- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (TimothyVI @ June 26 2007,11:56) Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,11:19) Hi Tim4,
The Word was with God in the beginning.
In the beginning of what?Tim
Hi Tim4,
The beginning is before GenesisQuote (Gene Balthrop @ June 26 2007,12:31) timothy v1> if we just take the text for what it say's without capitalizing the word (word) and making it a person instead reduce it to it's simplest form (logos) which means intellengent utterance that's all. in other words intellegence was with God and intellegance utterance was God. we all know what intellegance is and utter is to bring forth. that's not difficult to understand . this whole spin on the word (word 0 was done by trentarian idology and they were able to pull it of because all original greek words were written with capital letters, so the translators who wanted to make the word (WORD) simply left it in captial letter where ever they wanted too. and another thing a word can never (become flesh) the word became flesh, should be read came to be in flesh . Jesus spoke God's word's to us . but Jesus never became God.
Hi GB,
Did John get it wrong?
Did he know of Heraditus's usage of terms?Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,12:54) Quote (TimothyVI @ June 26 2007,11:56) Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,11:19) Hi Tim4,
The Word was with God in the beginning.
In the beginning of what?Tim
Hi Tim4,
The beginning is before Genesis
The beginning of creation.
Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;When you speak do you not create those words?
kenrch>..what was the beginning of the creation of God was it not the spirit. remember Jesus was relaying words God gave him to give unto his servants and how does he conclude all the letters to the churches is it not (Hear what the spirit say's unto the churches) God is spirit and spirit is the beginning of God creation.God used His Spirit to creat all things that exist and it is the beginning of the creation of God. thats the way i see it. peace to you . Gene???
Nick >.. no John did not get it wrong it's people who are forcing the text who get it wrong and most of them are rooted in trenitarian idology. the whole concept of Jesus (Being the WORD) is wrong.
neither can any word become flesh because a word is spirit not flesh. it derives its meaning from spirit not flesh. the flesh profits nothing it is not spirit. remember where it say's try the spirits to see if they are of
God. Jesus said the words i am speaking are spirit (not flesh) .Tim > you are right it certanily was the divine reason or plan that shaped the existance of all things and it was with God and it WAS God.
just like the text say's. you have it right,hang on to what you have.your friend and fellow seeker of truth…….Gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 26 2007,14:59) Nick >.. no John did not get it wrong it's people who are forcing the text who get it wrong and most of them are rooted in trenitarian idology. the whole concept of Jesus (Being the WORD) is wrong. neither can any word become flesh because a word is spirit not flesh. it derives its meaning from spirit not flesh. the flesh profits nothing it is not spirit. remember where it say's try the spirits to see if they are of
God. Jesus said the words i am speaking are spirit (not flesh) .
Hi Gene,
If Christ is not the WORD
Can Christ then be
The WAY?
The TRUTH?
The LIFE?
The RESURRECTION?
The LIGHT?
The GATE?
etcQuote (Gene Balthrop @ June 26 2007,15:14) Tim > you are right it certanily was the divine reason or plan that shaped the existance of all things and it was with God and it WAS God.
just like the text say's. you have it right,hang on to what you have.your friend and fellow seeker of truth…….Gene
Hi Gene,
Much that men would like to see that Christ is said to be
The Reason
The Plan
The ThoughtIt is not written.
Nic > thats the problem with some bible students they only focuse on a particular scripture and are unable to take the subject from a over all stand point and the get caught up in an unending cycle of meannings all different from one another and go no where.
there is an old saying…you can't see the forest because of the trees, if you learn to pull all scripture that deal with a topic together in your mind and use that as your guide and with God's Spirit you will figure things out. remember the Spirit will bring all things which Jesus spoke in to your mind. Peace to you Nick. …..Gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,09:59) Hi not3,
He is physically the Son of God.
Scripture says he proceeded from and came from God.
I think monogenes rather says he derived directly from God before he came
But again you are not willing to conceed that when this “monogenes” son is put through Mary and half her DNA is contributed – this “monogenes” son is ALTERED!Hi not3,
Why should the tent in which Christ lived alter him?
