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Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:22) Do you have a divine mechanism for cosmological origins, or are you only capable of platitude?
Mentioned it before.
Just we can create and code in a dimension that we create (cyberspace) so God can create in a dimension that he created, (space).Just as we are above (outside) and can create digital worlds, so it is that God can create worlds.
Our virtual world is cyberspace. God's virtual world is space.
Just take what we understand at our level and apply it at a higher level. Just as fractal geometry repeats at different levels, so do truths, and many other things. Look for the patterns. It speaks volumes.
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:22) you can tell me what “eternal” actually means, and how it relates to space-time, and do the same for your continually mindless use of the word “nothing”, then perhaps there is something to discuss.
Before the universe. What existed.
Nothing or something.
If something what was it.Thanks.
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 31 2010,12:52) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:22) Do you have a divine mechanism for cosmological origins, or are you only capable of platitude?
Mentioned it before.
Just we can create and code in a dimension that we create (cyberspace) so God can create in a dimension that he created, (space).Just as we are above (outside) and can create digital worlds, so it is that God can create worlds.
Our virtual world is cyberspace. God's virtual world is space.
Just take what we understand at our level and apply it at a higher level. Just as fractal geometry repeats at different levels, so do truths, and many other things. Look for the patterns. It speaks volumes.
Not can, that is religious naming, but did how? What mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:59) Quote (t8 @ Oct. 31 2010,12:52) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:22) Do you have a divine mechanism for cosmological origins, or are you only capable of platitude?
Mentioned it before.
Just we can create and code in a dimension that we create (cyberspace) so God can create in a dimension that he created, (space).Just as we are above (outside) and can create digital worlds, so it is that God can create worlds.
Our virtual world is cyberspace. God's virtual world is space.
Just take what we understand at our level and apply it at a higher level. Just as fractal geometry repeats at different levels, so do truths, and many other things. Look for the patterns. It speaks volumes.
Not can, that is religious naming, but did how? What mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
If you understand Fractal Geometry, you will know that it can be used to create cyber-landscapes, planets, mountains, with great ease. In fact it is why digital worlds are easy to create now.You will also see the same in nature. You can measure a rainforest by using one tree for example. You can measure the mass of a mountain range with great ease.
It is much simpler than you think. When you grasp that. Then understand the same concept at higher dimensions and try and not limit it all at your level. There are much higher dimensions than the one you see everything from.
Quote (t8 @ Oct. 31 2010,13:06) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:59) Quote (t8 @ Oct. 31 2010,12:52) Quote (Stu @ Oct. 31 2010,12:22) Do you have a divine mechanism for cosmological origins, or are you only capable of platitude?
Mentioned it before.
Just we can create and code in a dimension that we create (cyberspace) so God can create in a dimension that he created, (space).Just as we are above (outside) and can create digital worlds, so it is that God can create worlds.
Our virtual world is cyberspace. God's virtual world is space.
Just take what we understand at our level and apply it at a higher level. Just as fractal geometry repeats at different levels, so do truths, and many other things. Look for the patterns. It speaks volumes.
Not can, that is religious naming, but did how? What mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
If you understand Fractal Geometry, you will know that it can be used to create cyber-landscapes, planets, mountains, with great ease. In fact it is why digital worlds are easy to create now.You will also see the same in nature. You can measure a rainforest by using one tree for example. You can measure the mass of a mountain range with great ease.
It is much simpler than you think. When you grasp that. Then understand the same concept at higher dimensions and try and not limit it all at your level. There are much higher dimensions than the one you see everything from.
What mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
The evidence is that the same patterns are repeated at differing scales.
e.g., on a tree the branches of branches of branches follow the same pattern. Same with hair and anything for that matter.
You can take the basic outline of a mountain range and divide continuously with the same pattern to get a realistic view of what appears to be a complex mountain range. Once it is divided using fractals it looks complex, but it is the same pattern repeating. This works for anything. DNA, waves, etc. Waves also have waves which have waves, etc. Same pattern.Now we know that there is more than 3 dimensions. If we understand fractals just scale, then you can apply that up the dimension stack.
