Did Jesus go to hell after he died

Jesus descended into hell

The meaning of hell

Hell is translated from these three words: “Hades”,  “Geenna”, and “Sheol”. Below are the definitions for these three words.

HADES {hah’-dace} (as negative particle) hell, grave

  • name Hades or Pluto, the god of the lower regions
  • Orcus, the nether world, the realm of the dead
  • later use of this word: the grave, death, hell
  • In Biblical Greek it is associated with Orcus, the infernal regions, a dark and dismal place in the very depths of the earth, the common receptacle of disembodied spirits.
  • Usually Hades is just the abode of the wicked, Lu. 16:23, Rev. 20:13,14;
  • a very uncomfortable place.
 

GEENNA {gheh’-en-nah}

  • hell, hell fire
  • Hell is the place of the future punishment call “Gehenna” or “Gehenna of fire”. This was originally the valley of Hinnom, south of Jerusalem, where the filth and dead animals of the city were cast out and burned; a fit symbol of the wicked and their future destruction.
 

SHEOL {sheh-ole’}

  • sheol, underworld, grave, hell, pit
  • Sheol – the OT designation for the abode of the dead
  • place of no return
  • without praise of God
  • wicked sent there for punishment
  • righteous not abandoned to it
 

The location of hell

See the scriptures below. In Ezekiel 26:20 (English-NIV) it says:
then I will bring you down with those who go down to the pit, to the people of long ago. I will make you dwell in the earth below, as in ancient ruins, with those who go down to the pit, and you will not return or take your place in the land of the living.

Notice that this scripture indicates that some people are dwelling in the Earth below (the pit).

Ezekiel 31:16 (English-KJV)
I made the nations to shake at the sound of his fall, when I cast him down to hell with them that descend into the pit: and all the trees of Eden, the choice and best of Lebanon, all that drink water, shall be comforted in the nether parts of the earth.

Again Hell (sheol, underworld, grave, hell, pit) is referred to as being in the earth.

Luke 16:19-28 (English-NIV)
19 There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day.
20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores
21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried.
23 In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.
24 So he called to him, `Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.
25 But Abraham replied, Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony.
26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.
27 He answered, `Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father’s house,
28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.

Remember that these are the recorded words of Jesus himself.
Taken literally it suggests that the world of the dead is/was divided into two regions. One for the wicked and the other for the righteous.
The wicked are in torment in hell and the righteous are/were in peace with Abraham.
There was/is a chasm between the two places that stopped either side from crossing to the other, yet they could/can still communicate with each other.

Did Jesus go to hell after he was crucified?

Matthew 12:40 (English-NIV)
For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

This scripture is quite blatant about the fact that Jesus went to the heart of the earth for three days and three nights.

If this is the case then how do the words of Jesus spoken to the thief on the cross make sense.

Luke 23:42-43 (English-NIV)
42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
43 Jesus answered him, “I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise.”

The point I am making here is that Jesus was in the heart of the earth for approximately three days, after that he walked the earth for a short time and then he was lifted up into heaven.
So if the reference to Paradise was heaven, then when Jesus said to the thief on the cross “that he would be in paradise with him today” would have to be a contradiction because Jesus was in the heart of the earth for three days and three nights.

The only way that both scriptures can be explained without contradiction is to say that Paradise was also in the heart of the earth like Hell.
Do you find this hard to believe?
Doesn’t Luke 16:19-28 say the same thing. We just read earlier in those verses that when Lazarus died he went to Abraham’s side and the rich man went to hell. In hell the rich man looked up and could see Lazarus being comforted at Abraham’s side. But neither could cross over to the other side because of a huge chasm.

Further evidence for the location of hell

Ephesians 4:9 (English-NIV)
8 This is why it says: “When he ascended on high, he led captives in his train and gave gifts to men.”
9 (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions ?
10 He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.

The focal point for the word ascended and descended is the earth itself.
In verse 9 it says that he descended to the lower earthly regions

Why did Jesus go to hell?

Hebrews 2:14 (English-NIV)
Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might destroy him who holds the power of death–that is, the devil.

Revelation 1:18 (English-NIV)
17 When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last.
18 I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

These scriptures indicate that Jesus was dead and is now alive, he also has the Keys of death and hell. We can see clearly that Jesus mission to destroy the power that the devil had over death was a success.

