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[Cindy]

Quote (amille @ Sep. 09 2009,18:15)

Gene: The Holy Spirit plays the role of conviction to answer your question. Without His conviction we have no remorse for our sins. Everything I wrote was not at all about “fear” but was referencing exactly what I said which is exactly what the scriptures say. It is but once to die and then the judgement and there will be a Judgement seat of Christ and a Great White Throne of Judgement. If you choose to fear the two judgements and choose to follow Christ based on that fear that is up to you Gene. What I state was what the Scriptures state. That they will take place and much sooner than you obviously realize. For your information Gene: Psalm 58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies Romans 5:12: “Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned”   We are all born with a sinful nature, thanks to our inheritence from Adam we are already born spiritually dead when we are born, conceived in our mothers womb (separated from God) but we die physically. 1 Cor. 15:22: “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive.” Death came by Adam and the resurrection can only come to mankind by believing in Jesus Christ. David says Ps.58:3 “the wicked go astray from the womb, they err from their birth speaking lies. Job 15:1 “What is man, that he could be pure? And he who is born of a woman, that he could be righteous? Job 25: How then can man be righteous before God? Or how can he be pure who is born of a woman? David explained that his conception had sin involved. Ps 51:5: “Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin my mother conceived me.” We as David have a sin nature when we are born, it is not something we learn afterwards. Our actions only express what our nature is. The sin nature is the basis for all sinful habits. We are all slaves to sin except for Jesus, who did not inherit the sin nature because he was conceived of the Holy Spirit and formed by God in the womb of a virgin. We are all natural born sinners thanks to the fall of adam all mankind fell and are naturally born sinners. Babies are born as were you and I naturally born sinners. It is speaking in the spiritual context we are spiritually born sinners by way of Adams fall and do not become so by learned behaviors because that would be a physical trained behavior. We couldn't possibly have learned physically trained behaviors by the time of birth. Because humanity fell we can't act apart from our nature. We can see the sin nature at work even in a child who is not trained in behavior as a child disobeys and is selfish naturally, they do not need to learn this. The Bible says we act on our nature. So your concept falls completely apart. Why do you choose to argue what Jesus taught. He spoke it and it is so. Period. We don't choose to sin we sin because of our flesh. We are born sinners we do not learn to sin we are already born sinners who continue to sin because we are already sinners. We are born sinners that is why we sin because it is our nature as Paul says you are not born without your nature your nature is born with you when you are born. We are not sinners because we sin, we sin because we are sinners

Hello! You call the Holy Spirit a He, so do you then believe in a trinity? If you do you believe in a false doctrine made by a man. It was Quintus Septimus Florens Tertullian that first came up with it. Unfortunately most Churches today believe in that doctrine. Rev . tells us to come out of Her my People.
Deut. 4:35 ” Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD He is God, there is none other God but one.”
Deut. ” Hear O Israel; The LORD our God, is one LORD.
1 Corinth. 8:4 ” And that there is none other God, but one.
Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all , and through all, and in us all.
And by Jesus own word He said this
John 14:28 …. for my Father is greater then I.

I know what John 1:1 says, however we have to remember that the Father is the Almighty God, while Jesus is the Mighty God. Also the word God, is a title. like our Family name is. We are the Adopted Sons of God and Jesus is Gods only begotten Son of God. Jesus is our elder Brother. We all belong to the Family of God, after our Baptism. The Holy Spirit is the Fathers Spirit. Not a person, like the trinity doctrine claims.
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (karmarie @ Sep. 09 2009,09:19)

Yes! It is a place of waiting, this I agree it to mean. Like a holding cell!

