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Im a person with many questions.
i can be more direct if nessary.Quote The Bible was put together by the Catholic Church are you saying they had the discretion to leave in or take out whatever they chose? You said that it was The Word of God
Before that, the bible was made of the Torah, and than the poetic books, and also historical. and minor and and mayjor prophets. This is the OT. Even Job, was a hidden book for a long time, and only for private reading from scribes and pharasis, yet many Time Jesus qoute abotu Job and such things.
What am i saying? the catholics did not technically the ones responsible for putting the bible togethor.
The gospels after that were sent out, and the epistles of the diciples, majorly Paul, and the final book revelations.
Here is the point, that the diciples nor the writers of the old testament were the same person, they were different writers, that means that of course they are not the only intelligent people who know how to write, This forum is an example of that. We all write here, is there no truth in this site at all? of course there is, but the Catholics are ones that accepted everything. in other words, they really didnt take the time to consider what they had was holy or not. Martin Luther did. if anything they prayed, fasted to put all those books togethor.Personal question: did you like the parable i wrote? was it understandable?
Quote Nay,-whoever submits His whole self to Allah and is a doer of good,- He will get his reward with his Lord; on such shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #112)
How can we submit our selfs if God is too holy and we are unworthy. If God is perfect, submitting ourselves, is doing what exactly? following the law? so that means you fail one time, your not perfect? So… explain.Quote This is the Book; in it is guidance sure, without doubt, to those who fear Allah.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #2)
They are on (true) guidance, from their Lord, and it is these who will prosper.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #5)
They are those on whom (Descend) blessings from Allah, and Mercy, and they are the ones that receive guidance.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #157)
So your saying that we are guided to become perfect?Quote Why would I not quote the Bible? We have sent thee inspiration, as We sent it to Noah and the Messengers after him: we sent inspiration to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob and the Tribes, to Jesus, Job, Jonah, Aaron, and solomon, and to David We gave the psalms.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #163)
Should I really ignore the Scriptures that were sent down before the Quran?
It is He Who sent down to thee (step by step), in truth, the Book, confirming what went before it; and He sent down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus).
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #3)
Should you ignore your flesh after you been transformed?
i thought all of that was included in the Quran.
The step by step intructions, ended with John, so your saying 600 years later it needs more intruction based on what? So God didnt expect this? Its Gods Word, You think he cant stop us from corrupting it, and keeping it holy, that means if we continue to search for the Pebble we will find it.Quote The word of God is not the book it's in but the meaning of the word of God itself is Holy
In other words brother, You want to pick and pluck Bible verses that you believe are true, to validate the Quran. it doesnt work that way. One rotten apple can affect the whole apple tree.Quote Actually I am using the knowledge in The Quran to validate the Bible
Than the Bible is not Corrupt, even though The Quran says it is. For example: I have the Murderers knife, and a Victem. To prove that this Knife is connected to this Murderer of this Victem i need something to validate the connection, that is blood of the victems in the Knife that the murderer owns. I cant use someone elses blood. or my blood and just throw it there it there, becuase thats “Tampered” evidence. In other words brother, to validate the Bible it wuold need to validate itself with the evidence thats within its own words. The Quran cannot validate the Bible Automatically because it says it is corrupted. In other words, its tampered, it cannot be trusted. In the Court of Law, tampered evidence cannot be used to make reasonable claims, because it has been tampered. its illegal. Its thrown away. Especially if it stays tampered. The Quran can not untamper the evidence thats not legit. If anything, The fact that it takes you two perpectives from different books to understand an event is harmful. Becuaes your taking a tampered book and the untampered and making conclusions from both? this is unwise.The Quran cannot validate the Bible because within its own text says is corrupted, Note you mentioned Catholic bible, and conflicting verses
This doesnt make sense brother. You can believe whatever you like, but to hold this has truth, is dangerous.If anything i should be defending the bible, its you who are defending it more than me. It you continue to say the The Quran validates it, nope, it cannot. You said yourself the Quran is the holy scripture sent from heaven through an Angel to a Prophet to correct scriptures. So the Quran should hold to be true and not the Bible in your beliefs.
I have never heard a Muslim validating the Quran or viseversa by using other texts. Its contradicting.
Quote wouldn't you?
