Did god send jesus to die?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
He died as all men do.
So he lives by the Spirit of God.
That is the living hope of all who trust the sacred scriptures

[942767]

Hi BD:

You ask:

“Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world. If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome?

As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience.

Who said that I did not have to obey? I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says:

Quote

James 2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,14:56)

Hi BD: You ask: “Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world.  If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome? As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience. Who said that I did not have to obey?  I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says: Quote James  2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

Do you think these things were not required before Jesus was born?

Why is it you think morality became a virtue only after Jesus came. God has always commanded that we be righteous and HE has always said that if we try HE with HIS Mercy would make up the difference.

Do you deny that the Mercy of God is dependent upon anything but HIS own WILL?

[karmarie]

Bod, the scriptures say what they say and I believe all they say, why dont you?

I know Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, only those who put their trust in him and do the will of the Father in heaven will be saved, the bible says this…Jesus's words say this. If you do not accept the truth of the Son you will not be saved its that simple. Why? Because this is what the Bible says. All people of the World will have accurate knowledge of this, you have had the chance to accept this, Muslims all over the world are having dreams and visions of Jesus and are accepting this.

Why cant you see this?

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,15:28)

Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,14:56) Hi BD: You ask: “Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world.  If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome? As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience. Who said that I did not have to obey?  I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says: Quote James  2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Do you think these things were not required before Jesus was born? Why is it you think morality became a virtue only after Jesus came. God has always commanded that we be righteous and HE has always said that if we try HE with HIS Mercy would make up the difference. Do you deny that the Mercy of God is dependent upon anything but HIS own WILL?

Hi BD:

Yes, from the very beginning there were some who obeyed God prior to Jesus being born, but they fell short of perfect obedience. Jesus is the propitiation for their sins as well as for te sins of those who are reconciled to God through him from the time of his ministry on earth until he comes for the church.

At that time all who have obeyed God both from the OT and the NT will be raptured out of this world. Those who have died in faith from the OT, and those who have died in the faith in NT are a part of the body of Christ, and will be raised from the death by the Holy Spirit when Jesus comes for the church.

You asked seeking, about the second coming from the OT.

To whom do you say the following scriptures refer?

Quote

Daniel 7:13I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 14And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[bodhitharta]

Quote (karmarie @ May 08 2010,15:45)

Bod, the scriptures say what they say and I believe all they say, why dont you? I know Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, only those who put their trust in him and do the will of the Father in heaven will be saved, the bible says this…Jesus's words say this. If you do not accept the truth of the Son you will not be saved its that simple. Why? Because this is what the Bible says. All people of the World will have accurate knowledge of this, you have had the chance to accept this, Muslims all over the world are having dreams and visions of Jesus and are accepting this. Why cant you see this?

You seem to be confusing the issue as always the question is not whether believing in Jesus will grant someone salvation the question is can God grant salvation to whom HE pleases you seem to think HE cannot and that is where you are wrong completely.

Also you keep overlooking the very important fact:

And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.
Isaiah 49:5-7

For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.
Acts 13:46-48

For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts.
Malachi 1:10-12

I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
John 17:3-5

This is what you need to learn: Jesus came to Glorify God and lead others to God and not to become some sort of demigod and worshiped himself, your every objection is that I devote my worship to God and not Jesus, you are in severe error:

Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:2-4

I must worship God Karmarie, why does that disturb you so much? Do you wish me to be a pagan or a heathen? Do you want me to put partners with God?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,15:55)

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,15:28) Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,14:56) Hi BD: You ask: “Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world.  If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome? As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience. Who said that I did not have to obey?  I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says: Quote James  2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Do you think these things were not required before Jesus was born? Why is it you think morality became a virtue only after Jesus came. God has always commanded that we be righteous and HE has always said that if we try HE with HIS Mercy would make up the difference. Do you deny that the Mercy of God is dependent upon anything but HIS own WILL? Hi BD: Yes, from the very beginning there were some who obeyed God prior to Jesus being born, but they fell short of perfect obedience.  Jesus is the propitiation for their sins as well as for te sins of those who are reconciled to God through him from the time of his ministry on earth until he comes for the church. At that time all who have obeyed God both from the OT and the NT will be raptured out of this world.  Those who have died in faith from the OT, and those who have died in the faith in NT are a part of the body of Christ, and will be raised from the death by the Holy Spirit when Jesus comes for the church. You asked seeking, about the second coming from the OT. To whom do you say the following scriptures refer? Quote Daniel  7:13I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 14And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. Love in Christ, Marty

