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Hi Jodi,
I love the book of Enoch.
Quoted in the Spirit inspired book of Jude.
It answers a lot of questions about the origins of evil on earth.
It is available on this site for those who wish to research it for themselves.
Hi Jodi,
Flesh is weak as you have explained.
Men need the help of God to overcome and to become free.
Jesus did it by the power of the Spirit of God that he received from above at the Jordan.
Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by NATURE the children of wrath, even as others.
Jodi says, men who fulfill the desires of the flesh and of the mind are by Nature children of wrath.
Nick says, wicked rebel spirits seduce you into following your flesh to sin and you are then children of wicked rebel spirits.
Matthew 16:23 and he having turned, said to Peter, `Get thee behind me, adversary! thou art a stumbling-block to me, for thou dost not mind the things of God, but the things of men.’
Jodi says, Jesus calls Peter an adversary because he has in mind the things of men.
Nick says, Peter was rebuked by Jesus because a wicked rebel spirit was seducing Peter to think like a man.
Psalms 106:28 They joined themselves also unto Baalpeor, and ate the sacrifices of the dead. 29 Thus they provoked him to anger with their inventions: and the plague brake in upon them.
Jodi says, men were brought plagues because of their inventions that made God angry.
Nick says, wicked rebel spirits seduced men to eat sacrifices to the dead making God angry.
Psalms 106:39 Thus were they defiled with their own works, and went a whoring with their own inventions.
Jodi says, men were defiled by their own works and went after gods of their own inventions
Nick says, men were seduced by evil spirits who invented false gods and tricked men to believe in them.
Hi Jodi,
Since Eden idolatry has been the way of men and nothing has changed with false gods abounding still.
Being godless and loving intellectualism he is so easily seduced by doctrines of clever little demons.
Flesh is weak, why is that?
43 it is sown in dishonour, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power;
Romans 8:20 For the creation has been subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of the one who subjected it, in hope.
Hi Jodi,
Peter is not the adversary being spoken to but a cheeky little humanism demon that had found a home there and needed to be moved out.
The same doctrine of demons still finds a ready audience in the world.
And it poses as Christian teaching.
Hi Jodi,
Yes God has always used agents to do His work.
Our loving God has created agents, such as angels and Satan to do His work.
Hi Jodi,
You said that I said
“wicked rebel spirits seduced men to eat sacrifices to the dead”???
No not me. Was it you or is your imagination running wild again?
Hi Jodi,
Yes the demonic fruit from the minds and hearts of carnal men can only draw the wrath of God.
But the fruit of the Spirit is what He loves to see manifesting in us.
Nick…look at what Jesus said….
Mat 7:20-21….And he said, That which comes out of “THE MAN”, that defiles the man. 21, For from “WITHIN”, out of “THE MAN”, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22, Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lascivousness, an evil thoughts, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:
Verse 23..”ALL” these evil things come from “WITHIN”, and defile the man.
Jesus did not say they came from “OUTSIDE” the man, but from “WITHIN” the man that makes the man himself responsible for what he is producing in his life, not some phantom demon being, comming from without and jumping into him doing it Nick.
Also remember Jesus said “you “being” “evil”, “being” means “existing” in a evil state right?
Nick i think Jodi is right in a lot of what she is saying here brother, and as far as the book of ENOCH goes, it contains a lot of controversy things in it, even though it was used by the Jews alot. There is a lot of mystery fabrications in it as i remember.
Remember also, what it says, “you” make the tree (that which brings forth from “self”) good, and it’s fruit good, or “YOU” make it corrupt and it’s fruit corrupt’. That to me is saying we all have to deal with whats going on in “OUR OWN” lives brother, we should not be going around sayings “the devil made me do it”, no it our own selves doing it. either good or evil. IMO
I also believe God the Father does himself punish us and diciplines and rewards us for what “WE” are doing. I believe like King David, “thy rod (of correction) and staff (of guidence) does confort me”. Why because i by that know the Father is dealing with me in my life.
Anyway this is a very good thread, you and Jodi, are both bring up good points, helping us all grow.
Peace and love to you both and yours. ….gene
Hi Gene,
Yes it is from within the vessel of man that evil thoughts and behaviours come.
God does not give glory to the occupants behind these demonic problems
Jesus condemned Sin in the flesh and they know they have no future.
That vessel needs to be cleansed and transformed by renewal.
So God asks us to and repent and be baptised for the forgiveness of our sin and then He will give us the Spirit.