No i wouldnt, Would you Prove God, by showing people the Devil. Would you prove trees by showing them dust?
You learn nothing by showing the contradicting force, You learn of what something is, by it manifesting its features in your life. I know what Tree is because i have seen a Tree. I know what who my Mother is because i met her, know her. I wasnt shown who my Mother was, by looking at other moms, or by looking at my Father. Your point makes no sense.Quote O ye People of the Book! believe in what We have (now) revealed, confirming what was (already) with you, before We change the face and fame of some (of you) beyond all recognition, and turn them hindwards, or curse them as We cursed the Sabbath-breakers, for the decision of Allah Must be carried out.
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #47)And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #46)To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If Allah had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to Allah. it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute;
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #48)Tell me what you think these verses are saying. Becuase your last verse contradicts the whole Quran.
Allah Cant force people to become one unless they all submitted or killed them out. If there is Truth, there is no disputes. Its because we believe in differnet truths, thats why we dispute.Quote I'm not trying to disproves the Bible at all, I am simply showing that the Quran says that man has polluted the word of God and The Quran needs to be read to understand the what has been corrupted
Complete Contradiction to what you have written before. and your own verse that you posted confirms this. How can an Ant like Man corrupt the Word of God? you think to highly of men, they are as fragel as the flowers we step on. So your picking and choosing using the Quran as your holy glasses to see what part of th bible is corrupted or not. God doesnt work that way. He proves that with the Flood, he made. If he wanted to start over, he will wipe out what was before compelelty. God only uses to prove holyness by using holyness. He uses evil, or whats corrupted to crush it with holyness to prove holyness. This happen to egypt. He is not dependant on Man, Man is dependant of God. How is it possible that God cannot keep track of his own word, until 600 years later he finally figured it out?doesnt make sense. Your comment is very contradicting. Put the shoe in the other foot, and think how i would think. Think about what your saying as if you never heard it before, and think how this really doesnt make any logical sense. God is simple, not complicated.
Quote Thus doth Allah Make clear His Signs to you: In order that ye may understand.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #242)Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #256)
God is not a religion. Than if Truth was so clear, than there wouldnt be a problem (as you say) with the bible. We all are evil. we break Gods law everyday. just with a thought is enough to dissapoint God. how can you reject evil, if all you do is evil. Just thinking differntly from God is evil. Because God is Perfect good. Sometimes man believes what he is doing is Good, but to God its evil because Man doesnt know the outcome may become evil. This is called Good intentions. Anything seperate from Goods Perfect will is evil. the fact that we thinking differntly and that we are imperfect, means all that we know and do, is seperate from God unless we let him lead us.Quote The Bible is not the problem, Corruption of the bible is the problem
Than dont use it to validate claims. but wait the Quran tells you too and tells you that its corrupted. thats a clear contradiction.Much love brother, Again with much Love and Respect.
Questions and comments you havent answerd or refuted.
I said:Quote The bible verses you mentoined had nothing to do with Christ crucifiction. you expect me to believe what the angel gaberial gossiped about to Mohammed from 600 years later, than John who was there?
that doesnt make sense to me.Quote Than your Quran has contradicted itself. Why do i say this. 600 years later it says to study corrupted text? thats just makes no sense. In school when something is corrupted its tossed in the trash. for example, we dont teach people that Sigmond Freud theory that we are all sexual beast is truth. do we? we do not, we actually ignore the very idea that its truth, we dont read from it. we know abuot it, like how a muslim knows the Christian position, but doestn mean your own truth is based on reading other material thats lies. Quote I started watching this individual named Khalid Yasin,
Which i find him very hilarious
here is one of his videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jvq_yigisnA&feature=related
Why i say he is funny, is because In one video he speaks really American ghetto and with a perfect American accent, and than out of no where he has a accent in another video!Quote God hates corruption, he hates sin. How can God tolerate such a thing. He would remove it from existance.
Obeservation: Your using 2 Timonthy 3:16 to validate curropted scripture? so your using this verse to validate scripture from the Quran? Why do muslims use the bible as referense when they say its corrupted lol. its not 15 nor 17 its 16. look what 15 says.
