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Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,10:15) The eternal Paradise Creator Son “Michael” sent another revelation which inaugurated a new dispensation of grace and truth. We now have a vast amount of enformation, historic, scientific and spiritual concerning our world, where we came from, where we are going and who God is. The Urantia revelation constitutes the first composite revelation from a number of celestial beings.
The short time Michael was on earth he used the name his married parents gave him based on Mary's conversation with Gabriel, Jashua Ben Joseph.
After returning to heaven as sovegne Lord and God he is now Christ Michael.
Colter
Is Gabriel also Michael or is Gabriel another personification of the Father and if so is Michael/Jesus and Gabriel “One”?Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 01 2013,10:50) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,10:15) The eternal Paradise Creator Son “Michael” sent another revelation which inaugurated a new dispensation of grace and truth. We now have a vast amount of enformation, historic, scientific and spiritual concerning our world, where we came from, where we are going and who God is. The Urantia revelation constitutes the first composite revelation from a number of celestial beings.
The short time Michael was on earth he used the name his married parents gave him based on Mary's conversation with Gabriel, Jashua Ben Joseph.
After returning to heaven as sovegne Lord and God he is now Christ Michael.
Colter
Is Gabriel also Michael or is Gabriel another personification of the Father and if so is Michael/Jesus and Gabriel “One”?
Gabriel is the Bright and Morning Star, the first creation ig the Creator Son in Union with the Universe Mother Spirit.4. Gabriel — The Chief Executive
(369.4) 33:4.1 “The Bright and Morning Star is the personalization of the first concept of identity and ideal of personality conceived by the Creator Son and the local universe manifestation of the Infinite Spirit. Going back to the early days of the local universe, before the union of the Creator Son and the Mother Spirit in the bonds of creative association, back to the times before the beginning of the creation of their versatile family of sons and daughters, the first conjoint act of this early and free association of these two divine persons results in the creation of the highest spirit personality of the Son and the Spirit, the Bright and Morning Star.
(369.5) 33:4.2 Only one such being of wisdom and majesty is brought forth in each local universe. The Universal Father and the Eternal Son can, in fact do, create an unlimited number of Sons in divinity equal to themselves; but such Sons, in union with the Daughters of the Infinite Spirit, can create only one Bright and Morning Star in each universe, a being like themselves and partaking freely of their combined natures but not of their creative prerogatives. Gabriel of Salvington is like the Universe Son in divinity of nature though considerably limited in the attributes of Deity.
(369.6) 33:4.3 This first-born of the parents of a new universe is a unique personality possessing many wonderful traits not visibly present in either ancestor, a being of unprecedented versatility and unimagined brilliance. This supernal personality embraces the divine will of the Son combined with the creative imagination of the Spirit. The thoughts and acts of the Bright and Morning Star will ever be fully representative of both the Creator Son and the Creative Spirit. Such a being is also capable of a broad understanding of, and sympathetic contact with, both the spiritual seraphic hosts and the material evolutionary will creatures.
(370.1) 33:4.4 The Bright and Morning Star is not a creator, but he is a marvelous administrator, being the personal administrative representative of the Creator Son. Aside from creation and life impartation the Son and the Spirit never confer upon important universe procedures without Gabriel’s presence.
(370.2) 33:4.5 Gabriel of Salvington is the chief executive of the universe of Nebadon and the arbiter of all executive appeals respecting its administration. This universe executive was created fully endowed for his work, but he has gained experience with the growth and evolution of our local creation.
(370.3) 33:4.6 Gabriel is the chief officer of execution for superuniverse mandates relating to nonpersonal affairs in the local universe. Most matters pertaining to mass judgment and dispensational resurrections, adjudicated by the Ancients of Days, are also delegated to Gabriel and his staff for execution. Gabriel is thus the combined chief executive of both the super- and the local universe rulers. He has at his command an able corps of administrative assistants, created for their special work, who are unrevealed to evolutionary mortals. In addition to these assistants, Gabriel may employ any and all of the orders of celestial beings functioning in Nebadon, and he is also the commander in chief of “the armies of heaven” — the celestial hosts.