Then if we walk according to the Spirit we will be set free and sanctified day by day.
We always have the choice of becoming slaves again of sin.
But grace is always there every step of the way.
Heb 12.12
Therefore strengthen the hands that are weak and the knees that are feeble, and make straight paths for your feet, so that the limb which is lame may not be put out of joint, but rather be healed.
Eph 5.6
Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes on the sons of disobedience. Therefore do not be partakers with them, for you were formerly darkness, but now you are light in the Lord, walk as children of light ( for the fruit of the light consists of all goodness and truth), trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord. Do not participate in the unfruitful deeds of darkness, but instead even expose them.
Empty intellectual understandings that reject the teaching of Jesus Christ are without the inspiration of the Spirit.
Hi Jodi,
1 Cor 15.50
Now I say this,brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God;
nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
Behold I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed, in a moment,
in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound,
and the dead wil be raised imperishable, and we will all be changed.
For this perishable must put on the imperishable and this mortal must put on immortality,
But you say …no change folks. More of the same old same old. The natural flesh and blood mortal and perishable body does inherit imperishability and immortality. It just adds on immortality and imperishability to it’s mortal and perishable nature.
Whom should we believe?
Jodi,
“He does NOT acknowledge that he has a kingdom,”
“Jesus uses the word IF, this is NOT showing that he acknowledges that Beezlebub is real”
When Jesus asks Matt 12 “26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?
27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.
28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.” it’s simply a rhetorical question in response to the Pharisees accusation, and he plainly declares Satan has a kingdom. He could’ve just as easily left off the phrase “how shall his kingdom stand” if it were not so. And by saying “if I by the Spirit of God cast out devils, then the kingdom of God is come unto you” he furthers the point of Gods’ kingdom plundering Satan’s. To be consistent in your interpretation”if I by the Spirit of God cast out devils” should also mean that Jesus doesn’t really cast out devils at all.And what of Satan offering Jesus the kingdoms of the world during his temptations? you like to make a point of Jesus being tempted, but if Satan didn’t really have this to offer then this was no real temptation at all. Perhaps Jesus was just delusional after fasting so long? isn’t it a biblical fact that Matt12:8 says “the devil took Jesus to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory” 9 And he-the devil, said to him” All these I will give you if you will fall down and worship me“10 Then Jesus said to him “Be gone Satan” It says him here not it, no matter how one may interpret it. If this was just Jesus fighting his own sinful flesh or carnal mind, then the devil or “it” as you say is just part of Jesus own nature and thus in this story the devil is just Jesus own mind.
Is the Satan or saw-tawn of Christ’s temptation a holy angel of God? and after it/he leaves then other holy angels come to minister to him? or perhaps it’s just the evil tempting thoughts go and then more comforting thoughts come? Maybe the gods, and demons all just spring from our own minds which is why there is such inconsistency,disagreements and variations in religion?
To all….the word satan or devil, came from the word “evil spirit”it had nothing to do with a person or beings at all. The angels of God who he sent out to resst or abustruct man were later refered to a devils or ha-satan, meaning advasarieral bengs, these were angels of God, who were not evil themselves, but angels of God sent by God to do his work, he wanted done.
There exist no such thing as devil “beings” who represent a Satanic empire of evil beings. This is pagan trash that the Greek pagans and others even Jewish pagans imported into christanity.
There is only evil or unclean spirits, and good or clean spirits, that effect all of life. Non of them are beings but simply good or evil spirits working in the minds of all who have life in them.
Only God himself created, good and evil . It is up to us to chose which we will serve and let into our lives, and we are to be held solely responsible for what we chose to do. Not some other thing, like a demonic being of some kind. Even when God sent his angel to be a advasery to Job, God still held Job responsible for his attitude in judgment with Job.
Look up the original origin for the word devil or satan and read it for yourselfs.
Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene
Hi Gene,
There is only one Good Spirit.
The Lake of fire has been prepared for the devil and his angels.
You may not recognise them but God has already condemned them and hopes men will not join them.
Nick think on the below scriptures,
Hebrews 2:15 And deliver them who THROUGH FEAR of death were all their lifetime SUBJECT to BONDAGE.
Galatians 6:8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting
Matthew 16:24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples,If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.
Romans 8: 5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Romans 8: 13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Romans 5:19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Romans 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7 For he that is dead is freed from sin. 8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: 9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Ephesians 2: 3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Nick why does scripture say that many were made sinners because of one man’s disobedience?