1 Peter 3 (English-NIV)
18 For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit,
19 through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison
20 who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,

This scripture says that Jesus preached to disobedient spirits in prison who died before the flood of Noah.
Although I do not understand the full ramifications of this verse, it does make sense that when Jesus defeated death, he could have proclaimed his victory to the wicked spirits in Hell. In other words he heralded their soon coming judgement, and then of course he set the righteous spirits free to abide in Heaven. It doesn’t necessarily mean that Jesus gave the wicked a second chance to repent as the New Testament scriptures are quite blatant about the fact that you can only repent while you are alive on the Earth.

1 Peter 4:5-6 (English-NIV)
5 But they will have to give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.
6 For this is the reason the gospel was preached even to those who are now dead, so that they might be judged according to men in regard to the body, but live according to God in regard to the spirit.

This scripture could relate to the above scripture as they are only one chapter apart ie Jesus preached to the dead.
This scripture also seems to say that the Gospel was preached to the dead and they were given a chance at life, but it can also be interpreted to say that the disobedient who are dead actually heard the gospel when they were alive, and the reference to the dead is to say that they were dead at the time of the scripture, ie now dead, but were actually alive when they heard the gospel.
I have added these two verses as they relate to Jesus death and journey to the world of the dead, but I do repeat the statement I made earlier, and that is that I do not understand the full ramifications of these two verses.

Matthew 27:50 – 52 (English-KJV):
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Death is defeated

After Jesus died many of the dead saints arose and walked the earth and appeared to many.
This seems to suggest that Jesus freed the dead saints from a sleep, so he probably went to the place of the dead and set them free. These saints would have been in Paradise, see Luke 16:19-28 (quoted earlier). Remember that Jesus also rose from the dead and walked the earth before being taken up into Heaven. These saints of old that walked the earth probably were raised to heaven as well. There is no suggestion in the Bible that these saints continued to live amongst mankind.

The fact that the dead rose at the same time as Jesus resurrection is a fulfillment of what Jesus said would happen in John 5:28-29 (English-NIV)

28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
29 and come out–those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.

The resurrection of the saints

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (English-NIV)
16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage each other with these words.

Notice that the dead rise first, and at some stage all those believers who are still living will join the dead to meet the Lord.
Jesus victory over death has enabled the saints who have died to by pass Hades and go to Heaven as he did, this was a result of the victory over the devil; who had the power of death. Jesus took the keys of death and hell from him, as we read earlier Revelation 1:18.
Today when the righteous die, they go straight to heaven, but the wicked remain in the grave/hell until the great day of judgement. See Revelation 20:11-14 (English-NIV)

11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.
13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.
14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

There is no record of the righteous in heaven before Jesus death except for the Mount of Transfiguration where Elijah and Moses appeared with Jesus in heavenly glory. See Luke 9:29-31. But these two persons were exceptions. Elijah never saw death, he was taken up into Heaven while he was alive therefore by passing the holding place where Abraham dwelt, see 2 Kings 2:11
As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared and separated the two of them, and Elijah went up to heaven in a whirlwind.

Moses was also an exception. Jude 1:9 says
But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”

Here we see that Michael the Archangel and the devil fought over Moses body.
Each probably laying claim to why they could have it. The devil probably argued that it couldn’t be taken because he had the Power over death at that stage. Needless to say it doesn’t say who won, but that fact that Moses appeared in glory next to Jesus side in the Mount of Transfiguration shows us the outcome of this dispute.

Going on now we find the following scripture.

Revelation 1:5 (English-NIV)
and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood,

This scripture points out that Jesus is the first born from the dead. This suggest that there must be other people born from the dead to follow. Matthew 27:50 – 52  compliments this. Only the power of God can raise the dead and this is what it means to be Born Again. The power that raised Jesus from the dead will also raise all those who belong to God when they die.

Corinthians 15 22-28 English-NIV)
22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
23 But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him.
24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power.
25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death.
27 For he “has put everything under his feet.” Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ.
28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

This scripture reveals a great mystery, that mystery being “all in Christ live”. First Jesus, then the firstfruits, then those that belong to Jesus at his coming. Then the end will come when Jesus destroys all dominion and authority. The last enemy is death. This will result in God the Father being able to dwell in all.

This fits in well with the teaching that Jesus went to Hell, so as to be victorious over Hell, and therefore destroying the One who had Power over death, namely the Devil.