Are you saying that Daniel simply skips over the first coming of Jesus and goes right to the second? Why no mention of the first? You see how you can grab anything from the OT and simply apply it.

Also, we only know that a prophecy is of God when it proves to be true that prophecy that you pointed out to would be over 2300 years old but perhaps the vision had another purpose other than what you see as so obvious.

When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.
Deuteronomy 18:21-22

Do you think prophecies are simply open ended with no time limit. Read the Old Testament and see carefully how God through a prophet says what will happen and it comes to past in the very life of the prophet or at least that generation and hence a person can have faith from witnessing the Truth.

Can you imagine Moses going to Egypt and saying I will lead you out of Egypt but just have faith and years go by and everyone keeps saying don't worry we will get out of Egypt Moses promised us, can you imagine that?

The Word of God is Powerful so you read and you see the connection between what God says and what happens after it is said

[karmarie]

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,19:21)

Quote (karmarie @ May 08 2010,15:45) Bod, the scriptures say what they say and I believe all they say, why dont you? I know Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, only those who put their trust in him and do the will of the Father in heaven will be saved, the bible says this…Jesus's words say this. If you do not accept the truth of the Son you will not be saved its that simple. Why? Because this is what the Bible says. All people of the World will have accurate knowledge of this, you have had the chance to accept this, Muslims all over the world are having dreams and visions of Jesus and are accepting this. Why cant you see this? You seem to be confusing the issue as always the question is not whether believing in Jesus will grant someone salvation the question is can God grant salvation to whom HE pleases you seem to think HE cannot and that is where you are wrong completely. Also you keep overlooking the very important fact: And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. Isaiah 49:5-7 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth. Acts 13:46-48 For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts. Malachi 1:10-12 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. John 17:3-5 This is what you need to learn: Jesus came to Glorify God and lead others to God and not to become some sort of demigod and worshiped himself, your every objection is that I devote my worship to God and not Jesus, you are in severe error: Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Exodus 20:2-4 I must worship God Karmarie, why does that disturb you so much? Do you wish me to be a pagan or a heathen? Do you want me to put partners with God?

Bod, worshipping Jesus has nothing to do with this, worshipping Jesus is what many denominations do but also many dont…I was just saying to someone else this…I pray to Lord God YHVH Heavenly Father these are the words I use, I pray to who Jesus prayed to.

Thats not the problem here, its why does the Quran lie about Jesus..the Jewish Talmud does the same. (If what im saying doesnt make sense im sick today and its late)

[princess of the king]

Quick healing Sis

[bodhitharta]

Quote (karmarie @ May 08 2010,23:38)

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,19:21) Quote (karmarie @ May 08 2010,15:45) Bod, the scriptures say what they say and I believe all they say, why dont you? I know Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, only those who put their trust in him and do the will of the Father in heaven will be saved, the bible says this…Jesus's words say this. If you do not accept the truth of the Son you will not be saved its that simple. Why? Because this is what the Bible says. All people of the World will have accurate knowledge of this, you have had the chance to accept this, Muslims all over the world are having dreams and visions of Jesus and are accepting this. Why cant you see this? You seem to be confusing the issue as always the question is not whether believing in Jesus will grant someone salvation the question is can God grant salvation to whom HE pleases you seem to think HE cannot and that is where you are wrong completely. Also you keep overlooking the very important fact: And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth. Isaiah 49:5-7 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth. Acts 13:46-48 For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name shall be great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense shall be offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name shall be great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts. Malachi 1:10-12 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. John 17:3-5 This is what you need to learn: Jesus came to Glorify God and lead others to God and not to become some sort of demigod and worshiped himself, your every objection is that I devote my worship to God and not Jesus, you are in severe error: Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Exodus 20:2-4 I must worship God Karmarie, why does that disturb you so much? Do you wish me to be a pagan or a heathen? Do you want me to put partners with God? Bod, worshipping Jesus has nothing to do with this, worshipping Jesus is what many denominations do but also many dont…I was just saying to someone else this…I pray to Lord God YHVH Heavenly Father these are the words I use, I pray to who Jesus prayed to. Thats not the problem here, its why does the Quran lie about Jesus..the Jewish Talmud does the same. (If what im saying doesnt make sense im sick today and its late)