Why does scripture say we through FEAR of death are subject to bondage?
Nick why does scripture say that because Jesus cannot die no more that means DEATH no more has dominion over him?
Why does Jesus say those who will save their lives will lose it, and those that follow Christ and lose theirs will find it?
Why are we told by Paul that we are by NATURE children of wrath as we fulfill the desires of the flesh and of the mind?
I will tell you why because you don’t seem to comprehend.
The body of sin is the body that fears death which that fear is according to our nature. We are carnal like other animals, we survive through natural instincts. This is what is known as the “spirit of bondage” of FEAR. Are you familiar with the term FIGHT or FLIGHT Nick?
You want to say it is wicked rebel spirits that have us in bondage, but the devil is this very spirit of bondage that Paul describes throughout his letters. Slander, cheating, stealing, murder etc, they are all works of the flesh, they are produced through man’s own devices as he follows his natural instinct to be dominant, and the more dominant you are the more likely you are to SURVIVE. Those that follow God’s Spirit acknowledge like Paul did that they are a wretched man because as long as they are in this mortal body, temptation exists. Paul knew that he would receive an eternal body that would no longer be in bondage to the fear of death, the carnal instincts will be destroyed.
All after Adam were made sinners because they were born into this bondage of fear. They were by NATURE BORN children of wrath, under a spirit of bondage, that spirit is NOT a leader of fallen spirit beings, it is not a leader of dead wicked spirits, it is not a leader of dead hybrids of celestial beings having mated with human beings, it is the spirit within man that is bound up in the FEAR of DEATH. This spirit is a slanderer and an adversary, it says serve me so you may live, but we need to serve God’s will in order to live.
You completely disregard how the word spirit is often times used in scripture, and choose to view that word in a very narrow sense of which is convenient for you as it serves your theology. Everything I wrote above falls directly in line with what Paul teaches, and as well it is something we can readily observed throughout creation and God’s creatures. When men are referred to as brute beasts, or dogs going after their own vomit, or snakes speaking with a forked tongue, when Daniel and Revelation describe kings and their messengers as animals, it does not mean they are under evil spirit influences, it represents the mind of man that operates without the Spirit of God, which is exactly what animals do.
Book Of Enoch says,
Enoch 8:1–3a reads, “And Azazel taught men to make swords and knives and shields and breastplates; and made known to them the metals [of the earth] and the art of working them; and bracelets and ornaments; and the use of antimony and the beautifying of the eyelids; and all kinds of costly stones and all colouring tinctures. And there arose much godlessness, and they committed fornication, and they were led astray and became corrupt in all their ways.”
Scripture says,
Exodus 35: 30 And Moses said unto the children of Israel, See, the LORD hath called by name Bezaleel the son of Uri, the son of Hur, of the tribe of Judah; 31 And he hath filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship; 32 And to devise curious works, to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass, 33 And in the cutting of stones, to set them, and in carving of wood, to make any manner of cunning work.
Leviticus 16: 10 But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness… 26 And he that let go the goat for the scapegoat shall wash his clothes, and bathe his flesh in water, and afterward come into the camp.
scapegoat — transliterated word azazel
entire removal, scapegoat
There exists in the bible NO angel name Azazel, but Jews certainly invented a fable about one, of whom they took God’s powers of giving wisdom to man to fulfill His purpose and plan and they gave it over to an angel who is said to be punished by God for “revealing eternal secrets.”
Scripture teaches that God gives His wisdom to man and God all-knowing knows that which will be done with it.
The below scripture reveals a few key things,
Cunning works were invented by men of Judah under the King of Judah Uzziah.
Uzziah became strong through these inventions and his heart was lifted up to his destruction
For his transgression God plagued him with leprosy, of which he had from then unto his death.
