Feelings

[seekingtruth]

Stu,
You're living proof of the truth in scripture “professing themselves to be wise they become fools”. You rant, tear, and twist at everything others hold precious but to what end? I guess it is true, misery loves company.

[Maranatha]

Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22)

Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm

*smiles* Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures!

[Not3in1]

Mara,

Thanks for sharing your testimony. I enjoyed reading it, and I'm glad that you are here.

Love,
Mandy

[Maranatha]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Mar. 13 2009,18:03)

Mara, Thanks for sharing your testimony.  I enjoyed reading it, and I'm glad that you are here. Love, Mandy

Thanks! Glad to be here!

[Stu]

Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,07:00)

Stu, You're living proof of the truth in scripture “professing themselves to be wise they become fools”. You rant, tear, and twist at everything others hold precious but to what end? I guess it is true, misery loves company.

You are going to pronounce ME miserable on the words of the bigoted arch-zealot Saul of Tarsus? How much more miserable could he have been alternating between condemning homosexuals, calling those who disagreed with him 'fool' and 'acursed', emboldening christians with statements soothing their concerns that what they were being taught was blithering idiocy, writing letters to Romans bluffing them that the evidence for his version of reality was all around the and they were idiots not to see it, and letters to Greeks trying to convince them that Jesus was not just an apparition.

If you hold that precious I think you need to think carefully about what Jesus would have said about Saul of Tarsus and his small-minded misery.

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17)

Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures!

And at that point the deception is complete. Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do.

You could be right about your worldview. Can you see how you might be wrong?

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 14 2009,17:52)

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17) Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures! And at that point the deception is complete.  Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do. You could be right about your worldview.  Can you see how you might be wrong? Stuart

Nope, not at all. My faith in God will not waiver. I could care less about the lies that Satan has put out there to decieve people about evolution.

God created the Heavens and the earth, and I will never believe anything different.

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 15 2009,06:36)

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 14 2009,17:52) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17) Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures! And at that point the deception is complete.  Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do. You could be right about your worldview.  Can you see how you might be wrong? Stuart Nope, not at all.  My faith in God will not waiver.  I could care less about the lies that Satan has put out there to decieve people about evolution. God created the Heavens and the earth, and I will never believe anything different.

Then what immunity do you have against 'satan', who may have come in the name of your god, misleading you as 'he' goes, and is quite happy that you are completely inflexible in agreeing to 'his' doctrines?

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 15 2009,20:21)

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 15 2009,06:36) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 14 2009,17:52) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17) Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures! And at that point the deception is complete.  Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do. You could be right about your worldview.  Can you see how you might be wrong? Stuart Nope, not at all.  My faith in God will not waiver.  I could care less about the lies that Satan has put out there to decieve people about evolution. God created the Heavens and the earth, and I will never believe anything different. Then what immunity do you have against 'satan', who may have come in the name of your god, misleading you as 'he' goes, and is quite happy that you are completely inflexible in agreeing to 'his' doctrines? Stuart

My “immunity” is the Lord Jesus Christ. It's your own choice not to believe, but please take your unbelief somewhere else, because it is doubtful that anyone here can be swayed to your beliefs. Coming into a Christian forum, just to knock other people's beliefs is just sad.

[theodorej]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,02:08)

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 12 2009,18:14) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 12 2009,01:37) I'm sorry you don't believe, and I sincerely hope and pray that God will reveal Himself to you someday, before it is too late.   God bless! I'm sorry that you do believe, and I hope you are able to see the true beauty in the universe before it is too late. Stuart The universe HAS to have a Creator.   It, and us, with all our technology, etc. simply cannot just “come into existence one day and evolve the way we have without a creator.  The “big bang theory” is just ridiculous.     I do appreciate the universe, because my God created it, and everything in it. I'm always curious as to why an unbeliever hangs out in a Christian forum…….I mean, there are hundreds of other forums on the web, like sports, games, age groups, etc……. But if all you want to do is to attempt to discredit other people's strong beliefs, then what satisfaction can it possibly give you?  Wouldn't you be more happy at a forum where you had something in common with the other members?