Yes, get better soon.

If you worship God and I worship God, I don't see the problem, isn't that what Jesus wanted everyone to do?

[karmarie]

Quote (princess of the king @ May 08 2010,23:57)

Quick healing Sis

Thanks POK, maybe its Saterday where you are? So happy Sabbath! Hope your well.

[karmarie]

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 09 2010,03:11)

Yes, get better soon. If you worship God and I worship God, I don't see the problem, isn't that what Jesus wanted everyone to do?

Thanks.

Bod, agreed but what God? If one says one thing about (one thing) and the other says something way different…how can they be the same thing?

“….You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!..James 19

Shouldnt you investigate more, compare differences? Cheak? (Between what Jesus said and what is in the Quran?) You need to choose (because of these differences) between what Jesus said and what Mohammad said.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (karmarie @ May 09 2010,15:10)

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 09 2010,03:11) Yes, get better soon. If you worship God and I worship God, I don't see the problem, isn't that what Jesus wanted everyone to do? Thanks. Bod, agreed but what God? If one says one thing about (one thing) and the other says something way different…how can they be the same thing? “….You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!..James 19 Shouldnt you investigate more, compare differences? Cheak? (Between what Jesus said and what is in the Quran?) You need to choose (because of these differences) between what Jesus said and what Mohammad said.

“….You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!..James 19

There is no issue about which God because there is only ONE GOD.

Actually what you study about God is the same in The Quran and The Bible.

Tell me what about “GOD” is different in The Quran.

[karmarie]

Hi Bod.

There is not only one God there are many Gods we can make anything a God….

There is only one way to YHVH  today and that is only through the son Jesus. By believing in him and what was wrote, by being baptised, by believing that in the blood of Jesus we are cleansed from our sins.

What we study in the Bible is not the same as what you study in the Quran.

The God of the Quran is different than God YHVH, for one the most obvious is 2 different Jesus's.

God (Allah) is just a title,

Here is some writting regarding the title God;

http://www.yahweh.com/Booklets/Whois/Whois.htm

I wouldnt recommend the rest of the site but that page has a few interesting points.

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,19:39)

Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,15:55) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,15:28) Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,14:56) Hi BD: You ask: “Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world.  If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome? As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience. Who said that I did not have to obey?  I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says: Quote James  2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Do you think these things were not required before Jesus was born? Why is it you think morality became a virtue only after Jesus came. God has always commanded that we be righteous and HE has always said that if we try HE with HIS Mercy would make up the difference. Do you deny that the Mercy of God is dependent upon anything but HIS own WILL? Hi BD: Yes, from the very beginning there were some who obeyed God prior to Jesus being born, but they fell short of perfect obedience.  Jesus is the propitiation for their sins as well as for te sins of those who are reconciled to God through him from the time of his ministry on earth until he comes for the church. At that time all who have obeyed God both from the OT and the NT will be raptured out of this world.  Those who have died in faith from the OT, and those who have died in the faith in NT are a part of the body of Christ, and will be raised from the death by the Holy Spirit when Jesus comes for the church. You asked seeking, about the second coming from the OT. To whom do you say the following scriptures refer? Quote Daniel  7:13I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 14And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. Love in Christ, Marty Are you saying that Daniel simply skips over the first coming of Jesus and goes right to the second? Why no mention of the first? You see how you can grab anything from the OT and simply apply it. Also, we only know that a prophecy is of God when it proves to be true that prophecy that you pointed out to would be over 2300 years old but perhaps the vision had another purpose other than what you see as so obvious. When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him. Deuteronomy 18:21-22 Do you think prophecies are simply open ended with no time limit. Read the Old Testament and see carefully how God through a prophet says what will happen and it comes to past in the very life of the prophet or at least that generation and hence a person can have faith from witnessing the Truth. Can you imagine Moses going to Egypt and saying I will lead you out of Egypt but just have faith and years go by and everyone keeps saying don't worry we will get out of Egypt Moses promised us, can you imagine that? The Word of God is Powerful so you read and you see the connection between what God says and what happens after it is said

