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Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,17:31) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 26 2009,08:30) Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,16:19) Huh? Did I ever say anything about Paul not meaning Jesus as Christ in 1 Corinthians 10?
Thank you! You just admitted that Jesus was the one following Moses and the Children of Israel in the wilderness!And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and “that Rock was Christ.
WJ
Christ is the man of the seed of David!Abraham knew of the coming Jesus so did David and other prophets, they FOLLOWED that which YHWH revealed to them of the COMING CHRIST.
JodiThats not what the text says, your statement is loaded with inference.
And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and “that Rock was Christ“. 1 Cor 10:4
The word “Christ” in the NT is always referring to Jesus!
Strong's G5547 – Christos = Christ = “anointed”
1) Christ was the Messiah, the Son of God
2) anointed
The word “Christ” (Christos) was the Greek term for the “Anointed One” or “The Messiah”, and not the “anointing” or Holy Spirit.
“569 TIMES THE WORD “CHRIST” IS USED IN THE NT AND IN EVERY CASE IT IS REFERRING TO JESUS”.
The Apostle Paul, under the influence of the Holy Spirit USED THE WORD “CHRIST” (CHRISTOS) “57” OTHER TIMES IN THE EPISTLE AND ALL OF THEM REFER TO JESUS, yet you want to tell us that Paul meant something or someone else besides Jesus in 1 Cor 10:4.
WJ
Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,17:40) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 26 2009,08:32) Jodi Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,16:19) You take scripture WJ, and forget that CHRIST was foreknown, that he existed in the beginning with the Father as a plan.
A plan does not follow them in the wilderness!WJ
Christ is in us in the FORM of knowledge and belief, it is a work in our mind. This spirit of Christ was in Abraham and in David. Christ had not yet existed and he had not yet been raised from the dead, however the truth of this to come already bared fruit in the hearts of the prophets!!!CAN you understand that WJ? Truth is truth. It does not matter WHEN it OCCURS, what matters is what it produces in the knowledge of it.
People BELIEVED in Christ BEFORE YHWH's promises were fulfilled, and people believed in them after.
Jodiswprgv'pr!
Prove to me why Paul means something different in 1 Cor 10:4!
WJ
WJ
Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,17:40) CAN you understand that WJ? Truth is truth. It does not matter WHEN it OCCURS, what matters is what it produces in the knowledge of it. Do you believe this statement? For if you did then you would believe Pauls words!
WJ
Jodi
Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 25 2009,17:40) People BELIEVED in Christ BEFORE YHWH's promises were fulfilled, and people believed in them after.
But Paul knew and had seen Christ, and he ascribes 1 Cor 10:4 to Jesus!Do you know more than the eyewitness who was inspired to write those words. Why didn't he say “that Rock which followed them was forordained”?
He didn't did he? His words are plain and simple…
And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and “that Rock was Christ“. 1 Cor 10:4
It agrees with the other 57 times it was translated in 1 Corinthians! Why do you guys ignore this point?
But of course it must be that way for it destroys your “Unitarian” position that not only was Jesus preexistant, but also is YHWH!
WJ
WJ…………..Do you see the WORD JESUS there, NO, Just the word CHRISTOS, Which means the ANOINTING , If It had said Jesus Christ that would be different, Then it would have meant Jesus the Anointed. But it Just Says the Christos, that means the Anointing. Forcing the text to support you Trinitarian teachings is not Truth WJ. Jesus was not even born when Israel sojourned in the wilderness, if he was what was His name . Moses had the Christos on him as well as the seventy elders and Joshuah, and all the prophets as well as angles of God. GOD is the SPIRIT that Anoints Us , we who have that anointing in us are also (Christos) that is the anointed of GOD. Christos is (NOT) a Person it is what is in the Person. WJ please don't tell me you really don't understand that brother.
gene
WJ…………Jesus is the Christos of GOD, but not the only Christos of GOD, One of Many , There are many Christos but only one Jesus who was the foretold Christos (anointed) one. Many places in scripture should read Jesus (the) Christ, but translators took the Definite article out of the texts , they did that also with the word GOD many places should read (the) GOD a definite being but trinitarian translators took the definite article out of the original text to shore up there false beliefs of a unity of GOD'S the TRINITY. Check it out in an original Greek transliterations.
peace and love……………………….gene
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 26 2009,18:40) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 25 2009,16:58) Hi WJ,
Jesus was not given that name till born of Mary.
The Spirit of Christ which is of God was in the prophets and with Moses.The Lord is the Spirit.
NHAnathema!
Paul said “Christ was that Rock” therefore claiming by revelation that he is YHWH!