Are you kidding? All will sleep in the grave until the resurrection. Nobody has gone to Heaven and Hell is a hole in the ground or grave. Jesus went to hell for 3 nights and 3 days. He was in the grave. There is no holding place for those that die, that is so redicoulos. That is like saying that there is a purgtory, like the Catholics believe. Not IMO.
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (eveh @ Sep. 06 2009,17:50)

As I mentioned, I write gospel songs. Mandy suggested I share some of my own songs on here. So here they are. I have a couple up on singer's showcase for you to hear. I am smokedham on there. This is my darling husband Billy singing. I am blessed, he just happens to be a singer. http://www.singersshowcase.com/song.ph….t2=2327 http://www.singersshowcase.com/song.ph….t2=2264

Good, tomorrow is the day I will listen to all.
LOve Irene

[Cindy]

Kathi! Your a trip, I will listen to it tomorrow. It is to late now, I need to get some sleep.
Love you, Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (Gene @ Sep. 09 2009,11:19)

Irene …….it says that the devil that decieved them will be cast into the lake of fire it does not say anyone else will. If it is there pleas post it.  IMO peace and love to you and Georg…………………….gene

Gene! Did you not read Malachi. The wicked will be destroyed along with Satan and Anti-Christ. Who the wicked are is not revealed in Malachi.
Rev, 19:20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the
false prophet who worked signs in his presence which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshipped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone.
I also believe that those who belong now to that beast power should heed the warnings, some of God's People that God has revealed the truth to. And if you don't know what I am talking about, then go to one of the treads in Prophecy,
Also read on in Rev. 20 and 21. Unfortunately there will be humans that end up in the lake of fire. I am not predicting who will and who will not. Malachi says plenty. The false prophet is a human, and so is the beast. And all those who have the mark of the beast are humans.

Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

I am rather surpriced that no one said anything to my post. Why? Is it to hard to understand me?
This is not the first time that this has happend. It rather makes me wonder.
Oh well, all is well with my Soul.
Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (princess of the king @ Sep. 09 2009,14:52)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 09 2009,09:12) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 08 2009,17:07) Hi WJ, As you say God was fully revealed in the vessel of His Son. NH What you just said is another way of saying… God was in the flesh! WJ WJ this is where you loose me, tri not tri which ever may be, there are seven churches warned in revelations, surely, we are amoung them, denominations are labels, of which we are to only to be label as set apart. it seems we disagree on what god we serve, worship. To me, when the word was spoken of old, it was brought forth by spirit, either the spirit of Yahweh himself, or messengers sent forth. Christ was flesh, when he spoke, he spoke as a man, so the word became flesh. Christ spoke what he had seen and been taught. Christ being flesh experienced the same as I do everyday, being he walked the earth. Giving up his 'divine' right to ensure my salvation, so I cannot stand  in front of him some day and say, ' you did not know what I had to endure on earth'. with you giving the title of 'god' i cannot attain that, knowing that i have my salvation through Christ, I can attain. you set the standards to high for me to reach, i.e. the pharisees that added their own to sabbath keeping, it was where if you tore a piece of paper you were considered a sabbath breaker. I do not understand this teaching you present, nor can my spirit accept it. you tell me to accept Christ, then tell me he is god. how confusing is this when scriptures repeat constantly, how Christ spoke to the Father, prayed to him, cried out to him, did his will. in my faith, i feel unity, knowing that Christ is there to speak for me and tell the Father that she is a good and faithful servant, i will open the door for her, so she may enter the kingdom. in your faith, i don't have that, I have no one to open the door to the kingdom, i have no mediator, I have no one that will speak for me. your god is flesh. we read the same scriptures, we believe so differently. as you ask for mercy on the souls that don't believe as you do, I ask for unity and for all to come to know the truth. may supplication and favor be given to us

Hello!  I do somewhat understand you are saying to W.J.  The trinity is a man made doctrine and it is so false.  Jesus had a beginning and came forth from the Father.  He was the firstborn over all creation.
Col/ 1:15-17
Rev.3:14
in John 127:5 Jesus said this
“And now O Father glorify Me together with the glory I had with Yourself before the world was.”
John 1:1 says that the Word was God and the Word was with God.  Understanding that God is a title or Family name.  We are the Sons of God, the Family of God.  In verse 14 the Word became flesh and dwelt among men.  Jesus being the firstborn of all creation of the Family of God. Why is that so hard to understand for some.  
Jesus knew were He came from and never sinned.  He now sits at the right hand of our Heavenly Father, and He is our Mediator.  We don't need no other Sacrifice now, He is the perfect Sacrifice.  No other is needed.  In the Old Testament time, they had to make atonement for their sins, and sacrifice an Animal.  We are so blessed now.  Praise God on High and His Son Jesus Christ, forever more.
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (Lightenup @ Sep. 09 2009,03:37)

Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 08 2009,11:06) Quote (Cindy @ Sep. 08 2009,19:31) Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 08 2009,19:13) Irene said: Quote We are the adopted Sons of God, while Jesus is His literal Son by being the firstborn of all creation. Jesus is not God's literal Son. God cannot have sex. The Scripture is clear that Jesus is the Son of God BY DECREE (Psalm 2). “I will declare THE DECREE, 'You are My Son; today I have begotten you.' “ and, “Who was DECREED to be the Son of God WITH POWER…. “ (Romans 1:3) You have been following Kathi's nonsense too long. thinker Did I say that He had sex?  No you don't read well, do you.  He is the firstborn of all creation. God does not have to have sex to bring forth His Son.  He is the Almighty God and He can do anything He wants to.  And if you think He can't you are limiting God. Irene You said that Jesus is God's “literal” son. How does someone have a son literally? By having sex of course. Kathi believes that “firstborn” in reference to Jesus means that Christ came out of God's body. Is this what you mean by “firstborn?” Do you believe that Christ literally came out of God's body? Irene said: Quote He is the Almighty God and He can do anything He wants to.  And if you think He can't you are limiting God. BANG BOOM!    IF GOD CAN DO ANYTHING HE WANTS TO THEN HE CAN BECOME FLESH. RIGHT? thinker Thinker not, Did you miss a Biology class or two?  I am not going to begin to say how the process went for God to produce His very own literal offspring.  He is not human and does not need to reproduce as a human.  But I will tell you that God did design asexual reproduction as well as sexual reproduction.  Read and learn: Quote Asexual reproduction Main article: Asexual reproduction Asexual reproduction is the process by which an organism creates a genetically-similar or identical copy of itself without a contribution of genetic material from another individual. Bacteria divide asexually via binary fission; viruses take control of host cells to produce more viruses; Hydras (invertebrates of the order Hydroidea) and yeasts are able to reproduce by budding. These organisms do not have different sexes, and they are capable of “splitting” themselves into two or more individuals. Some 'asexual' species, like hydra and jellyfish, may also reproduce sexually. For instance, most plants are capable of vegetative reproduction—reproduction without seeds or spores—but can also reproduce sexually. Likewise, bacteria may exchange genetic information by conjugation. Other ways of asexual reproduction include parthogenesis, fragmentation and spore formation that involves only mitosis. Parthenogenesis (from the Greek παρθένος parthenos, “virgin”, + γένεσις genesis, “creation”) is the growth and development of embryo or seed without fertilization by a male. Parthenogenesis occurs naturally in some species, including lower plants (where it is called apomixis), invertebrates (e.g. water fleas, aphids, some bees and parasitic wasps), and vertebrates (e.g. some reptiles,[1] fish, and, very rarely, birds[2] and sharks[3]). It is sometimes also used to describe reproduction modes in hermaphroditic species which can self-fertilize. Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproduction You say this out of one side of your mouth: Quote BANG BOOM!    IF GOD CAN DO ANYTHING HE WANTS TO THEN HE CAN BECOME FLESH. RIGHT? But then you say that He can't reproduce?   If God can do anything He wants to then He can also reproduce if He wants to and doesn't need anyone's help.  It's simple for Him to produce His own offspring with His same nature. Keep it simple!