Greetings M……Stu hones his debating skills inconjunction with developing a support system that is self contained and constantly reassures him that, he is right and you are wrong…
He is a formidable opponent to my belief system and I welcome his discourse….Welcome to the forum…

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 16 2009,02:19)

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 15 2009,20:21) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 15 2009,06:36) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 14 2009,17:52) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17) Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures! And at that point the deception is complete.  Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do. You could be right about your worldview.  Can you see how you might be wrong? Stuart Nope, not at all.  My faith in God will not waiver.  I could care less about the lies that Satan has put out there to decieve people about evolution. God created the Heavens and the earth, and I will never believe anything different. Then what immunity do you have against 'satan', who may have come in the name of your god, misleading you as 'he' goes, and is quite happy that you are completely inflexible in agreeing to 'his' doctrines? Stuart My “immunity” is the Lord Jesus Christ.     It's your own choice not to believe, but please take your unbelief somewhere else, because it is doubtful that anyone here can be swayed to your beliefs.  Coming into a Christian forum, just to knock other people's beliefs is just sad.

Why do you think Saul of Tarsus is so keen to tell christians that they will be mocked? Is it because he was mocked and he needed some reinforcement? It is true that christians believe ridiculous things. Why can they not admit it and accept the reality check on offer?

It is not my goal to convert, only to make you think seriously about what you believe. Is that a bad thing? The way you write, you seem to indicate that there is some fragility to your faith that needs protection from me.

You do have the option of only posting where I cannot…

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 16 2009,19:28)

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 16 2009,02:19) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 15 2009,20:21) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 15 2009,06:36) Quote (Stu @ Mar. 14 2009,17:52) Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 13 2009,13:17) Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 13 2009,03:22) Maranatha, Good post, it is a shame that many become too “sophisticated” to believe the “foolish” things of God. I believe it is why Jesus told us to be as a child. Welcome, hope you stick around Wm *smiles*  Yes….it does say in the Bible that unbelievers will find the message of the cross and the things we believe in foolish. It is certainly happening according to scriptures! And at that point the deception is complete.  Your immunity to fantasy religious nonsense is compromised by all those scriptures that appeal to your in-group psychology by telling you that all the nasty people will mock you – for believing utterly silly things, which actually you do. You could be right about your worldview.  Can you see how you might be wrong? Stuart Nope, not at all.  My faith in God will not waiver.  I could care less about the lies that Satan has put out there to decieve people about evolution. God created the Heavens and the earth, and I will never believe anything different. Then what immunity do you have against 'satan', who may have come in the name of your god, misleading you as 'he' goes, and is quite happy that you are completely inflexible in agreeing to 'his' doctrines? Stuart My “immunity” is the Lord Jesus Christ.     It's your own choice not to believe, but please take your unbelief somewhere else, because it is doubtful that anyone here can be swayed to your beliefs.  Coming into a Christian forum, just to knock other people's beliefs is just sad. Why do you think Saul of Tarsus is so keen to tell christians that they will be mocked?  Is it because he was mocked and he needed some reinforcement?  It is true that christians believe ridiculous things.  Why can they not admit it and accept the reality check on offer? It is not my goal to convert, only to make you think seriously about what you believe.  Is that a bad thing?  The way you write, you seem to indicate that there is some fragility to your faith that needs protection from me. You do have the option of only posting where I cannot… Stuart

Yes, Christians have been, and will be mocked…..because to people who are perishing, the things we believe are “foolishness”

I believe in Jesus. You don't. I will not change my beliefs, no matter what you say to me, but I hope that God will make Himself real to you so that you can believe and understand, and have hope for the future.

I see no need to continue this conversation either.

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 17 2009,01:57)

Yes, Christians have been, and will be mocked…..because to people who are perishing, the things we believe are “foolishness” I believe in Jesus.  You don't.  I will not change my beliefs, no matter what you say to me, but I hope that God will make Himself real to you so that you can believe and understand, and have hope for the future.   I see no need to continue this conversation either.

We are all 'perishing', but hopefully not in the near future. This promise of eternal life given to you by Jesus's scriptwriters is not worth the parchment it was 'printed' on. I am glad you can see that the things you believe look foolish to everyone else. That is a definition of delusion, of course.

