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Quote (t8 @ Aug. 22 2013,09:12) Colter. You have rejected the word of God and accepted the doctrine of demons and wisdom of man. That is your choice of course. It is your soul, hence you do with as you see fit. 1 Timothy 4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
God is the Word, the Word is living. But the oppression of sects like the JW's wouldn't exist if man didn't actually prefer conformity and the suductive ease and fellowship of doctrinal bondage.People who are in oppressive cults don't usually think they are in a cult. It's only those who are able to get out and see how screwed up their thinking had become.
Colter
Quote (t8 @ Aug. 22 2013,09:17) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 21 2013,15:32) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 21 2013,11:10) Colter. The fact that you believe in a Trinity at all proves your foundation is faulty. No amount of verses and no amount of human reasoning can stand when the foundation is wrong.
Even if you think the building is strong, if the foundation is weak, it will all collapse.
Your deck of cards has already fallen by the way.
Light has come into the world but the world preferred darkness to light.And who is the Prince of Darkness?
It is the one who poses as an Angel of Light?And why pose as an angel of Light?
To deceive people who do not embrace the true light.For the true light has already come into the world.
But you have not embraced it and have chosen another light which is not true light at all.
Oooh, that's spookey, did you get that from jwsermons.com?Colter
What I say is true.
That is the best I can do for you.
Those that would flatter you are not your friend.
Even a parent chastises a child in order to save him.
And a friend would warn of impending doom.
But can you come back from a seared conscience?
My conscience is free in the liberty of the gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven. You have been warped by group think all along the Watchtower.Colter
Quote You have not refuted what I have said because you cannot.
If you cannot, then that means you are lacking.
If you are lacking, then you need more than what you understand now.Colter, try to aim for a higher level of rebuttal as your reply is near the bottom rung of the pyramid.
Perhaps this was the reasoning used on you therefore you think it will work on others?
t8 you created a thread entitled “Urantia Trinity” to presumably refute the Urantia Trinity, yet you don't even know what it is, you have not even responded to the quotes from the book that I have provided to explain it. So you are being phony and disingenuous when you complain about dialogue.
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,00:20) Quote You have not refuted what I have said because you cannot.
If you cannot, then that means you are lacking.
If you are lacking, then you need more than what you understand now.Colter, try to aim for a higher level of rebuttal as your reply is near the bottom rung of the pyramid.
Perhaps this was the reasoning used on you therefore you think it will work on others?
t8 you created a thread entitled “Urantia Trinity” to presumably refute the Urantia Trinity, yet you don't even know what it is, you have not even responded to the quotes from the book that I have provided to explain it. So you are being phony and disingenuous when you complain about dialogue.
Colter
While I certainly do not believe in any sort of trinity I will agree that T8 often is very ingenuous in any dialogue. He will be interested in a subject or oppose something out of sheer instinct but will not take the time or research needed to truly rebut something even his pyramid of proper refutation he does not follow. On a personal note I think he is a very smart individual but should someone be too smart too examine the issue objectively?Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 23 2013,01:51) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,00:20) Quote You have not refuted what I have said because you cannot.
If you cannot, then that means you are lacking.
If you are lacking, then you need more than what you understand now.Colter, try to aim for a higher level of rebuttal as your reply is near the bottom rung of the pyramid.
Perhaps this was the reasoning used on you therefore you think it will work on others?
t8 you created a thread entitled “Urantia Trinity” to presumably refute the Urantia Trinity, yet you don't even know what it is, you have not even responded to the quotes from the book that I have provided to explain it. So you are being phony and disingenuous when you complain about dialogue.
Colter
While I certainly do not believe in any sort of trinity I will agree that T8 often is very ingenuous in any dialogue. He will be interested in a subject or oppose something out of sheer instinct but will not take the time or research needed to truly rebut something even his pyramid of proper refutation he does not follow. On a personal note I think he is a very smart individual but should someone be too smart too examine the issue objectively?
bodhitharta,They aren’t allowed to think for themselves or agree with anything at variance with the elders doctrines. That’s why they talk like robots. Show them one part of the Bible and they come back with an out of context reference from another part of the Bible as if you are an idiot. Most fringe sects have a special way of reading the Bible, so they first want to sit down with you and go through that exercise. In truth, most lukewarm Christians have never read the Bible or studied it, they don't know why they believe what they believe, so someone with a convincing sounding template can win them over to the fellowship then guilt trip the converts should they ever question the doctrine or how it was arrived at. Besides, when you have many other converts who sincerely believe the template, human nature is such that they want to conform, be a part, then join in looking down their noses at the rest of the stupid world who doesn’t think as they think.
