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Quote (Devolution @ Jan. 22 2013,01:00) And one more point to consider Ed, Israel did not give birth to Jesus……….
Micah 5
2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clans of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times.”Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:08) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) You seem to understand that the woman is Gods teachings(doctrine).
I understand that is what you are claiming.Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) This was Gods woman taught to israel.
So the righteous ways God tried to teach the Israelites were “God's woman”?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus born out of mother Zion.
Then Jesus took over for a short while,and he gave it over to men to teach;this is the daughter of Zion.
Now I'm lost again. Are you saying that the mother BECAME her own daughter?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus will come back to take over,and he will bring her to perfection,
in his 1000yr reign.This will be his treasure,his bride,the work of his hand.
So Jesus will bring his own “mother” to perfection, and then marry her?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) When christ has gone up to his Father,the woman(daughter of Zion) has been persecuted by Paul,and God helped the woman and hides her.This is when they had to hide behind locked doors here and there.
This part kind of makes sense – as ONE possible understanding. But the doctrine of Christians was not persecuted for only 3 and a half years. The persecution goes on to this day.
Hi Mike,Good scrutiny of Wakeup's doctrine.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgI'm just trying to understand, Ed. Some of what they're saying makes sense to me, and other parts don't seem to add up.
Nor did Devo do a good job, IMO, of rebutting your understanding that the woman is Israel. For example, he said it couldn't be Israel, because Israel has never had to flee from Israel. But where is the scripture that says this woman flees FROM ISRAEL?
Not to mention that Israel has had to flee many times in their history. In fact, Jesus warned them to flee when they saw the abomination that causes desolation in the holy place, right? Or am I getting my scriptures mixed up?
(No offense, Devo. I'm just saying it like I see it. Remember that I am on milk when it comes to many scriptural things – so who cares what I think anyway?
)Hi Mike,
You got it right but, it is not a 3½ year period, instead it is 1,260 day/years.
(the correct cypher to use is a day for a year as spelled out in Ezekiel 4:6)
And the abominations of desolation “IS” what she is fleeing from.1948 – 1260 = 688 AD – the year construction of the dome of the rock began.
That is when Israel had to flee to the wilderness of the nations till 1948,
when she was born as a nation in one day as Prophesied in Isa 68:8.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgHi Mike,
Watch the video at this link, it's about the four horseman of Rev.6:2-8. (Link)
It should help to you to better understand fulfilled prophecy.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,08:25) Hi Mike, You got it right but, it is not a 3½ year period, instead it is 1,260 day/years.
(the correct cypher to use is a day for a year as spelled out in Ezekiel 4:6)
And the abominations of desolation “IS” what she is fleeing from.1948 – 1260 = 688 AD – the year construction of the dome of the rock began.
That is when Israel had to flee to the wilderness of the nations till 1948,
when she was born as a nation in one day as Prophesied in Isa 68:8.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
edjwhat all your speculation have to do with anything???
Titus after 70 ad, flatten the areA of the temple and palaces and built temples to Roman gods on it ,this is way before the domE of Islam,
Titus did a job so good it is hard today to figure out were the temple really was exactly even the walls so call standing are suspicious of origin,
it seems to me that you are still very Jewish practising Judaism
with the flesh in view ,
Israel nation in 70 ad was officially rejected by God for her last sin ,and there has been no remains to bring back any of the past worship ,it is gone forever and now IT IS THE SON OF GOD AND THE GOSPEL THAT REMAINS AND BY WITCH ALL MEN WILL BE JUDGED ,
THE REAL TEMPLE IS NOW IN HEAVEN ,THE REAL SACRIFICES ARE NOW DONE WITH THE HEART,THE REAL BOND IS WITH GOD IN LOVE AND TRUTH ,
IF NOT YOU WILL BE USELESS AND TERMINATED
Hi Ed:
You say:
Quote And the abominations of desolation “IS” what she is fleeing from The abomination of desolation ushers in the great tribulation, and Israel is fleeing from this tribulation.