I think I would probably believe in Jesus, had he existed. Not all the miracle nonsense that Saul of Tarsus did not believe in, nor the virgin birth nonsense that many religions invented around the same time also copy, not the Winter Solstice birthday that so many religions co-opted for their man-god saviours, and not the nonsense that people walk again after they have been judicially executed. I believe in the consideration of the 'golden rule', and forgiveness and other principles supposedly expoused by Jesus even though he was not the first expouser of them. I also think one can never know if Jesus really existed, because there is no clear-cut non-christian mention of him and Paul has stomped all over with his homophobic and just plain antisocial bigotry anyway.

I hope you will see that the created universe with the myth of Jesus you believe is an ugly thing.

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 17 2009,21:05)

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 17 2009,01:57) Yes, Christians have been, and will be mocked…..because to people who are perishing, the things we believe are “foolishness” I believe in Jesus.  You don't.  I will not change my beliefs, no matter what you say to me, but I hope that God will make Himself real to you so that you can believe and understand, and have hope for the future.   I see no need to continue this conversation either. We are all 'perishing', but hopefully not in the near future.  This promise of eternal life given to you by Jesus's scriptwriters is not worth the parchment it was 'printed' on.  I am glad you can see that the things you believe look foolish to everyone else.  That is a definition of delusion, of course. I think I would probably believe in Jesus, had he existed.  Not all the miracle nonsense that Saul of Tarsus did not believe in, nor the virgin birth nonsense that many religions invented around the same time also copy, not the Winter Solstice birthday that so many religions co-opted for their man-god saviours, and not the nonsense that people walk again after they have been judicially executed.  I believe in the consideration of the 'golden rule', and forgiveness and other principles supposedly expoused by Jesus even though he was not the first expouser of them.   I also think one can never know if Jesus really existed, because there is no clear-cut non-christian mention of him and Paul has stomped all over with his homophobic and just plain antisocial bigotry anyway. I hope you will see that the created universe with the myth of Jesus you believe is an ugly thing. Stuart

As I said. I believe it. Most of the people here believe it. You don't. So WHY do you persist in hanging out here with people who obviously choose not to believe the way you do?

Does it just give you pleasure to walk around knocking people's beliefs all the time? What possible pleasure can that give you? Does it make you feel good about yourself? Does it give you a peace in your heart?

I'm going to Heaven someday to be with my Lord Jesus, who I love SO much….that is what is keeping me happy! That is what I look forward to when I die. This life is just a temporary place to survive in. My real home is in Heaven. I will get to physically touch the scars on my Lord Jesus' hands one day…..I will lean up against Him and feel His heartbeat. I will walk in the Garden of Eden with Him and eat of the Tree of Life.

I look FORWARD to these things, and I press on in my belief, every day…..

What is keeping YOU truly happy Stu? Your job? Your car? Your wife/girlfriend/boyfriend? Do they make you TRULY happy, Stu, or are you constantly “seeking” something more in your life?

What about when you die Stu? What do you imagine will happen then? You can disbelieve in Jesus all you want……BUT. What. If. we. are. right. about. Him???

Then what Stu? What do you actually LOSE by believing in Him now? Nothing at all. But what do you gain by believing?

Your eternal salvation, and a hope for the future, and peace and love, and a change in yourself.

Stu, you will NEVER find what you are looking for in life….. KEEP seeking and seeking, until you accept Jesus, and know true peace in your life.

[Stu]

What business is it of yours??

Quote

Do they make you TRULY happy, Stu, or are you constantly “seeking” something more in your life? I seek the truth. Because you claim to have found it, I don't think you do seek truth. What really keeps me going are the two big challenges I have set myself: to work out as well as I can what the universe is all about, what makes it work; and to work out what makes my fellow humans tick. That could be part of the reason I post here, although as I posted earlier there is little profit to be had in questioning the motives of others, other than doing so in a general sense. Nothing can make you 'truly happy', that is a function of your bain chemistry. It is especially not a happiness-inducing thought to believe in a god that admitted to killing up to 32,000,000 of my fellow humans. Such a god should be hunted down and put on trial, not worshipped. What about when you die Stu? What do you imagine will happen then? You can disbelieve in Jesus all you want……BUT. What. If. we. are. right. about. Him???

