Which messengers?

[Jodi]

Hebrews chapter 1 seems to me to be referring to human messengers and not heavenly messengers!

Hebrews 1 In many parts, and many ways, God of old having spoken to the fathers in the prophets, 2 in these last days did speak to us in a Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He did make the ages; 3 who being the brightness of the glory, and the impress of His subsistence, bearing up also the all things by the saying of his might — through himself having made a cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the greatness in the highest,

4 having become so much better than the messengers, as he did inherit a more excellent name than they. 5 For to which of the messengers said He ever, `My Son thou art — I to-day have begotten thee?' and again, `I will be to him for a father, and he shall be to Me for a son?'

6 and when again He may bring in the first-born to the world, He saith, `And let them bow before him — all messengers of God;' 7 and unto the messengers, indeed, He saith, `Who is making His messengers spirits, and His ministers a flame of fire;' 8 and unto the Son: `Thy throne, O God, [is] to the age of the age; a scepter of righteousness [is] the scepter of thy reign;

9 thou didst love righteousness, and didst hate lawlessness; because of this did He anoint thee — God, thy God — with oil of gladness above thy partners;' 10 and, `Thou, at the beginning, Lord, the earth didst found, and a work of thy hands are the heavens; 11 these shall perish, and Thou dost remain, and all, as a garment, shall become old, 12 and as a mantle Thou shall roll them together, and they shall be changed, and Thou art the same, and Thy years shall not fail.'

13 And unto which of the messengers said He ever, `Sit at My right hand, till I may make thine enemies thy footstool?' 14 are they not all spirits of service — for ministration being sent forth because of those about to inherit salvation?

-The beginning of Hebrews is talking about God’s human messengers >the prophets and Jesus.

Verse 4-Surely we are not being told to compare the names of the angels, which we only know a few of, with that of Jesus, but we are to be comparing the names of the prophets with that of Jesus.

Verse 5-When in the bible have we ever been told of the things God says to angels on behalf of the angels? We don’t know what God says to the angels for their sake. We do know what God has said to the prophets, and we can CONFIRM that he never told any of them ‘My Son thou art today I have begotten thee’

Verse 6-When Jesus is brought back into the world, indeed God’s human messengers will bow to Jesus

Verse 7-Why would God need to be making the angels spirits? Aren’t angels already spirits?

Verse 13- Once again we can only confirm what God has said to the prophets and we know that He never told one of them, ‘Sit at My right hand’

What do you think?

[NickHassan]

Hi JOdi,
And where are these messengers in scripture?

[NickHassan]

Hi Jodi,
Was Jesus made less than these messengers for a time?
So are these messengers then greater than men?

[kenrch]

Heb 1:7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

Angelic beings are already spirits. Here scripture says He makes His angels spirits. “Seems” like angels here means HUMAN messenger that HE MAKES spirits.

[NickHassan]

hmmm

[NickHassan]

Hi,
Heb 1
” 14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?”

[kenrch]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2007,11:49)

Hi, Heb 1 ” 14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?”

Heb 1:7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

Why would He have to make angelic “spiritual beings” spirit when they are already spirits. Angel in this scripture must mean human messengers that He makes spiritual beings.

Heb 1:14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Hmmmmm

Guardian angels

[Jodi]

$alm/Mal'ak- is the Hebrew word for messenger and is translated in the bible either as angel or messenger, simply by the text. If the text seems to be talking about a heavenly messenger, then it is translated as angel, and if the text applies to a human then it is referred to as messenger.

This is the same for the Greek word a[ggelo/Aggelos
This Greek word means messenger and the translators go by the text to either translate the word angel or messenger.

I am just saying some of the aggelos in the book of Hebrews according to the text could easily apply to human messengers instead of heavenly messengers.

John is called an aggelos in Matthew, Mark and Luke

I don’t know maybe I’m on crack!

[kejonn]

Quote (Jodi @ July 30 2007,20:27)

I don’t know maybe I’m on crack!

Your bushy eyebrows and mustache would compliment such an assertion .

[kenrch]

Quote (kejonn @ July 31 2007,14:27)

Quote (Jodi @ July 30 2007,20:27) I don’t know maybe I’m on crack!   Your bushy eyebrows and mustache would compliment such an assertion  .

[Jodi]

AH, Thanks Guys!

[NickHassan]

Hi JOdi,
I thought it was just a wig you were wearing.

[Jodi]

Unfortunately, until I shave, that's what I look like every morning! My poor husband, after 7 years it still startles him!

[Author]

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