(370.4) 33:4.7 Gabriel and his staff are not teachers; they are administrators. They were never known to depart from their regular work except when Michael was incarnated on a creature bestowal. During such bestowals Gabriel was ever attendant on the will of the incarnated Son, and with the collaboration of the Union of Days, he became the actual director of universe affairs during the later bestowals. Gabriel has been closely identified with the history and development of Urantia ever since the mortal bestowal of Michael.
(370.5) 33:4.8 Aside from meeting Gabriel on the bestowal worlds and at the times of general- and special-resurrection roll calls, mortals will seldom encounter him as they ascend through the local universe until they are inducted into the administrative work of the local creation. As administrators, of whatever order or degree, you will come under the direction of Gabriel.”
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,11:42) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 01 2013,10:50) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,10:15) The eternal Paradise Creator Son “Michael” sent another revelation which inaugurated a new dispensation of grace and truth. We now have a vast amount of enformation, historic, scientific and spiritual concerning our world, where we came from, where we are going and who God is. The Urantia revelation constitutes the first composite revelation from a number of celestial beings.
The short time Michael was on earth he used the name his married parents gave him based on Mary's conversation with Gabriel, Jashua Ben Joseph.
After returning to heaven as sovegne Lord and God he is now Christ Michael.
Colter
Is Gabriel also Michael or is Gabriel another personification of the Father and if so is Michael/Jesus and Gabriel “One”?
Gabriel is the Bright and Morning Star, the first creation ig the Creator Son in Union with the Universe Mother Spirit.4. Gabriel — The Chief Executive
(369.4) 33:4.1 “The Bright and Morning Star is the personalization of the first concept of identity and ideal of personality conceived by the Creator Son and the local universe manifestation of the Infinite Spirit. Going back to the early days of the local universe, before the union of the Creator Son and the Mother Spirit in the bonds of creative association, back to the times before the beginning of the creation of their versatile family of sons and daughters, the first conjoint act of this early and free association of these two divine persons results in the creation of the highest spirit personality of the Son and the Spirit, the Bright and Morning Star.
(369.5) 33:4.2 Only one such being of wisdom and majesty is brought forth in each local universe. The Universal Father and the Eternal Son can, in fact do, create an unlimited number of Sons in divinity equal to themselves; but such Sons, in union with the Daughters of the Infinite Spirit, can create only one Bright and Morning Star in each universe, a being like themselves and partaking freely of their combined natures but not of their creative prerogatives. Gabriel of Salvington is like the Universe Son in divinity of nature though considerably limited in the attributes of Deity.
(369.6) 33:4.3 This first-born of the parents of a new universe is a unique personality possessing many wonderful traits not visibly present in either ancestor, a being of unprecedented versatility and unimagined brilliance. This supernal personality embraces the divine will of the Son combined with the creative imagination of the Spirit. The thoughts and acts of the Bright and Morning Star will ever be fully representative of both the Creator Son and the Creative Spirit. Such a being is also capable of a broad understanding of, and sympathetic contact with, both the spiritual seraphic hosts and the material evolutionary will creatures.
(370.1) 33:4.4 The Bright and Morning Star is not a creator, but he is a marvelous administrator, being the personal administrative representative of the Creator Son. Aside from creation and life impartation the Son and the Spirit never confer upon important universe procedures without Gabriel’s presence.
(370.2) 33:4.5 Gabriel of Salvington is the chief executive of the universe of Nebadon and the arbiter of all executive appeals respecting its administration. This universe executive was created fully endowed for his work, but he has gained experience with the growth and evolution of our local creation.
(370.3) 33:4.6 Gabriel is the chief officer of execution for superuniverse mandates relating to nonpersonal affairs in the local universe. Most matters pertaining to mass judgment and dispensational resurrections, adjudicated by the Ancients of Days, are also delegated to Gabriel and his staff for execution. Gabriel is thus the combined chief executive of both the super- and the local universe rulers. He has at his command an able corps of administrative assistants, created for their special work, who are unrevealed to evolutionary mortals. In addition to these assistants, Gabriel may employ any and all of the orders of celestial beings functioning in Nebadon, and he is also the commander in chief of “the armies of heaven” — the celestial hosts.