Source Wiki:
“Doctrines of Jehovah's Witness. Witnesses are established by the Governing Body, without consultation with other members.[6] The religion does not tolerate dissidence about doctrines and practices;[140][304][305][306] members who openly disagree with the religion's teachings are shunned.[225] Watch Tower Society publications strongly discourage followers from questioning its doctrines and counsel, reasoning that the Society is to be trusted as “God's organization”.[306][307][308][309] It also warns members to “avoid independent thinking”, claiming such thinking “was introduced by Satan the Devil”[310][311] and would “cause division”.[312] Those who openly disagree with official teachings are condemned as “apostates” and “mentally diseased”.[313][314][315]
Former members Heather and Gary Botting compare the cultural paradigms of the religion to George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-four,[316] and Alan Rogerson describes the religion's leadership as totalitarian.[317] Other critics charge that by disparaging individual decision-making, the Watch Tower Society cultivates a system of unquestioning obedience[146][318] in which Witnesses abrogate all responsibility and rights over their personal lives.[319][320] Critics also accuse the Watch Tower Society of exercising “intellectual dominance” over Witnesses,[321] controlling information[225][322][323] and creating “mental isolation”,[324] which former Governing Body member Raymond Franz argued were all elements of mind control.[324]
Watch Tower Society publications state that consensus of faith aids unity,[325] and deny that unity restricts individuality or imagination.[325] Historian James Irvin Lichti has rejected the description of the religion as “totalitarian”.[326]
Sociologist Rodney Stark states that while Jehovah's Witness leaders are “not always very democratic” and members are expected to conform to “rather strict standards,” enforcement tends to be informal, sustained by close bonds of friendship and that Jehovah's Witnesses see themselves as “part of the power structure rather than subject to it.”[92] Sociologist Andrew Holden states that most members who join millenarian movements such as Jehovah's Witnesses have made an informed choice.[327] However, he also states that defectors “are seldom allowed a dignified exit”,[313] and describes the administration as autocratic.[6]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jehovah's_Witnesses#Criticism
Colter
Colter.
Why are you involving the jw's in our discissions?
If we are one of them;then we wont be here will we?
We wont be allowed to discuss spiritual matters outside the club would we.Speaking of a warped mind.
Who's mind is warped here?
The ones that follow the word of God; or someone that
follow some new philosophy introduced by some space man, of some unknown planet,with some strange names,like nano nano.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 23 2013,03:18) Colter. Why are you involving the jw's in our discissions?
If we are one of them;then we wont be here will we?
We wont be allowed to discuss spiritual matters outside the club would we.Speaking of a warped mind.
Who's mind is warped here?
The ones that follow the word of God; or someone that
follow some new philosophy introduced by some space man, of some unknown planet,with some strange names,like nano nano.wakeup.
Answer:The ones who say that the writings of men are the Words of God.
Nano, Nano is from Mork and Mindy.
King James Bible
“In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.”
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,03:44) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 23 2013,03:18) Colter. Why are you involving the jw's in our discissions?
If we are one of them;then we wont be here will we?
We wont be allowed to discuss spiritual matters outside the club would we.Speaking of a warped mind.
Who's mind is warped here?
The ones that follow the word of God; or someone that
follow some new philosophy introduced by some space man, of some unknown planet,with some strange names,like nano nano.wakeup.
Answer:The ones who say that the writings of men are the Words of God.
Nano, Nano is from Mork and Mindy.
King James Bible
“In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.”
Colter
Colter.I know ,and mork is of some other planet
and he sits on his head(upside down).Notice what Jesus said?
He said I *prepare* a place for you.
That means that the place was not there,or ready.
It is being prepared.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 23 2013,04:01) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,03:44) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 23 2013,03:18) Colter. Why are you involving the jw's in our discissions?
If we are one of them;then we wont be here will we?
We wont be allowed to discuss spiritual matters outside the club would we.Speaking of a warped mind.
Who's mind is warped here?
The ones that follow the word of God; or someone that
follow some new philosophy introduced by some space man, of some unknown planet,with some strange names,like nano nano.wakeup.
Answer:The ones who say that the writings of men are the Words of God.
Nano, Nano is from Mork and Mindy.
King James Bible
“In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.”
Colter
Colter.I know ,and mork is of some other planet
and he sits on his head(upside down).Notice what Jesus said?
He said I *prepare* a place for you.
That means that the place was not there,or ready.
It is being prepared.wakeup.
The place is where all salvaged souls go, they've been going there for hundreds of thousands of years.Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 21 2013,20:31) People who are in oppressive cults don't usually think they are in a cult. It's only those who are able to get out and see how screwed up their thinking had become.
Kind of like us watching from the outside looking in at the effects your new cult has had on you?
Wakeup has addressed your JW accusations and ad hominems very well. If we were JWs, then we wouldn't be ALLOWED to be here having this discussion, right?
I like you Colter. I always have. There are even some well thought out points in your UB – with which I agree. But all we are doing here is using scripture to refute any teaching of a triune Godhead. I'd say we've been successful.
Don't ever forget that the God of you is also the God of Jesus. We all, including Jesus Christ, have the same God and Creator.
Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 22 2013,11:01) He said I *prepare* a place for you.