Quote Mat 24:15 ¶ When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) Mat 24:16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Mat 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
Mat 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
Mat 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
Mat 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,12:54) I'm just trying to understand, Ed. Some of what they're saying makes sense to me, and other parts don't seem to add up. Nor did Devo do a good job, IMO, of rebutting your understanding that the woman is Israel. For example, he said it couldn't be Israel, because Israel has never had to flee from Israel. But where is the scripture that says this woman flees FROM ISRAEL?
Not to mention that Israel has had to flee many times in their history. In fact, Jesus warned them to flee when they saw the abomination that causes desolation in the holy place, right? Or am I getting my scriptures mixed up?
(No offense, Devo. I'm just saying it like I see it. Remember that I am on milk when it comes to many scriptural things – so who cares what I think anyway?
)
MIke B.Remember israel the followers of the apostles, had to flee from Paul, working for the scribes and pharisees.
Israel the physical, and we also are israel the spiritual.
Israel the physical and the spiritual had to flee from the romans,when attacked.In the last days both israel, has to flee, when the false prophet will come in and occupy israel for 3/half yrs,
rev.11. and will set up the abomination of desolation.
His temple in jerusalem.The physical israel is israel today.
The spiritual israel are the christians.wakeup.
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,10:12) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:08) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) You seem to understand that the woman is Gods teachings(doctrine).
I understand that is what you are claiming.Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) This was Gods woman taught to israel.
So the righteous ways God tried to teach the Israelites were “God's woman”?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus born out of mother Zion.
Then Jesus took over for a short while,and he gave it over to men to teach;this is the daughter of Zion.
Now I'm lost again. Are you saying that the mother BECAME her own daughter?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus will come back to take over,and he will bring her to perfection,
in his 1000yr reign.This will be his treasure,his bride,the work of his hand.
So Jesus will bring his own “mother” to perfection, and then marry her?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) When christ has gone up to his Father,the woman(daughter of Zion) has been persecuted by Paul,and God helped the woman and hides her.This is when they had to hide behind locked doors here and there.
This part kind of makes sense – as ONE possible understanding. But the doctrine of Christians was not persecuted for only 3 and a half years. The persecution goes on to this day.
Hi Mike,Good scrutiny of Wakeup's doctrine.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.You see it as wakeups doctrine,but its what the sriptures teach,and no one can refute the scriptures teachings up to now and never will.
wakeup.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:16) Quote (Devolution @ Jan. 22 2013,01:00) And one more point to consider Ed, Israel did not give birth to Jesus……….
Micah 5
2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clans of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times.”
MIke B.This is so true; he is from of old,and he will truly rule in his 1000yr kingdom.
He is not ruling now; for he is stting next to his Father,
waiting untill his Father has put all his enemies under his feet.EdJ. teaches that he has been ruling now for 2000yrs.
This is a great error,because the kingdom is in chaos.
Because he is not ruling now.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 27 2013,14:55) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,13:25) Hi Mike, You got it right but, it is not a 3½ year period, instead it is 1,260 day/years.
(the correct cypher to use is a day for a year as spelled out in Ezekiel 4:6)
And the abominations of desolation “IS” what she is fleeing from.1948 – 1260 = 688 AD – the year construction of the dome of the rock began.
That is when Israel had to flee to the wilderness of the nations till 1948,
when she was born as a nation in one day as Prophesied in Isa 68:8.God bless
Ed J
MIke B.In the last days both israel, has to flee, when the false prophet will come in and occupy israel for 3/half yrs,
rev.11. and will set up the abomination of desolation.
His temple in jerusalem.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,You're describing something as a future event, which I
have clearly illustrated (in my quote) to be historical fact.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:16) Quote (Devolution @ Jan. 22 2013,01:00) And one more point to consider Ed, Israel did not give birth to Jesus……….
Micah 5
2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clans of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times.”