(370.4) 33:4.7 Gabriel and his staff are not teachers; they are administrators. They were never known to depart from their regular work except when Michael was incarnated on a creature bestowal. During such bestowals Gabriel was ever attendant on the will of the incarnated Son, and with the collaboration of the Union of Days, he became the actual director of universe affairs during the later bestowals. Gabriel has been closely identified with the history and development of Urantia ever since the mortal bestowal of Michael.
(370.5) 33:4.8 Aside from meeting Gabriel on the bestowal worlds and at the times of general- and special-resurrection roll calls, mortals will seldom encounter him as they ascend through the local universe until they are inducted into the administrative work of the local creation. As administrators, of whatever order or degree, you will come under the direction of Gabriel.”
Colter
So there is a a Mother God as well? Gabriele is not a son? Why does the Bible and the Quran speak of them both as being the same kind of being?Quote (Colter @ Aug. 31 2013,14:11) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,05:35) His name was Jesus. Why would we think it was something else? God has sent Gabriel to earth. Did his name change when this happened?
The scripture doesn't say that, according to you if it's not in the scripture you can't talk about it, remember?
The scriptures don't specifically say that Gabriel's name has always been Gabriel either.But what is the best assumption? That Gabriel has always been Gabriel? Or that he has periodic name changes?
Obviously, there have been name changes in scripture. Abram to Abraham. Jacob to Israel. Simon to Peter.
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.
And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth. I mean, if God sent Gabriel to be made in human likeness, is there any reason he would have to change his name to something other than Gabriel?
Of course not.So while I've read Wakeup's comments, and I know that the general consensus is that Jesus only became his name when he was born of Mary, I will stick to common sense and continue to assume that his name has ALWAYS BEEN Jesus – since there is NOTHING in any scripture to cause us to assume otherwise.
I believe Wakeup would also agree with this common sense assumption if he believed the one who is NAMED “Jesus”, and who has the TITLE “the Word of God”, existed as a sentient being before being made in the likeness of a human being.
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 31 2013,18:42) Gabriel is the Bright and Morning Star, the first creation ig the Creator Son in Union with the Universe Mother Spirit.
Jesus told us that HE was the bright Morning Star. And I don't even know how to address this “Universe Mother Spirit” thing the UB author has concocted.I can only roll my eyes in bewilderment that you believe this stuff, Colter.
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 29 2013,13:32) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 29 2013,12:05) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 29 2013,01:01) Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Jesus is not Michael.God through his son gave us all victory and just as the angels defeat the fallen angels, so it is that man will defeat these angels too.
We have the victory in Christ Jesus/Yeshua. Not in Christ Michael.
Angels serve Christ.
What was the Sons name before he came down from heaven?C
The Logos. The Word of God.Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:25) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 31 2013,18:42) Gabriel is the Bright and Morning Star, the first creation ig the Creator Son in Union with the Universe Mother Spirit.
Jesus told us that HE was the bright Morning Star. And I don't even know how to address this “Universe Mother Spirit” thing the UB author has concocted.I can only roll my eyes in bewilderment that you believe this stuff, Colter.
As it turns out the truth really is stranger than fiction, but you have no room to roll your eyes at anyone.Colter
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 01 2013,21:25) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 29 2013,13:32) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 29 2013,12:05) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 29 2013,01:01) Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Jesus is not Michael.God through his son gave us all victory and just as the angels defeat the fallen angels, so it is that man will defeat these angels too.
We have the victory in Christ Jesus/Yeshua. Not in Christ Michael.
Angels serve Christ.
What was the Sons name before he came down from heaven?C
The Logos. The Word of God.
That's a good answer, closer to the truth then an eternal Son having a Jewish name LOL, but we now know his true name “Christ Michael”Colter
We are ALL Sons of God including Gabriel, it's just that he was the first creation of Michael and the universe Mother spirit. He is a unique one off being.