Conclusion

It makes scriptural sense when Jesus died that he went to Hell and defeated death and took the Keys of death and Hell from Satan who had the power of death. This victory means that Jesus defeated death in a bid to make all things subject to him. Death was the last enemy that needed to be conquered and now Jesus has been exalted to the highest position in heaven by God. This victory has enabled all those who belong to God to be raised from the dead with the same power. Jesus is waiting for all his enemies to be made a footstool at his feet.Then  he will give his Kingdom to his Father that the Father may dwell in all.

Hebrews 1:13
13 To which of the angels did God ever say,
“Sit at my right hand
until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet”?
14 Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?

Hebrews 10:12-14
12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, 13 and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. 14 For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.

Much  of the work that is left is for the Church to complete, including preaching the gospel of the Kingdom  to all the world. Then the end shall come.

Is hell eternal?

Did you know that Hell is not forever because it is thrown into the Lake of Fire. God is going to destroy the Heavens and Earth with fire after the Millennium, and with this same fire, he destroys the wicked. Further, it he destroys the Earth and Hell is inside the Earth then Hell as a dwelling place would surely also be destroyed. See these next three scriptures for confirmation. Or read this related writing:
https://heavennet.net/writings/is-hell-eternal/

2 Peter 3:7 (English-NIV)
By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

Revelation 21:1 (English-NIV)
Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.

Revelation 20:14 (English-KJV)
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.


Discussion

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  • #778811
    Wakeup
    Participant

    Ezekiel 13:1 And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,

    Ezekiel 13:2 Son of man, prophesy against the prophets of Israel that prophesy, and say thou unto them that prophesy out of their own hearts, Hear ye the word of the LORD;

    Ezekiel 13:3 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing!

    Ezekiel 13:4 O Israel, thy prophets are like the foxes in the deserts.

    Ezekiel 13:5 Ye have not gone up into the gaps, neither made up the hedge for the house of Israel to stand in the battle in the day of the LORD.

    Ezekiel 13:6 They have seen vanity and lying divination, saying, The LORD saith: and the LORD hath not sent them: and they have made others to hope that they would confirm the word.

    Ezekiel 13:7 Have ye not seen a vain vision, and have ye not spoken a lying divination, whereas ye say, The LORD saith it; albeit I have not spoken?

    Ezekiel 13:8 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because ye have spoken vanity, and seen lies, therefore, behold, I am against you, saith the Lord GOD.

    Ezekiel 13:9 And mine hand shall be upon the prophets that see vanity, and that divine lies: they shall not be in the assembly of my people, neither shall they be written in the writing of the house of Israel, neither shall they enter into the land of Israel; and ye shall know that I am the Lord GOD.

    Ezekiel 13:10 Because, even because they have seduced my people, saying, Peace; and there was no peace; and one built up a wall, and, lo, others daubed it with untempered morter:

    Ezekiel 13:11 Say unto them which daub it with untempered morter, that it shall fall: there shall be an overflowing shower; and ye, O great hailstones, shall fall; and a stormy wind shall rend it.

    Ezekiel 13:12 Lo, when the wall is fallen, shall it not be said unto you, Where is the daubing wherewith ye have daubed it?

    Ezekiel 13:13 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I will even rend it with a stormy wind in my fury; and there shall be an overflowing shower in mine anger, and great hailstones in my fury to consume it.

    Ezekiel 13:14 So will I break down the wall that ye have daubed with untempered morter, and bring it down to the ground, so that the foundation thereof shall be discovered, and it shall fall, and ye shall be consumed in the midst thereof: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

    Ezekiel 13:15 Thus will I accomplish my wrath upon the wall, and upon them that have daubed it with untempered morter, and will say unto you, The wall is no more, neither they that daubed it;

    Ezekiel 13:16 To wit, the prophets of Israel which prophesy concerning Jerusalem, and which see visions of peace for her, and there is no peace, saith the Lord GOD.

    Ezekiel 13:17 Likewise, thou son of man, set thy face against the daughters of thy people, which prophesy out of their own heart; and prophesy thou against them,

    Ezekiel 13:18 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you?

    Ezekiel 13:19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?

    Ezekiel 13:20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.

    Ezekiel 13:21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

    Ezekiel 13:22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:

    Ezekiel 13:23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

    BASICALLY;THE PROPHETS ARE NOT CALLED BY GOD;THEY PROPHECY FALSELY.
    THEY MAKE THE SOULS FLY WITH SOOTHING WORDS;SUCH AS; YOU ARE ALL SAVED AND BORN AGAIN.NO EVIL CAN COME TO US.
    THEY HAVE BUILD THE WALL WITH UNTEMPERED MORTAR;IT SHALL FALL WHEN THE GREAT STORM COMES.GOD WILL SET THE PRISONNERS FREE FROM THEIR CAPTURE.

    wakeup.

