Eternal past existence of the son

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  • #367431
    journey42
    Participant

    OK, LETS GO OVER IT THEN.  THERES A RYTHM TO GOD'S WORDS. IT'S BEAUTIFUL, LIKE POETRY.

    PROVERBS CHAPTER 8

    1 Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice? SPEAKING OF WISDOM, THIS IS HOW THE CHAPTER STARTS

    2 She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths. ….SHE…IS THE ONE CRYING… WISDOM,

    3 She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors. WISDOM STANDS AT THE DOOR OF ZION.
    Proverbs 24:3   Through wisdom is an house builded; and by understanding it is established:

    4 Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man. WISDOM IS CALLING OUT TO MAN ….DESIRE ME.  

    5 O ye simple, understand wisdom: and, ye fools, be ye of an understanding heart.
    PSALMS 19:7   THE LAW OF THE LORD IS PERFECT, CONVERTING THE SOUL: THE TESTIMONY OF THE LORD IS SURE, MAKING WISE THE SIMPLE

    6 Hear; for I will speak of excellent things; and the opening of my lips shall be right things. WISDOM DOES NOT SPEAK FOOLISHLY

    7 For my mouth shall speak truth; and wickedness is an abomination to my lips.
    Psalms 49:3   My mouth shall speak of wisdom; and the meditation of my heart shall be of understanding.

    8 All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.
    Psalms 37:30  
    The mouth of the righteous speaketh wisdom, and his tongue talketh of judgment.
    [/B]

    9 They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge. WISDOM IS EASY, SIMPLE, NOT COMPLICATED AND CONFUSING.

    10 Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold. WISDOM WILL INSTRUCT/GUIDE AND KNOWLEDGE IS THE FRUIT OF IT.

    11 For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.
    Ecclesiastes 7:12   For wisdom is a defence, and money is a defence: but the excellency of knowledge is, that wisdom giveth life to them that have it.

    12 I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions. COMMON SENSE, GOOD JUDGMENT IS HAVING WISDOM.

    13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate. IF YOU HAVE WISDOM YOU WILL HATE THE THINGS GOD HATES.  SIMPLE AS THAT.

    14 Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.
    Proverbs 4:7   Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

    15 By me kings reign, and princes decree justice. GOD'S WISDOM HAS ALREADY PLANNED FROM THE BEGINNING THAT THERE WILL BE KINGS EXISTING IN THE GRAND PLAN, …TO PAVE THE WAY FOR THE KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS, ..TO EXCEL THEM ALL.

    16 By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth.
    Psalms 105:22   To bind his princes at his pleasure; and teach his senators wisdom.

    17 I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.
    Psalms 51:6   Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.

    18 Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.  WISDOM

    19 My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.
    Proverbs 16:16   How much better is it to get wisdom than gold! and to get understanding rather to be chosen than silver!

    20 I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment: AGAIN, WISDOM LEADS THE WAY

    21 That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures. LOVE WISDOM AND INCREASE YOUR TREASURES IN HEAVEN.

    22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. WISDOM

    23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.WISDOM

    24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.  WISDOM WAS ALWAYS WITH GOD

    25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
    WISDOM

    26 While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. WISDOM

    27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: WISDOM
    Psalms 136:5   To him that by wisdom made the heavens: for his mercy endureth for ever.

    28 When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep:
    Job 38:37   Who can number the clouds in wisdom? or who can stay the bottles of heaven.

    29 When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
    Jeremiah 51:15   He hath made the earth by his power, he hath established the world by his wisdom, and hath stretched out the heaven by his understanding.

    30 Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him;
    Jeremiah 10:12   He hath made the earth by his power, he hath established the world by his wisdom, and hath stretched out the heavens by his discretion.

    31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.  WISDOM
    2 Chronicles 9:7   Happy are thy men, and happy are these thy servants, which stand continually before thee, and hear thy wisdom.

    32 Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.  WISDOM
    Proverbs 9:10   The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

    33 Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.  WISDOM
    Jeremiah 8:9   The wise men are ashamed, they are dismayed and taken: lo, they have rejected the word of the LORD; and what wisdom is in them

    34 Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.  WISDOM
    Psalms 111:10   The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do his commandments: his praise endureth for ever.

    35 For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.  WISDOM
    Ephesians 1:17   That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:

    36 But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.  WISDOM
    Ecclesiastes 9:10   Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.