Mike,Who was Christs Father, a physical man from Israel or God Himself?
Yes the physical Jesus came out of physical Israel through Mary's womb…but how did Jesus come to be IN Mary's womb to start with?
The Word CAME DOWN FROM HEAVEN and manifested in the flesh remember?
Physical Israel was never in heaven Mike.
This is what we are speaking of…His ORIGINS…heavenly.Cheers.
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,15:06) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 27 2013,14:55) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,13:25) Hi Mike, You got it right but, it is not a 3½ year period, instead it is 1,260 day/years.
(the correct cypher to use is a day for a year as spelled out in Ezekiel 4:6)
And the abominations of desolation “IS” what she is fleeing from.1948 – 1260 = 688 AD – the year construction of the dome of the rock began.
That is when Israel had to flee to the wilderness of the nations till 1948,
when she was born as a nation in one day as Prophesied in Isa 68:8.God bless
Ed J
MIke B.In the last days both israel, has to flee, when the false prophet will come in and occupy israel for 3/half yrs,
rev.11. and will set up the abomination of desolation.
His temple in jerusalem.wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,You're describing something as a future event, which I
have clearly illustrated (in my quote) to be historical fact.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.That is something that you must proof using scriprures.
wakeup.
Hi Wakeup,
Prophecy describes an event before it happens. And the
Historical record is the proof that the prophecy was fulfillment.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgHi Wakeup,
“A day for a year” as the prophetic time-table
is also used in the 70 weeks of Daniel prophecy.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgmikeboll64,Jan. wrote:[/quote]
Hi Mike,Quote Nor did Devo do a good job, IMO, of rebutting your understanding that the woman is Israel. For example, he said it couldn't be Israel, because Israel has never had to flee from Israel. But where is the scripture that says this woman flees FROM ISRAEL? The reason why the woman fled from Israel, is because that is where the woman's doctrine was first sent & preached & she only left Israel when she was forced out of Israel & she had to flee from persecution that came from her own brethren…FLEEING from Israelis IN Israel where she was.
This woman based herself in Israel when she came into the world remember…
Not Rome, not Tyre, not Greece but Israel.
So the ONLY place the physical “she” could flee from would be her first home…Israel, because she wasn't sent anywhere else to begin with but to Israel.
So no it's not spelled out in the scriptures, like I didn't spell it out, instead its discerned.Quote Not to mention that Israel has had to flee many times in their history. In fact, Jesus warned them to flee when they saw the abomination that causes desolation in the holy place, right? Or am I getting my scriptures mixed up? No, you DO have good understanding Mike it's just that you haven't had enough time on this subject to wrap your head around all the implications, that is, you haven't had time to question & ask yourself & answer for yourself every possible question/scenario on this subject is all…that's why I'm needing to clarify.
Israel has never fled Israel in their history Mike…nationally.
Sure they've been conquered & scattered & taken into captivity & Israel emptied out, but never on a national scale have they just up & fled from the land of Israel willingly…Israels defeats have always been by Gods doing (sending nations against her etc)This woman actually fled from her own kind…Israelis.
Like David & his men fled Saul.
All of Israel never fled, just David & his men…just like the woman.
This was my point.Those who flee the abomination of desolation will be those Israelis that see & hear, not all Israel see & hear Gods word…so not all of Israel will flee.
Quote (No offense, Devo. I'm just saying it like I see it. Remember that I am on milk when it comes to many scriptural things – so who cares what I think anyway? )What's wrong with you guys?
Why are we always the bad guys?
Things get said in the heat of battle, sometimes we are reacting to perceived insults ourselves, yet we forgive & forget & always come back to treating you guys with respect before the next lot of insults build up again. (Though you personally don't do this often which is why i like you, but you have said things before…I remember the impression not the words spoken, IF I had a grudge, I would remember the words too…but I don't)Yet we are held accountable to every word, never mind that our sometimes harsh responses are always responses to blunt insults or subtle ones…we are always the guilty ones!