Knowing that everything we do is created and we can replicate designs that which we see in the natural world with our own space and materials, then it is not hard to see that the same design and designer process is just a matter of scale. There is no reason for it not to go right to the top.
It is also the only explanation that makes sense anyway, so you do not have to be brilliant to understand that it is the only viable option of the three. Someone, something, nothing.
So what do I have going for me in my belief?
I have:- A simple explanation that can explain anything that exists.
- My belief is not impossible.
- My belief works at different scale in the scale that we humans can comprehend. It works on the macro and micro scale.
Now what do you have?
You have:- No real clue
- Of that which is possible for an Atheist or someone who doesn't give God a chance in 0.000005% of existing, you have 2 impossible and ludicrous options to choose from. That something has always existed and is eternal or existed before the Big Bang etc, or nothing which is for the realm of fools.
- Even at the macro and micro scale that we humans can comprehend, your eternal something or nothing doesn't work. There is no evidence of it happening at our scale.
So in our scale things happen because they are governed by laws or forces. These laws or forces are merely the instructions from the master programmer who made all things. Because he is beyond even the highest dimension, his laws govern the universe in the same way that a programmer sets instructions in a digital world to govern what is possible in that world.
It is not hard to comprehend.
What you have is a 3-dimensional thinking model that tries to explain all dimensions of which it cannot. It doesn't even work in the 3 or 4 dimensions that you might have understanding or partial understanding of. You take things like similar code and say that this must have come from that or share a common ancestor that is now dead. You cannot even understand that just as two similar valleys side by side may look the same and in Fractal Geometry share the same fractal design, they do not share a common ancestor. No code is what it is. It is governed by laws and forces and the sequences come out depending on what the forces and laws dictate. Saying that there is no God and one species came from another and so on has no proof and is as likely as 2 similar valleys coming from a shared valley ancestor.
Stu, you do not understand code. You have appreciation for the creative design of code, building blocks, and libraries, coupled with creative imagination needed to give it existence.
You think rabbits come out of hats from nothing.OK, I know that you will take this piece by piece and say simple silly stuff like, “Religious Platitude”, “Fairytale”, etc, but how about giving me a run for my money. How about giving me a real challenge. What about actually giving me a theory starting from the first thing or the eternal thing. I haven't heard to come up with a model that starts back there. Then you can explain how it all unfolded and you don't have to go too deep into theories that explain what happened during the Big Bang. I am well versed in them. Just an overall model that explains all dimensions, the cause, and what started it all if indeed it started, or what it is exactly that is eternal if not.
BTW, this post took between 5 – 10 mins. So it may be riddled with grammatical error. But the six o'clock news is on so I gotta go. Now let's see you come up with a model that explains everything without a God. Starting with the eternal thing or nothing.
I wait with baited breath.
Go. It should only take 10 minutes if you already know what the model is.
Hi T8,
Atheist scientists use to believe that the universe was eternal,
because the thought of God existing disgusted their pee-brains.Now that it's known that the universe certainly had a starting point,
they are now going about creating new alternate non-God 'theories'!It's really funny, because I have proof that God encoded his existence into
his book; but Stuart will not even take the time to consider the evidence!
Especially since Stuart always speaks about what has been “observed”.Stuart's Avatar really depicts his disposition well, don't you think; T8?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgt8
Quote The evidence is that the same patterns are repeated at differing scales.
e.g., on a tree the branches of branches of branches follow the same pattern. Same with hair and anything for that matter.
My hair does not branch. Does yours?Quote You can take the basic outline of a mountain range and divide continuously with the same pattern to get a realistic view of what appears to be a complex mountain range. Once it is divided using fractals it looks complex, but it is the same pattern repeating. This works for anything. DNA, waves, etc. Waves also have waves which have waves, etc. Same pattern.