    #778812
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi,
    Jesus was a man and went where all dead men go.
    The only difference is that Hades could not hold him and neither can it hold us. Like Peter we have the keys.

    #778813
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    True.

    #778814
    terraricca
    Participant

    WHY WOULD Jesus go to hell (hades) to preach to the dead their ?

    many do not believe that their is anyone there anyway ,for many all soul dies ,so this view seem strange does it ,

    and yet Jesus was in the hades only a few ours spread over 3 days ,and in human time ,

    so i need more scriptures ,for the ones some have given here only says that God is every were and the promisse not to leave Jesus soul in dead ,

    did i mis some thing?

    #788561
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    @terraricca

    Some people hold that he preached to those in Hades a message regarding victory over death. We read after Jesus rose from hades the following:

    The tombs were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised…

    Thus he preached and proclaimed victory over death and freed those who were under death.

    We read later in Revelation the following:

    I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

    Jesus once talked about hades as a place with a division between the righteous and wicked. When Jesus preached to the dead, he could have proclaimed freedom to the captives and possibly final judgement to the wicked.

    It doesn’t say that he preached the gospel to the dead, but that he preached. However, it is even possible that he preached the gospel.

    but they will give account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead. For the gospel has for this purpose been preached even to those who are dead, that though they are judged in the flesh as men, they may live in the spirit according to the will of God.

    The last verse may be referring to something completely different, I haven’t looked into it. I put it here as food for thought.

    #788589
    terraricca
    Participant

    @t8

    the only possible true answer lays in these words ;The tombs were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised…

    who are the saints ? are not those faithful believers in God almighty the righteous of old that have walk in the way of their God Jehovah ? yes those are the ones ;

    those where the ones that long for the coming of God’s promise and waited for it all their lives,

    that day that Jesus descended to hell (hades) he only needed to show himself to their soul they would know who he was ,

    truth can see truth when presented to them

    #788592
    Lightenup
    Participant

    Here is your answer according to this writing, entitled:

    The Gospel of Nicodemus

    Part II.—The Descent of Christ into Hell.

    Greek Form.

    Chapter 1 (17).

    Joseph says: And why do you wonder that Jesus has risen? But it is wonderful that He has not risen alone, but that He has also raised many others of the dead who have appeared in Jerusalem to many.1930 And if you do not know the others, Symeon at least, who received Jesus, and his two sons whom He has raised up—them at least you know. For we buried them not long ago; but now their tombs are seen open and empty, and they are alive, and dwelling in Arimathæa. They therefore sent men, and they found their tombs open and empty. Joseph says: Let us go to Arimathæa and find them.

    Then rose up the chief priests Annas and Caiaphas, and Joseph, and Nicodemus, and Gamaliel, and others with them, and went away to Arimathæa, and found those whom Joseph spoke of. They made prayer, therefore, and saluted each other. Then they came with them to Jerusalem, and brought them into the synagogue, and secured the doors, and placed in the midst the old covenant of the Jews; and the chief priests said to them: We wish you to swear by the God of Israel and Adonai, and so that you tell the truth, how you have risen, and who has raised you from the dead.

    The men who had risen having heard this, made upon their faces the sign of the cross, and said to the chief priests: Give us paper and ink and pen. These therefore they brought. And sitting down, they wrote thus:—

    That is just the beginning of the story regarding Jesus’ descent into hell. You can find that story here and the rest of the story to follow after that: http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf08.vii.xiv.i.html

    It really is absolutely enlightening if it is so!!

    #788593
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,

    Since there is no SIGN OF THE CROSS in scripture but only in catholic theology then you can understand this is spurious.

    #788600
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @NickHassan
    Are you threatened by those who look to the cross as the tree of life since on it Jesus destroyed the power of death?

    #788601
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Lightenup…..JESUS went no where but the grave and was raised by his GOD, back to life. As far as others raised back to “eternal” life, there was non Others then Him. The word hell simply means grave and that is where Jesus went and where a who die go.