Even things said months & months ago, a year ago, we are always reminded by you guys at some point.
Gee, maybe that's why we get defensive at times wouldn't you think?I hope you, Mike, have at least noticed we do our best to ignore sleights, we don't always succeed, but we damn well try our best to rise above them…go count any perceived insults by us & then weigh them up against the insults leading up to those responses.
We are the ones defending not attacking.
And that's a big difference.So let me say this to you, once again, if I have ever insulted you, I humbly apologise as a brother.
I do NOT think your understanding is basic, you need to let go of those emotions poisoning you against me.
You have good understanding Mike, I never thought otherwise, just ask Journey.Cheers.
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,16:15) Hi Wakeup, “A day for a year” as the prophetic time-table
is also used in the 70 weeks of Daniel prophecy.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EDJ.We must keep on flowing like a river.
We can not turn ourselves into a pool.
We must carry on and gain some more knowledge.wakeup.
Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2013,10:12) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:08) Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) You seem to understand that the woman is Gods teachings(doctrine).
I understand that is what you are claiming.Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) This was Gods woman taught to israel.
So the righteous ways God tried to teach the Israelites were “God's woman”?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus born out of mother Zion.
Then Jesus took over for a short while,and he gave it over to men to teach;this is the daughter of Zion.
Now I'm lost again. Are you saying that the mother BECAME her own daughter?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus will come back to take over,and he will bring her to perfection,
in his 1000yr reign.This will be his treasure,his bride,the work of his hand.
So Jesus will bring his own “mother” to perfection, and then marry her?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) When christ has gone up to his Father,the woman(daughter of Zion) has been persecuted by Paul,and God helped the woman and hides her.This is when they had to hide behind locked doors here and there.
This part kind of makes sense – as ONE possible understanding. But the doctrine of Christians was not persecuted for only 3 and a half years. The persecution goes on to this day.
Hi Mike,Good scrutiny of Wakeup's doctrine.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed,Do you think everything we understand is from Wakeup only?
No, Wakeup has taught us MANY things, yes, but we had to see it for ourselves before we agreed Ed….we have also taught Wakeup things Ed…this is no dictatorship Ed, its a bretherenship.
Sometimes on certain subjects we have DISAGREED, sometimes for weeks, months, even a year and a half on one subject…but eventually we always come to the same conclusion.
We're not like churches Ed…”I'm the teacher and that's that” kind of mentality..no.So there you go, it's not Wakeup's doctrine, but the doctrine that Wakeup speaks…we or ourselves also see in the scriptures.
And FYI, I worked this one out for myself a year & a half or so ago…that it lines up perfectly with what Wakeup says is just evidence we are seeing the same things IN SCRIPTURE…again, this is not “Wakeup's doctrine” as though he is trying to be some sort of Guru, Wakeup is a very honest & humble man who guided us to much understanding…not ALL our understanding…we have to work (seek) for ourselves too Ed.
So no point trying to demonise Wakeup when you disagree, we are not a cult okay?
We learn individually at the same time as collectively okay Ed?
That is how the Spirit teaches…ALL learn and ALL teach eachother…even the teacher learns at times and gets corrected at times…God does this so no man is exalted above his station and becomes puffed up.
And the fact Wakeup has accepted error in the past and changed his viewpoint on certain subjects is a testament to his humility and not some puffed up teacher that is not to be questioned nor challenged.Thought you should know.
Quote (Devolution @ Jan. 26 2013,22:16) This is what we are speaking of…His ORIGINS…heavenly.
Okay. Got it.Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2013,09:08) [/quote] Wakeup,Jan. wrote:You seem to understand that the woman is Gods teachings(doctrine).
I understand that is what you are claiming.Fair enough Mike.
Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) This was Gods woman taught to israel.
So the righteous ways God tried to teach the Israelites were “God's woman”?Don't forget Mike, Christ likens us to a BODY too.
Isn't that exactly the same concept as the “woman”?