5. Mortals of Time and Space
(445.2) 40:5.1 “Mortals represent the last link in the chain of those beings who are called sons of God. The personal touch of the Original and Eternal Son passes on down through a series of decreasingly divine and increasingly human personalizations until there arrives a being much like yourselves, one you can see, hear, and touch. And then you are made spiritually aware of the great truth which your faith may grasp — sonship with the eternal God!
(445.3) 40:5.2 Likewise does the Original and Infinite Spirit, by a long series of decreasingly divine and increasingly human orders, draw nearer and nearer to the struggling creatures of the realms, reaching the limit of expression in the angels — than whom you were created but a little lower — who personally guard and guide you in the life journey of the mortal career of time.
(445.4) 40:5.3 God the Father does not, cannot, thus downstep himself to make such near personal contact with the almost limitless number of ascending creatures throughout the universe of universes. But the Father is not deprived of personal contact with his lowly creatures; you are not without the divine presence. Although God the Father cannot be with you by direct personality manifestation, he is in you and of you in the identity of the indwelling Thought Adjusters, the divine Monitors. Thus does the Father, who is the farthest from you in personality and in spirit, draw the nearest to you in the personality circuit and in the spirit touch of inner communion with the very souls of his mortal sons and daughters.”
Colter
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:21) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 31 2013,14:11) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,05:35) His name was Jesus. Why would we think it was something else? God has sent Gabriel to earth. Did his name change when this happened?
The scripture doesn't say that, according to you if it's not in the scripture you can't talk about it, remember?
The scriptures don't specifically say that Gabriel's name has always been Gabriel either.But what is the best assumption? That Gabriel has always been Gabriel? Or that he has periodic name changes?
Obviously, there have been name changes in scripture. Abram to Abraham. Jacob to Israel. Simon to Peter.
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.
And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth. I mean, if God sent Gabriel to be made in human likeness, is there any reason he would have to change his name to something other than Gabriel?
Of course not.So while I've read Wakeup's comments, and I know that the general consensus is that Jesus only became his name when he was born of Mary, I will stick to common sense and continue to assume that his name has ALWAYS BEEN Jesus – since there is NOTHING in any scripture to cause us to assume otherwise.
I believe Wakeup would also agree with this common sense assumption if he believed the one who is NAMED “Jesus”, and who has the TITLE “the Word of God”, existed as a sentient being before being made in the likeness of a human being.
That was true of Mecaventia Melchizedek, he kept his heavenly name while incarnate. Michael, as a heavenly name, was known by seers and prophets although some confused him as an archangel, at least until the revelation to John on Patmos when Christs heavenly name was once again disclosed. Joshua is a Hebrew derivative.Colter
Wiki:
The English name Joshua is a rendering of the Hebrew language “Yehoshua”, meaning “Yahweh is salvation”.[6][7] The vocalization of the second name component may be read as Hoshea – the name used in the Torah before Moses added the divine name (Numbers 13:16).[8]
“Jesus” is the English of the Greek transliteration of “Yehoshua” via Latin. In the Septuagint, all instances of the word “Yehoshua” are rendered as “Ἰησοῦς” (Iēsoūs), the closest Greek pronunciation of the Aramaic “Yeshua” (Hebrew word #3443 in Strong's, Nehemiah 8:17).[9][10] Thus in Greek Joshua is called “Jesus son of Naue” (τοῦ Ναυή) to differentiate him from Jesus Christ. This is also true in the Slavic languages following the Eastern Orthodox tradition (e.g. “Иисус Навин” (Iisús Navín) in Russian).The name Michael means “one who is like God” literally “one who is like El”. That fits Jesus as he is Just like his Father.
Colter
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:21) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 31 2013,14:11) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,05:35) His name was Jesus. Why would we think it was something else? God has sent Gabriel to earth. Did his name change when this happened?
The scripture doesn't say that, according to you if it's not in the scripture you can't talk about it, remember?
The scriptures don't specifically say that Gabriel's name has always been Gabriel either.But what is the best assumption? That Gabriel has always been Gabriel? Or that he has periodic name changes?
Obviously, there have been name changes in scripture. Abram to Abraham. Jacob to Israel. Simon to Peter.
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.
And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth. I mean, if God sent Gabriel to be made in human likeness, is there any reason he would have to change his name to something other than Gabriel?
