Here is something that came to me as I was contemplating Phil 2 and trying to figure out exactly what Paul meant by “likeness of man.”We know that Paul believe that Jesus was very man. So, why would he say Jesus was “made in the LIKENESS of man”? This really was bothering me. Why not, Jesus was made a man?Well, it came to me. You can reject this…[Read more]

Phil 2 is indeed a “difficult” text. I can not easily say why Paul wrote the way that he did. I can say that he NEVER says Jesus was “changed” into a man. You can, too, if you are honest.I can say there are a lot of difficult text in the Bible.So, when addressing the Philippians about how THEY should think, we are to believe that Paul has now…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,23:15)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 20 2013,23:44)1) It says “no man” has seen God “except” Jesus..right? So, it is saying Jesus is that MAN who saw God!John 1:18 (English-KJV)No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.Maybe I am getting a bit too picky with…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,22:42)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 22 2013,15:22)BUT, PAUL does not include in that order, Jesus ceasing to be “in the form of God” which is what you claim!!That is true. But then again, if I existed as a New Zealander, emptied myself or gave up the right of New Zealand citizenship, to became an American, then that would well mean…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,22:34)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 22 2013,15:42)But, again, in no way does “image/form of God” imply a being itself/himself.But an image of God can only be applied to a being.I know that there was an image of Baal, but surely an image of God who is the God of the living is a living being too. Or can there be an image of God that is…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,22:27)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 22 2013,15:22)BUT, PAUL does not include in that order, Jesus ceasing to be “in the form of God” which is what you claim!!I cannot see where this means 'image'. Can you help me?Although I have no real reason for this not to mean 'image', I just can't see where it means that.Form/nature/external…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,17:15)jb,In an earlier post, you said, “Elijah will come again, but it will not be until the end.”1.  When Elijah does come, will he come with the spirit and power of Elijah?  No..He will BE Elijah!!And..Jesus is the one that said Elijah will come IN THE END to restore all things!!Quote 2.  Or more to the point, is…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,16:56)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 21 2013,21:29)Jesus, whose GOING FORTH (not origins) are from long ago.Well, I'm glad that you at least have come to know that “owlam” doesn't mean “from eternity”.  We did a thread about this a couple of years ago.  A lot of us did some research into it, and it seems that the Hebrew c…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,16:49)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 21 2013,21:22)Again, Jesus never stopped..BEING in the form of God, He ONLY did not try to be equal with God. As evidence by, He emptied Himself of His desires and took on the ROLE of a servant.You forgot a line.Actually, he emptied himself, took on the role of a servant, and was made in…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,16:40)I believe that Paul was talking about Jesus' whole life to death here on earth!!Phew!  That took a long time.So you think the whole thing reflects Jesus' existence on earth, right?  And that means that even from Paul's perspective as he wrote those words, all these things had already happened, r…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,15:38)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 21 2013,21:05)The whole point is you are saying that “he was rich” but then he “became” poor!!No.  I am saying that at a time in the past when he WAS rich, he worked side by side with the poor.Your example makes no comment whatsoever about whether John became poor later on, or remains…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,15:35)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 21 2013,21:05)I understand what you are saying completely..I just disagree!!That statement right there takes a BIG load off, jb.Now you only have to tell me WHY you think Paul would summarize the important events of Jesus' existence, putting SOME OF THEM in order, and others OUT OF ORDER.1.…[Read more]

Something else to consider.We know/believe, hopefully, that the Jewish people are God's chosen people. We know/believe that God revealed Himself to them. We know/believe that the Jews are only blinded by God to the fact that Jesus was the Messiah.BUT..that is not to say that they do not know a Messiah is coming. They just “missed it” due to being…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,09:43)In the end JB, anyone can cleverly discredit each of these verses given enough time and knowledge of other people's effort who do the same, but isn't it strange that you have to reinterpret so many verses? If Jesus did not indeed exist with the Father before the cosmos was created, why are there so many verses that…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,09:37)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 20 2013,23:22)The problem is that He did not say that He came “from God.” What He said was that He came “out from God.”There is a difference, if we choose to see it.John 8:42 (English NIV)Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and now am here. I have n…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Sep. 22 2013,09:24)Man was created in the image of God. Is this talking of the flesh or the spirit of man. After all, God is not a man, but a spirit and we know we have a spirit and that we can have fellowship with God by being connected to him spirit to spirit.Romans 8:16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,09:20)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 20 2013,06:43)The problem is..John did not “preexist” as Elijah.Jesus clearly said that John is the Elijah who was to come.  He said that Elijah did indeed come, but they did to him what they wanted.  He said these things in reference to John the Baptist.Here are those scriptures again.  …[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,09:16)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 20 2013,06:34)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 20 2013,10:02)Heb “from the past, from the days of antiquity.”Elsewhere both phrases refer to the early periods in the history of the world or of the nation of Israel. For מִקֶּדֶם (miqqedem, “from the past”) see Neh 12:46; Pss 74:12; 77:11; Isa 45:…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,08:55)Quote (jb2u @ Sep. 20 2013,06:25)“Purposely refuse”? I am not sure why you want to keep using such language with me.It's because I KNOW for a fact that you ARE able to see what I'm saying.  I KNOW for a fact that you CAN see how one could take “existing in the form of God” as something that happened BEFORE…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2013,08:33)jb, your answer to this question should end this once and for all……….In your understanding, was Paul talking about the time when Jesus existed in the image of God as a human being on earth, before becoming obedient to death on a stake?  YES or NO?Yes. I, unlike you, do not believe that Jesus “existed”…[Read more]