Hi Kathi! I hope too that thinker will read all, but I have not to much hope for that He will understand. When their blinded they are blinded. Just like our Son who goes to the Baptist Church. I talked to Him so many times. You can talk to them until you blue in the face, it just will not happen, that they understand. You know what, that shows me, that God has to call you first, to understand Scriptures. That is the only way I can see it.
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 09 2009,04:28)

9 Quote (Cindy @ Sep. 09 2009,03:22) Your last statement is rather ridiculous.  Jesus or Yeshua at that time was the firstborn of all creation.  I am not going to write the Scriptures again, you know what they are.  Bang Boom, no God did not become Jesus.  Whether begotten or brought forth by the Father in my eyes does not really matter that much, just that Jesus did exist before His Birth as a human, that is important.  If God can or what He does is also not the question here.  There is no trinity and I and others can prove that.  While you and those who do believe in it cannot.  For your well being I would study that some more rather then just believe in it. Math 15:9 And in vain do they worship me, teaching the doctrine the commandments of men. Start reading from verse 3 With much Love and Peace Irene Irene, So you really didn't mean it when you said that God is not limited. You were not sincere when you said that God can do anything He wants. Your idea of “firsrtborn” is false. Jesus was the “firstborn” BY DECREE. It means only that He is supreme. That's all. Jacob was not literally the firstborn. He became firstborn because God ordained it by His decree. Therefore, Jacob became the HEAD of the covenantal family. Firstborn does not mean “first of every creature.” It means “HEAD of every creature.” Paul made it clear by saying that all things were created “FOR” Him and that He is “supreme” and the “HEAD of the body.” “FIRSTBORN” REFERS TO HIS RANK OVER ALL CREATION AND NOT HIS ORIGIN IN TIME. You once had the truth and then you trashed it. Now you don't go to church at all but spend your time online speaking a lot of nonsense! thinker

Yes, I did mean what I said that God can do anything He wants to. However it also states that God can not look on Sin. And right now all Humans are sinning. That is why God would not come to earth. Only when all have been subject to Jesus, will He give the Kingdom back to God and God will come down with the New Jerusalem. As far as firstborn of all creation, you are interpreting it. By Jesus own words He said this in John 17:5 And now O Father glorify Me together with Yourself with the glory I had with You before the world was.
Jesus was with the Father before the World was.

Also John 1:1 In beginning there was the Word and the Word was God and the Word was with God.
verse 14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. You are so mixed up, in your beliefs, I have to shake my head. Firstborn is what it says. It is the first Baby as a Human that is born. O.K. thinker why are you getting personal with me. You have no respect whatsoever. Shame on you. I am 71 years old and I don't need that. When you can't understand something you get nasty, very nice of you. Have I ever done that to you???
All that I hope you will do is get away from the trinity so Math. 15: 9 that you will not do that again. That is Scripture that You should take to heart. The Catholic Church and their Daughters will be sorry one of these days. I meant it well with you that maybe, just maybe you would see, but I guess its not going to happen yet. But one day you will, my friend,
Good luck, Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (Gene @ Sep. 09 2009,03:01)

TJ…………..”For every mans work shall be tried, they which have built with gold and silver and precious stones will recieve a reward, they which have built with wood, hay or stubble , will suffer loss, because the fire will burn it up, (BUT) they shall be saved (YET) as by FIRE”. Fire in scripture is symbolic for intense Judgment, and like GOLD refined by fire and the dross floats up and is scraped of. So it is with man intense Judgments cause the wrong to surface and can by removed fro the man. Our concept of Judgment as some kind of condemnation is in error in fact without judgement non of us can be made right, (JUDGMENT BEGIN AT THE HOUSE OF GOD). Now concerning the fiery trial that has tried you as if some strange thing has happened unto you, Here Peter is referring to this fiery trial.  Fire is symbolic for (INTENSE JUDGMENTS)  As Jodi said GOD is (NOT) Willing that any PARISH and is quite capable of Saving ALL His creation. IMO peace and love ……………………………gene