Of course not.So while I've read Wakeup's comments, and I know that the general consensus is that Jesus only became his name when he was born of Mary, I will stick to common sense and continue to assume that his name has ALWAYS BEEN Jesus – since there is NOTHING in any scripture to cause us to assume otherwise.
I believe Wakeup would also agree with this common sense assumption if he believed the one who is NAMED “Jesus”, and who has the TITLE “the Word of God”, existed as a sentient being before being made in the likeness of a human being.
Mike B.Isaiah 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is *NO SAVIOUR*.
THE MAN JESUS WAS NOT;THE NAME JESUS WAS NOT.
Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, **I am the LORD** that maketh **ALL THINGS**; that stretcheth forth the heavens *ALONE*; that spreadeth abroad the earth **BY MY SELF**;
wakeup.
Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,06:41) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:21)
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth.
That was true of Mecaventia Melchizedek, he kept his heavenly name while incarnate. Michael, as a heavenly name, was known by seers and prophets although some confused him as an archangel, at least until the revelation to John on Patmos when Christs heavenly name was once again disclosed. Joshua is a Hebrew derivative.
Aren't “Michael” and “Gabriel” also Hebrew names?And if your UB claims that Melchizadek had the same name in heaven and on earth, why is it such a stretch to believe Jesus had the same name in heaven and on earth?
t8 and Wakeup seem to think his NAME was “the Word of God”. But that is a TITLE, not a NAME. He has held that TITLE for as long as he has held the NAME “Jesus”.
And just as he STILL holds that TITLE, he STILL has the NAME “Jesus”.
Like I said, unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for anyone, under any circumstance, to just assume without reason that someone's name has been changed from one thing to another.
Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 01 2013,08:30) Isaiah 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is *NO SAVIOUR*. THE MAN JESUS WAS NOT;THE NAME JESUS WAS NOT.
Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, **I am the LORD** that maketh **ALL THINGS**; that stretcheth forth the heavens *ALONE*; that spreadeth abroad the earth **BY MY SELF**;
wakeup.
…and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came….It would be hard for all things to come through Jesus Christ if Jesus Christ didn't exist before those “all things” that came through him.
As for Isaiah 43:11………
Nehemiah 9:27
But when they were oppressed they cried out to you. From heaven you heard them, and in your great compassion you gave them saviors, who rescued them from the hand of their enemies.This verse speaks of the judges of old, Wakeup. And God had sent these saviors long before He emphatically said, “besides me there is no savior”.
As for Isaiah 44:24, I have no disagreement with it. I truly believe that Jehovah did indeed make all things by Himself.
He who creates is one, and he through whom the thing is created is another. – Tertullian
The fact that God created all things through Jesus doesn't contradict the claim that God created all things by Himself.
Just like the fact that God created you through your parents doesn't contradict the fact that God, alone and by Himself, is the one who created you.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2013,02:13) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,06:41) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:21)
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth.
That was true of Mecaventia Melchizedek, he kept his heavenly name while incarnate. Michael, as a heavenly name, was known by seers and prophets although some confused him as an archangel, at least until the revelation to John on Patmos when Christs heavenly name was once again disclosed. Joshua is a Hebrew derivative.
Aren't “Michael” and “Gabriel” also Hebrew names?And if your UB claims that Melchizadek had the same name in heaven and on earth, why is it such a stretch to believe Jesus had the same name in heaven and on earth?
t8 and Wakeup seem to think his NAME was “the Word of God”. But that is a TITLE, not a NAME. He has held that TITLE for as long as he has held the NAME “Jesus”.
And just as he STILL holds that TITLE, he STILL has the NAME “Jesus”.
Like I said, unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for anyone, under any circumstance, to just assume without reason that someone's name has been changed from one thing to another.
Mike B.The word of God is not just a title.
He is the literal Word of God,brought forth from inside God.Let there be light;and there was light.
God spoke and it is created.
God created all things for his own pleasure.
Without the Word was *not anything* made that was made.Isaiah 44:24 Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that *maketh all things*; that stretcheth forth the heavens *ALONE*; that spreadeth abroad the earth *BY MY SELF*.