WJ
WJ……..Christos is the ROCK, because it is GOD. GOD was (IN) Jesus (HOW) By the CHRISTOS or ANOINTING . SO simple why can't you people understand it. CHRISTOS IS A DESCRIPTOR WORD WHICH DESCRIBES GOD'S ANOINTING OR SPIRIT, THIS WAS ON MOSES AND THE SEVENTY ELDERS OF ISREAL AND ON THE ANGLES WHO WERE DEALING WITH ISREAL IN THE WILDERNESS, IT HAS NO ATTACHMENT TO JESUS AS REGARDS TO THE WILDERNESS OR BEFORE HIS BERTH. The Christos (IS) GOD, who was (IN) Jesus so yes it is the (ROCK) it was this (ROCK) the revealed to Peter who Jesus was and It is this (ROCK) that Jesus would use to build The Church. WJ why can't you understand these things.peace and love………………gene
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 27 2009,02:33) WJ…………Jesus is the Christos of GOD, but not the only Christos of GOD, One of Many , There are many Christos but only one Jesus who was the foretold Christos (anointed) one. Many places in scripture should read Jesus (the) Christ, but translators took the Definite article out of the texts , they did that also with the word GOD many places should read (the) GOD a definite being but trinitarian translators took the definite article out of the original text to shore up there false beliefs of a unity of GOD'S the TRINITY. Check it out in an original Greek transliterations. peace and love……………………….gene
Now that's a funny statement Gene. Jesus said that the sign of the end was that people would say that there are “christs.” How many TRUE Christ's are there Gene?thinker
Gene said to WJ:
Quote WJ……..Christos is the ROCK, because it is GOD. TO WJ:
LOOK WHAT GENE SAID. HE SAID THE ROCK IS GOD. THERE YOU HAVE IT!
thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 26 2009,16:38) Gene said to WJ: Quote WJ……..Christos is the ROCK, because it is GOD. TO WJ:
LOOK WHAT GENE SAID. HE SAID THE ROCK IS GOD. THERE YOU HAVE IT!
thinker
JackTrue and in every case the word “Christos” is used in the NT it is reffering to Jesus!
Thanks Gene for admitting Jesus is God the Rock, for truly he is!
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 27 2009,08:44) Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 26 2009,16:38) Gene said to WJ: Quote WJ……..Christos is the ROCK, because it is GOD. TO WJ:
LOOK WHAT GENE SAID. HE SAID THE ROCK IS GOD. THERE YOU HAVE IT!
thinker
JackTrue and in every case the word “Christos” is used in the NT it is reffering to Jesus!
Thanks Gene for admitting Jesus is God the Rock, for truly he is!
WJ
WJ,
I think Gene meant to attribute deity to an actual rock. He would bow to a hunk of mineral before he would bow to Jesus.thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 26 2009,16:35) Quote (Gene @ Sep. 27 2009,02:33) WJ…………Jesus is the Christos of GOD, but not the only Christos of GOD, One of Many , There are many Christos but only one Jesus who was the foretold Christos (anointed) one. Many places in scripture should read Jesus (the) Christ, but translators took the Definite article out of the texts , they did that also with the word GOD many places should read (the) GOD a definite being but trinitarian translators took the definite article out of the original text to shore up there false beliefs of a unity of GOD'S the TRINITY. Check it out in an original Greek transliterations. peace and love……………………….gene
Now that's a funny statement Gene. Jesus said that the sign of the end was that people would say that there are “christs.” How many TRUE Christ's are there Gene?thinker
JackTrue, Gene just admitted that there is more than one “Christos”, “Anointed One”, “Messiah”.
There is only One Messiah Gene!
WJ
1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.
After further thinking on the above scripture the following scripture came to me.
Hebrews 11:24 By faith Moses, when he became of age, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter, 25 choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin, 26 esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward. 27 By faith he forsook Egypt , not fearing the wrath of the king; for he endured as seeing Him who is invisible. 28 By faith he kept the Passover and the sprinkling of blood, lest he who destroyed the firstborn should touch them. 29 By faith they passed through the Red Sea as by dry land, whereas the Egyptians, attempting to do so, were drowned. 30 By faith the walls of Jericho fell down after they were encircled for seven days.………..39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, 40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
The Christ Paul was referring to was the MAN who died on the cross, not some pre-existent god son.
WJ………..O really, tell me was Mosses anointed , were the seventy elders anointed , were angles anointed also, Look up in the original Greek and discover that Jesus is call (THE) Christos or Anointed , where does it say He is the (ONLY ONE) that has or is anointed. YOU and thinker have made Jesus (YOUR GOD) not the Unique SON of GOD.
2Sam 12:…….> And Nathan said to David, thou art the Man. Thus saith the LORD GOD of ISREAL, I (ANOINTED) thee King over Israel.
Isa 45:1 Thus saith the LORD to his (ANOINTED) to Cyrus, whose right hand i have holden.
Zec 4:14….> then said he, these are the two (ANOINTED) ONES.
Luk 4:18..> The Spirit of the LORD is (UPON) Me, (BECAUSE HE HAS ANOINTED ME)
ACT 10:38…> How GOD (ANOINTED) Jesus of Nazareth (WITH the HOLY SPIRIT) and with POWER> That is HOW GOD was with HIM.
If Jesus was and He was Anointed what was He anointed with. (HOLY SPIRIT) from GOD. Now tell me is this SPIRIT any Different in US who have it then in Jesus, (Let this mind be (in) you that was in Jesus (Christos) the Anointed . Same anointing same Mind. The Spirit of GOD is interchangeable with the Anointing of GOD. There is (ONLY) ONE GOD and HE is the ANOINTER of HIS SPIRIT.