No BD, Daniel did not skip the first coming but also prophesied regarding the coming of the Messiah here:

Quote

Daniel 9:20And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God; 21Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation. 22And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding. 23At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision. 24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

And so, because the rapture has not come to pass as yet, you are saying that Daniel is a false prophet?

Quote

2 Peter 3 God’s Promise Is Not Slack 1 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in both of which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder), 2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us,[a] the apostles of the Lord and Savior, 3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.” 5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water, 6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water. 7 But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. 8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

I hope that you have made the right decision by the time of his coming because there is no doubt that he will come.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[princess of the king]

Quote (karmarie @ May 09 2010,15:04)

Quote (princess of the king @ May 08 2010,23:57) Quick healing Sis Thanks POK, maybe its Saterday where you are? So happy Sabbath! Hope your well.

Karmarie,

All is well here, I do hope to find you feeling better. It seems you have not given up on BD, nor has he given up on you.

Take care.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (karmarie @ May 12 2010,11:10)

Hi Bod. There is not only one God there are many Gods we can make anything a God…. There is only one way to YHVH  today and that is only through the son Jesus. By believing in him and what was wrote, by being baptised, by believing that in the blood of Jesus we are cleansed from our sins. What we study in the Bible is not the same as what you study in the Quran. The God of the Quran is different than God YHVH, for one the most obvious is 2 different Jesus's. God (Allah) is just a title, Here is some writting regarding the title God; http://www.yahweh.com/Booklets/Whois/Whois.htm I wouldnt recommend the rest of the site but that page has a few interesting points.

So you must consider Jesus a liar because he says:

And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
John 17:2-4

In Facy you call God Himself a liar:

Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Isaiah 43:9-11

Obviously this title is exclusive to the ONLY ONE WORTHY to be called GOD. Don't ever get confused and lie on God and HIS Christ again, you should know better.

There is NO god but GOD.

Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
Isaiah 44:23-25

I fear for your soul as you turn to Idols in Vain worship.

God is more than a title. GOD IS GOD and who are you to belittle HIS TITLE and POSITION

You should apologize and repent

[bodhitharta]

Quote (942767 @ May 12 2010,12:07)