And Mike, since you are into translations, have you forgotten that the Hebrew word used to describe the Holy Spirit is always a FEMININE descriptive linguistically?
Is that not a correlation to this woman?Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus born out of mother Zion.
Then Jesus took over for a short while,and he gave it over to men to teach;this is the daughter of Zion.
Now I'm lost again. Are you saying that the mother BECAME her own daughter?No.
That the Spirit of the mother dwells WITHIN her children is what you need to focus on.
That will give the answer to your question bro.
A woman has children and they grow into a family
God's woman has children too…BELIEVERS…but ther is no literal woman in heaven, “she” is just symbolised as a woman because she “breeds” a family unto God…again, the church is a body too…symbolically…same concept.
“She” dwells in men Mike, that Spirit which contains Gods TRUTH/doctrine…as Jesus said, “Your word is truth”…so where those men are, since they have “her” Spirit growing in them, then wherever they are…”she” is there too.
Other words, When they flee…she flees too…symbolically…because an essence of her is IN THEM…”her” children…the Spirit FROM heaven GROWING WITHIN men.
And they REPRESENT “her” whilst on earth before men.Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) Jesus will come back to take over,and he will bring her to perfection,
in his 1000yr reign.This will be his treasure,his bride,the work of his hand.
So Jesus will bring his own “mother” to perfection, and then marry her?Jesus is perfecting the PHYSICAL manifestation of that woman which is poured out from that “heavenly mother” to grow WITHIN the mortal shells of His disciples.
He is not perfecting that which is in heaven, only that which came down to earth, perfecting her WITHIN His disciples…so really, we are not saying Jesus is perfecting her, but perfecting that which comes from her within men.
So it is the spirits of men mingled with “her” Spirit which is being perfected.
Not “her” needing perfecting, but men “she” is to grow within.The “mother” is still in heaven, those she dwells in are on earth, so where the children flee, & since “the spirit of the mother” dwells IN them, then symbolically the “mother” (the poured out Spirit WITHIN her children) flees too…symbolically.
Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 21 2013,22:08) When christ has gone up to his Father,the woman(daughter of Zion) has been persecuted by Paul,and God helped the woman and hides her.This is when they had to hide behind locked doors here and there.
This part kind of makes sense – as ONE possible understanding. But the doctrine of Christians was not persecuted for only 3 and a half years. The persecution goes on to this day.Mike you misunderstand.
The TRUE un polluted doctrine was protected & PREACHED for 3 1/2 years as it was being taught, all the while the persecutors were searching for them to kill them & that doctrine.
So it was the CORRECT TEACHING (rendering/imparting) of that doctrine that was being protected before it became CORRUPTED.
Otherwise we would not have Matthew, Mark, Luke & John etc…we'd instead have Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Nicodemus, Cornelius, Santa Claus etc etc.
The foundation teachings needed to be kept PURE.
The source, the truth, established for 3 1/2 years un polluted.Hence Paul's declaration:
Acts 20:29 >For I know this, that AFTER my DEPARTING shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.
Acts 29:30 >Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to DRAW AWAY DISCIPLES AFTER THEM.
Acts 29:31 >Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space OF THREE YEARS I ceased not to WARN every one night and day with tears.
3 years the TRUTH was taught UNPOLLUTED.
Paul declared it bluntly & plainly.
The other 6 months is discernable but not set in stone I admit.
But the message is clear…the TRUTH was being preached to those OUTSIDE of Israel (the woman FLED) for THREE YEARS in the above…
Again, the OTHER 6 MONTHS are NOT set in stone in the scriptures…we have to discern the missing time by the events…again, I admit that.
But can you admit/see that there is a definite link?
Remember, being “fed” is being taught truth that makes our Spirits grow.
And just as children represent their PARENTS (think of estates being legally prosecuted in the hands of lawyers before all concerned) so do “her” children represent “her” whilst here on earth.
We are not her, we represent the part of her within us whilst on earth is all.Hope that helps?
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