2 Cor 1:21….> Now he which establishes us with you in Christ (the anointed) and Has (ANOINTED) us is GOD.
It is really unbelievable how little you understand WJ and Thinker. IMO
gene
Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 28 2009,05:07) 1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness. After further thinking on the above scripture the following scripture came to me.
Hebrews 11:24 By faith Moses, when he became of age, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter, 25 choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin, 26 esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward. 27 By faith he forsook Egypt , not fearing the wrath of the king; for he endured as seeing Him who is invisible. 28 By faith he kept the Passover and the sprinkling of blood, lest he who destroyed the firstborn should touch them. 29 By faith they passed through the Red Sea as by dry land, whereas the Egyptians, attempting to do so, were drowned. 30 By faith the walls of Jericho fell down after they were encircled for seven days.………..39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, 40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
The Christ Paul was referring to was the MAN who died on the cross, not some pre-existent god son.
- So the christ who was born 2000 years later followed the children of Israel and Moses and yet he didn't actually exist.
- “Before Abraham, I am”, doesn't mean that he existed before Abraham.
- And when it says that he is the root and offspring of David, it means that he is the offspring, but not the root.
It doesn't make sense to me.
Looks more like a bunch of excuses than a non-biased and correct rendering of scripture.Quote (Gene @ Sep. 27 2009,14:06) WJ………..O really, tell me was Mosses anointed , were the seventy elders anointed , were angles anointed also, Look up in the original Greek and discover that Jesus is call (THE) Christos or Anointed , where does it say He is the (ONLY ONE) that has or is anointed. YOU and thinker have made Jesus (YOUR GOD) not the Unique SON of GOD. 2Sam 12:…….> And Nathan said to David, thou art the Man. Thus saith the LORD GOD of ISREAL, I (ANOINTED) thee King over Israel.
Isa 45:1 Thus saith the LORD to his (ANOINTED) to Cyrus, whose right hand i have holden.
Zec 4:14….> then said he, these are the two (ANOINTED) ONES.
Luk 4:18..> The Spirit of the LORD is (UPON) Me, (BECAUSE HE HAS ANOINTED ME)
ACT 10:38…> How GOD (ANOINTED) Jesus of Nazareth (WITH the HOLY SPIRIT) and with POWER> That is HOW GOD was with HIM.
If Jesus was and He was Anointed what was He anointed with. (HOLY SPIRIT) from GOD. Now tell me is this SPIRIT any Different in US who have it then in Jesus, (Let this mind be (in) you that was in Jesus (Christos) the Anointed . Same anointing same Mind. The Spirit of GOD is interchangeable with the Anointing of GOD. There is (ONLY) ONE GOD and HE is the ANOINTER of HIS SPIRIT.
2 Cor 1:21….> Now he which establishes us with you in Christ (the anointed) and Has (ANOINTED) us is GOD.
It is really unbelievable how little you understand WJ and Thinker. IMO
gene
GeneYou have not given “One scripture” where the word Christ “Christos” is reffering to any other than Jesus!
Just one Gene!
Is or was there any other “Messiah” Gene?
That is what the word means! “The Anointed One”, not a anointed one!
You accuse us of not knowing anything, yet you deny this scriptural fact and that is because you have bought into the false doctrine of the Unitarians that do not believe that Jesus is the “Root” and the “Offpsring” of David and in fact with his own words said that before Abraham was he existed and that he came down from heaven.
Clear words that you have closed your ears to.
John said…
This is the one I meant when I said, ‘A man who comes after me has surpassed me “because he was before me.’“ John 1:30
WJ
Quote (Jodi Lee @ Sep. 27 2009,13:07) 1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I do not want you to be unaware that all our fathers were under the cloud, all passed through the sea, 2 all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, 3 all ate the same spiritual food, 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them, and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with most of them God was not well pleased, for their bodies were scattered in the wilderness. After further thinking on the above scripture the following scripture came to me.
Hebrews 11:24 By faith Moses, when he became of age, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter, 25 choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin, 26 esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward. 27 By faith he forsook Egypt , not fearing the wrath of the king; for he endured as seeing Him who is invisible. 28 By faith he kept the Passover and the sprinkling of blood, lest he who destroyed the firstborn should touch them. 29 By faith they passed through the Red Sea as by dry land, whereas the Egyptians, attempting to do so, were drowned. 30 By faith the walls of Jericho fell down after they were encircled for seven days.………..39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, 40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
The Christ Paul was referring to was the MAN who died on the cross, not some pre-existent god son.
JodiThe scripture you quote proves again that Jesus existed for Moses esteemed Christ (Jesus) riches greater which he (Jesus) had at that time and Moses looked to as his reward!
esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward.
WJ
Hi all
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 27 2009,14:06) 2 Cor 1:21….> Now he which establishes us with you in Christ (the anointed) and Has (ANOINTED) us is GOD.
The words “Christ” and “Anointed” are two different words (Christos and chriō) but Gene is implying that they mean the same thing!Anathema!
There is only “One Messiah”, “Anointed One”!
WJ
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