That Gene is wrong. Not all will be saved. Even though God would want all to be saved, and all will have the opportunity to, however after the Millenium Satan will be loosed again and Millions will follow Him right into the Lake of Fire along with Anti-Christ. All will be destroyed.
There is a Scripture in Malachi 4:1-3
Those that will be saved will trample on the Ashes of those that were burned up in the Lake of Fire.
Also this earth is being kept for the destruction of the Wicked.
2 Peter 3:7 But the heavens and the earth which now exit kept in store, by the same word, reserved for fire until the day of judgement perdition of ungodly men.
They will be destroyed. And will be ashes under the feet of the righteous. Scriptures in Malachi.
They will not be saved as Scripture tells you.
I would be interested to see where the Scriptures are to prove your understanding of what you said?
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (karmarie @ Aug. 29 2009,22:05)

Its confusing sometimes.

Why don't you ask us a question, if you are confused about something. I will be glad to try to answer any Question you have. Also my Husband has a good understanding of the Scriptures and if I ask Him something He always knows. So you have every opportunity to do so.
Peace and Love Irene

[Cindy]

Your last statement is rather ridiculous. Jesus or Yeshua at that time was the firstborn of all creation. I am not going to write the Scriptures again, you know what they are. Bang Boom, no God did not become Jesus. Whether begotten or brought forth by the Father in my eyes does not really matter that much, just that Jesus did exist before His Birth as a human, that is important. If God can or what He does is also not the question here. There is no trinity and I and others can prove that. While you and those who do believe in it cannot. For your well being I would study that some more rather then just believe in it.
Math 15:9 And in vain do they worship me, teaching the doctrine the commandments of men.
Start reading from verse 3
With much Love and Peace Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 08 2009,19:13)

Irene said: Quote We are the adopted Sons of God, while Jesus is His literal Son by being the firstborn of all creation. Jesus is not God's literal Son. God cannot have sex. The Scripture is clear that Jesus is the Son of God BY DECREE (Psalm 2). “I will declare THE DECREE, 'You are My Son; today I have begotten you.' “ and, “Who was DECREED to be the Son of God WITH POWER…. “ (Romans 1:3) You have been following Kathi's nonsense too long. thinker

Did I say that He had sex? No you don't read well, do you. He is the firstborn of all creation. God does not have to have sex to bring forth His Son. He is the Almighty God and He can do anything He wants to. And if you think He can't you are limiting God.
Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 08 2009,18:59)

carnal nature Quote (eveh @ Sep. 08 2009,17:11) Jodi, Here is where you and I separate on our beliefs. I believe as you do that Jesus is the Son of God and God is the Heavenly Father. However I do not believe what you have written here. I can't find a scripture for such a belief. “But YHWH will have mercy ON THEIR guilt, as He has had mercy on others, and He will embrace them like He has everyone else.” However, I find many, many scriptures that say things like, “Today is the day of salvation”.  If you do not believe that Jesus is your Saviour, you will die in your sins. Since it is given men, “Once to die, and after that the judgement”…when you die, unrepentive, you die in your sins. Hi Eveh, May I ask you just what you think the judgment is? Ro 11:32 For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all. 1Ti 4:10 For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe. 1 Timothy 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 5 For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time, 2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. Eze 37:14 I will put My Spirit in you, and you shall live, and I will place you in your own land. Then you shall know that I, the Lord, have spoken it and performed it,” says the Lord.' Whatever YHWH speaks it shall BE DONE! YHWH says He is not willing that ANY should perish but ALL come to repentance, therefore it shall be done! Shame ON ALL you, please don't count God as being slack towards His promise!! Certainly don't tell YHWH that He cannot accomplish His own promises! No one will perish after the second resurrection, death and carnal nature will be destroyed in the lake of fire, resulting in no more sinners.