And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
this contradicts your statment. remember c
onsider Context.Quote lol I find that funny, because that detailed explantion of that verse is detailed in the gospel of John. Lets just say as my proffesor once said that Mark was in a hurry. They say that mark was the very boy who ranaway naked when Jesus was arrested, and that he was the one that was rejected by Paul and than finaly accepted. Actually its not, because it agrees with Johns gospel. If your going to provide a claim, i have to see it as well. I can tell you that at night i see aliens, doesnt mean anything until you meet them. Please show me your source so that we can validate your claim. Do you realize what the bible is? Do you understand that the Bible has MANY Writers. Yet they all agree in the same personality of God. They give referense to eachother. They agree in so many aspects yet many never met eachother. yet agree? Quote In court according to Testimony and evidence, what holds more one persons testimony or many?
Which one would the Perfect God who makes perfect Choices choose to establish his word.Quote In other words. If we are going to prove what bible holds to be more true. Lets be legal about this… lets see, The people who actualy wrote testimonies about there one on one encounter with God or the one person who was told about such expierences through an Angel? Quote Im going to re-respond to this point you made. the Quran is more like the outline of the bible. They agree in common foundation yet the Quran leaves out alot of information, and its stories are not exactly like the bibles. here is one example, The bible says which son that Abraham was going to scrafise, yet the Quran does not state anything concerning which one. The Quran differs in stories, left out some stories, denys God as the father, and Jesus as the Son of God, and his very crucifiction. thats just the gist of it. Quote Your running away from the orginal observation i made. literally. Lol i didnt even metion Jesus in that observation… so to me i see your response as random. but either way ill continue. You have to understand what I believe because if you are going to argue that, than here is anothher scripture for you. John 8:58 (Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
So If i believe that Jesus is God, than Moses speaking to God, is as if Speaking to Jesus. one and the same. And if Jesus is connected to the very God, who he talked like, walked like, and never sined, he did only what The father did. What would you do if you met someone who acts exactly alike me?
in every way… the same talk, walk, choices, If i raise my right hand so does he. He walk the same direction and even think alike.Quote Notice how Gabriel speaks he speaks in command to God and does not give orders. He speaks of God.
The angel in the bush however is different, first of all he is the Angel of the Lord/Angel of Jehovah, second he spoke in first person, and spoke for himself as I am That I am, and than that Moses reacted in fear to See God.
Big difference here.
When i say that they do not act in authority, as in they do not act as if they have all the authority or majesty to speak as if they are God. in first person.Quote that wasnt my point, the way you used the verse was out of context, you were basicly saying that the same way john was delivered a book, it was the same that Muhammed was.
Im telin you, that you didnt not consider the context.Quote So your saying that a Prophest word can be wrong?
Matthew 10:22-24
do you know who was being persecuted? most usualy relate this to Revelations when the people run from the False idol or whatever. Who was not going over the cities of Israel?
Matthew 16:27-28
its safer to assume that Jesus believed He was God, and that he had a Kingdom, so that the one who has defeated death, can say that Death where is thy sting.Paul Washer-“To make all contradicting statements True is the death of Truth”
Observations:
1.) Uncorrupted Quran cannot be validated by the Bible because its corrupted according to Qurans Text.
2.) Uncorrupted Quran cannot be validated by the Bible because its not corrupted when the Quran says it is.
3.) Uncorrupted Quran can be validated by the bible because it completes the bible which is corrupted, so the uncorrupted and the corrupt come togthor in adultry.
4.) Uncorrupted Quran validates the Bible that is corrupted, Yet to uphold Truth, Quran says to study both books as Allah provides Truth to the disputer. To study both books, what was sent before and the guardian of it.Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 30 2010,16:12) Quote Before that, the bible was made of the Torah, and than the poetic books, and also historical. and minor and and mayjor prophets. This is the OT. Even Job, was a hidden book for a long time, and only for private reading from scribes and pharasis, yet many Time Jesus qoute abotu Job and such things.
What am i saying? the catholics did not technically the ones responsible for putting the bible togethor.
The gospels after that were sent out, and the epistles of the diciples, majorly Paul, and the final book revelations.
Here is the point, that the diciples nor the writers of the old testament were the same person, they were different writers, that means that of course they are not the only intelligent people who know how to write, This forum is an example of that. We all write here, is there no truth in this site at all? of course there is, but the Catholics are ones that accepted everything. in other words, they really didnt take the time to consider what they had was holy or not. Martin Luther did. if anything they prayed, fasted to put all those books togethor.Once again you seem to not realize that we are talking about a collection of books called the Bible, you have admitted that some whole one collection while others observe a different collection therefore there is no unified collection.
