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Ed: You clearly take a very allegorical approach to the bible and from what i can gather the author of this article has a literal one (with the obvious consideration for literature genre). The Bible is not there as a mental driver to get the wheels turning so one can ponder what they think it means. It is there to communicate a message to all nations and all generations with intent not what they think it means. Jesus spoke of hell more than anyone and he was clearly communicating that it was not a place one wanted to go. God has mercy yes that’s why he sent Jesus. He is also a Just God and he who denies Jesus here will be denied in heaven. “It is appointed unto man once to die and then the Judgement.” There are no second chances. Chose now in this life. You will find much more freedom in taking God Word at face value and not allegorizing it where it is not meant to be an allegory. The lake of fire is the second death. Rev 21:8
I don’t think Ed is necessarily denying that it is literal, (not from what I read in his post at least), but that the fire is what redeems all things. However, as that may be possible, (we do not know all of God’s plans) the Second Death is eternal destruction. Hence the simplest understanding of that is death is eternal just as the life that the righteous are given is also eternal.
We are told eternal life or perish. Eternal life or destruction. Eternal life or death. But I don’t see eternal life in Hell.
You said that the devil was cast out of heaven. No,, in Genesis that was a figure of speech. Heaven is a high place. If you notice Adam and Eve was on earth when Eve was deceived by the serpent. This simply mean that the devil was cast down from a high position. God put the devil flat on his stomach. Now at the end times, the devil will try to make it to heaven and fight but, he will be defeated. Also, there is a passage in the old testament that shows that the devil was never in heaven,, I believe it’s in Isiah. I hope this will help you to understand.
Revelation 12:7-13
7 And there was war in heaven, Michael and his angels waging war with the dragon. The dragon and his angels waged war, 8 and they were not strong enough, and there was no longer a place found for them in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole [d]world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. 10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying,
“Now the salvation, and the power, and the kingdom of our God and the authority of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down, he who accuses them before our God day and night. 11 And they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their testimony, and they did not love their life even [e]when faced with death. 12 For this reason, rejoice, O heavens and you who [f]dwell in them. Woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, knowing that he has only a short time.”13 And when the dragon saw that he was thrown down to the earth, he persecuted the woman who gave birth to the male child.
Ed: No disrespect, but your use of the scripture “One day every knee will bow and confess that Jesus Chris is Lord” to communicate your apparent believe that all created things will enter heaven seems to be a bit off. Like, a 100% bit off. This scripture is referring to the fact that one day we’ll all stand at judgment before God and give account for what we’ve done. Isn’t it safe to assume that while standing before the throne of God every soul will then believe, by sight and no longer by faith, that God is real and Jesus Christ is Lord”? This doesn’t mean all will enter into heaven. It simply means all will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord! Even if i was a non-believer I surely would confess that i was wrong and Jesus was real upon seeing him in the flesh! Unless a few scriptures are taken from the Word and used out of context, the overall text of the Holy scriptures absolutely points to a very real heaven and a very real hell (and then ultimately lake of fire). I wish your doctrine of “salvation and restoration of all things” were true…it’d sure make life a lot more care free and the anguish I have over lost souls a lot less painful.
You can’t have read or understood the above writing correctly. It doesn’t preach the doctrine of “salvation and restoration of all things”. It preaches that yes at some point there will be a new Heavens and Earth and no more suffering and pain. It also teaches that the wicked will be eternally destroyed. Both points can clearly be seen in scripture. If Hell (the wicked) are thrown into the Second Death to be destroyed, then that is hardly restoration of these souls.
1)Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead
know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward;
for the memory of them is forgotten.
9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now
perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in
any thing that is done under the sun.
2) Psalms 146:1 Praise ye the LORD. Praise the LORD, O my soul.
146:2 While I live will I praise the LORD: I will sing
praises unto my God while I have any being.
146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man,
in whom there is no help.
146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in
that very day his thoughts perish.
3) Acts 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the
patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his
sepulchre is with us unto this day.
2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he
saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my
right hand….
4) 1Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even
so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
4:15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that
we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord
shall not prevent them which are asleep.
4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with
a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump
of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first…Agreed. Have you also read that when Jesus rose again, so did many of the saints of old. Further, when Jesus defeated death, he took the keys of death and hell from the Devil. Meaning that whatever power the Devil had in this realm was taken back. He was defeated and death was defeated. We read in Revelation for example that the souls of the Martyrs are under the altar and cry out to God to avenge their blood. They are told to rest a little more till their number is complete.
When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained; 10and they cried out with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, will You refrain from judging and avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?”…
Jesus indeed went to hell when he died.(DEAD).Not alive.
But truly dead. And hell was his grave(tomb).
He did nothing but sleep for three days.
Science is confined to this earth; Is ignorant regarding the spiritual.
Can not proof man’s mind;nor conscience.
Not qualified to comment on the spiritual.
Stay with the material world.wakeup.
Yes;Jesus was in the belly of the earth for three days.
And was resurrected by His redeemer; the Lord of Host.
After His reaurrection Jesus went down to the angels that are in prisonned during the days of Noah,and showed himself to them.
That He was alive.That He had conquered death.wakeup.
