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While I could have placed this topic into Scripture and Biblical teaching, it is more suited to here because the focus is on debunking this verse as a support verse for the Trinity or Binity.
Feel free to add more info on debunking this so-called proof verse.
Our resident Binitarian states that 1 Peter 2 supposedly identifies Jesus as the Jehovah of hosts of Isaiah 8:13, when in actual fact it is plainly obvious that the text is referring to another that is sent by YHWH. Let’s take a look.
Isaiah 8:12-15
11 For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12 Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13 Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14 And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15 And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.1 Peter 2
6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion,
a chosen and precious cornerstone,
and the one who trusts in him
will never be put to shame.”
7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe,
“The stone the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone,”
8 and,
“A stone that causes people to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall.”Let’s analyse this and put to rest the false conclusion that this implies Jesus is God.
The first obvious thing to point out is that when God decides to become something such as a rock of offense, he personally doesn’t turn up as that rock, but sends his messenger. We see in other scriptures that God is light. But he sends Jesus into the world and Jesus proclaims that “he is the light of the world”. When he is about to leave, he passes this on to us, (the Church) when he proclaimed, “You are the light of the world”.
So when God sent light into this dark world, given Kathi’s thought processes, you would conclude that Jesus is God, but then also have to beleive that we (the Church) are God based on the fact that God, Jesus, Church are all called ‘light’. Thus if God refers to himself as a stone and sends Jesus who is identified as the stone, then that is not a valid proof verse to say that Jesus must be God.
Further, when you look at 1Peter 2, it becomes very clear that YHWH is talking about another. Read closely.
“See, I lay a stone in Zion,
a chosen and precious cornerstone,
and the one who trusts in him
will never be put to shame.”Notice the words, “I lay a stone”. Kathi would love it if it said, “I am this stone”. But alas it does not.
Now notice the words “a chosen and precious cornerstone”. If God is the stone, then who is the one who CHOSE the stone?Again, the Binity and Trinity proof verses are easily exposed when you decide to read the text carefully. At least Peter doesn’t agree with Kathi, and I concur with our brother Peter.
Trinies have been caught in a web of their own spinning.
Trying to wiggle out of that web by using colourful words and long explanations.
Loving doctrine more than truth.
For this reason was I banned from christian chat. This alone is a sign that they are insecure.
What they really preach is: that God died but is not really dead.
Jesus is God but not really the father.
Thomas saw God but not really God. Because no one can see the Father and live.
Yet;there are many of them; and we are the antichrists.wakeup.
The trinies has been caught in a web of their own spinning.
To get out of that web,they must twist and turn and use all sorts of language to
wiggle out of it. But still will not give up their beloved doctrine.
They love doctrine more than the truth.
I have heard them say many times that God died for our sins.The question is “Does 1 Peter 2 imply that Jesus is God?” According to my limited understanding the answer is yes, Jesus is the only begotten God as Jehovah of Hosts which is someone other than Jehovah in the context of Isaiah 8:12-15 which Peter refers to.
Isaiah 8:12-15
11 Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12 Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13 Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14 And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15 And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.1 Peter 2
6 For in Scripture it says:
“See, I lay a stone in Zion,
a chosen and precious cornerstone,
and the one who trusts in him
will never be put to shame.”
7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe,
“The stone the builders rejected
has become the cornerstone,”
8 and,
“A stone that causes people to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall.”From what I can tell, many do not understand that the Son is the eternal offspring “part” of the eternal spirit being whom Jesus refers to as His Father. He is the eternal life that was with the Father from the beginning.
When the “part” of something is an “offspring” then you have another of the same kind. Simple! Please realize that Jesus is an ONLY begotten, not one of many.
When all eyes are open, both persons get the same blessing, the same honor, the same glory, the same dominion for ever and ever (even by those who want to deny this likeness of kind.) Read it for yourself:
Rev 5:13
And every created thing which is in the heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and on the sea, and all things are in them, heard I saying, Unto him that sitteth on the throne, and unto the Lamb, be the blessing, and the honor, and the glory, and the dominion, for ever and ever.
From what I can tell, in some contexts of scripture, the two persons are perceived as one and that is when you understand Jesus as a “part” of the Father, in other contexts of scripture, the two persons are perceived as two whom are distinct yet act intradependently as deity (as opposed to acting in-dependently).
So, is there one or two ____? I believe the answer to that is yes, it just depends on whether the blank is asking for eternal deity or person/persons. One eternal deity, two persons. The Spirit of God, btw, does not seem (again, according to my limited understanding) to be a third person but instead the personal extension of the two persons as one united spirit, i.e. the omnipresence of eternal deity.
Blessings!
Great Nick,
That makes two who are God making up our one deity.
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you!
When the son and God are merged into one being, it insults God and it denies the son his unique identity. It offends both.
The first commandment is broken and the foundation that Jesus built his Church on is also attacked.
@Nick
I believe that Jehovah is the God of Israel. Jehovah has an offspring part to Him who is called “Jehovah of hosts” in Isaiah 8:12-15. The offspring part is the same kind of being as the Father.Hi LU,
The hosts are the angels.
The Lord God of Israel has always been called this name.\
Now He has given all authority to His Son till all things are put under his feet
Yes Nick, the Lord God of Israel has been called Jehovah of hosts. Both Father and Son are eternal beings and both have the name Jehovah which appropriately demonstrates the eternalness of existence.
In Isaiah 8 we see that Jehovah is talking about Jehovah of hosts as someone other than Himself. In 1 Peter 2, Peter is identifying the Jehovah of hosts of Isaiah 8 as Jesus.
You said:
Sonship is by sharing the Spirit of the Father.
Have you become His daughter too?
Yes, I am, not in the same sense as Jesus is though. Do you believe that you are a son of God in the same sense as Jesus is a Son of God??
Hi LU,
Jesus was given the fulness of the Spirit but we can only be given a part of that blessing to fulfill a role in his Body.
Of course we would be brothers and sisters of the Lord only by adoption.
We can become children of God if we are washed and allow an increase in that investment given us at rebirth
Yes Nick, the Lord God of Israel has been called Jehovah of hosts. Both Father and Son are eternal beings and both have the name Jehovah which appropriately demonstrates the eternalness of existence.
I count two eternal gods in that statement.
Further, you stated that you do not teach that two beings are merged as one God.
You teach two Gods, but the true faith stands on one God not multiple Gods.
Deuteronomy 6:4-15
4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:
5 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.
6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:
7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.
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