Quote Personal question: did you like the parable i wrote? was it understandable? It was very understandable but what you are in-fact admitting is that the collection is not unifiable and therefore cannot be equally viewed as correct one of the versions must be corrupt you seem to believe it is the Catholic version. By the way there are several canons of the Bible/collection.
Quote How can we submit our selfs if God is too holy and we are unworthy. If God is perfect, submitting ourselves, is doing what exactly? following the law? so that means you fail one time, your not perfect? So… explain. I find your point of view incorrect Man is most worthy as we were made as such although most are ungrateful.
O mankind! there hath come to you a direction from your Lord and a healing for the (diseases) in your hearts,- and for those who believe, a guidance and a Mercy.
( سورة يونس , Yunus, Chapter #10, Verse #57)Quote Should you ignore your flesh after you been transformed?
i thought all of that was included in the Quran.
The step by step intructions, ended with John, so your saying 600 years later it needs more intruction based on what? So God didnt expect this? Its Gods Word, You think he cant stop us from corrupting it, and keeping it holy, that means if we continue to search for the Pebble we will find it.If it had been thy Lord's will, they would all have believed,- all who are on earth! wilt thou then compel mankind, against their will, to believe!
( سورة يونس , Yunus, Chapter #10, Verse #99)Quote Than the Bible is not Corrupt, even though The Quran says it is. For example: I have the Murderers knife, and a Victem. To prove that this Knife is connected to this Murderer of this Victem i need something to validate the connection, that is blood of the victems in the Knife that the murderer owns. I cant use someone elses blood. or my blood and just throw it there it there, becuase thats “Tampered” evidence. In other words brother, to validate the Bible it wuold need to validate itself with the evidence thats within its own words. The Quran cannot validate the Bible Automatically because it says it is corrupted. In other words, its tampered, it cannot be trusted. In the Court of Law, tampered evidence cannot be used to make reasonable claims, because it has been tampered. its illegal. Its thrown away. Especially if it stays tampered. The Quran can not untamper the evidence thats not legit. If anything, The fact that it takes you two perpectives from different books to understand an event is harmful. Becuaes your taking a tampered book and the untampered and making conclusions from both? this is unwise. Actually it's a progressive revelation not two perspectives and hence corruption can be known as the Original message giver who is God is testifying what and who is corrupted and God Knows best what mankind does.
Verily We have revealed the Book to thee in Truth, for (instructing) mankind. He, then, that receives guidance benefits his own soul: but he that strays injures his own soul. Nor art thou set over them to dispose of their affairs.
( سورة الزمر , Az-Zumar, Chapter #39, Verse #41)Quote The Quran cannot validate the Bible because within its own text says is corrupted, Note you mentioned Catholic bible, and conflicting verses
This doesnt make sense brother. You can believe whatever you like, but to hold this has truth, is dangerous.If anything i should be defending the bible, its you who are defending it more than me. It you continue to say the The Quran validates it, nope, it cannot. You said yourself the Quran is the holy scripture sent from heaven through an Angel to a Prophet to correct scriptures. So the Quran should hold to be true and not the Bible in your beliefs.
I have never heard a Muslim validating the Quran or viseversa by using other texts. Its contradicting.
It is that corruption that is made clear so that the entire truth can be clear. The corruption is here a little there a little but over all it has implications and si the Quran corrects what needs to be corrected.
But the transgressors changed the word from that which had been given them; so We sent on the transgressors a plague from heaven, for that they infringed (Our command) repeatedly.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #59)But because of their breach of their covenant, We cursed them, and made their hearts grow hard; they change the words from their (right) places and forget a good part of the message that was sent them, nor wilt thou cease to find them- barring a few – ever bent on (new) deceits: but forgive them, and overlook (their misdeeds): for Allah loveth those who are kind.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #13)O Messenger. let not those grieve thee, who race each other i
nto unbelief: (whether it be) among those who say “We believe” with their lips but whose hearts have no faith; or it be among the Jews,- men who will listen to any lie,- will listen even to others who have never so much as come to thee. They change the words from their (right) times and places: they say, “If ye are given this, take it, but if not, beware!” If any one's trial is intended by Allah, thou hast no authority in the least for him against Allah. For such – it is not Allah.s will to purify their hearts. For them there is disgrace in this world, and in the Hereafter a heavy punishment.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #41)Quote No i wouldnt, Would you Prove God, by showing people the Devil. Would you prove trees by showing them dust?
