Berean:  Mike

Colossians 2: 9

In French  we have translated

The word   DIVINITY( DIVINITE)

For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the DIVINITY bodily.

That’s a much better translation than “Godhead” – which is a man’s idea and is nowhere found in scripture.  I agree that God’s fullness dwells in His holy servant Jesus.  After all, Jesus is th…[Read more]

Jodi: I do not at all deny that God created all things through Jesus. I declare it and find it to be a most profound truth… God’s purpose for His creation would be executed through a man whom God calls (Isaiah 46), and it is Jesus who IS that man.

I agree with almost everything in your post.  Yes, Jesus is a man whom God foretold He’d sen…[Read more]

Lightenup: Hi Jodi,

You spend many words trying to convince us that Jesus is a man. Who is debating that here? Many of us believe that Jesus existed in another manner before he was brought forth into Mary’s womb to become that man though.

That is a great summary of what I’ve noticed as well.  Many words and scriptures to demonstrate that God for…[Read more]

Lightenup:  …the Father is God to both the Son and the church albeit indirectly to the church since He has placed Christ in the direct position to the church after the resurrection.

So the servant’s GOD has given His servant a position of prominence?  What does it mean Jehovah is the God of His servant Jesus – if Jesus and the Father together m…[Read more]

Lightenup:  For instance, you and your father have two distinct wills. If your father was perfect in wisdom and in every way, it would behoove you to do as he wills you to do and not defy his will.

Your word “behoove” illustrates my point.  I asked if one Creator/Entity can have two DIFFERENT wills.   And the logical answer is no.  If one make…[Read more]

Lightenup: You said: He chose to create another entity as His firstborn Son – not an equal clone of Himself.

Where do you get that in the Bible?

I get that idea from the countless scriptures that refer to Jesus as God’s Son. 😉  The closest example we have of a cloned person would be an identical twin.   Has there ever been a case where one ident…[Read more]

Jodi: Hi All,

Passages that Gene and I speak of are passed over time and time again and are NOT APPLIED, they are disregarded. You are far from the truth when you refuse to apply scripture with scripture.

In all fairness, you include a LOT of scriptures in virtually every post, Jodi.  😉  That’s perfectly fine, but I personally only have a li…[Read more]

Berean:  HE CAN’T HAVE ORIGINALLY BEEN A CREATURE OF GOD.

But at least 4 different scriptures say he is.  And “before all things” doesn’t change that.  Your “fullness of the Godhead” scripture is a bad translation. So is “and the Word was God”.

I thought we agreed that the Father was the only Almighty God, and that He created all things.  Maybe…[Read more]

Lightenup:  When you get stuck with the fact that the Bible said all things were made by God alone and also it says that God made all things through the Son, it really is as simple as recognizing that Jehovah God is both the God of gods (the Father) and Lord of lords (the Son) two persons.

So then…

1 Cor 8:6

for us there is but one God,…[Read more]

Lightenup: Mike, you asked:

Can one creator have two different wills?

Yes when the two are perfectly united.

That seems counterintuitive to me.  How could there be two DIFFERENT wills, yet perfectly united as one single will?  Perfectly united implies two identical wills, therefore only one total will.  But we know Jesus has a will of his own…[Read more]

Ed: Quit trying to change what Scripture says to fit your beliefs!  …Jesus did not create nor help create in any way.

I haven’t changed a single scripture of which I’m aware.  There is one God who created the heaven, the earth, the sea, and everything in them. (Acts 4)  He did that THROUGH His holy servant Jesus.  I don’t know what “thr…[Read more]

Lightenup:  <span style=”color: #ff0000;”>The only difference is one cell is the begetter cell, the other is the begotten cell.</span>

The original cell was alive before the other one ever existed, and we could consider that situation as the latter cell being created/begotten/brought forth by the former.  So the Jesus cell would still owe his v…[Read more]

Lightenup:  Mike,

I have wrestled with those passages as you have and I have an example in nature that helps me understand, I found an example in nature of how the Father and the Son can both be the same eternal age. Are you ready for that discussion?

Probably not! 😁  Just kidding… lay it on me, sister.  Just know that I’ve been working a lo…[Read more]

Lightenup:  Together they created as one creator Jehovah God. They did not act separately, they acted interdependently, united in their Holy Spirit as one spirit.

Can one creator have two different wills?

Berean: Hi Jodi

The subject is: WHO IS “THE WORD”?
Yes  or  no  ?
THE BIBLE SAYS THAT “THE WORD” IS CHRIST HIMSELF. (JOHN 1; REVELATION 19)

That was a good post, B.  What say you, Jodi?  Does the Bible say equate “the Word” with “Jesus”?

Berean: JESUS IS NOT THE ALMIGHTY GOD (FATHER)

BUT HE HAS THE DIVINE NATURE OF HIS
FATHER…   

THE WORD: “god” is also applied for thé “angels”

Psalms 8:5
For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels(elohiym), and hast crowned him with glory and honour.

You and I are not too far off.  Most erroneously claim that the Hebrew cultu…[Read more]

Berean:  In the meantime, you hide the fact that Christ is the creative agent of the Father and that through Him all things were created.

I guess “creative agent” works for me, although none of us actually know for sure what it means that God created all things through Jesus.  But we do indeed know that God created all things through Jesus, r…[Read more]

Jodi: Coll 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the CHURCH: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Hi Jodi,

What does it mean to you that Jesus was the firstborn from the dead?  What do those words actually mean?

Lightenup:  Hi Mike,

The “beginning” is a person as Revelation 3:14 shows us, and in that person (the Son), God created all things, the heaven and the earth.

Gen1:1

In the beginning (the Son), God created the heavens and the earth.

That is how I have begun to understand that, it is my opinion, a possibility.

I don’t know, Kathi.  Prove…[Read more]

Don’t forget the gyros, D.  The “instrumentation on the dashboard” (as far as attitude is concerned) works off a gyro.  A gyro is rigid in space.  They spin it up to speed on the runway so that the spinning disk is horizontal AS the wings on the attitude meter are horizontal and level.  As the plane takes off up into the air, the wings on the gau…[Read more]