2 Chronicles 26:14 And Uzziah prepared for them throughout all the host shields, and spears, and helmets, and habergeons, and bows, and slings to cast stones. 15 And he made in Jerusalem engines, invented by cunning men, to be on the towers and upon the bulwarks, to shoot arrows and great stones withal. And his name spread far abroad; for he was marvellously helped, till he was strong. 16 But when he was strong, his heart was lifted up to his destruction: for he transgressed against the LORD his God, and went into the temple of the LORD to burn incense upon the altar of incense. 17 And Azariah the priest went in after him, and with him fourscore priests of the LORD, that were valiant men: 18 And they withstood Uzziah the king, and said unto him, It appertaineth not unto thee, Uzziah, to burn incense unto the LORD, but to the priests the sons of Aaron, that are consecrated to burn incense: go out of the sanctuary; for thou hast trespassed; neither shall it be for thine honour from the LORD God. 19 Then Uzziah was wroth, and had a censer in his hand to burn incense: and while he was wroth with the priests, the leprosy even rose up in his forehead before the priests in the house of the LORD, from beside the incense altar. 20 And Azariah the chief priest, and all the priests, looked upon him, and, behold, he was leprous in his forehead, and they thrust him out from thence; yea, himself hasted also to go out, because the LORD had smitten him. 21 And Uzziah the king was a leper unto the day of his death, and dwelt in a several house, being a leper; for he was cut off from the house of the LORD: and Jotham his son was over the king’s house, judging the people of the land.
The book of Enoch says,
- 8. And now, the giants, who are produced from the spirits (fallen angels) and flesh (human women), shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, and on the earth shall be their dwelling. 9. Evil spirits have proceeded from their bodies; because they are born from women, and from the holy Watchers (fallen angels) is their beginning and primal origin; they shall be evil spirits on earth, and evil spirits shall they be called. 10. As for the spirits of heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their dwelling. 11. And the spirits of the giants afflict, oppress, destroy, attack, do battle, and work destruction on the earth, and cause trouble: they take no food, but nevertheless hunger, and thirst, and cause offences. And these spirits shall rise up against the children of men and against the women, because they have proceeded from them.
Scripture says,
Deuteronomy 7: 23 But the LORD thy God shall deliver them unto thee, and shall destroy them with a mighty destruction, until they be destroyed.
Deuteronomy 32: 21 They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. 22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. 23 I will heap mischiefs upon them; I will spend mine arrows upon them. 24 They shall be burnt with hunger, and devoured with burning heat, and with bitter destruction:…. 27 Were it not that I feared the wrath of the enemy, lest their adversaries should behave themselves strangely, and lest they should say, Our hand is high, and the LORD hath not done all this. 28 For they are a nation void of counsel, neither is there any understanding in them. 29 O that they were wise, that they understood this, that they would consider their latter end! 30 How should one chase a thousand, and two put ten thousand to flight, except their Rock had sold them, and the LORD had shut them up? 31 For their rock is not as our Rock, even our enemies themselves being judges. 32 For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter: 33 Their wine is the poison of dragons, and the cruel venom of asps. 34 Is not this laid up in store with me, and sealed up among my treasures? 35 To me belongeth vengeance, and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste. 36 For the LORD shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants, when he seeth that their power is gone, and there is none shut up, or left. 37 And he shall say, Where are their gods, their rock in whom they trusted, 38 Which did eat the fat of their sacrifices, and drank the wine of their drink offerings? let them rise up and help you, and be your protection. 39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. 40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever. 41 If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.
The book of Enoch is a work of fables!
God declares with certainty, repeatedly In Genesis that everything made on earth was of a certain kind and would reproduce from their kind.
1 Corinthians 15: 39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
A celestial being do not mate with terrestrials. But the Book of Enoch says that angels not only mated with humans but with animals as well. Calling a Son of God a wicked angel makes sense? Calling a Son of God a righteous man is false? The theology created around Genesis 6 is blasphemous, pure lies. The authors then say that the dead offspring of the angels and humans became wicked spirits on earth bringing all trouble and destruction unto man. The word of God however says specifically that men would invent from the imaginations of their minds, false gods that kill and make alive, that wound and can heal, but God says ONLY HE can do this, there is no other, no god of Ekron, no god of the Philistines, no god of Egypt, and no gods of blasphemous Jews. Paul warns us of these Jews directly, calling those who invented doctrines of demons liars and hypocrites. Likewise Jesus called them blind hypocrites. These absurd men woke up in the morning to complete a hand washing ritual to remove the last of the demons that entered them every night, as they ridiculously believed. We see Josephus known as a Pharisee believed that it was not hybrids that were the evil spirits, he says they are the spirits of dead wicked men.
The Book of Enoch says a fallen angel brings war, scripture tells us that it is God that establishes kingdoms and territories, He sets kings up and He makes them fall. He brings Israel to the sword as punishment. GOD made the body of Uzziah unclean with LEPROSY because his heart was lifted up and he defiled God.
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