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Hi Kejonn,
You wrote:
I think that people want to force Jesus into fitting the role of the Jewish messiah when it is quite apparent that he does not meet the requirements.I write:
What topic on this message board spells this out about Him not meeting the requirements? Would you mind showing me so that I can read about it?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,08:31) Hi mandy,
God sends the Comforter.
We are poor servants
Nick,You are not a poor servant but rather a stubborn servant.
You see the points that are being raised but choose to safeguard the status of what you have come to accept as the “truth”. But when this truth is questioned you say, “Don't question it.” It's almost like you are afraid to question anything at this point in your life? You certainly are harsh with those of us who are questioning.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,16:19) Hi mandy,
Really?
You know of a better way than faith?
Do I sense sarcasm? That's so surprising coming from you! Nick, faith and “reasoning together” do not have to be opposites. When God called Abe he didn't say, “Don't question me, just believe!” He said, “Come, let us reason together.”
One can have faith and still ask questions.
It's OK. God can handle it.
Hi mandy,
We must endure.
Matthew 24:13
” But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved.
1 Corinthians 13:7
bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
2 Timothy 2:10
For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory.
2 Timothy 2:12
If we endure, we will also reign with Him;If we deny Him, He also will deny us;We must hate falsehood.
Psalm 119:163
I hate and despise falsehood,But I love Your law.
Psalm 101:3
I will set no worthless thing before my eyes;I hate the work of those who fall away;It shall not fasten its grip on me.
Psalm 119:104
From Your precepts I get understanding;Therefore I hate every false way.
Psalm 119:128
Therefore I esteem right all Your precepts concerning everything,I hate every false way.Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 26 2008,22:32) Hi Kejonn,
You wrote:
I think that people want to force Jesus into fitting the role of the Jewish messiah when it is quite apparent that he does not meet the requirements.I write:
What topic on this message board spells this out about Him not meeting the requirements? Would you mind showing me so that I can read about it?
https://heavennet.net/cgi-bin/forum/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST;f=17;t=1625
You can start with that thread.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,16:19) Hi mandy,
Really?
You know of a better way than faith?
Nick,Faith without reason is a man standing on one leg; reason without faith can be sterile yet faith without reason is the germ of fanaticism and superstition.
Faith is
1: firm belief in something for which there is no proof
2: complete trust
3: something that is believed especially with strong convictionSuperstition is
a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation b: an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural, nature, or God resulting from superstition
2: a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary.Faith is to carry us when there is no proof not to deny truth when we hear it, that is superstition.
Quote (Cato @ Mar. 27 2008,22:48) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,16:19) Hi mandy,
Really?
You know of a better way than faith?
Nick,Faith without reason is a man standing on one leg; reason without faith can be sterile yet faith without reason is the germ of fanaticism and superstition.
Faith is
1: firm belief in something for which there is no proof
2: complete trust
3: something that is believed especially with strong convictionSuperstition is
a belief or practice resulting from ignorance, fear of the unknown, trust in magic or chance, or a false conception of causation b: an irrational abject attitude of mind toward the supernatural, nature, or God resulting from superstition
2: a notion maintained despite evidence to the contrary.Faith is to carry us when there is no proof not to deny truth when we hear it, that is superstition.
The Bible teaches us to prove all things.
1 Thes. 5:21 ” Prove all things……”Mrs.
Hi cato,
Faith must come before knowledge.
2Peter 1
5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;6And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
Quote (Mandy @ Mar. 27 2008,08:27) Quote (seek and you will find @ Mar. 26 2008,17:51) Quote (Mandy @ Mar. 26 2008,16:16) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 26 2008,16:05) Hi mandy,
It is not the godless gunman blazing away that is the real threat
but the soft shoe philosophy salesman who would pick your pocket of faith.
Nick, I know you mean well. However the things that Cato writes are not a threat to my faith, nor do I see them as purely humanistic.What has been more a threat to my faith has come from believer's such as yourself, who plainly see the various flaws with scripture and say nothing. Nor will you even allow yourlsef to acknowledge any part of the concern. This has made me question blind faith in Christianity. When I ask questions and I am only told to not ask questions, that makes me wonder? It makes me lose faith in the unquestionable.