No, the hell that he suffered is the punishment that endured beginning with the agony that he went through beginning here:
Luk 22:42
Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.Luk 22:43
And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.Luk 22:44
And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground.And continuing with all that he suffered until he gave up the ghost and died, here:
Luk 23:46
And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.When he died, he was in the grave with not life in his body until God raised him from the dead. His soul was asleep.
Love in Christ,
MartyIt obvious that Jesus went to hell; His grave.
Psalms 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Psalms 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
No Jesus did not go anywhere in hell,for He was truly dead.
Wakeup.
Yes Jesus went to hell hell is death/ the grave for men. But Jesus was resurrected from hell.on gods great judgment day all those in hell will be resurrected. Rev 20 13-14
JEsus was not in his tomb for 3days and three nights.
First we must understand what hell is.To t8. why am i having problems with replying on prophrsies?
My keypad does not work,when I tried to reply.
It just wont print.I have tried many times.
But I can do it here.wakeup.
942.
I agree with you; hell started when Jesus was tortured.
He was dead for one day and two nights.(in the tomb).
He went into the hearth of the earth;which is into all the evil on this earth.wakeup.
THE SEALING OF THE 144000, BEFORE THE 7TRUMPETS/7VIALS.(REV.7).
THE WRATH OF GOD.Revelation 8:7 The first angel *SOUNDED*, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.
Revelation 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his *VIAL* upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the *MARK OF THE BEAST*, and upon them which worshipped his image.
(NOTE; THE MARK OF THE BEAST IS ALREADY COMPULSORY).
(THIS MEANS THE FALSE PROPHET IS ALREADY IN POWER)Revelation 8:8 And the second angel *SOUNDED*, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood;
Revelation 8:9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.Revelation 16:3 And the second angel poured out his *VIAL* upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea. (BLOOD AS DEAD MAN=OIL SLICK).
Revelation 8:9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.
Revelation 8:10 And the third angel *SOUNDED*, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;
Revelation 8:11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.
Revelation 16:4 And the third angel poured out his *VIAL* upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.(WORMWOOD).
Revelation 8:12 And the fourth angel *SOUNDED*, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.
Revelation 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his *VIAL* upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
(IT WAS DARK,BUT HOT;ITS A GREENHOUSE EFFECT).Revelation 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other *VOICES* of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to SOUND!
Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel *SOUND*, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
Revelation 9:2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.
Revelation 9:3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
Revelation 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his *VIAL* upon the seat of the BEAST; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,(BECAUSE OF THE STINGS).
Revelation 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
Revelation 9:13 And the sixth angel *SOUNDED*, and I heard a voice from the four horns of the golden altar which is before God,
Revelation 9:14 Saying to the sixth angel which had the trumpet, Loose the four angels which are bound in the great river Euphrates.
Revelation 9:15 And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.(THE THIRD PART OF MEN). (WAR).
Revelation 9:16 And the number of the army of the horsemen were two hundred thousand thousand: and I heard the number of them.
Revelation 9:17 And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
(WAR HARDWARE).Revelation 9:18 **By these three was the third part of men killed**,
by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.Revelation 9:19 For their power is in their mouth, and in their tails: for their tails were like unto serpents, and had heads, and with them they do hurt.
Revelation 9:20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
Revelation 9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.
(THIS IS THE WAR OF MEN AGAINST MEN).(3RD WW).Revelation 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his *VIAL* upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the EAST(THE MEDES AND HIS DOMINIONS) might be prepared.
Revelation 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Revelation 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.(ARMAGEDDON).
Revelation 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. BLESSED IS HE THAT WATCHETH, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.(NOT IF WE ARE AWAKE)(NOT IF WE HAVE KNOWLEDGE,THEREFORE WATCH
Revelation 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Revelation 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his *VIAL* into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Revelation 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Revelation 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and THE CITIES OF THE NATIONS FELL: and GREAT BABYLON came in remembrance before God, to give unto *HER* the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Revelation 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
Revelation 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.( THIS IS ARMAGEDDON).
THE 7TH TRUMPET/VIALS = THE FINALE.(NO CME MENTIONED).(NO GOG MENTIONED).
BABYLON THE GREAT IS NO MORE. NOW THE KINGDOM OF GOD WILL BE SET UP.(THE 3RD WW)
Jeremiah 51:24 And I will render unto BABYLON and to all the inhabitants of Chaldea all their evil that they have done in Zion in your sight, saith the LORD.Jeremiah 51:25 Behold, I am against thee, O destroying mountain, saith the LORD, which destroyest ALL GHE EARTH: and I will stretch out mine hand upon thee, and roll thee down from the rocks, and will make thee a burnt mountain.
Jeremiah 51:26 And they shall not take of thee a stone for a corner, nor a stone for foundations; but thou shalt be desolate for ever, saith the LORD.
Jeremiah 51:27 Set ye up a standard in the land, blow the trumpet among the NATIONS, prepare the NATIONS against her, call together against her the kingdoms of Ararat, Minni, and Ashchenaz; appoint a captain against her; cause the horses to come up as the rough caterpillers.
Jeremiah 51:28 Prepare against her the nations with the kings of the MEDES, the captains thereof, and all the rulers thereof, and all the land of his dominion.
wakeup.
Isaiah 66:22-24
For as the new heavens, and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith The Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.
And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship saith The Lord.
And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.
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