    Acts 2:29-36. And notice where JESUS IS FROM THE LOINS OF KING DAVID, HE WAS AND IS NOT A GOD OF ANY KIND. NOTICE THE DIFFERENT WORDS FOR LORDS USED IN VERSE VERSE 34, “For David is not asended into the heavens: but says himself, the LORD (adonia) meaning A “GOD”, said unto my Lord (adoni) (meaning a human judge or ruler), sit you on my right hand, until I (adonia, GOD) make your ( lord, adoni) foes his footstool.

    Please use a standard king James bible instead of a corrupted Catholic bible.

    peace and love to you and yours………………gene

    #788603
    terraricca
    Participant

    LU

    The Gospel of Nicodemus

    the apostate gospel ;looks like your own faith ;not all are looking for lies most are looking for truth

    #788614
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @GeneBalthrop
    I dont use a Catholic Bible. You are mistaken in nearly everything you wrote in your post except that Jesus, according to the flesh is from the seed of David through His mother Mary. That is where He, being the Son of God from eternity, became also a son of man. His first birth was without mother, His second birth was without earthly father.

    Regarding the phrase “Lord of lords” it is the same in the Greek in the Septuagint OT where it refers to Jehovah as it is in Revelation where it refers to Jesus. You really need to be careful what you try to teach.

    #788615
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @terraricca
    You can’t prove that didn’t happen as Nicodemus wrote…so you merely assume that it is a lie because it doesn’t support your Christology. I tell you what…your opinion doesn’t make it false. You have to have more than an your opinion. The Bible does speak of an event that dead people had risen from the dead and walked around the town as witnessed by the people that were alive at the time.

    Matt 27
    51And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. 52The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, 53and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many.

    If Nicodemus witnessed this, I am not surprised that he would investigate this and write about what he found out. Not every true writing could become canon or the Bible would be super heavy.

    #788628
    terraricca
    Participant

    LU

    Matt 27
    51And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split. 52The tombs also were opened. And many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, 53and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many.

    why do you think THE CURTAIN WAS TORN IN TWO TOP TO BOTTOM ?

    WHY DO YOU THINK THE EARTH SHOOK ?

    AND THE ROCKS WERE SPLIT?

    AND WHY THOSE SAINTS WERE RAISED ?

    AND WHY DID THEY ONLY SHOW UP IN THE HOLY CITY AFTER JESUS RESURRECTION AND NOT BEFORE ?

    AND TO WHOM DID THEY APPEAR (TO MANY)?

    If Nicodemus witnessed this

    “IF” WE CAN GO FAR WITH THAT WORD ,BUT NOT IN THE TRUTH ,

    #788630
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    His first birth was without mother, His second birth was without earthly father.

    I am pretty sure that you have taught many times in the past that Jesus has always existed. Thus you now speak of a former birth.

    If so, then I guess you hold the view that Jesus existed inside God like an embryo and was then begotten to be next to God. If this is the case, then imagine that he is not inside God as a person, but that God who has the logos within him begat the logos so that the logos was with him. All the while not lessening the logos that is within God, for God is eternal and not diminishing.

    Jesus came from God, he said it himself.

    #788631
    Lightenup
    Participant

    “IF” WE CAN GO FAR WITH THAT WORD ,BUT NOT IN THE TRUTH ,

    Prove it terraricca. Were you there at the time? If not, then you really don’t know if it is true or not, do you?

    You have many questions. Pick one for starters, ok.

    #788632
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @t8
    The logos is a sentient person and always has been and always will be. When begotten that person created the universe. You are right that the one who begat Him was not diminished after the begetting. They remain interdependently existent.

    #788646
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    This is where your assumptions begin and is perhaps the root from whence your doctrine comes.

    Unfortunately for your doctrine, God is a Father, and Jesus his son. This is what we should believe.

    Not conjoined twins, big and little brother, or a Binity God.

    For us there is one God the Father.

    This is why we say you cannot be ‘us’ even by your own admission.

    You preach another gospel.

    #788657
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @t8

    This is why we say you cannot be ‘us’ even by your own admission.

    You preach another gospel.

    Glad you realize that and see a distinction.

    I would rather be with the ‘us’ that has both, the ‘God of gods’ and the ‘Lord of lords’, the one and mighty God-Jehovah who IS both.

    #788660
    terraricca
    Participant

    LU

    Prove it terraricca. Were you there at the time? If not, then you really don’t know if it is true or not, do you?

    You have many questions. Pick one for starters, ok.

    SINCE YOU MAKE THE “IF” A REALITY ,YOU ANSWER MY QUESTIONS AND SEE “IF” WHAT YOUR “IF” IS TRUE ?

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