He is the same yesterday, today and forever-and he no longer is flesh.Nick > i did not say Jesus did not speak the word he certanly did but those words weren't his just as he said they were the words of Him who sent Him, so who could that make him the word then.
was christ the way..yes he was the way to eternal life that expression was to tell us we need to do as he did because it's the way to life.your still in the forest.
back up and ask yourself in what way was he those things HE was not those things himself but he was the way to those things another waord the way he did it is the exact way we have to do it. Jesus was the example of what we have to do. didn't he say to him who overcomes even as i have, he was our example of how to live and have a right relationship with God the Father and it exatly like his.
again i repeat i never said Jesus didn't speak God The Farther's words to us. but being the messenger does not make him the massage .
i hopee you are not thinking i am degrading Jesus i am not. peace to you and all who love truth…Gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,15:58) Hi not3,
Why should the tent in which Christ lived alter him?
He is the same yesterday, today and forever-and he no longer is flesh.
Because the “tent” was Mary's contribution from the line of David. Jesus was a literal descendent – unless people don't believe that either?When a preexistent person is COMBINED with Mary – the result will be an altered person. Again, true conception will result in the combination of both parents.
1. Preexistent son + Mary's DNA = Same preexistent Son
2. Preexistent son + Mary's DNA = New SonWhich one? Why?
Hi not3,
Christ was truly physically fathered by God through the Spirit .
He was just like us-with half perfect Chromosomes.
Son of David.
Son of Man
Son of God.But also son of God before he came.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 26 2007,16:12) Hi not3,
Christ was truly physically fathered by God through the Spirit .
He was just like us-with half perfect Chromosomes.
Son of David.
Son of Man
Son of God.But also son of God before he came.
You had me until the very last sentence was tacked on.I'm afraid you cannot have it both ways.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 26 2007,16:02) Nick > i did not say Jesus did not speak the word he certanly did but those words weren't his just as he said they were the words of Him who sent Him, so who could that make him the word then. was christ the way..yes he was the way to eternal life that expression was to tell us we need to do as he did because it's the way to life.your still in the forest.
back up and ask yourself in what way was he those things HE was not those things himself but he was the way to those things another waord the way he did it is the exact way we have to do it. Jesus was the example of what we have to do. didn't he say to him who overcomes even as i have, he was our example of how to live and have a right relationship with God the Father and it exatly like his.
again i repeat i never said Jesus didn't speak God The Farther's words to us. but being the messenger does not make him the massage .
i hopee you are not thinking i am degrading Jesus i am not. peace to you and all who love truth…Gene
Hi Gene,
He is the Word because the Word says so.
And we must eat his flesh and drink his blood-the Word.
Can you grasp that?not3in1 .> what i believe, is Jesus never preexisted as a life form before him beining born as a flesh and blood human. i know there are scriptures that can be taken that way but to me he was in the plan of God before the foundations of the world. Peter seams to put it that way when he said that christ was (ordained) from the foundation of the world (BUT) was manifested in our time. God ordained cyrus, Jeremiah, David, and even Jesus told God the deciples were his in the beginning.
I believe Jesus was 100% like we are with no advantage other than God was with Him, it was a man that died on that cross or tree not a God.
thats just my take onthe subject. peace to all seekers of truth you will find it. Gene.
Nick…> i certanly can grasp that what it means to eat the flesh and drink the blood of Jesus. it means the same thing we do when we eat or drink anything, we take it to ourselves. so let me ask you a question .
what are we eating and drinking is it Jesus Christ”s sacurfice or is it the Lamb that GOD sacrificed for our sin's. Jesus is God the Father's sacrifice for our sin's it was God's justice that was being demonstrated. His requirement for our sin's that was being paid for.
your focusing on Jesus instead of the Father God who Jesus focesed on.
Jesus was God's plan not his own plan. Just as it (BECAUSE) he poured out his soul unto death God his God and our God put him above every name in heaven and earth. not because he preexisted.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