Funny. I just used that same scripture to refute one of your points in the other thread, Wakeup.Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 23 2013,09:41) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 22 2013,11:01) He said I *prepare* a place for you.
Funny. I just used that same scripture to refute one of your points in the other thread, Wakeup.
We are opening our bibles,no more a dust collector.wakeup.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 23 2013,09:40) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 21 2013,20:31) People who are in oppressive cults don't usually think they are in a cult. It's only those who are able to get out and see how screwed up their thinking had become.
Kind of like us watching from the outside looking in at the effects your new cult has had on you?Wakeup has addressed your JW accusations and ad hominems very well. If we were JWs, then we wouldn't be ALLOWED to be here having this discussion, right?
I like you Colter. I always have. There are even some well thought out points in your UB – with which I agree. But all we are doing here is using scripture to refute any teaching of a triune Godhead. I'd say we've been successful.
Don't ever forget that the God of you is also the God of Jesus. We all, including Jesus Christ, have the same God and Creator.
I asked if you all were JW's, no one answered. Your doctrines are similar so I assumed. I see JW's on the net often. What denomination are you?UB readers aren’t organized per say, most all are independent readers. There are study groups that meet in people homes. The papers are compelling all on their own to truth seekers.
You've been successful in keeping your mind closed Mike not in debunking the person and office of Christ. The same Bible that you parse to refute personification of Infinity has been the foundation for billions of people who can see the Father revealed in Christ.
I will not forget that my Father is a personification of the infinite I AM as are all his duplicates as well as the source of my personality. I AM a son of I AM.
Colter
Isaiah 41:14 Fear not, **thou worm Jacob**, *and ye men of Israel*; I will help thee, saith the LORD, and thy redeemer, the Holy One of Israel.
Of course,it is the jews writing.
wakeup.
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,04:25) I asked if you all were JW's, no one answered.
Perhaps because it is irrelevant. What if I told you I WAS a JW? Would the scriptures I post then mean something different?
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,04:25) The same Bible that you parse to refute personification of Infinity has been the foundation for billions of people who can see the Father revealed in Christ.
True enough. But Jesus told that that road to salvation is narrow, and few will find it.The bottom line is that you believe Jesus IS the very God he is the SON OF. I find that belief ludicrous, nonsensical, and frankly laughable.
We are all created in God's image, and not one of our sons is the same exact being as us. Why then would we assume that the Son Jesus is the same exact being as his Father?
After all, it was God who explained to us that Jesus was His Son – knowing full well how the humans He created would understand a father/son relationship.But you go on traveling down that road that is wide and filled with unscriptural delusions. Many are the ones who will find that road, Colter…….. so you'll never be alone. You'll always have “billions of people” right beside you.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 25 2013,05:41) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 23 2013,04:25) The same Bible that you parse to refute personification of Infinity has been the foundation for billions of people who can see the Father revealed in Christ.
True enough. But Jesus told that that road to salvation is narrow, and few will find it.The bottom line is that you believe Jesus IS the very God he is the SON OF. I find that belief ludicrous, nonsensical, and frankly laughable.
We are all created in God's image, and not one of our sons is the same exact being as us. Why then would we assume that the Son Jesus is the same exact being as his Father?
After all, it was God who explained to us that Jesus was His Son – knowing full well how the humans He created would understand a father/son relationship.But you go on traveling down that road that is wide and filled with unscriptural delusions. Many are the ones who will find that road, Colter…….. so you'll never be alone. You'll always have “billions of people” right beside you.
You don't even believe the scripture you claim to follow. The only narrow thing in this discussion is your mind. I have explained the infinite Gods reason for personifying but I truly think you don't have a clue, especially now that you revealed your faith in a pantheon of deities.I will ask again since you seem to be ashamed of it, what denomination are you?
Colter
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 24 2013,00:25) I asked if you all were JW's, no one answered. Your doctrines are similar so I assumed. I see JW's on the net often. What denomination are you?
I belong to no denomination and hence am able to think for myself and allow God to show me things, even if they disagree with denominations.I have never been a JW, Catholic, or member of any denomination. I have been to many meetings by different denominations, but I see the Body of Christ as being those that belong to God and his Christ, no matter if they belong to a denomination or not.
Quote (Colter @ Aug. 25 2013,11:06) You don't even believe the scripture you claim to follow. The only narrow thing in this discussion is your mind. I have explained the infinite Gods reason
If you believe in a Trinity then yes, 'infinite Gods'.Quote (t8 @ Aug. 25 2013,10:09) Quote (Colter @ Aug. 24 2013,00:25) I asked if you all were JW's, no one answered. Your doctrines are similar so I assumed. I see JW's on the net often. What denomination are you?
I belong to no denomination and hence am able to think for myself and allow God to show me things, even if they disagree with denominations.I have never been a JW, Catholic, or member of any denomination. I have been to many meetings by different denominations, but I see the Body of Christ as being those that belong to God and his Christ, no matter if they belong to a denomination or not.
Thanks for answering.C
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