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Hi 94,
Rev21
1And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.2And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
9And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolyte; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21And the twelve gates were twelve pearls: every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
22And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
There is a new [or renewed] earth.
This new Jerusalem comes out of heaven.
God comes to dwell with men rather than men going to dwell with God.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,12:44) Hi 94,
Rev21
1And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.2And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
9And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolyte; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21And the twelve gates were twelve pearls: every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
22And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.
There is a new [or renewed] earth.
This new Jerusalem comes out of heaven.
God comes to dwell with men rather than men going to dwell with God.
That the Earth will be made brand new, paradise for God's children, is true. However, where do you think that we will be when the following is taking place?Quote 3:7
But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.Quote 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.Hi 94,
For those who sleep in death.
Jn14
1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.2In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Where are these mansions?
Then for all in Christ
1Thess 4
'16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. '
Is the wedding feast in the air?
Would it be a comedown if they were in heaven and had to pack up and come to earth?
Nick:
The following scripture that you posted shows that we will rise, and that we will meet the Lord in the air, and that we will be with him forever more:
Quote 1Thess 4
'16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. '
If the wedding feast was to be on earth, he would not have taken us up to meet him. It is true that we will at some point come down to earth after God has made it anew, but while God's wrath is being poured out on those who have received the mark of the beast, I don't believe that we will be on earth.
I believe that the 1000 year reign will be in heaven rather than on earth. The saints will be judging the dead during this time period, and then they will be resurrected to receive their judgment.
What are your thoughts?
Hi 94,
You say
“I believe that the 1000 year reign will be in heaven rather than on earth.”
Why“The saints will be judging the dead during this time period”
Why if they are not raised till after the millenium?
,
” and then they will be resurrected to receive their judgment.”
Where is this judgement in absentia written?Surely the sons of God will be busy enough ruling earth?
2Tim 2
is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:12If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
13If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
Lk 19
15And it came to pass, that when he was returned, having received the kingdom, then he commanded these servants to be called unto him, to whom he had given the money, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading.16Then came the first, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained ten pounds.
17And he said unto him, Well, thou good servant: because thou hast been faithful in a very little, have thou authority over ten cities.
18And the second came, saying, Lord, thy pound hath gained five pounds.
19And he said likewise to him, Be thou also over five cities.
Hi 94,
Rev 20
'Revelation 20
1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. '
The point of view of the writer who sees the souls equipped to judge does not seem to be in heaven as he sees the angel come down from there.
I haven't been following this thread, but where does it say that the saints will live on a paradise earth forever?
I know it says that they will reign for 1000 years, but that is one day to God.
And it says that God will create a new heavens and new earth.Hi T8,
Matthew 25:46
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.Mark 10:30
But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers,and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
John 3:15
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.The end of the book has God dwelling on earth with men who have been given eternal life
Hi Nick:
You say:
Quote The saints will be judging the dead during this time period”
Why if they are not raised till after the millenium?Why do you say that we will not be raised until after the millenium?
My unerstanding is that the whole church, the dead in Christ, and those who are alive will be raised to meet the Lord in the air prior to God's wrath being poured out upon those who have worshipped the beast. This will be their judgment.
Those who died in their sins prior to this will raised from the dead to receive their judgment which will be determined during the 1000 years.
Quote Rev 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
These martyrs were dead, and my understanding they will be part of the church which will be raised from the dead when the Lord comes for the church. They lived first and then reigned with Christ 1000 years or in the millenium. They are not raised from the dead after the 1000 years.
Quote 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years. Quote Rev 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth–Gog and Magog–to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. 9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. 10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
Quote 1Co 6:2
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?What are your thoughts?
ps,
Of course God will still be in heaven as He was when He dwelled on earth among men before.
Exodus 25:8
And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.Exodus 29:45
And I will dwell among the children of Israel, and will be their God.Exodus 29:46
And they shall know that I am the LORD their God, that brought them forth out of the land of Egypt, that I may dwell among them: I am the LORD their God.Quote (942767 @ Feb. 05 2008,14:04) Hi Nick: You say:
Quote The saints will be judging the dead during this time period”
Why if they are not raised till after the millenium?Why do you say that we will not be raised until after the millenium?
My unerstanding is that the whole church, the dead in Christ, and those who are alive will be raised to meet the Lord in the air prior to God's wrath being poured out upon those who have worshipped the beast. This will be their judgment.
Those who died in their sins prior to this will raised from the dead to receive their judgment which will be determined during the 1000 years.
Quote Rev 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
These martyrs were dead, and my understanding they will be part of the church which will be raised from the dead when the Lord comes for the church. They lived first and then reigned with Christ 1000 years or in the millenium. They are not raised from the dead after the 1000 years.
Quote 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years. Quote Rev 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth–Gog and Magog–to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. 9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. 10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
Quote 1Co 6:2
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?What are your thoughts?
Hi 94,
You misunderstand.
The children of God are in the first resurrection at the beginning of the Millenium
Rev20
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,14:11) Quote (942767 @ Feb. 05 2008,14:04) Hi Nick: You say:
Quote The saints will be judging the dead during this time period”
Why if they are not raised till after the millenium?Why do you say that we will not be raised until after the millenium?
My unerstanding is that the whole church, the dead in Christ, and those who are alive will be raised to meet the Lord in the air prior to God's wrath being poured out upon those who have worshipped the beast. This will be their judgment.
Those who died in their sins prior to this will raised from the dead to receive their judgment which will be determined during the 1000 years.