You learn nothing by showing the contradicting force, You learn of what something is, by it manifesting its features in your life. I know what Tree is because i have seen a Tree. I know what who my Mother is because i met her, know her. I wasnt shown who my Mother was, by looking at other moms, or by looking at my Father. Your point makes no sense.Aren't you saying that my point makes no sense based on the premise of what I am saying is correct i.e. through comparison and contrast?
I shall answer your questions later, out of time for now. God Bless!
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 30 2010,16:12)
Genesis 18:21-23 (Young's Literal Translation)21I go down now, and see whether according to its cry which is coming unto Me they have done completely — and if not — I know;'
22and the men turn from thence, and go towards Sodom; and Abraham is yet standing before Jehovah.
23And Abraham draweth nigh and saith, `Dost Thou also consume righteous with wicked?
Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjoQuote (katjo @ May 31 2010,15:36) Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjo
Even Satan uses the Bible for his own means.
Satan used the bible against Jesus, and Jesus used scriptures to defend himself.
The scripture is a sword. it can destory you.The problem is the brothers state of mind. He studies what he believes is corrupted. in a cognitive sense, he will not be able to really open his mind, unless you can accept the idea that he could be wrong, and consider the point that Maybe the bible is truth, not by our preception but by Gods.
The Quran ruins this, by letting people study other books, but psychological putting the defense system of the believer that the others are corrupted. This a great, genuis tactic to create a doubt in everything, yet using what is doubted to defend yourself.
Brother, this is all psychology.
The problem is not God or belief, its our wicked Heart and the barriers of our mind.
(I hope that my post wasnt random)
either way, your right
brother,
It shows that you care!many blessing!
Much love,
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2010,16:33) Quote (katjo @ May 31 2010,15:36) Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjo
Even Satan uses the Bible for his own means.
Satan used the bible against Jesus, and Jesus used scriptures to defend himself.
The scripture is a sword. it can destory you.The problem is the brothers state of mind. He studies what he believes is corrupted. in a cognitive sense, he will not be able to really open his mind, unless you can accept the idea that he could be wrong, and consider the point that Maybe the bible is truth, not by our preception but by Gods.
The Quran ruins this, by letting people study other books, but psychological putting the defense system of the believer that the others are corrupted. This a great, genuis tactic to create a doubt in everything, yet using what is doubted to defend yourself.
Brother, this is all psychology.
The problem is not God or belief, its our wicked Heart and the barriers of our mind.
(I hope that my post wasnt random)
either way, your right
brother,
It shows that you care!many blessing!
Much love,
4.) Uncorrupted Quran validates the Bible that is corrupted, Yet to uphold Truth, Quran says to study both books as Allah provides Truth to the disputer. To study both books, what was sent before and the guardian of it.Quote (katjo @ May 31 2010,15:36) Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjo
Jehovah is Elohim which is ALLAH there is no mistake about it.If you only read the King James Version then you are admitting that other versions are corrupted and yet there are many canons that came before the KJV so are you saying that it took 1611 years for the Bible to be “Infallible” in the KJV?
Then on top of it you call Jehovah, Jesus and yet Jesus refers to God in the NT in Aramaic the lanfuage he spoke and you know how he said “God” Alaha.
Scholars believe that Jesus spoke mostly Aramaic, although sometimes
he spoke Hebrew and he might have spoken Greek on some occasions.
If Jesus spoke Aramaic, then he referred to God using basically the
same word that is used in Arabic.Also make no mistake about it in the KJV Arabic translation middle eastern Christians and Jews call God “ALLAH” and have used that name before Muhammad spoke of the Quran.
Jesus is not Jehovah and you should know that.
Quote (bodhitharta @ May 31 2010,17:04) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2010,16:33) Quote (katjo @ May 31 2010,15:36) Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjo
Even Satan uses the Bible for his own means.
Satan used the bible against Jesus, and Jesus used scriptures to defend himself.