Mountains have approximately the same shape because they are made of approximately the same stuff, which falls into mountain shapes in approximately the same way in the same gravity field. DNA is present in all living organisms because we share a common ancestor.Quote Now we know that there is more than 3 dimensions. If we understand fractals just scale, then you can apply that up the dimension stack.
Apply what?Quote Knowing that everything we do is created and we can replicate designs that which we see in the natural world with our own space and materials, then it is not hard to see that the same design and designer process is just a matter of scale. There is no reason for it not to go right to the top.
You are supposedly giving mechanisms and evidence for some divine creation, but here you are firstly making the assumption that it happened then using that as evidence for it. That is the logical fallacy of circular logic: it is invalid.Quote It is also the only explanation that makes sense anyway, so you do not have to be brilliant to understand that it is the only viable option of the three. Someone, something, nothing.
It does not make any sense to me, and that is because it is not actually a valid explanation.Quote So what do I have going for me in my belief?
I have:
# A simple explanation that can explain anything that exists.
And what explanation would that be?Quote # My belief is not impossible.
I would not doubt that you believe it.Quote # My belief works at different scale in the scale that we humans can comprehend. It works on the macro and micro scale.
This is the logical fallacy of special pleading. You are claiming that you can understand something that others cannot.Quote Now what do you have?
You have:
# No real clue
Scientific theories which are falsifiable, make predictions that have turned out to be right years later, and that are based in evidence, actually.Quote # Of that which is possible for an Atheist or someone who doesn't give God a chance in 0.000005% of existing, you have 2 impossible and ludicrous options to choose from. That something has always existed and is eternal or existed before the Big Bang etc, or nothing which is for the realm of fools.
I’ll give you 17 points if you can identify two of the logical fallacies that make this statement invalid.Quote # Even at the macro and micro scale that we humans can comprehend, your eternal something or nothing doesn't work. There is no evidence of it happening at our scale.
There is no evidence of what?Quote So in our scale things happen because they are governed by laws or forces. These laws or forces are merely the instructions from the master programmer who made all things. Because he is beyond even the highest dimension, his laws govern the universe in the same way that a programmer sets instructions in a digital world to govern what is possible in that world.
Religious platitude, logical fallacy. This does not explain anything, and especially it does not explain how it was done.Quote It is not hard to comprehend.
What isn’t??Quote What you have is a 3-dimensional thinking model that tries to explain all dimensions of which it cannot. It doesn't even work in the 3 or 4 dimensions that you might have understanding or partial understanding of.
What value does it have if it cannot explain what is observed in the 4 dimensions with which we are familiar? Why should that be an impossible task? Especially as you said just above that it is not hard to comprehend.Quote You take things like similar code and say that this must have come from that or share a common ancestor that is now dead. You cannot even understand that just as two similar valleys side by side may look the same and in Fractal Geometry share the same fractal design, they do not share a common ancestor.
You do write some prize bollocks t8. Are valleys born from other valleys sexually reproducing??Quote No code is what it is. It is governed by laws and forces and the sequences come out depending on what the forces and laws dictate.
Yes, evolution by natural selection is what you call the biological version of that.Quote Saying that there is no God and one species came from another and so on has no proof and is as likely as 2 similar valleys coming from a shared valley ancestor.
Saying that species share common ancestors is stating a fact of history. Saying there is no god is making the obvious provisional conclusion.Quote Stu, you do not understand code. You have appreciation for the creative design of code, building blocks, and libraries, coupled with creative imagination needed to give it existence.
You think rabbits come out of hats from nothing.
So, according to your “explanation”, libraries are living organisms. That about sums up the idiocy of it.Quote OK, I know that you will take this piece by piece and say simple silly stuff like, “Religious Platitude”, “Fairytale”, etc,
You said it. A load of fatuous bollocks is what it is. You are more intelligent than this.Quote but how about giving me a run for my money. How about giving me a real challenge.
I did. I wrote: What mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Once you have addressed that you will have begun to meet the challenge.