Mandy! I have been very sad ever since you have denied Jesus Christ as your Savior. And now you feel like it is Nick's fault, because He is not positive? Did I help too? You told me that you have lost faith. That is no body's fault, but your own. We are to prove all things, not our neighbor.
Please don't feel offended, but I just had to say something. We make our own decision, and we can't blame others for doing so, Mandy.
Peace be with you, I will always love you.
Peace and Love Irene
Hi Irene,First of all, I've never “denied” Jesus as my Savior. I only said that I am doubting and searching the truth out.
Secondly, you misunderstand my beef with Nick. None of my doubting is Nick's fault per se. I have become discouraged with “believers” who, like him, will not address the obvious concerns that folks like me have.
Lastly, you should not speak of being judgemental of your brother's and sisters as you fill that role quite often here. You need only look to the Trinity thread to see where you have (once again) told someone they are “wrong” and why you are right. Regardless, look to the log in your own eye before trying to help me with the speck in mine, please.
And peace be with you, and I will always love you.
Mandy
You know what Mandy, I still question why t8 took your posting right in the believers tread away? If you did not deny Jesus being our Messiah?
That is why I said what I did.
Peace IreneQuote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,16:44) Hi mandy,
We must endure.
Matthew 24:13
” But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved.
1 Corinthians 13:7
bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.
2 Timothy 2:10
For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory.
2 Timothy 2:12
If we endure, we will also reign with Him;If we deny Him, He also will deny us;We must hate falsehood.
Psalm 119:163
I hate and despise falsehood,But I love Your law.
Psalm 101:3
I will set no worthless thing before my eyes;I hate the work of those who fall away;It shall not fasten its grip on me.
Psalm 119:104
From Your precepts I get understanding;Therefore I hate every false way.
Psalm 119:128
Therefore I esteem right all Your precepts concerning everything,I hate every false way.
Thank you for this, Nick.It's finding out what the “false” way is – that is the homework for a lifetime.
Love,
MandyQuote (seek and you will find @ Mar. 28 2008,08:20) You know what Mandy, I still question why t8 took your posting right in the believers tread away? If you did not deny Jesus being our Messiah?
That is why I said what I did.
Peace Irene
He didn't take away my posting rights in the “believer's” section, I laid them down. I thought that it was only right to not be included among the “believer's” that Jesus is the Messiah (I guess that is what “believer” means here on this site). The reason being because I am not sure if that is right or not. I am searching it out. Therefore, I wanted a neutral ground from which to operate.I have to say that I am sorry I can not contribute in the “believer's” area because I have had many questions that could not be asked due to limited posting. Plus, the limitation goes beyond the “Believer's Place” and includes other areas like Prayer and sharing a Testimony! Therefore my contributions have been limited.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2008,14:52) Hi cato,
Faith must come before knowledge.
2Peter 1
5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;6And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
I can see this. Peter (or whoever wrote this) knew that people like you, Nick, would develop a faith that would later deny knowledge. Had people sought knowledge (and been allowed to access such knowledge, thank you Church) first, they would never have developed faith because such knowledge would show that many things do not add up.But I've noticed that those who develop a strong dogmatic faith tend to shun knowledge. Knowledge is the enemy of faith — at least faith in something that contradicts real knowledge.
Real knowledge will show that –according to the Hebrew OT — Jesus could not be the promised Messiah. Real knowledge will show that God saw human sacrifice as evil. Real knowledge will show that no one can pay for the sins of another.
Real knowledge would shatter faith in false things.
Quote (kejonn @ Mar. 28 2008,15:03) Real knowledge will show that –according to the Hebrew OT — Jesus could not be the promised Messiah. Real knowledge will show that God saw human sacrifice as evil. Real knowledge will show that no one can pay for the sins of another. Real knowledge would shatter faith in false things.
Alright Kejonn. What “real knowledge” has led you to the conclusion that Yeshua is not the Messiah. And since you put no stock at all in the veracity of the scriptures we'll have to exclude them as a source of reference…..What have you got for us?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 28 2008,09:31) Hi Mandy,
You are not a disbeliever.
Just checking stuff.
Thanks, Nick. Ya, I've been thinking this too. I wonder if my other account is still active? Ha! I'm just fickle right now, there is no other way to discribe me. One day I'm sure, the next day I'm not. Good grief.
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