    #367433
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 16 2014,19:03)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 16 2014,05:46)
    J42

    NO ,I CANNOT SEE IT BUT I NOW CAN SEE WHY YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES AND THE PROPHECIES , AND THAT YOU HAVE TO FOLLOW MEN TO FEEL SAVE ,


    Pierre

    Do you need help?


    my days of looking for help from men are long over sis

    #367469
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,03:42)

    Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 16 2014,19:03)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 16 2014,05:46)
    J42

    NO ,I CANNOT SEE IT BUT I NOW CAN SEE WHY YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES AND THE PROPHECIES , AND THAT YOU HAVE TO FOLLOW MEN TO FEEL SAVE ,


    Pierre

    Do you need help?


    my days of looking for help from men are long over sis


    T.

    Those scriptures you just have read(??) are not from men.
    They are written by a man with the Holy spirit.
    Eat the flesh of Christ,and He will give you His wisdom.

    wakeup.

    #367485
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2014,05:24)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,03:42)

    Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 16 2014,19:03)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 16 2014,05:46)
    J42

    NO ,I CANNOT SEE IT BUT I NOW CAN SEE WHY YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES AND THE PROPHECIES , AND THAT YOU HAVE TO FOLLOW MEN TO FEEL SAVE ,


    Pierre

    Do you need help?


    my days of looking for help from men are long over sis


    T.

    Those scriptures you just have read(??) are not from men.
    They are written by a man with the Holy spirit.
    Eat the flesh of Christ,and He will give you His wisdom.

    wakeup.


    j42

    i understand but it is there understanding within scriptures that is the key ,so is all the prophetical books and gospels

    #367511
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,12:01)

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2014,05:24)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,03:42)

    Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 16 2014,19:03)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 16 2014,05:46)
    J42

    NO ,I CANNOT SEE IT BUT I NOW CAN SEE WHY YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND SCRIPTURES AND THE PROPHECIES , AND THAT YOU HAVE TO FOLLOW MEN TO FEEL SAVE ,


    Pierre

    Do you need help?


    my days of looking for help from men are long over sis


    T.

    Those scriptures you just have read(??) are not from men.
    They are written by a man with the Holy spirit.
    Eat the flesh of Christ,and He will give you His wisdom.

    wakeup.


    j42

    i understand but it is there understanding within scriptures that is the key ,so is all the prophetical books and gospels


    T.

    The key is: seek and ye shall find.
    Seek by eating the flesh of Christ.

    wakeup.

    #367523
    terraricca
    Participant

    w

    you can seek ,forever and never find ,

    and the metaphor of eating Christ flesh does not give you anything ,

    unless you do the effort and grab the understanding of it all

    #367533
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,15:25)
    w

    you can seek ,forever  and never find ,

    and the metaphor of eating Christ flesh does not give you anything ,

    unless you do the effort and grab the understanding of it all


    T.

    You seek, and the Holy spirit will assist you.

    wakeup.

    #367553
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2014,10:44)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,15:25)
    w

    you can seek ,forever  and never find ,

    and the metaphor of eating Christ flesh does not give you anything ,

    unless you do the effort and grab the understanding of it all


    T.

    You seek, and the Holy spirit will assist you.

    wakeup.


    W
    Seeking is not the only condition that is required for the assistance of the Holy Spirit

    #367556
    journey42
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,19:21)

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 17 2014,10:44)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 17 2014,15:25)
    w

    you can seek ,forever  and never find ,

    and the metaphor of eating Christ flesh does not give you anything ,

    unless you do the effort and grab the understanding of it all


    T.

    You seek, and the Holy spirit will assist you.

    wakeup.


    W
    Seeking is not the only condition that is required for the assistance of the Holy Spirit


    Pierre

    If we are seeking, then we are seeking the scriptures, for in them we will find life.

    #367580
    terraricca
    Participant

    j42

    Quote
    Pierre

    If we are seeking, then we are seeking the scriptures, for in them we will find life.

    we do not find life but the key to life ,but the condition in witch we are wen we are seeking and the reasons for us seeking are very important ,for it say :NOT ALL THAT SAYS LORD LORD WILL ENTER THE KINGDOM ” just like JAMES SAYS WE HAVE TO SUBMIT TO OURSELVES TO GOD 100% SO THAT TRUTH IN OUR WAYS CAN BE FOUND AND SEEN THEN WE WILL HAVE RESULTS

    #367592
    journey42
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 18 2014,04:55)
    j42

    Quote
    Pierre

    If we are seeking, then we are seeking the scriptures, for in them we will find life.