The scripture is a sword. it can destory you.The problem is the brothers state of mind. He studies what he believes is corrupted. in a cognitive sense, he will not be able to really open his mind, unless you can accept the idea that he could be wrong, and consider the point that Maybe the bible is truth, not by our preception but by Gods.
The Quran ruins this, by letting people study other books, but psychological putting the defense system of the believer that the others are corrupted. This a great, genuis tactic to create a doubt in everything, yet using what is doubted to defend yourself.
Brother, this is all psychology.
The problem is not God or belief, its our wicked Heart and the barriers of our mind.
(I hope that my post wasnt random)
either way, your right
brother,
It shows that you care!many blessing!
Much love,
4.) Uncorrupted Quran validates the Bible that is corrupted, Yet to uphold Truth, Quran says to study both books as Allah provides Truth to the disputer. To study both books, what was sent before and the guardian of it.
Your point for qouteing my observation brother?NO, Im not saying you can only read the King James, there is other good translations BUT when you compare they have to have the same meaning even tho the wording is different. Dont you beleive you have to have Jesus to be saved? He is the Lord! And without Him your nothing. He is even told of all over the Old Testament, before He even came into the world. (scripture says; He came unto HIS OWN) Until you fully understand who Jesus is, your going to be confused. He is who is going to judge us ,He is going to set up hIS new kingdom, He is our Savior, He is who we will spend eternity with! Dont you want to know Him? The bible tells us there is only one Lord, and the Lord is God. Every knee will bow to Jesus one day.All the dead will rise to face judgement, even hitler will bow to Jesus! ALL! 1Corinth 12;3 tells us that no man can say Jesus is lord without the Holy Ghost, Acts 2;21 tells us everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved(jesus) Acts 2;36 says; JESUS IS BOTH LORD AND CHRIST, and DEUT. 4;35 TELLS US; THE LORD(jESUS) IS GOD!! very clear, and when you figure that out and start to understand it you will have a whole differnt out look on God!
God bless you…
KatjoQuote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2010,19:40) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 31 2010,17:04) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2010,16:33) Quote (katjo @ May 31 2010,15:36) Hello, May i just say; There is no God but Jehovah. And when you study the true bible and just watch all the prophecy being ful-filled thats in the bible,you know that you know who God is. No doubt in your mind! You dont want to question who God really is… you know. and you will fill his presence, and no one will deceive you.You have got to have Jesus or you have nothing. He is your Savior.! You have to have Him to receive the Holy spirit and than you will understand what is truth. You are not searching to find out if your God is really the true God..YOU KNOW! iF YOU COULD READ THE KING jAMES WITH NOTHING ELSE YOU WOULD GET A WHOLE DIFFERENT FEW OF GOD.
God Bless..
katjo
Even Satan uses the Bible for his own means.
Satan used the bible against Jesus, and Jesus used scriptures to defend himself.
The scripture is a sword. it can destory you.The problem is the brothers state of mind. He studies what he believes is corrupted. in a cognitive sense, he will not be able to really open his mind, unless you can accept the idea that he could be wrong, and consider the point that Maybe the bible is truth, not by our preception but by Gods.
The Quran ruins this, by letting people study other books, but psychological putting the defense system of the believer that the others are corrupted. This a great, genuis tactic to create a doubt in everything, yet using what is doubted to defend yourself.
Brother, this is all psychology.
The problem is not God or belief, its our wicked Heart and the barriers of our mind.
(I hope that my post wasnt random)
either way, your right
brother,
It shows that you care!many blessing!
Much love,
4.) Uncorrupted Quran validates the Bible that is corrupted, Yet to uphold Truth, Quran says to study both books as Allah provides Truth to the disputer. To study both books, what was sent before and the guardian of it.
Your point for qouteing my observation brother?