Quote Rev 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
These martyrs were dead, and my understanding they will be part of the church which will be raised from the dead when the Lord comes for the church. They lived first and then reigned with Christ 1000 years or in the millenium. They are not raised from the dead after the 1000 years.
Quote 5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years. Quote Rev 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison 8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth–Gog and Magog–to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore. 9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. 10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. 11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
Quote 1Co 6:2
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?What are your thoughts?
Hi 94,
You misunderstand.
The children of God are in the first resurrection at the beginning of the Millenium
Rev20
4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Hi Nick:Perhaps, I misunderstood what you were asking here:
Quote The saints will be judging the dead during this time period”
Why if they are not raised till after the millenium?Why do you say that we will not be raised until after the millenium?
When you say: Why if they are not raised till after the millenium? Are you referring to those being judged during this period? It appeared that you were referring to the saints.
Hi 94,
I do not.
THEY refers to the DEAD and I should have been clearer.
But the rest of the dead, the unsaved nations, are not raised till after the Millenium.Hi 94,
You say
“Those who died in their sins prior to this will raised from the dead to receive their judgment which will be determined during the 1000 years.”The millenium is a time of joy and reestablishment of godly order on earth and not judgement in my view.
The judgement follows.
If it did not then those who join the rebellion against Christ and His God at the end of the millenium would not be judged for doing so.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,14:33) Hi 94,
I do not.
THEY refers to the DEAD and I should have been clearer.
But the rest of the dead, the unsaved nations, are not raised till after the Millenium.
No problem Nick. I probably should have realized that you meant the dead. But I do make mistakes, and so, I'm sorry that I misunderstood this.The works of every one including the dead are written in a book and everyone will be judged according to their works. If my understanding is correct, whatever punishment will be administered to the dead will be determined by the saints during this 1000 year period. Otherwise, it would take another 1000 years for the dead to be judged after they are resurrected.
God Bless
Hi 94,
I do not think judgement will take long after the millenium.
Book of life and book of remembrance
or if not found there books of actions
then
Sheep or goats.Life or second death
The judges on thrones surely will be as Moses was, and now they are judging the nations who live.
The conversations between Christ and the judged are already written
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,15:04) Hi 94,
I do not think judgement will take long after the millenium.
Book of life and book of remembrance
or if not found there books of actions
then
Sheep or goats.Life or second death
The judges on thrones surely will be as Moses was, and now they are judging the nations who live.
The conversations between Christ and the judged are already written
Nick:Maybe you are right, but I can only give my understanding until I see it differently.
If what you are saying is correct, when will the following take place?
Quote 1Co 6:2
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?Christians are being judged now, and the verdict for those who overcome is not guilty, but they must still go before the judgment seat of Christ to receive rewards.
Quote 1Pe 4:17
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?Quote 2Co 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.What does it mean when the following scripture states: “judgment was given unto them”?
Quote Rev. 20:4
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image *, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.Are you saying that they will be judging the nations who live?
Again, when will the following occur?
Quote 1Co 6:2
Do you not know that the saints will judge the world?Hi 94,
This is some of the type of work.
It is an aspect of ruling.
Deuteronomy 1:17
Ye shall not respect persons in judgment; but ye shall hear the small as well as the great; ye shall not be afraid of the face of man; for the judgment is God's: and the cause that is too hard for you, bring it unto me, and I will hear it.
Deuteronomy 16:18
Judges and officers shalt thou make thee in all thy gates, which the LORD thy God giveth thee, throughout thy tribes: and they shall judge the people with just judgment.
Deuteronomy 16:19
Thou shalt not wrest judgment; thou shalt not respect persons, neither take a gift: for a gift doth blind the eyes of the wise, and pervert the words of the righteous.
Deuteronomy 25:1
If there be a controversy between men, and they come unto judgment, that the judges may judge them; then they shall justify the righteous, and condemn the wicked.
2 Samuel 8:15
And David reigned over all Israel; and David executed judgment and justice unto all his people.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 05 2008,13:53) Hi T8,
Matthew 25:46
And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.Mark 10:30
But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers,and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
John 3:15
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.The end of the book has God dwelling on earth with men who have been given eternal life
OK, so the points made are as follows:- eternal life
- in this time – one hundred fold
- eternal life in the world to come
- men shall dwell on earth
But I still do not see a teaching in this that says we will live on the earth forever.
I prefer to keep my options open knowing this:
1 Corinthians 2:9
However, as it is written: “No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him”In other words if we haven't seen or heard what God has for us, then how can we say that God has eternal life on earth for all men, unless it is written specifically that he has?
I tend to think that God has for us much more than we can ever dream of. And yes men will inhabit the earth and the earth will be a righteous and awesome paradise.
We know that the Kingdom of God is not confined to earth, and the whole of creation in that age/world will have no sin. This I can say because it is written and revealed. But eternal life in a flesh body on earth?
As I said before, I prefer to keep my options open knowing that God has more for us than we can ever imagine. And the other thing to consider is that we have eternal life. That is a long time and it seems a bit presumptuous to say that forever God will not allow any man to go beyond the first and second heaven.
Is it not written that God will give us all things?
Romans 8:32
He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all—how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things?T8,
I agree, personally I believe that we will inhabit this corporeal existence, free to expand through out the endless universe and encountering the challenges of doing so (not sitting around strumming on harps or being idle). We will be eternally amazed at it's wonders and variety, and this will be one more reason for praise to well up to our God.I also believe it may be possible that we may visit “heaven” but to me we were not designed to inhabit a spiritual plane of existence (personally I believe that it is so different from anything that we are imagining).
I'm not teaching this as doctrine only expressing my beliefs and as you said “No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived …
Wm
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