God was by *himself* when he created all that is created,
and his *WORD* made it happen.All things are framed by the *Word* of God.
The name Jesus was not;untill the word was made flesh.
The prophets never was introduced to the name Jesus,because he was not yet born.Matt.1:21. She shall bring forth a son;and **thou shall call his name** *JESUS*,——-.
Jesus will come again with a new name that no man knows. *His name* shall be called the *WORD OF GOD*rev.19:12.
wakeup.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2013,02:13) Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,06:41) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 01 2013,15:21)
But unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for a sensible person to go out of their way to ASSUME a name has changed from one thing to another.And this is the case with Jesus. The fact that Mary was told to name him Jesus when he was born on earth doesn't prohibit his name from being Jesus before he was born on earth.
That was true of Mecaventia Melchizedek, he kept his heavenly name while incarnate. Michael, as a heavenly name, was known by seers and prophets although some confused him as an archangel, at least until the revelation to John on Patmos when Christs heavenly name was once again disclosed. Joshua is a Hebrew derivative.
Aren't “Michael” and “Gabriel” also Hebrew names?And if your UB claims that Melchizadek had the same name in heaven and on earth, why is it such a stretch to believe Jesus had the same name in heaven and on earth?
t8 and Wakeup seem to think his NAME was “the Word of God”. But that is a TITLE, not a NAME. He has held that TITLE for as long as he has held the NAME “Jesus”.
And just as he STILL holds that TITLE, he STILL has the NAME “Jesus”.
Like I said, unless a name change is specifically mentioned, there is no reason for anyone, under any circumstance, to just assume without reason that someone's name has been changed from one thing to another.
It's not a stretch at all, it's just that it isn't true, Joshua was the name chosen for the incarnate Son. Michael had incarnate 6 previous times as various orders of celestial beings in his vast universe, he served superbly in these secret assignments. Each time his identity was concealed, at least until after he had completed his assignment. You might notice the Jesus asked the apostles to keep his identity a secret until he returned to his pace in heaven. Micheals incarnation on earth was the only time he incarnate as a mortal baby. The entire process of the 7 incarnations took 1 billion years.Colter
Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 01 2013,09:47) Jesus will come again with a new name that no man knows. *His name* shall be called the *WORD OF GOD*rev.19:12.
But don't we already know the title “the Word of God”?How then can it be the new name of Jesus that NOBODY KNOWS?
So since you are wrong that “Word of God” is a personal NAME, and you are wrong that it is the “name” no one knows, perhaps you are wrong on the other stuff you wrote in that last post.
(You are. And I am happy to go through it with you if you are willing to stick with the discussion this time. I say that because we started this a long time ago, and you ended up walking away from it.)
Quote (Colter @ Sep. 01 2013,09:59) It's not a stretch at all, it's just that it isn't true.
So we agree that it is not a stretch. And we agree that the only reason you have to believe it isn't true is your UB.Since I believe the UB is the concoction of some man or men in the 50's, and nothing more, then I personally still don't have any valid reason to assume it's not true.
1. It's not a stretch at all.
2. I have no reason to believe Jesus' name was changed when he was made in the likeness of a human being.Conclusion: I will continue to believe that Jesus has been his name from the moment God created him before the ages – because I have no valid reason to assume a name change.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 02 2013,03:59) Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 01 2013,09:47) Jesus will come again with a new name that no man knows. *His name* shall be called the *WORD OF GOD*rev.19:12.
But don't we already know the title “the Word of God”?How then can it be the new name of Jesus that NOBODY KNOWS?
So since you are wrong that “Word of God” is a personal NAME, and you are wrong that it is the “name” no one knows, perhaps you are wrong on the other stuff you wrote in that last post.
(You are. And I am happy to go through it with you if you are willing to stick with the discussion this time. I say that because we started this a long time ago, and you ended up walking away from it.)
Mike B.Revelation 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that *no man knew*, *but he himself*.
Revelation 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is *called* The Word of God.
His new name no one knows,but he is *called* the Word of God.
The fact here is that he wont come with the name Jesus.
wakeup.
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