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Pierre,
You never gave me the source of the commentary that you quoted. Do you not know where you got that from?Kathi
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 13 2011,22:06) Mike, Satan is not a God spirit being. He is an angel spirit being that made himself a god, not by nature but by arrogance. If anyone calls satan a god it would only be that he has wrongfully exalted himself making himself out to be like the most high.
Kathi
So, what Paul really meant to say was:“The [arrogant, self apointed, and wrongfully exalted] god of this age has blinded the minds of the unbelievers”?
Boy, why didn't he just say that then? 
Kathi, by what power does Satan blind the minds of the unbelievers? Because a “false god” or a “so-called god” would be a god that is really no god at all, right? And a god who is really no god at all would have no power at all, right? Kind of like the idols that were said to be “no gods at all”, right?
Yet it seems that this particular “non-god” has MUCH power. He was only able to offer Jesus the kingdoms of the world because, for the time being, they belong to him.
He can masquerade as an angel of light. Hmmmm…………….that seems pretty powerful. He has the combined power of a full third of the angels of God behind him, right? The angel in Rev says, “Woe to the earth and those living in it” when Satan is cast out of heaven. Why woe to us? He's just a “fake god” right? What harm can he do to us?
Are you getting my point yet?
peace,
mikeMike,
A god who is really no god at all by nature can still have great powers. The angels have great powers, they are not gods but still they are supernatural. Satan has great powers just like the other angels but he uses his power in ways to oppose Jehovah and does the opposite of good. The good angels minister to God by using their great powers. Satan is called god because he exalted himself, God did not exalt him at all…satan had a free will to sin and God allowed it knowing that evil will not win out and He will show His great grace and truth and victory over sin ultimately for our benefit. God works all things for good to those who love Him.He has done great harm Mike, no doubt all you have to do is read the angry tone of those here and how they do not seem to have peace. He is very subtle and can change one word and persuade you to buy into the interpretation. We all have to be aware of the schemes of satan. His wants us all to think that we can be gods, we have seen people here say that they will be gods, haven't we.
Gen 3:5 For God does know that in the day you eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
Kathi
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,13:23) Pierre,
In order to be given birth, one has to exist before birth…that is elementary. Birth is not the same as creation. Did you know that half of the 46 chromosomes that made you were in your mother from her birth, several years before you were even conceived?Kathi
Kathiis God a man ?
was Christ a man when he was created ?
Pierre
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,13:24) Pierre,
You never gave me the source of the commentary that you quoted. Do you not know where you got that from?Kathi
Kathithe NIV commentary's
Pierre
Ok Pierre thanks, do you have a link to where that particular quote is in that commentary?
You already asked me if God was a man, remember? I have answered you.
Kathi
Pierre,
you asked:Quote was Christ a man when he was created ? The Son was not created but was begotten.
The flesh body that the Son took on was created but the Son that took it on already existed.Kathi
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Rev 3:14 ¶ And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Irene
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,20:53) Pierre,
you asked:Quote was Christ a man when he was created ? The Son was not created but was begotten.
The flesh body that the Son took on was created but the Son that took it on already existed.Kathi
Kathithat was not the question,was Christ a man ? wen he was made
Pierre
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,20:51) Ok Pierre thanks, do you have a link to where that particular quote is in that commentary? You already asked me if God was a man, remember? I have answered you.
Kathi
Kathii have no link ,this is part of my bible program that i purchase 10 years or so ago,
at that time it was the top of the line ,
sorry
Pierre
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 14 2011,18:03) Mike,
A god who is really no god at all by nature can still have great powers. The angels have great powers, they are not gods but still they are supernatural.
You are getting warmer, Kathi! Angels truly ARE beings who are supernatural, immortal, and have special powers over the lives and affairs of people and the course of nature, right? Webster’s Dictionary defines the word god as, “any of various beings conceived of as supernatural, immortal, and having special powers over the lives and affairs of people and the course of nature”.
This same definition applied during biblical times, Kathi. “Elohim” referred to a “mighty one”, whether that one was a spirit being or a human being. By the time Jesus came to the earth, “theos” had more of a meaning of “mighty SPIRIT being” only.
So how can you say that Satan is not a “mighty spirit being” by nature? How can you say the gods of Egypt, who matched many of the signs and wonders performed by Moses were not “mighty spirit beings” by nature? According to Moses, Jehovah rendered judgment upon those gods of Egypt.
That sounds a lot like Psalm 82:1, where Jehovah assembles with the other gods and renders judgment upon them.
Jehovah is not called “the God of FALSE and SO-CALLED gods”, Kathi. He is called “the God of gods”. He has that title for a reason.
So if you think that the God Most High is the ONLY god in existence, then you haven't thought out the title “God MOST HIGH” very diligently.
And just like in the case of “God of gods” and “God Most High, there would be no need for the title “God ALMIGHTY” if there we no other gods in existence from which to distinguish Jehovah.
Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
peace,
mikeMike,
Quote Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
'
Seriously, Mike, you think that satan is a real bonafide god now? Wow, I'll bet your 'bonafide god' is ready to give you and the peanut gallery that follow you some party hats. This is what happens to your bonafide god, Mike:…and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night — to the ages of the ages. (Rev. 20:10, Young's Literal Translation.)
Does that sound like the party you want to go and take your buddies to?
There are no created gods, Mike. All that might go by the title 'gods' did not start out as 'gods' by nature. They exalted themselves or were exalted in the minds of others but never created to be legitimate gods by our Creator. Everything that God created was good.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,12:03) no doubt all you have to do is read the angry tone of those here and how they do not seem to have peace Talking about yourself again? Oh wow!
Who could have peace when your around? Truly I say that.
Your right Mike. Its a new day tomorrow. Time to move on and forget about it. So long as she stops making stupid posts that wind people up, such as a few days ago! Read up on scriptures LU and stop trying to make yourself out to be so good and perfect because you are not!
There is only one good, and that is God. Study properly.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,16:38) Mike, Quote Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
'
Seriously, Mike, you think that satan is a real bonafide god now? Wow, I'll bet your 'bonafide god' is ready to give you and the peanut gallery that follow you some party hats. This is what happens to your bonafide god, Mike:…and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night — to the ages of the ages. (Rev. 20:10, Young's Literal Translation.)
Does that sound like the party you want to go and take your buddies to?
There are no created gods, Mike. All that might go by the title 'gods' did not start out as 'gods' by nature. They exalted themselves or were exalted in the minds of others but never created to be legitimate gods by our Creator. Everything that God created was good.
Kath! Why do you take up judging others that do not believe in your theory? We have shown you Scripturesover and over again, and still you accuse the Brethren…. I don't even know you any more… what a shame….IreneIrene,
You need to know who the brethren are. Those who say “Jesus is Lord” as deity and live that truth are the brethren. Have you posted anything in the 'Jesus is deity' scriptural database. If you believe in the deity of Christ why do you side with those who don't?I will hope to continue standing for the deity of Christ to the glory of our Heavenly Father! You can join those of us who are in that pursuit or not.
James 1 2Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, 3knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance. 4And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.
5But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him. 6But he must ask in faith without any doubting, for the one who doubts is like the surf of the sea, driven and tossed by the wind. 7For that man ought not to expect that he will receive anything from the Lord, 8being a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.9But the brother of humble circumstances is to glory in his high position; 10and the rich man is to glory in his humiliation, because like flowering grass he will pass away. 11For the sun rises with a scorching wind and withers the grass; and its flower falls off and the beauty of its appearance is destroyed; so too the rich man in the midst of his pursuits will fade away.
12Blessed is a man who perseveres under trial; for once he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. 13Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death. 16Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren. 17Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shifting shadow. 18In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, so that we would be a kind of first fruits among His creatures.
19This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; 20for the anger of man does not achieve the righteousness of God. 21Therefore, putting aside all filthiness and all that remains of wickedness, in humility receive the word implanted, which is able to save your souls. 22But prove yourselves doers of the word, and not merely hearers who delude themselves. 23For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; 24for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was. 25But one who looks intently at the perfect law, the law of liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man will be blessed in what he does.
Kathi
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,00:38) Mike, Quote Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
'
Seriously, Mike, you think that satan is a real bonafide god now? Wow, I'll bet your 'bonafide god' is ready to give you and the peanut gallery that follow you some party hats. This is what happens to your bonafide god, Mike:…and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night — to the ages of the ages. (Rev. 20:10, Young's Literal Translation.)
Does that sound like the party you want to go and take your buddies to?
There are no created gods, Mike. All that might go by the title 'gods' did not start out as 'gods' by nature. They exalted themselves or were exalted in the minds of others but never created to be legitimate gods by our Creator. Everything that God created was good.
Amen KathiSatan is also known as an “angel of light” but we know that he can transform himself to appear as an “angel of light” not that he is an “angel of light”. To the world and the unbelievers he has blinded their minds to believe he is “a god' because Paul says he is “the god” of this world and we know that we are not of this world. To us satan is “no god” at all, oh that right that is what the Apostle Paul also said…
“There is “NO god” but one” 1 Cor 8:4
Mike hasen't realized that yet.
WJ
Yes Keith,
Here is that scripture:1I wish that you would bear with me in a little foolishness; but indeed you are bearing with me. 2For I am jealous for you with a godly jealousy; for I betrothed you to one husband, so that to Christ I might present you as a pure virgin. 3But I am afraid that, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, your minds will be led astray from the simplicity and purity of devotion to Christ. 4For if one comes and preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted, you bear this beautifully. 5For I consider myself not in the least inferior to the most eminent apostles. 6But even if I am unskilled in speech, yet I am not so in knowledge; in fact, in every way we have made this evident to you in all things.
