WorshippingJesus said:Quote Its because he did not come and their rest was in Christ! The promise was for all those in Christ Jesus!So you're saying that the statement “when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven” may be interpreted metaphorically then?  It simply means “rest IN Christ?”May non-futurists take your allegorical approach to other…[Read more]

WorshippingJesus said:Quote Context Jack, the same heavens and earth that he created in verse 10 is the same heavens and earth that will perish and be destroyed in verses 11, 12!Keith,My original post was deleted before I finished it. So I will have to be brief now. The same language in Hebrews 1:11-12 is used in Isaiah 34 to speak about the…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 07 2009,08:31)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 07 2009,06:48)Explain how sinners can live on the futurist's notion of the new earth (Is. 65:20).thinkerYeshua will not hand over the Kingdom to His Father until all rule, authority and power has been abolished, He must reign until all enemies have been put under His feet (1 Cor…[Read more]

Paul said:Quote Christ is currently not reigning from Mt Zion in Jerusalem. The inhabitants of the Earth are currently not going “up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to celebrate the Feast of Booths” (Zech 14:16). Etc etc…This prophecy was NOT Messianic and has indeed been fulfilled.thinker

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 07 2009,08:25)I haven't really been following the discussion on this general topic (why so many new threads?!?!), so I hope I'm not covering old ground.One of the problems with preterism is that you have to alegorise A LOT of eschatological scripture. So me, having a literalists bent, am never going to be comfortable with it.…[Read more]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 10 2009,07:11)Hi TT, Your pursuit of worldly understanding has not taught you WHO god is but only puffed you up and confused you it seems. Back to basics as your qualifications have no heavenly merit do they?Nick,Look who's talking. Your god “takes His crop and moves on.” I still get a kick out of that one. thinker

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 10 2009,06:43)Hi TT, You are so sure of yourself but so wrong.I am a former futurist Nick. As Keith I earned my degree at two Bible Colleges. Both were Futurist. I began to question Futurism and so I studied at an “orthodox” Preterist Seminary. It took me a total of 20 years to let every remnant of Futurism go. I could…[Read more]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 10 2009,05:54)Hi TT, Is not your crowing unseemly when you do not even know WHO God is?Yakkety yak. Anyone who is a trinitarian does not know God. Yakkety yak.thinker

Quote (Constitutionalist @ Nov. 10 2009,05:47)Ad Homien,Try putting up my whole statement, before you ad hoc and toss implications around that I may or may not have said.Your even misquoting my logic.To the cornfield with you.Please answer David's calling Messiah “my Lord.” And if I have misunderstood your logic regarding “gennao” then please…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 09 2009,17:36)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 08 2009,22:10)Paul said that those who were alive and remained AFTERWARDS would be caught up. John was caught up therefore when he died. He acquired his immortal body from heaven (2 Corinthians 4:16-5:5). His earthly body was eaten by the bugs.Wrong Jack, read Paul’s words a…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 09 2009,16:41)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 08 2009,22:10)Worshippingjesus said:Quote The scriptures clearly teach that the catching away for the saints is at his coming.John wasn't caught away in 70AD.First the dead in Christ will be raised then we which are alive will be “caught up together” with them to meet the Lord…[Read more]

WorshippingJesus said:Quote Because the clouds are the place of meeting just as a general when he calls his warriors to war their meeting place is at base.Keith,Not likely. The Greek “en” may also be rendered “through”. They go upward through the clouds to meet Him. What war? You have said that Peter teaches that when the Lord returns this earth…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 09 2009,18:08)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 09 2009,12:16)Paul clearly said that Jesus would descend from heaven and that those who are living would be “caught UP” to meet Him. Why are they “caught UP” to meet Him if He is on the earth? I see these as two seperate events with the “catching up” preceeding the second coming of…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 09 2009,17:41)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 09 2009,12:16)Hi Paul,You know that I am a staunch trinitarian so please don't misunderstand what I am about to say. The passage you have cited says that Jehovah will stand on the Mt. of Olives. In Zechariah we see that Jehovah is to be distinguished from the Messenger of Jehovah…[Read more]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 09 2009,12:48)Hi TT, Jesus spoke of his return many times . Were you not listening as you had a dogma to tend?He did not speak about a return to earth. Show me where.thinker

Worshippingjesus said:Quote The scriptures clearly teach that the catching away for the saints is at his coming.John wasn't caught away in 70AD.First the dead in Christ will be raised then we which are alive will be “caught up together” with them to meet the Lord in the air!Hi Keith,I never said that John was caught away in ad70. I said that he…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 08 2009,18:25)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 08 2009,11:20)Yes Zechariah 12-14 has been fulfilled.Thinker,In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will…[Read more]

Quote (georg @ Nov. 08 2009,22:17)thethinker does everything but think.GeorgGeorg,Disprove me then.thinker

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 08 2009,14:29)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 08 2009,08:42)To ALL:God promised Abraham that he would show mercy to his descendants for “a thousand generations.”Quote 8 He remembers His covenant forever,         The word which He commanded, for a thousand generations, 9 The covenant which He made with Abraham,         And His…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 08 2009,15:57)Quote (thethinker @ Nov. 07 2009,19:42)Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 08 2009,08:12)Hi JackQuote (thethinker @ Nov. 06 2009,22:12)There it is friends. Jesus CLEARLY said that His coming cannot be described in terms of “He is here” or “He is there.”But yet you say he and the Father are in the clouds?…[Read more]