When I die my atoms get recycled. It has been a very long time I have not existed and it will in the future be a long time I will not exist. It didn't bother me in the past and so why should it bother me in the future? Nevertheless what an amazing thing to have been born at all and be in a position to contemplate such things.

What if I am right about Jesus?

Quote

Then what Stu? What do you actually LOSE by believing in Him now? Nothing at all. But what do you gain by believing?

I lose a tremendous amount. The beauty of the universe and its fathomability, the absurd nonsense of being sincere about things that are just ridiculous. I don't see any gain of value by trying to overcome my skepticism. By not assuming any religious tenets I am open to the constant surprises that the world throws up. If I just put everything ultimately down to a god that can do magic, what a dull world it would become. I think more than anything it simply could be genetic. I don't think I have god-believing genes. I think Pascal's Wager is a cowardly philosophy, and I wonder what kind of god would admire those with a bob each way.

Quote

Your eternal salvation, and a hope for the future, and peace and love, and a change in yourself.

I don't need 'salvation', the lie invented by a power-seeking church that attepts control by the drill-sergent's methods, and I don't think I need to change myself, certainly not from being curious and in awe of the universe to accepting things about it that are not true, on no evidence. How is that an improvement? I have plenty of the hope that is inherent in all humanity, the hope that religion tries to hijack for its own ends, but does not belong to it. I have peace and love already, something I am grateful for.

Quote

Stu, you will NEVER find what you are looking for in life…..

Bollocks. you don't know me. Does your bible tell you that I cannot find “What I am looking for”? Of course it does: christianity invents a need and then sells the cure, just like any good conman.

Quote

KEEP seeking and seeking, until you accept Jesus, and know true peace in your life.

I seek, and what I find so far is a reality more exciting in its discovery than any dull human-invented mythology. I do not appreciate your cheap prostyletising, either.

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 18 2009,20:29)

What business is it of yours?? Quote Do they make you TRULY happy, Stu, or are you constantly “seeking” something more in your life? I seek the truth.  Because you claim to have found it, I don't think you do seek truth.  What really keeps me going are the two big challenges I have set myself: to work out as well as I can what the universe is all about, what makes it work; and to work out what makes my fellow humans tick.  That could be part of the reason I post here, although as I posted earlier there is little profit to be had in questioning the motives of others, other than doing so in a general sense.  Nothing can make you 'truly happy', that is a function of your bain chemistry.  It is especially not a happiness-inducing thought to believe in a god that admitted to killing up to 32,000,000 of my fellow humans.  Such a god should be hunted down and put on trial, not worshipped. What about when you die Stu?  What do you imagine will happen then?   You can disbelieve in Jesus all you want……BUT.  What. If. we. are. right. about. Him??? When I die my atoms get recycled.  It has been a very long time I have not existed and it will in the future be a long time I will not exist.  It didn't bother me in the past and so why should it bother me in the future?  Nevertheless what an amazing thing to have been born at all and be in a position to contemplate such things.   What if I am right about Jesus? Quote Then what Stu?  What do you actually LOSE by believing in Him now?  Nothing at all.  But what do you gain by believing? I lose a tremendous amount.  The beauty of the universe and its fathomability, the absurd nonsense of being sincere about things that are just ridiculous. I don't see any gain of value by trying to overcome my skepticism.  By not assuming any religious tenets I am open to the constant surprises that the world throws up.  If I just put everything ultimately down to a god that can do magic, what a dull world it would become.  I think more than anything it simply could be genetic. I don't think I have god-believing genes.  I think Pascal's Wager is a cowardly philosophy, and I wonder what kind of god would admire those with a bob each way. Quote Your eternal salvation, and a hope for the future, and peace and love, and a change in yourself. I don't need 'salvation', the lie invented by a power-seeking church that attepts control by the drill-sergent's methods, and I don't think I need to change myself, certainly not from being curious and in awe of the universe to accepting things about it that are not true, on no evidence.  How is that an improvement?  I have plenty of the hope that is inherent in all humanity, the hope that religion tries to hijack for its own ends, but does not belong to it.  I have peace and love already, something I am grateful for. Quote Stu, you will NEVER find what you are looking for in life….. Bollocks.  you don't know me.  Does your bible tell you that I cannot find “What I am looking for”?  Of course it does: christianity invents a need and then sells the cure, just like any good conman. Quote KEEP seeking and seeking, until you accept Jesus, and know true peace in your life. I seek, and what I find so far is a reality more exciting in its discovery than any dull human-invented mythology.  I do not appreciate your cheap prostyletising, either. Stuart

So WHY even waste your time hanging out here? WHY?

