thread is about Matthew though. Scholars say that this gospel was written to Jews. I am simply showing where Matthew is so flawed that any Jewish person who knows scripture would deny Jesus because of the many problems with Matthew.

As I do this I am almost thinking that the writer of Matthew purposely made these mistakes so Jews would deny Jesus.

If other people want me to continue, I will. Just be warned that you will know what I will be showing and if you do not like it you should stay away from my threads. That will have to be the form of privacy that is given.

[Towshab]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 28 2007,01:26)

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21) Amen! Knowledge is a good thing. But faith is better…… Many things are hidden or unsearchable, but without faith it is impossible to please God (this goes for the God of the OT as well). Kevin, will there come a day when you consider our dear Lord to be a pagen influence that needs to be shed? I fear you are headed in this direction under the counsel of a stranger to God. The water is about to boil…..JUMP!

You and others on here act as if studying the Jewish scriptures which were influenced by the G-d of Israel is a bad thing. If someone comes to see that Jesus was not the real Messiah and embraces YHVH what is your problem?

The biggest flaw of Christianity is that they place their trust in a man instead of G-d. Christians want to read the Jewish bible with a Christian mind so they read Jesus back into them. That is wrong!

Studying the Jewish bible would show people what the world will be like when the Messiah does come. None of it has taken place and it certainly did not in 30 AD. When the Messiah comes the whole world will know. You may agree because you are waiting for some second coming but there is not a shred of evidence to support this in G-d's promises to His people in the Jewish bible. The second coming was invented to make up for the death of Jesus.

Let me ask you, do you think that devout Jews are going to hell?

[kejonn]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 28 2007,01:26)

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21) Amen! Knowledge is a good thing. But faith is better…… Many things are hidden or unsearchable, but without faith it is impossible to please God (this goes for the God of the OT as well). Kevin, will there come a day when you consider our dear Lord to be a pagen influence that needs to be shed? I fear you are headed in this direction under the counsel of a stranger to God. The water is about to boil…..JUMP!

Christianity is not where I believe Yeshua would have wanted it. There are so many wild beliefs out there and that is why Christianity has so many different denominations. Some people believe in handling snakes, others talk about being “slain in the spirit”, still others jump pews and shake. Then there are those who make Yeshua out to be God, others who think they will be gods, and yet more who think Yeshua was placed inside a woman to be born. All of this, so far from where it was ever meant to go.

I have no problem with Yeshua, I just have many issues with what people have made him. If anything, I'll shed Christianity in its various modern wrappings and embrace a simpler faith, the one I see in the new testament and the Tanach.

LG&LP,
Kevin

[kenrch]

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 29 2007,02:22)

Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 28 2007,01:26) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Oct. 28 2007,13:42) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 28 2007,12:32) Towshab and I have been going at it “behind the scenes”. He knows I am desirous of learning the Tanach — particularly the Torah — but he also know that while I'm “teetering” that I still hold a special place in my heart for Yeshua. I hope and pray that as I mature as a christian I NEVER get to a stage where I would make a statement like this. Instead I hope that Yeshua becomes increasingly significant to me in my life, to the point where I, like Paul, might make statements like this: “For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.” (Philippians 1:21) Amen! Knowledge is a good thing.  But faith is better…… Many things are hidden or unsearchable, but without faith it is impossible to please God (this goes for the God of the OT as well). Kevin, will there come a day when you consider our dear Lord to be a pagen influence that needs to be shed?  I fear you are headed in this direction under the counsel of a stranger to God.  The water is about to boil…..JUMP! There are so many wild beliefs out there and that is why Christianity has so many different denominations. Some people believe in handling snakes, others talk about being “slain in the spirit”, still others jump pews and shake. Then there are those who make Yeshua out to be God, others who think they will be gods, and yet more who think Yeshua was placed inside a woman to be born. All of this, so far from where it was ever meant to go. I have no problem with Yeshua, I just have many issues with what people have made him. If anything, I'll shed Christianity in its various modern wrappings and embrace a simpler faith, the one I see in the new testament and the Tanach. LG&LP, Kevin

Quote

Christianity is not where I believe Yeshua would have wanted it.

kejonn Jesus knew that all these things would happen.

Mat 24:3  As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the close of the age?”
Mat 24:4  And Jesus answered them, “See that no one leads you astray.

Mat 24:5  For many will come in my name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and they will lead many astray.

The very first sign of the end time was that many would come in the Name of Jesus and say that Jesus is the Christ and will deceive many.

Then we have in Rev. the Mother of harlots and her daughters.

Also in Revelations we have Jesus calling HIS people out of her.

We have Satan deceiving the whole world.