Jodi! I don't quit understand what you are trying to say, with your last sentence. Are you saying that all will be saved? The carnal nature of a person is thrown into the Lake of Fire and not the Person? Is that what you are saying? If so, you are wrong. After the Millenium Satan will be loosed again and many will follow Him and will end up in the Lake of Fire along with Anti-Christ and Satan. All will be destroyed.
Read Malachi 4:1-3

[Cindy]

Quote (Gene @ Sep. 08 2009,14:34)

TO all………The first fruits apply to the first to be harvested from the earth of humanity, but as in nature the biggest crop is the fall harvest by far. That is when the rest of man kind will be saved.  Did Jesus really say that every person the was not in Him would be cut out from him and cast into the fire, OR did he say that every branch in (HIM) that did not produce fruit the FATHER takes away and destroys,That (HE) would produce more fruit,  was He referencing the FATHERS personal work of Perfecting  Jesus himself , saying every branch in (me) that does not produce fruit, The father removes. We may be assuming that is talking about others when he may have been talking about  Jesus HIMSELF. With that said we are though considered branches and Jesus is the true vine,  And unless we do abide in Christ were removing ourselves from Him.  WE must also remember the the LIFE of the Complete Vine is the water that flows through it and symbolic that is representative of the Spirit and it is the life of the whole vine and it branches, all are given life by the SPIRIT that WATER it. IMO. peace and love to you all……………….gene

Gene!  Are we not under a New Covenant?  IMO we are.
Luke 22:20
…” This cup is the new covenant in My Blood, which is shed for you.”
By His Blood that we are under, we are saved, but also in
Ephesians 2:8 ” For by grace you have been saved, through faith, and that not of yourself, it is a gift from God.
verse 9 not of works lest anyone should boast.
verse 10For we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.  
The question is will we be alive when Christ will come.  Will we survive the tribulation period.  In Revelation 7:14  
And I said to Him” Sir you know ” These are the ones who came out of the great tribulation, and have washed there robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
verse 15  ” Therefore they are before the Throne of God and serve Him day and night in His temple.  And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.
IMO the first fruits are the Saints that have died for Christ in the from the Apostles on, except John, until the third century who died for Christ.  They were persecuted and killed, first by the Romans and later by the Catholic Church.
If you will read on in Revelation 7:16-17
IMO we will have to wait and see.  I do know that I will die before that time arrives, since I am 71 years old.  But who knows if God will keep me alive or not.  I though when I was diagnosed with Lupus, I only had 15-20 years left, and it is now 31 years since I was diagnosed.  Time will tell.
With much Love and Peace Irene

[Cindy]

Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 08 2009,07:55)

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 17 2009,15:37) Trinitarians believe that the Holy Spirit is a separate “being” of the triune God.  I suggest this was not the message of scriptures.  It is never mentioned of the Spirit as being the “third person of the trinity” anywhere in scriptures.   As Michael L. Brown says in Answering Jewish Objections to Jesus,” p. 53: Quote …Is the “Spirit of God” the same as “God”? Yes and no.  The Spirit clearly has personality, since the Holy Spirit instructs the people of Israel and can be grieved or angered. Yet the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God-i.e., God's very Spirit, he is both giving himself as well as giving of himself.  The key is always this: God touches us, teaches us, interacts with us, and empowers us by his Spirit. With that understanding it is very easy to understand why the “Holy Spirit” is not mentioned along with the Father in these following verses since references speaking of the person of the Father would assume that the innermost part of the Father to obviously be included in His person. See below and you will find plenty of scriptures that you would think would mention all “three persons” of the trinity but doesn't: Matt 24:36 36 “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone. NASU John 5:23 23 so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him. NASU John 5:26 26 “For just as the Father has life in Himself, even so He gave to the Son also to have life in Himself; NASU John 6:40 40 “For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.” NASU John 6:46 46 “Not that anyone has seen the Father, except the One who is from God; He has seen the Father. NASU 1 John 2:23-24 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also. 24 As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. NASU 2 John 3 3 Grace, mercy and peace will be with us, from God the Father and from Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love. NASU 2 John 9 9 Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son. NASU Peace and love, Kathi Kathi, How do you figure that statements which do not mention the Holy Spirit imply that He is not a distinct person? This is not a valid inference. Jesus said that he who blasphemes the Son may be forgiven and he who blasphemes the Holy Spirit may not be forgiven. There is no mention of the Father being blasphemed in Jesus' statement. And what about the scriptures which speak of the fellowship of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit? And what about the fact that Jesus said that He would send the Spirit who would be under His subjection? The Spirit was “sent.” Did the Father send Himself or did Jesus send the Father? The Spirit would speak what He hears from Jesus (John 16). Was the Father under Jesus? As usual you pit scripture against itself. Have you considered that the absence of one or the other in any given statement may be for the sake of emphasis or to serve a particular point? thinker