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 19 2009,02:29)

Stu,Mar. wrote: What business is it of yours?? Quote Do they make you TRULY happy, Stu, or are you constantly “seeking” something more in your life? Quote I seek the truth.  Because you claim to have found it, I don't think you do seek truth.  What really keeps me going are the two big challenges I have set myself: to work out as well as I can what the universe is all about, what makes it work; and to work out what makes my fellow humans tick.  That could be part of the reason I post here, although as I posted earlier there is little profit to be had in questioning the motives of others, other than doing so in a general sense.  Nothing can make you 'truly happy', that is a function of your bain chemistry.  It is especially not a happiness-inducing thought to believe in a god that admitted to killing up to 32,000,000 of my fellow humans.  Such a god should be hunted down and put on trial, not worshipped. What about when you die Stu?  What do you imagine will happen then?   You can disbelieve in Jesus all you want……BUT.  What. If. we. are. right. about. Him??? When I die my atoms get recycled.  It has been a very long time I have not existed and it will in the future be a long time I will not exist.  It didn't bother me in the past and so why should it bother me in the future?  Nevertheless what an amazing thing to have been born at all and be in a position to contemplate such things.   What if I am right about Jesus? Quote Then what Stu?  What do you actually LOSE by believing in Him now?  Nothing at all.  But what do you gain by believing? I lose a tremendous amount.  The beauty of the universe and its fathomability, the absurd nonsense of being sincere about things that are just ridiculous. I don't see any gain of value by trying to overcome my skepticism.  By not assuming any religious tenets I am open to the constant surprises that the world throws up.  If I just put everything ultimately down to a god that can do magic, what a dull world it would become.  I think more than anything it simply could be genetic. I don't think I have god-believing genes.  I think Pascal's Wager is a cowardly philosophy, and I wonder what kind of god would admire those with a bob each way. Quote Your eternal salvation, and a hope for the future, and peace and love, and a change in yourself. I don't need 'salvation', the lie invented by a power-seeking church that attepts control by the drill-sergent's methods, and I don't think I need to change myself, certainly not from being curious and in awe of the universe to accepting things about it that are not true, on no evidence.  How is that an improvement?  I have plenty of the hope that is inherent in all humanity, the hope that religion tries to hijack for its own ends, but does not belong to it.  I have peace and love already, something I am grateful for. Quote Stu, you will NEVER find what you are looking for in life….. Bollocks.  you don't know me.  Does your bible tell you that I cannot find “What I am looking for”?  Of course it does: christianity invents a need and then sells the cure, just like any good conman. Quote KEEP seeking and seeking, until you accept Jesus, and know true peace in your life. I seek, and what I find so far is a reality more exciting in its discovery than any dull human-invented mythology.  I do not appreciate your cheap prostyletising, either. Stuart So WHY even waste your time hanging out here?   WHY?

Why do you think it is a waste of time?

Stuart

[Maranatha]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 19 2009,05:48)