7Or did I commit a sin in humbling myself so that you might be exalted, because I preached the gospel of God to you without charge? 8I robbed other churches by taking wages from them to serve you; 9and when I was present with you and was in need, I was not a burden to anyone; for when the brethren came from Macedonia they fully supplied my need, and in everything I kept myself from being a burden to you, and will continue to do so. 10As the truth of Christ is in me, this boasting of mine will not be stopped in the regions of Achaia. 11Why? Because I do not love you? God knows I do!
12But what I am doing I will continue to do, so that I may cut off opportunity from those who desire an opportunity to be regarded just as we are in the matter about which they are boasting. 13For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. 14No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. 15Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.
Love to you,
KathiQuote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 16 2011,11:29) Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,00:38) Mike, Quote Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
'
Seriously, Mike, you think that satan is a real bonafide god now? Wow, I'll bet your 'bonafide god' is ready to give you and the peanut gallery that follow you some party hats. This is what happens to your bonafide god, Mike:…and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night — to the ages of the ages. (Rev. 20:10, Young's Literal Translation.)
Does that sound like the party you want to go and take your buddies to?
There are no created gods, Mike. All that might go by the title 'gods' did not start out as 'gods' by nature. They exalted themselves or were exalted in the minds of others but never created to be legitimate gods by our Creator. Everything that God created was good.
Amen KathiSatan is also known as an “angel of light” but we know that he can transform himself to appear as an “angel of light” not that he is an “angel of light”. To the world and the unbelievers he has blinded their minds to believe he is “a god' because Paul says he is “the god” of this world and we know that we are not of this world. To us satan is “no god” at all, oh that right that is what the Apostle Paul also said…
“There is “NO god” but one” 1 Cor 8:4
Mike hasen't realized that yet.
WJ
WJit the mixture you make of it that we do not like ,it is so unscriptural,
binni or trinity's all are on there own cloud and moving away from truth of God,
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 15 2011,14:44) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 16 2011,11:29) Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 15 2011,00:38) Mike, Quote Kathi, can you show me any SCRIPTURAL evidence, proof, or even an inkling that Satan is less than a real, bonafide god?
'
Seriously, Mike, you think that satan is a real bonafide god now? Wow, I'll bet your 'bonafide god' is ready to give you and the peanut gallery that follow you some party hats. This is what happens to your bonafide god, Mike:…and the Devil, who is leading them astray, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where [are] the beast and the false prophet, and they shall be tormented day and night — to the ages of the ages. (Rev. 20:10, Young's Literal Translation.)
Does that sound like the party you want to go and take your buddies to?
There are no created gods, Mike. All that might go by the title 'gods' did not start out as 'gods' by nature. They exalted themselves or were exalted in the minds of others but never created to be legitimate gods by our Creator. Everything that God created was good.
Amen KathiSatan is also known as an “angel of light” but we know that he can transform himself to appear as an “angel of light” not that he is an “angel of light”. To the world and the unbelievers he has blinded their minds to believe he is “a god' because Paul says he is “the god” of this world and we know that we are not of this world. To us satan is “no god” at all, oh that right that is what the Apostle Paul also said…
“There is “NO god” but one” 1 Cor 8:4
Mike hasen't realized that yet.
WJ
WJit the mixture you make of it that we do not like ,it is so unscriptural,
binni or trinity's all are on there own cloud and moving away from truth of God,
Pierre
PeirreSHHHH! Does anyone hear that? It sounds like chatter in the wind!
Oh sorry it is just Peirre.
But you never answered my question.
Do you believe in the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit?
If you do then you believe in a “trinity”.
Now little one you should stop badgering people and go and learn what that means, and when you have something substantive to share then please come back and teach us if you can!
WJ
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 16 2011,05:19) James 1 2Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, 3knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance. 4And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.
5But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him. 6But he must ask in faith without any doubting, for the one who doubts is like the surf of the sea, driven and tossed by the wind. 7For that man ought not to expect that he will receive anything from the Lord, 8being a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.9But the brother of humble circumstances is to glory in his high position; 10and the rich man is to glory in his humiliation, because like flowering grass he will pass away. 11For the sun rises with a scorching wind and withers the grass; and its flower falls off and the beauty of its appearance is destroyed; so too the rich man in the midst of his pursuits will fade away.
12Blessed is a man who perseveres under trial; for once he has been approved, he will receive the crown of life which the Lord has promised to those who love Him. 13Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God”; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. 14But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death. 16Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren. 17Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shifting shadow. 18In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, so that we would be a kind of first fruits among His creatures.
19This you know, my beloved brethren. But everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak and slow to anger; 20for the anger of man does not achieve the righteousness of God. 21Therefore, putting aside all filthiness and all that remains of wickedness, in humility receive the word implanted, which is able to save your souls. 22But prove yourselves doers of the word, and not merely hearers who delude themselves. 23For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man who looks at his natural face in a mirror; 24for once he has looked at himself and gone away, he has immediately forgotten what kind of person he was. 25But one who looks intently at the perfect law, the law of liberty, and abides by it, not having become a forgetful hearer but an effectual doer, this man will be blessed in what he does.
Kathi
“Because with lies you have grieved the heart of the righteous, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, and be saved alive.”
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