Jesus knew that this is where Christianity would be in the last days just before his second coming.

Everything is on sechedual for scripture to be fulfilled.

[Not3in1]

Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 29 2007,00:50)

Just be warned that you will know what I will be showing and if you do not like it you should stay away from my threads.

The demons also wanted Christ to stay away from them.  In fact, they begged him to not torture them before their appointed time.  The demons wanted Jesus to “stay away” as well.

No one owns a thread.  To say a thread is “my thread” only exposes further your true mission here.

Those who deny Christ are not in the faith, and therefore have nothing to teach God's children.

2 Corninthians 13:5
Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves.  

Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you – unless, of course, you fail the test?

[Not3in1]

Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 29 2007,02:22)

I have no problem with Yeshua, I just have many issues with what people have made him. If anything, I'll shed Christianity in its various modern wrappings and embrace a simpler faith, the one I see in the new testament and the Tanach.

You are on a journey.  You will learn a great many things about man and his creations/rules/doctrine/traditions…..  The important thing to remember is that these are man-made rules, not God's.

Jesus was revealed by prophesy, then revealed in the flesh, then again through revelations……  

Galations 1:11, 12, emphasis mine
I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up.  I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it (through the law/OT); rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.

Paul was studied in the OT.  But the salvation he accepted came through revelation.  We can study and study, but unless the Lord is revealed to you……..you will be like the waves, tossed about by every teaching you hear; always questioning your faith and belief that Christ has truly saved you.  Move forward in your journey and study, as I am moving forward, but have your anchor firmly grounded or you will toss.  Have your spirit quiet enough to hear the Shepard's voice……he may warn you about potential danger's (and stranger's).

[charity]

Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 29 2007,00:50)

Quote (Not3in1 @ Oct. 28 2007,01:35) Quote (Towshab @ Oct. 28 2007,11:22) If the moderators can make private forums that people can access by invitation only I would be willing to continue. But I'd like for the threads to be private. Can ikonboard do that? John 3:20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God. I'm sorry, but I am not trying to hide anything. I just figured that I could carry this on with those who are interested without disrupting the others on the board. Some have already said (you being one of them) that I am here to attack people's faith, and someone else told me that this board was like a community for its members. I read some parts of some other threads and saw the truth in this. It made me feel bad because my purpose is not to hurt people. You may not agree but all of what I present is from your bible and Jewish scriptures. If you feel I am hiding or fearing I can continue. I have no fear of what my faith is. If you call me evil then be prepared to call your 'old testament' evil because I can show where Jesus is not the Messiah from them. This thread is about Matthew though. Scholars say that this gospel was written to Jews. I am simply showing where Matthew is so flawed that any Jewish person who knows scripture would deny Jesus because of the many problems with Matthew. As I do this I am almost thinking that the writer of Matthew purposely made these mistakes so Jews would deny Jesus. If other people want me to continue, I will. Just be warned that you will know what I will be showing and if you do not like it you should stay away from my threads. That will have to be the form of privacy that is given.

Hi Towshab

I’m Interested in what you have to say…and also my thinking is… that “their” is a problem with the eye witness testament of the Man Jesus Christ’s Life… If “Altered”? I found Mathew to be rather innocent, after seeing the Gospels of John…in its true colours, removing the orginal Kingdom from the earth…and teach the congregation to Judge his brother against his own Knowledge. And to stand firm in pride…just look around and see his work…..it…this Disciple book has lead the world in every way with his one linners,more than Mathews., anyway that’s another thread!
Who's Luke?
Who's Mark?

I have found that all the false hoods… that shall poses this earth at the end of this age… will be planed and constructed from the Life of this Man call Jesus…As this prophecy reveals below and is coming to pass…till now.. as it will have to be reviewed, looking back on blinded age that preforms the greatest evils of destrution, to now, the time the eye's are opened, and knees strenthen to see and identify the error of the human imaginations, its evil powers and forces of pride, that destroy the peace and happiness. perverting the transforming of the Nations into one, no more greek Jew..all are brothers of christ?

Isa 8:14  And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem. And many among them shall stumble, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.
Isa 8:16 ¶ Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples.
And I will wait upon the LORD, that hideth his face from the house of Jacob, and I will look for him. Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me [are] for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.¶ And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, [it is] because [there is] no light in them. And they shall pass through it, hardly bestead and hungry: and it shall come to pass, that when they shall be hungry, they shall fret themselves, and curse their king and their God, and look upward.

  Thank you for your posts. And I don't think you are evil at all…I prefer to have all that i have taken on as truth challenge. And I pray that all that is left standing is the truth within me…one day at a time…what’s right today. can be wrong tomorrow…Gods good will to all men.

charity

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