Your observation is correctQuote (katjo @ June 01 2010,00:11) NO, Im not saying you can only read the King James, there is other good translations BUT when you compare they have to have the same meaning even tho the wording is different. Dont you beleive you have to have Jesus to be saved? He is the Lord! And without Him your nothing. He is even told of all over the Old Testament, before He even came into the world. (scripture says; He came unto HIS OWN) Until you fully understand who Jesus is, your going to be confused. He is who is going to judge us ,He is going to set up hIS new kingdom, He is our Savior, He is who we will spend eternity with! Dont you want to know Him? The bible tells us there is only one Lord, and the Lord is God. Every knee will bow to Jesus one day.All the dead will rise to face judgement, even hitler will bow to Jesus! ALL! 1Corinth 12;3 tells us that no man can say Jesus is lord without the Holy Ghost, Acts 2;21 tells us everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved(jesus) Acts 2;36 says; JESUS IS BOTH LORD AND CHRIST, and DEUT. 4;35 TELLS US; THE LORD(jESUS) IS GOD!! very clear, and when you figure that out and start to understand it you will have a whole differnt out look on God!
God bless you…
Katjo
First of all we should love all of those whom God sent to give us light and not only Jesus. I Love and honour Jesus and believe he came out from God as he said he did but he is not God and you shouldn't insert his name where it was not:Deuteronomy 4:35 (King James Version)
35Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him.
The Name Jesus is not mentioned in the OLD Testament at all his name was told to Mary by Gabriel.
If Jesus was God he would not have said:
“While I am in the world, I am the Light of the world.”
John 9:4-6However God Almighty is the Father of Lights:
Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shifting shadow.
James 1:16-18And once again Acts 2:21 is not referring to Jesus at all:
Acts 2:21 (King James Version)
21And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
If it was pertaining to Jesus Jesus would not have said:
“Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.
Matthew 7:20-22In otherwords not everyone who calls on Jesus will be saved according to Jesus.
You have gret love for Jesus and that's wonderful now simply let him be the way, the truth and the life that leads you to The Father who is THE TRUE and ONLY GOD
Hi Bod.
Iv been reading my bible this week and all the letters of Paul which I never got before. Now I do.
And rereading the others.All through the writtings it repeats the crucifixion and death of Jesus the raising from the dead the naming of him as the only begotten Son of God,
The Quran doesnt say that but it says the complete opposite.
You need to choose one, either this or the Quran, because they dont agree.
You cant use them both. Because then you hold one as superior over the other and in your case its the Quran. They both say different things.
God doesnt change.
jesus Christ is Lord, and the only name which you can be saved by; One Lord and the Lord is God. Acts 2 is referring to Jesus. Any one who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Matthew 7;20 when it says not everyone who says to me Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven is because of there wickedness. Read on down to verse 23. Acts 2;36 tells you He is Lord and Christ. Remember scripture says He came unto HIS OWN.(He became one of us) but did not sin? could not sin. He was teaching us how God is, and ascended back to were He was in the beginning. He is king of Kings and Lord of Lords. i didnt say His name was in the Old Testament but the O. Testament tells everything He will do and go threw before He even came to the earth.Hebrews tells us jesus is the author and finisher of our faith. John 9 is simply saying He is the light of the world, while He is here, but He promised when he ascended back to heaven, to send us a helper. the” Holy Spirit”
He is our light now.(Holy Spirit is also referred as He) katjokarmarie, I totally agree with that post!
katjo
Quote (karmarie @ June 01 2010,11:37) Hi Bod. Iv been reading my bible this week and all the letters of Paul which I never got before. Now I do.
And rereading the others.All through the writtings it repeats the crucifixion and death of Jesus the raising from the dead the naming of him as the only begotten Son of God,
The Quran doesnt say that but it says the complete opposite.
You need to choose one, either this or the Quran, because they dont agree.
You cant use them both. Because then you hold one as superior over the other and in your case its the Quran. They both say different things.
God doesnt change.
But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
1 Corinthians 15:19-21Wasn't Lazarus raised from the dead before Christ? Wouldn't he be the firstfruit or even much longer before that when many others were raised from the dead including a man raised to life from the dead bones of Elisha.
also the Quran says that they did in-fact think they killed Christ Jesus but
That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.
Mark 4:11-13That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #157)If you read and understand them in order you will understand. Otherwise you need not read the OT either just believe in the NT. There is no prophecy of a Saviour being Crucified the Jews were expecting a conquering hero that would save them and there is no mention of a Christ coming and then returning to be a conquering hero therefore you can clearly see that the NT reveals things that are not in the OT likewise the Quran does this same thing again.
Even Pauls ministry is foreign to the Gospels which proclaim clearly by Jesus:
These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Matthew 10:4-6God doesn't need to change to reveal things you didn't know or understand, you need to change not God.
