- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 12 2013,09:59) Quote (2besee @ Jan. 11 2013,18:42) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 12 2013,01:34) Babtism with water does not cleans away sin.
Hi Wakeup.
Acts 2:38,
'Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.'
2beehow many Jews were at that event
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28.Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,12:34) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,01:57) Hi 2Besee, Are you saying you disagree with… “with the mouth confession is made unto salvation” ?
God bless
Ed J
No, I was talking about Baptism in water.
Confession with the 'mouth' is something else.Does every single person that you know “know” that you are a follower of Jesus? If so, then that is (part of) “confession with the mouth” and you also have to be a good 'role model' to begin with.
Hi 2Besee,In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:15) Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,12:34) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,01:57) Hi 2Besee, Are you saying you disagree with… “with the mouth confession is made unto salvation” ?
God bless
Ed J
No, I was talking about Baptism in water.
Confession with the 'mouth' is something else.Does every single person that you know “know” that you are a follower of Jesus? If so, then that is (part of) “confession with the mouth” and you also have to be a good 'role model' to begin with.
Hi 2Besee,In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Hi Ed.According to scripture, “If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9)
But then again scripture says “On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’ (Matt 7:21-23)
Hebrews 4:12 'T'he word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
So even though Romans tells us that a person is saved just through confessing Jesus as Lord with His mouth and believing that God raised Jesus from the dead, many will be turned away despite this confession, because they “practiced lawlessness”
Scripture also says. Matthew 12:50. “Whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.”
What is the will of the Father Ed?
Also, “The word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart.” Hebrews 4:12.
Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,15:52) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:15) Hi 2Besee, In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
God bless
Ed J
Hi Ed.According to scripture, “If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9)
Hi 2Besee,So is that a “Yes” then?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org“Whoever is ashamed of me and of my words, of him will the Son of Man be ashamed when he comes in his glory and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels.”
Could you stand before thousands of men including friends and work associates and confess your belief and be baptized to put an end to sin?
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:57) Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,15:52) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:15) Hi 2Besee, In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
God bless
Ed J
Hi Ed.According to scripture, “If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9)
Hi 2Besee,So is that a “Yes” then?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Hi Ed,
No, it is not the only thing.Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,16:00) “Whoever is ashamed of me and of my words, of him will the Son of Man be ashamed when he comes in his glory and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels.” (1)Could you stand before thousands of men including friends and work associates and confess your belief (2)and be baptized (3)to put an end to sin?
Hi 2Besee,Done all those things:
1) Stood before people and confessed my belief.
2) Been baptized with God's Holy Spirit.
3) And have put an end to sin.Now will you answer my question?
In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,07:42) Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 12 2013,09:59) Quote (2besee @ Jan. 11 2013,18:42) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 12 2013,01:34) Babtism with water does not cleans away sin.
Hi Wakeup.
Acts 2:38,
'Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins.'
2beehow many Jews were at that event
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28.
2beeNO ,I disagree your scriptures do not say this ,it was about 3.5 years lather that the event of Cornelius was converted ,
and accepted into the congregation
you like to make all things your way ,???
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,18:20) Now will you answer my question?
In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
Ed,
No, it is not necessary all of the time, because some people do not speak, such as severely Autistic withdrawn people, etc.
So not always.
But if we are hiding our belief from others because we are “ashamed” somehow, or do not want to let go of 'sin', then yes, it is necessary, don't you think?Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,16:01) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:57) Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,15:52) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,17:15) Hi 2Besee, In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
God bless
Ed J
Hi Ed.According to scripture, “If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9)
Hi 2Besee,So is that a “Yes” then?
God bless
Ed J
Hi Ed,
No, it is not the only thing.
Hi 2Besee,I didn't ask you if it was the ONLY thing necessary, now did I? What I instead asked was:
“In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?”
Now will you please answer the question THAT I DID ASK?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgED, please read back a page, my full answer is there. You only quoted part of what I said. Thank you.
Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,16:34) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 12 2013,18:20) Now will you answer my question?
In your view, is confession with the mouth necessary for salvation?
Ed,
No, it is not necessary all of the time, because some people do not speak, such as severely Autistic withdrawn people, etc.
So not always.
But if we are hiding our belief from others because we are “ashamed” somehow, or do not want to let go of 'sin', then yes, it is necessary, don't you think?
Hi 2Besee,I do think confession is necessary for salvation, but my question is about what you believe.
So (you say) that if someone is mute, then they have an exception, is that it?
Can they not write it, use sign language, gesture or grunt it out?So do you believe public confession is necessary for salvation then; yes or no?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgHi Ed.
It is a difficult question to answer because what if a person is a complete loner or something?
….. If we are able to speak and understand, then yes, it is essential!
Personally, everybody who I know KNOWS about my belief and the way that I live my life. They know what i study, they know what I do, and do not do, and who I obey.
If I had to stand in front of the whole world and confess my beliefs I could and would. Would you? Yes?
Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,17:30) Hi Ed. It is a difficult question to answer because what if a person is a complete loner or something?
….. If we are able to speak and understand, then yes, it is essential!
OK, the guy that is drowning at sea that makes his confession to God alone, and then dies, is exempt.You know what I mean, now please answer my question yes or no?
