Quote (david @ Jan. 24 2009,15:13)Does it appear that “antichrist” is an attitudeYes, it does.  The Bible said there WERE “many antichrists” already in the first century.  Movies and stories like to portray the idea of one really bad guy, “the antichrist.”Glad we appear in agreement that “antichrist is an attitude.I have felt for years that l…[Read more]

Quote (david @ Jan. 23 2009,18:07)1 JOHN 2:18-19 (c. 98. C.E.)“Young children, it is the last hour, and, just as you have heard that antichrist is coming, even now there have come to be many antichrists; from which fact we gain the knowledge that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of o…[Read more]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 23 2009,15:15)You can argue your case for pre-existance all you like.  You cannot prove it by the scriptures.  There is no scriptures or scriptures which state outright that he pre-existed his virgin birth.You can go on believing this if you like.  So what,  I guess you discovered some big secret that God has hidden from hum…[Read more]

Quote (martian @ Jan. 23 2009,08:19)Jesus never surrendered his position as the image of God. His exact representation. He did not sell his birthright as we have.That is a foreign “word” as “the word” states “Who, being in very nature God,did not consider equality with God something to be grasped but made himself nothing taking the very nature of…[Read more]

Quote (thethinker @ Jan. 23 2009,05:08)How is the Father an example to us seeing that He did not live among us???Thinker,I will not cite scripture as I am sure you will recall their content, however, the Bible tells us much about the character of God. He is love, just, justifier, giving -etal.These are examples of His nature that we can emulate…[Read more]

Quote (martian @ Jan. 23 2009,03:51)The word for perfect here is TM which means complete or whole. One who is mature, undefiled, perfect and upright and whole.Matthew 5:48 (KJV) Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. teleios, tel'-i-os; from Greek (telos); complete (in various applications of labor,…[Read more]

Quote (david @ Jan. 22 2009,14:49)Quote A. I can see no purpose in Christ having preexistance that would help to fulfill God's plan to make us like Jesus. Does God deal in abstract knowledge without purpose?Martian, the problem with this, is you believe that it is “God's plan to make us like Jesus.”  No scripture says this.There is a scripture…[Read more]

Martian,I am not sure how you interjected your transition from “secretthings” to mystery. No where in my response do I see that I said anything about my salvation in Christ being mysterious or a mystery to me. It is a certainty not a mystery.There is no longer “mystery” about salvation in Christ- Ephes. 3:4-6 (KJV) Whereby, when ye read, ye…[Read more]

Martian,I like your Bumble Bee example. It proves that Scientists, Philosophers, and Theologians – among others – do not know Gods ways. No wonder God wrote:Deut. 29:29 (KJV) The secret things belong unto the Lord our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this…[Read more]

Martian,Q. Do you believe Jesus existed in some conscious state before his birth to mary?A. Not physical or earthly consciousness. But in a spiritual sense he apparently had existence with the father that I surely do not completely understand (John 17:5 (KJV) And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had…[Read more]

Martian,Thank you for your apology. If I have been offensive, If I have been offensive I extend the same courtesy to you.I offered the following as my present convictions:”I see Jesus as god to the extent that all power has been given to him on heaven and earth, Mt.18:20. He can do all the things God can do but only to the extent that it is the…[Read more]

Lightenup,This is excellent exegesis.”Just want to interject something here. The logos of John 1:1 “was with” God in an active voice not a passive voice. Do you understand the difference. It has to do with Greek grammar. A plan doesn't do an action but is passive and acted upon. The verb “was” here, is written in an active voice and not a…[Read more]

I simply believe what John wrote as “his” definition for “logos” without attempting to change the meaning in any other usagebiblical or otherwise.You speak of “my doctrine” which leads me to believe you think I hold Trinitarian convictions. I do not! I see Jesus as god to the extent that all power has been given to him on heaven and earth,…[Read more]

You wrote:One of the primary tennants of biblical interpretation is to line up our definitions of words with the language and then cross reference them with other times that word is used.An even more basic tenant of interpretation is that context determines meaning.Your volumes of passages do not and cannot negate what John wrote:John 1:14 (KJV)…[Read more]

Gene,you wrote:”To use John 1:1 as a proof text of Jesus being God ,you even in your mind have to change the Actual meaning of the word (WORD) to mean a person right.”Many are adamant that, word (logos) here has to mean what it generally means – speech, thought, sometnig spoken, etc.If we are trying to understand what John meant “word” to be in…[Read more]

David,Very helpful and informative. Another thought that has come to mind is that even those who meant to worship Him correctlycould have been doing so erroneously wheteher He corrected them our not. I believe we are getting somewhere! Thanks.proskuneo, pros-koo-neh'-o; from Greek 4314 (pros) and a probably derivative of Greek 2965 (kuon)…[Read more]

T8 & 94Thanks! The comments you both made added some clarity.I will value your prayers also.Seeking

David. Good analogy! Thanks.

To all who have responded to the topic,I believe the scriptures are plain that Jesus is subservient to God his father. John 14:10 (KJV) Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. (John14:10 KJV)This and many…[Read more]

Peter was clear it was Jesus that did the healing and the raising, not he -Peter “And Peter said unto him, Aeneas, Jesus Christ maketh thee whole: arise, and make thy bed. And he arose immediately.” (Acts 9:34 KJV)Peter was quite clear that he was not anything like Jesus and,for example, was not deserving of worship as Jesus was. And as…[Read more]