Maranatha,Mar. wrote: [quote=Stu,Mar. 18 2009,20:29]What business is it of yours?? Quote Do they make you TRULY happy, Stu, or are you constantly “seeking” something more in your life? Quote I seek the truth.  Because you claim to have found it, I don't think you do seek truth.  What really keeps me going are the two big challenges I have set myself: to work out as well as I can what the universe is all about, what makes it work; and to work out what makes my fellow humans tick.  That could be part of the reason I post here, although as I posted earlier there is little profit to be had in questioning the motives of others, other than doing so in a general sense.  Nothing can make you 'truly happy', that is a function of your bain chemistry.  It is especially not a happiness-inducing thought to believe in a god that admitted to killing up to 32,000,000 of my fellow humans.  Such a god should be hunted down and put on trial, not worshipped. Quote What about when you die Stu?  What do you imagine will happen then?   You can disbelieve in Jesus all you want……BUT.  What. If. we. are. right. about. Him??? When I die my atoms get recycled.  It has been a very long time I have not existed and it will in the future be a long time I will not exist.  It didn't bother me in the past and so why should it bother me in the future?  Nevertheless what an amazing thing to have been born at all and be in a position to contemplate such things.   What if I am right about Jesus? Quote Then what Stu?  What do you actually LOSE by believing in Him now?  Nothing at all.  But what do you gain by believing? I lose a tremendous amount.  The beauty of the universe and its fathomability, the absurd nonsense of being sincere about things that are just ridiculous. I don't see any gain of value by trying to overcome my skepticism.  By not assuming any religious tenets I am open to the constant surprises that the world throws up.  If I just put everything ultimately down to a god that can do magic, what a dull world it would become.  I think more than anything it simply could be genetic. I don't think I have god-believing genes.  I think Pascal's Wager is a cowardly philosophy, and I wonder what kind of god would admire those with a bob each way. Quote Your eternal salvation, and a hope for the future, and peace and love, and a change in yourself. I don't need 'salvation', the lie invented by a power-seeking church that attepts control by the drill-sergent's methods, and I don't think I need to change myself, certainly not from being curious and in awe of the universe to accepting things about it that are not true, on no evidence.  How is that an improvement?  I have plenty of the hope that is inherent in all humanity, the hope that religion tries to hijack for its own ends, but does not belong to it.  I have peace and love already, something I am grateful for. Quote Stu, you will NEVER find what you are looking for in life….. Bollocks.  you don't know me.  Does your bible tell you that I cannot find “What I am looking for”?  Of course it does: christianity invents a need and then sells the cure, just like any good conman. Quote KEEP seeking and seeking, until you accept Jesus, and know true peace in your life. I seek, and what I find so far is a reality more exciting in its discovery than any dull human-invented mythology.  I do not appreciate your cheap prostyletising, either. Stuart So WHY even waste your time hanging out here?   WHY? Why do you think it is a waste of time? Stuart

I don't think it is a waste of time. Because I am a believer. But you DON'T believe, no matter what anyone else says to you, you don't believe, and you come here every day to attempt to knock down everyone else's beliefs. I mean, if you are not a believer, what point is there to come here, if you totally refuse to see the TRUTH in Jesus Christ? Why even come here, when you could hang out in some athiest forum and probably have more fun? Why try to bring us down with your unbelief and negativity?

[Stu]

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 19 2009,17:58)

I don't think it is a waste of time.  Because I am a believer.  But you DON'T believe, no matter what anyone else says to you, you don't believe, and you come here every day to attempt to knock down everyone else's beliefs.   I mean, if you are not a believer, what point is there to come here, if you totally refuse to see the TRUTH in Jesus Christ?   Why even come here, when you could hang out in some athiest forum and probably have more fun?  Why try to bring us down with your unbelief and negativity?

Like I said before, it is dull as anything to discuss motives for posting here. Nearly as dull as christianity.

Stuart

[theodorej]

Quote (Stu @ Mar. 19 2009,21:23)

Quote (Maranatha @ Mar. 19 2009,17:58) I don't think it is a waste of time.  Because I am a believer.  But you DON'T believe, no matter what anyone else says to you, you don't believe, and you come here every day to attempt to knock down everyone else's beliefs.   I mean, if you are not a believer, what point is there to come here, if you totally refuse to see the TRUTH in Jesus Christ?   Why even come here, when you could hang out in some athiest forum and probably have more fun?  Why try to bring us down with your unbelief and negativity? Like I said before, it is dull as anything to discuss motives for posting here.  Nearly as dull as christianity. Stuart

Greetings Stu…..What ever your motives are for posting,I find you a refreshing break from the picaune arguing over chapter and verse with neither side of the discusion yeilding to the possibility that,they could be wrong…A truly interlectual approach to the existance God is a virtual impossibility simply because a self proclaimed interlect will not concede his huberus in exchange for the contritness of a child…God finds himself among sinners not pius self rightous practioners of the letter of his word….God loves us and for that reason he gave us an instruction manual (The Bible )..This book tells of things to come,history that has been made and judgement that has been meated out for the purpose of correction….

[Author]

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