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,19:39) Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,15:55) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 08 2010,15:28) Quote (942767 @ May 08 2010,14:56) Hi BD: You ask: “Then, why does Jesus say you must also overcome sin and the ways of the world.  If God made Jesus replace your own efforts then why must you overcome? As I said he overcame sin and death, and I also by walking in his footsteps will overcome, but I could not overcome without the blood that he shed for me to wash away my sins when I fall short of perfect obedience. Who said that I did not have to obey?  I am saved by Faith in what God has done for me in the person of Jesus Christ, but as James says: Quote James  2:14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? 17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. 20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? 21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Do you think these things were not required before Jesus was born? Why is it you think morality became a virtue only after Jesus came. God has always commanded that we be righteous and HE has always said that if we try HE with HIS Mercy would make up the difference. Do you deny that the Mercy of God is dependent upon anything but HIS own WILL? Hi BD: Yes, from the very beginning there were some who obeyed God prior to Jesus being born, but they fell short of perfect obedience.  Jesus is the propitiation for their sins as well as for te sins of those who are reconciled to God through him from the time of his ministry on earth until he comes for the church. At that time all who have obeyed God both from the OT and the NT will be raptured out of this world.  Those who have died in faith from the OT, and those who have died in the faith in NT are a part of the body of Christ, and will be raised from the death by the Holy Spirit when Jesus comes for the church. You asked seeking, about the second coming from the OT. To whom do you say the following scriptures refer? Quote Daniel  7:13I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. 14And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. Love in Christ, Marty Are you saying that Daniel simply skips over the first coming of Jesus and goes right to the second? Why no mention of the first? You see how you can grab anything from the OT and simply apply it. Also, we only know that a prophecy is of God when it proves to be true that prophecy that you pointed out to would be over 2300 years old but perhaps the vision had another purpose other than what you see as so obvious. When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him. Deuteronomy 18:21-22 Do you think prophecies are simply open ended with no time limit. Read the Old Testament and see carefully how God through a prophet says what will happen and it comes to past in the very life of the prophet or at least that generation and hence a person can have faith from witnessing the Truth. Can you imagine Moses going to Egypt and saying I will lead you out of Egypt but just have faith and years go by and everyone keeps saying don't worry we will get out of Egypt Moses promised us, can you imagine that? The Word of God is Powerful so you read and you see the connection between what God says and what happens after it is said No BD, Daniel did not skip the first coming but also prophesied regarding the coming of the Messiah here: Quote Daniel 9:20And whiles I was speaking, and praying, and confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel, and presenting my supplication before the LORD my God for the holy mountain of my God; 21Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation. 22And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding. 23At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision. 24Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. And so, because the rapture has not come to pass as yet, you are saying that Daniel is a false prophet? Quote 2 Peter 3 God’s Promise Is Not Slack 1 Beloved, I now write to you this second epistle (in both of which I stir up your pure minds by way of reminder), 2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us,[a] the apostles of the Lord and Savior, 3 knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.” 5 For this they willfully forget: that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of water and in the water, 6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water. 7 But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved by the same word, are reserved for fire until the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. 8 But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. I hope that you have made the right decision by the time of his coming because there is no doubt that he will come. Love in Christ, Marty

I didn't say Christ wasn't coming, even the Quran agrees that he is returning.

Do you read into my posts meanings that are not there? What I said was that Daniel does not refer to any second coming, am I right or not?

If I am not then tell me where Daniel explains that Jesus will come be crucified, resurrected and then return in the distant future

[karmarie]

Quote (princess of the king @ May 12 2010,13:21)

Quote (karmarie @ May 09 2010,15:04) Quote (princess of the king @ May 08 2010,23:57) Quick healing Sis Thanks POK, maybe its Saterday where you are? So happy Sabbath! Hope your well. Karmarie, All is well here, I do hope to find you feeling better. It seems you have not given up on BD, nor has he given up on you. Take care.

Hey Princess of the King…feeling better thankyou, glad to hear your well..no I havent given up on him yet I dont give up easilly. Take care of yourself ok. (still waiting for that bus!)haha.

[karmarie]

Hi bod.

Quote (bodhitharta @ May 12 2010,16:12)

So you must consider Jesus a liar because he says: And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. John 17:2-4

That they may know thee the only true God and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent

To know Jesus you must know him as the Apostles and writters of the Scriptures. (Which is different than the Quran)

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In Fact you call God Himself a liar: Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. Isaiah 43:9-11 Obviously this title is exclusive to the ONLY ONE WORTHY to be called GOD. Don't ever get confused and lie on God and HIS Christ again, There is NO god but GOD.

Youngs literal translation…
“..Ye are My witnesses, an affirmation of Jehovah, And My servant whom I have chosen, So that ye know and give credence to Me, And understand that I am He, Before Me there was no God formed, And after Me there is none..”.

Is Jehovah in the 99 names of Allah? Is Jesus named as the Son of God?

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I fear for your soul as you turn to Idols in Vain worship.

Thanks for your concern but idols in vain worship? I have no need of idols what are you talking about?

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God is more than a title. GOD IS GOD and who are you to belittle HIS TITLE and POSITION You should apologize and repent

God is YHVH and his Son is Yahshua…Yahshua means Yah saves.

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