Quote What about actually giving me a theory starting from the first thing or the eternal thing. I haven't heard to come up with a model that starts back there. Then you can explain how it all unfolded and you don't have to go too deep into theories that explain what happened during the Big Bang. I am well versed in them. Just an overall model that explains all dimensions, the cause, and what started it all if indeed it started, or what it is exactly that is eternal if not.
What is “eternal”? You still haven’t answered that.Quote Now let's see you come up with a model that explains everything without a God.
Already done to a far deeper level of detail than anything you have ever written. Several times over. Still waiting for one single explanation of ANYTHING that benefits from the inclusion of a god.And evidence that it was not Jupiter that did it.
Stuart
*removal of t8/Stuart's conversation.
Stuart[/quote]
Quote My hair does not branch. Does yours? Mornings usually.
Quote You are supposedly giving mechanisms and evidence for some divine creation Use me as evidence for a divine creation, there you go.
Quote And evidence that it was not Jupiter that did it. Are you referring to the planet or god? At times big ape you get ahead of yourself.
Much love to you Stuart.
Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 31 2010,19:48) Hi T8, Atheist scientists use to believe that the universe was eternal,
because the thought of God existing disgusted their pee-brains.Now that it's known that the universe certainly had a starting point,
they are now going about creating new alternate non-God 'theories'!It's really funny, because I have proof that God encoded his existence into
his book; but Stuart will not even take the time to consider the evidence!
Especially since Stuart always speaks about what has been “observed”.Stuart's Avatar really depicts his disposition well, don't you think; T8?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Hi Stuart,No comment on this Post?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgI agree Edj that Stu is an African Ape who might be able to see enemies from tree heights and is also able to peel a banana, but has little reasoning power to understand his own existence.
Usually we just let people be, but because he represents a new religion (the no God one), I like to hammer him to the wall with logical thinking that leaves him responding with one liners that show he is out of his depth.
Besides dismantling his arguments for his religion, there is also the fascination of watching first hand how pride blinds a man which serves as a lesson for all.Just as I thought Stu.
You have nothing intelligent to say and pose no intellectual threat to the existence of a creator.
Now how about giving me your model as to how it all came from nothing, or how it came from something eternal and if so, what that eternal thing is.
Please put up, or say you don't have one.
Just don't dodge it. I have put up. Now it is your turn.Thanks.
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 01 2010,08:58) Just as I thought Stu. You have nothing intelligent to say and pose no intellectual threat to the existence of a creator.
Now how about giving me your model as to how it all came from nothing, or how it came from something eternal and if so, what that eternal thing is.
Please put up, or say you don't have one.
Just don't dodge it. I have put up. Now it is your turn.Thanks.
I have already said the intelligent stuff, and now I am replying to you. That naturally limits the discussion of course, but nevertheless I have pointed out how your arguments are mostly logically invalid but you don't appear to be able to explain how they are. Just like with the assertion of your Imaginary Friend you assert stuff without any support for it in evidence or logical argument.You still seem to be stuck on the side of this new broken LP that mindlessly repeats the word eternal. Is that a brand of aftershave? What does it mean in the context of space-time? If you can't tell me that then why are you asking?
Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 01 2010,08:58) Usually we just let people be, but because he represents a new religion (the no God one), I like to hammer him to the wall with logical thinking that leaves him responding with one liners that show he is out of his depth.
Regarding your claims of divine creation, what mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
Stu you lack understanding.
BTW, another digital world just exploded into existence in cyberspace. Binary code being acted upon by a non-intelligent force called a program instruction just assembled the binary in just the right way for the digital world to come into being. Had the force been slightly different it wouldn't have succeeded as the binary based world would have collapsed.
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 02 2010,16:13) Stu you lack understanding. BTW, another digital world just exploded into existence in cyberspace. Binary code being acted upon by a non-intelligent force called a program instruction just assembled the binary in just the right way for the digital world to come into being. Had the force been slightly different it wouldn't have succeeded as the binary based world would have collapsed.