Quote (katjo @ June 01 2010,12:10) jesus Christ is Lord, and the only name which you can be saved by; One Lord and the Lord is God. Acts 2 is referring to Jesus. Any one who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Matthew 7;20 when it says not everyone who says to me Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven is because of there wickedness. Read on down to verse 23. Acts 2;36 tells you He is Lord and Christ. Remember scripture says He came unto HIS OWN.(He became one of us) but did not sin? could not sin. He was teaching us how God is, and ascended back to were He was in the beginning. He is king of Kings and Lord of Lords. i didnt say His name was in the Old Testament but the O. Testament tells everything He will do and go threw before He even came to the earth.Hebrews tells us jesus is the author and finisher of our faith. John 9 is simply saying He is the light of the world, while He is here, but He promised when he ascended back to heaven, to send us a helper. the” Holy Spirit”
He is our light now.(Holy Spirit is also referred as He) katjo
Artaxerxes, king of kings, unto Ezra the priest, a scribe of the law of the God of heaven, perfect peace, and at such a time.
Ezra 7:11-13For thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will bring upon Tyrus Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, a king of kings, from the north, with horses, and with chariots, and with horsemen, and companies, and much people.
Ezekiel 26:6-8Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.
Daniel 2:36-38So you should worship these other King of Kings as they were also Lords. You don't understand the scriptures and the usage of phrases in Hebrew.
If Jesus was God why would he be inheriting the throne of DAVID?
He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
Luke 1:31-33Bod, firstly, Jesus became a light to the Gentiles,
Second You need to make a choice, theres no further revelations in the Quran.
God doesnt change.
So God cant be the Author of a book which says he has a son and his son was killed and rose from the dead and gather a whole world of followers and then say “No that was wrong.”
Why would God lie?
God is not a man that he can lie.
The bible is a book which is everywhere all around the world the most read book ever in history, things in it prophecies come true just as it says, why would you not trust in that? Do you think that God wont protect his word? They found old scriptures in caves which matched perfectly.
Quote (karmarie @ June 01 2010,12:44) Bod, firstly, Jesus became a light to the Gentiles, Second You need to make a choice, theres no further revelations in the Quran.
God doesnt change.
So God cant be the Author of a book which says he has a son and his son was killed and rose from the dead and gather a whole world of followers and then say “No that was wrong.”
Why would God lie?
God is not a man that he can lie.
The bible is a book which is everywhere all around the world the most read book ever in history, things in it prophecies come true just as it says, why would you not trust in that? Do you think that God wont protect his word? They found old scriptures in caves which matched perfectly.
Where does God say his Son was killed?Bod, it is late here but I havesome things I want to post for you, I will post tomorrow, ALOT that speaks of Jesus in the Old Testament! I would like your comment after you read it.
God Bless..
katjoQuote (katjo @ June 01 2010,00:11) NO, Im not saying you can only read the King James, there is other good translations BUT when you compare they have to have the same meaning even tho the wording is different. Dont you beleive you have to have Jesus to be saved? He is the Lord! And without Him your nothing. He is even told of all over the Old Testament, before He even came into the world. (scripture says; He came unto HIS OWN) Until you fully understand who Jesus is, your going to be confused. He is who is going to judge us ,He is going to set up hIS new kingdom, He is our Savior, He is who we will spend eternity with! Dont you want to know Him? The bible tells us there is only one Lord, and the Lord is God. Every knee will bow to Jesus one day.All the dead will rise to face judgement, even hitler will bow to Jesus! ALL! 1Corinth 12;3 tells us that no man can say Jesus is lord without the Holy Ghost, Acts 2;21 tells us everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved(jesus) Acts 2;36 says; JESUS IS BOTH LORD AND CHRIST, and DEUT. 4;35 TELLS US; THE LORD(jESUS) IS GOD!! very clear, and when you figure that out and start to understand it you will have a whole differnt out look on God!
God bless you…
Katjo
People reject Jesus for who he is,Romans 1
says they knew God, and they still rejected him.
Its about choosing God. most people know about Jesus, but the true gospel, is the change Christ made in you,Christ in you,
Much love,
dont be deceived, im in full agreement with you, im just extending.
than again idk who this comment is met for me, or bod.
clarify?
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