thinker

Why did Jesus say, he “has” to go to the Father? if he didn't go the Father would not send the Holy Spirit? Only after Jesus died on the cross for the sins of the apostles, and ours, and only after he presented his sacrifice to the Father, after his ascension, and only after the Father excepted his sacrifice, were the apostles cleansed from their sins, and God could then send them his Holy Spirit.
God does not dwell in sinful men, (Is. 59:2) only after we accept Jesus sacrifice for our sins, can the Father forgive us, and dwell in us.
If the Holy Spirit was a person, what is his name?
If the Holy Spirit was a person, why did Paul never thank him? Rom. 1:8, 1 Cor. 1:4, Phil. 1:3, Col. 1:3, 1 Thes. 1:2; is not the Holy Spirit credited with teaching us all things? would he not deserve some thanks too?
The apostle John says, “if we abide in the doctrine of Christ we have BOTH, the Father and the Son”; 2 John 9, should we not have all three?
I don't know of a scripture where Paul speaks of the Holy Spirit as of a person.

Georg

[Cindy]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 08 2009,14:58)

Hi Jodi, So you too think that all men will be raised in the FIRST resurrection and that there will be a time of revision for those who did not get the message before they died and then all will believe and things will be hunky dory? WWCOG cobblers. It is appointed to men once to die and then the judgement. Take your chance while you live and breathe

Nick

You don't even know what “judgment” means.
What does it mean, “judgment must begin at the house (church) of God”? (1 Peter 4:17).
In your opinion sentence follows judgment; without a trial?
The saints were first taught by the apostles, and then they had to make up their mind whether to believe it, and obey it, or not. I am sure that not every one the apostles spoke to, became followers of Jesus.
You have it in your mind that you are right, you know what? so did the Pharisees.

Georg

[Cindy]

Of course it is just a parable; how would Lazarus have made it into heaven before Jesus died, and paid for his sins? providing heaven is where he would have gone.

Georg

[Cindy]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 08 2009,15:40)

Hi, I am surprized how this nonbiblical idea remains popular

Nick

You are such an enlightened individual.

Why not reply with a “TOPICAL”?

Georg

[Cindy]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Sep. 06 2009,18:20)

Quote (Cindy @ Sep. 06 2009,17:35) I'm doing fine Mandy, thank you. 1914 was the end of the seven times punishing period for the Israelites, and God had to make good on his promise to bring them back into their own land; he cleared the way for them to return by means of the first WW. He had the British drive out the Muslims out of Palestine. Georg Hi Georg, I don't think I'll ever be smart enough or have the insight to figure stuff like this out.  It's interesting though. Love, Mandy

Mandy

God warned the Israelites that if they would continue to disobey him, he would punish them 7 times more, Lev. 26:18.
A time is a year of 360 days, God's punishment is a year for a day, 7 x 360 years = 2520 years.
This punishment began with the invasion by the Babylonians in 606 B C, and ended in 1914 A D.
Ezekiel prophesied they would loose their crown, Ez. 21:26, a crown is a symbol of self ruler-ship. Then in v. 27 he prophesied they would be ruled over by three other kingdoms in succession, the Media-Persia, the Greek, and last the Romans. In v. 27 Ezekiel speaks of, overturn “it”, and “it” shall be no more; this “it”, meaning “nation”, ceased to exist after 70 AD.
But God had promised to bring them back after they served their sentence, Jer. 30:3, and he did; I already explained how.

Georg

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