Regarding your claims of divine creation of the universe and the life within it, what mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 01 2010,08:58) I agree Edj that Stu is an African Ape who might be able to see enemies from tree heights and is also able to peel a banana, but has little reasoning power to understand his own existence.
Usually we just let people be, but because he represents a new religion (the no God one), I like to hammer him to the wall with logical thinking that leaves him responding with one liners that show he is out of his depth.
Besides dismantling his arguments for his religion, there is also the fascination of watching first hand how pride blinds a man which serves as a lesson for all.
Hi T8,You're right! He asks for evidence and, when it's presented,
he then closes his eyes just like his avatar presents himself!God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgStu if you think it was the law of gravity, then know that all laws have a law giver. All forces have a cause. Using simple logic is enough to understand that a creator is the only viable option. I use the simple process of deduction which leaves one option that explains all things. I have yet to hear your grand theory on how it all came from nothing or how it all came from a non-intelligent eternal something and would also like to know what that is.
You are clueless Stu and my faith is not even based on theories, but real experience from God, (not an organised religion). Once you have real experience or tasted of the Kingdom of God, then watching people try to scratch around for a theory that explains God away is for the foolish. But ignoring experience, God is the only viable option and arguing against that option is again foolish.
The fool has said there is no God. No matter how much you quote Prophet Hawking and talk about baryons and anti-baryons, you are a fool if you deny a creator.
You have simply buried your head in the sand when it comes to the cause of all things and try to baffle people with detail after the fact. Perhaps if you tried to quit dodging this point then you might actually learn something. Until then, you have lost and continue to lose because you have no answer as to the cause of everything.
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 02 2010,22:16) Stu if you think it was the law of gravity, then know that all laws have a law giver. All forces have a cause. Using simple logic is enough to understand that a creator is the only viable option. I use the simple process of deduction which leaves one option that explains all things. I have yet to hear your grand theory on how it all came from nothing or how it all came from a non-intelligent eternal something and would also like to know what that is. You are clueless Stu and my faith is not even based on theories, but real experience from God, (not an organised religion). Once you have real experience or tasted of the Kingdom of God, then watching people try to scratch around for a theory that explains God away is for the foolish. But ignoring experience, God is the only viable option and arguing against that option is again foolish.
The fool has said there is no God. No matter how much you quote Prophet Hawking and talk about baryons and anti-baryons, you are a fool if you deny a creator.
You have simply buried your head in the sand when it comes to the cause of all things and try to baffle people with detail after the fact. Perhaps if you tried to quit dodging this point then you might actually learn something. Until then, you have lost and continue to lose because you have no answer as to the cause of everything.
Regarding your claims of divine creation of the universe and the life within it, what mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Nov. 03 2010,17:01) Quote (t8 @ Nov. 02 2010,22:16) Stu if you think it was the law of gravity, then know that all laws have a law giver. All forces have a cause. Using simple logic is enough to understand that a creator is the only viable option. I use the simple process of deduction which leaves one option that explains all things. I have yet to hear your grand theory on how it all came from nothing or how it all came from a non-intelligent eternal something and would also like to know what that is. You are clueless Stu and my faith is not even based on theories, but real experience from God, (not an organised religion). Once you have real experience or tasted of the Kingdom of God, then watching people try to scratch around for a theory that explains God away is for the foolish. But ignoring experience, God is the only viable option and arguing against that option is again foolish.
The fool has said there is no God. No matter how much you quote Prophet Hawking and talk about baryons and anti-baryons, you are a fool if you deny a creator.
You have simply buried your head in the sand when it comes to the cause of all things and try to baffle people with detail after the fact. Perhaps if you tried to quit dodging this point then you might actually learn something. Until then, you have lost and continue to lose because you have no answer as to the cause of everything.
Regarding your claims of divine creation of the universe and the life within it, what mechanism was actually used, and what evidence supports it?Stuart
Hi Stuart,Your question illustrates bias.
You instead should use the word method!God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
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