    we do not find life but the key to life ,but the condition in witch we are wen we are seeking and the reasons for us seeking are very important ,for it say :NOT ALL THAT SAYS LORD LORD WILL ENTER THE KINGDOM ” just like JAMES SAYS WE HAVE TO SUBMIT TO OURSELVES TO GOD 100% SO THAT TRUTH IN OUR WAYS CAN BE FOUND AND SEEN THEN WE WILL HAVE RESULTS


    That's right Pierre, the key to life,
    the doorway,
    Christ, the Word of God,
    Not only his sacrifice on the cross,
    but but his words that contain truth.
    The ones that say Lord, Lord, and get rejected,
    are those that have not obeyed the voice they have been seeking.
    They have not put God first in their heart above all,
    they have allowed men to guide them,
    ignoring the scriptures, participating in all sorts of things,
    hanging on to every word their preachers says,
    even if it doesn't make sense, but accepting any way,
    because they let the preachers guide them,
    becoming, or following women preachers,
    feeding on strange flesh, (another bible)
    celebrating pagan festivals,
    taking blood,
    trampling on the word of God,
    being proud,
    teaching error,
    all sorts of things,
    unforgiving,
    having hate in them,
    God knows their heart's even before they are born,
    but he gives them a chance anyway,
    and gives the spirit according to our measure.

    #367600
    terraricca
    Participant

    j42

    Quote
    feeding on strange flesh, (another bible)

    coming from you the other mean other than KJV right

    #367601
    terraricca
    Participant

    j42

    Quote
    trampling on the word of God,

    this is something we see daily

    #367610
    Wakeup
    Participant

    T.

    The God fearing will never do that.
    Satans apostles has been doing it for years.

    wakeup.

    #367622
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 18 2014,12:13)
    T.

    The God fearing will never do that.
    Satans apostles has been doing it for years.

    wakeup.


    W

    Religion fanatics do that on a daily base ,in their own ignorance ,

    I mean bashing the scripters

    #367638
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Jw's one of them.
    The sheep just refuse to investigate the past/roots of the jw's
    Their past books are full of freemasons symbols.
    And are told not to look back.
    Pastor T Russel's grave has a pyramid build next to it; with
    watchtower bible society written on it.
    Buried on freemason ground, near the freemason lodge.

    Sad indeed; they have their heads in the sand.
    I had a hard time with one of their elders;we had a discussion for weeks.
    They dont make any sense;and contradict scriptures.

    wakeup.

    #367656
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 18 2014,16:03)
    Jw's  one of them.
    The sheep just refuse to investigate the past/roots of the jw's
    Their past books are full of freemasons symbols.
    And are told not to look back.
    Pastor T Russel's grave has a pyramid build next to it; with
    watchtower bible society written on it.
    Buried on freemason ground, near the freemason lodge.

    Sad indeed; they have their heads in the sand.
    I had a hard time with one of their elders;we had a discussion for weeks.
    They dont make any sense;and contradict scriptures.

    wakeup.


    w

    there are over 400 religion sects around the world not just one

    #367675
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (journey42 @ Jan. 13 2014,17:12)

    Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 14 2014,04:25)
    so that is my answer and understand that ;BORN/BRING FORTH/CREATED/CONCEIVED, ARE ALE THE SAME THING

    Pierre,

    Your answer to me is more clear now.  You say Jesus was BORN in heaven, and by saying he was BORN, you mean he was CREATED by God,
    and not only that, he was conceived in heaven, although there was no mother to put his seed into at that time, but nevertheless, it was done in heaven.

    So the very same Jesus who in the beginning, who had his hand on creation WITH God, was actually a creature himself at that time?  The creator was really a creature?  Is this what you are saying.  Another creature, made like the angels?

    Colossians 1:16   For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:


    journey,

    It seems you are playing word games, or are confused. Saying Jesus was “born” does NOT mean that he wasn't “created”, or “conceived”. All of those are just some of the different ways to say “brought forth into existence”.

    Likewise, saying that all things were created through Jesus does not equate him with the Creator, or make him “a creator”.

    Listen to Pierre on this one.

    #367732
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Mikeb.

    The Word of God/spirit: was transformed by birth into flesh.
    Transformed by birth into a ctreature,because He is willing to humble Himself.

    wakeup.

    #367742
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 19 2014,12:43)
    Mikeb.

    The Word of God/spirit: was transformed by birth into flesh.
    Transformed by birth into a ctreature,because He is willing to humble Himself.

    wakeup.


    W

    You only right in part ,the WORD his God son that was called Jesus and he was a spirit being before coming in the womb of a women

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