Quote (2besee @ Jan. 12 2013,17:33) Personally, everybody who I know KNOWS about my belief and the way that I live my life. They know what i study, they know what I do, and do not do, and who I obey. If I had to stand in front of the whole world and confess my beliefs I could and would. Would you? Yes?
Hi 2Besee,I don't believe giving others a dossier of my past deeds needs to be included though.
Plus speaking private matters publicly would be excluded as well.
But yes, that is precisely what I do do.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Jan. 07 2013,17:13) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 07 2013,17:09) Hi Marty, The water baptized converts were from Judaism.
The Gentiles were not required to be “water baptized”.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
'I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;' (1 Cor 1:14)
HEd:Cornelius and those with him were the first gentiles who received the Holy Spirit and they received the Holy Spirit prior to being baptized in water, but the Apostle Peter stated this after they had received the Holy Spirit:
Quote Act 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Act 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
The Apostle Peter commanded them to be baptized in water, and he states: “can any man forbid water”, and the answer is “no they can not”.
The Apostle Paul in the scriptures that you posted did not say that water baptism was not necessary. He said that the Lord did not send him to baptize but to preach the gospel. He as an evangelist had to sow the seed, the gospel of Christ so that there would be believers.
Water baptism is an action showing that one has believed the gospel and has repented. If one has not believed with a repentant heart, water baptism means nothing.
You say that we are saved by faith, and that is true. It is believing with a repentant heart. If one confesses Jesus as Lord, one is indicating by that confession that he will obey the Lord's commandments.
Quote Rom 6:1 ¶ What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 08 2013,11:28) Quote (942767 @ Jan. 06 2013,19:23) Hi Mike: The question to you is: Have you received Holy Spirit since you have believed the gospel?
Not sure, Marty. I haven't spoken in tongues, raised any dead people, or cured any diseases.
But I do feel “guided” many times.Quote (942767 @ Jan. 06 2013,19:23) And so if you disagree, what do these scriptures mean to you?
The scriptures you quoted are metaphorical teachings, IMO. I've already addressed sayings like these in an earlier post to Pierre.Paul says things like, “you have died to Christ”, and, “you have been raised with Christ”.
Nobody Paul was writing to had LITERALLY died at that time (or he would have been writing letters to dead people), and nobody he was writing to had LITERALLY been raised with Christ to heaven.
They are METAPHORICAL sayings. You, Pierre, 2B, and others here believe Jesus' teachings to Nicodemus were also about a METAPHORICAL rebirth. I believe, that while many sayings in scripture are metaphorical, Jesus' teachings to Nicodemus in John 3 were about LITERALLY being born again and LITERALLY being able to enter the Kingdom of God with a new, spirit, body.
Am I right? Who knows for sure? This is just the way I personally understand John 3.
Obviously, opinions on the matter vary greatly, right?
Hi Mike:I could think of some wise cracks to say, but this is a serious thing, and if you have not received the Holy Spirit, the scripture states that you are not saved even though you might believe.
I was raised a Catholic and was taught that there was a God, and I was married in the Assembly of God church, and I was a member of a Southern Baptist church, but I did not have a personal relationship with God until I received the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
Being born again from the dead does not mean a literal physical death. It means dying unto sin and being raised from this spiritual death or separation from God because of this sin, to a personal relationship with God having all our past sins washed away by the blood of Jesus.
Maybe the following scriptures will help:
Quote m 6:1 ¶ What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Rom 6:8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
Rom 6:10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
Rom 6:11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
Quote Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. Rom 8:12 ¶ Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Not every one speaks in tongues when they receive the Holy Ghost. Tongues is a gift of the Spirit, and may come later as may other gifts of the Spirit.
You will know when you have received the Holy Spirit through the love you feel for God and for humanity.
Jesus states the following:
Quote Luk 11:13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? The Apostle Peter stated who believed the gospel:
Quote Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, [even] as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (942767 @ Jan. 13 2013,09:20) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 07 2013,17:13) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 07 2013,17:09) Hi Marty, The water baptized converts were from Judaism.
The Gentiles were not required to be “water baptized”.God bless
Ed J
'I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;' (1 Cor 1:14)
HEd:Cornelius and those with him were the first gentiles who received the Holy Spirit and they received the Holy Spirit prior to being baptized in water, but the Apostle Peter stated this after they had received the Holy Spirit:
Quote Act 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Act 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
The Apostle Peter commanded them to be baptized in water, and he states: “can any man forbid water”, and the answer is “no they can not”.
The Apostle Paul in the scriptures that you posted did not say that water baptism was not necessary. He said that the Lord did not send him to baptize but to preach the gospel. He as an evangelist had to sow the seed, the gospel of Christ so that there would be believers.
Water baptism is an action showing that one has believed the gospel and has repented. If one has not believed with a repentant heart, water baptism means nothing.
You say that we are saved by faith, and that is true. It is believing with a repentant heart. If one confesses Jesus as Lord, one is indicating by that confession that he will obey the Lord's commandments.
Quote Rom 6:1 ¶ What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Love in Christ,
Marty
Hi Marty,The Apostle Paul said that after He was baptized with the “HolySpirit” as well.
I don't forbid 'water baptism', for it symbolizes the Gospel.
Water baptism is an action for those under the old covenant
to showing that one has believed the gospel and has repented.But the fact that Gentiles were baptized without water baptism proves it is not necessary. …what say YOU?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
