The Trinity Doctrine

[NickHassan]

Hi w,
You say
“You are a poor debater my friend , because when you have no response or answer to a thing you try to delude by reverting back to your canned doctrines.”

If this was a debating game then I would not be interested but I am here to defend the integrity of the Scriptures against the attacks from the old enemy,Tradition.

Mk 7
” 13Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. “

and vain speculations

Romans 1:21
For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

2 Corinthians 10:5
We are destroying speculations and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ,

2 Timothy 2:23
But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi w, You say “You are a poor debater my friend , because when you have no response or answer to a thing you try to delude by reverting back to your canned doctrines.” If this was a debating game then I would not be interested but I am here to defend the integrity of the Scriptures against the attacks from the old enemy,Tradition. Mk 7 ” 13Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye. “ and vain speculations Romans 1:21 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 2 Corinthians 10:5 We are destroying speculations and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ, 2 Timothy 2:23 But refuse foolish and ignorant speculations, knowing that they produce quarrels.

NH

Now your in denial if you dont think this is friendly debate!

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hiw, You be the judge. But we serve the Master in this regard as best we can hoping to rescue some from the fire in the knowledge that the world is in the power of the evil one but He who is in us is greater that he who is in the world.

NH

Why would I trade a more scriptural view of God for a lessor one?

[NickHassan]

Hi w,
Trinity is not taught in scripture.

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi w, Trinity is not taught in scripture.

NH

Henotheism Or polytheism is not taught in scripture!

[NickHassan]

Hi w,
It is not us who teach that we should worship anyone but God Himself.
We do not uphold other deities to worship because scripture tells us

“6But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.”

You should listen to Jesus too on this matter.

Jn 17
” 3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. “

Jn 4
” 23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi w, It is not us who teach that we should worship anyone but God Himself. We do not uphold other deities to worship because scripture tells us “6But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.” You should listen to Jesus too on this matter. Jn 17 ” 3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. “ Jn 4 ” 23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. ————–

NH

Really?

Then who wrote the following…

First of all I think that we can all agree that the Father is the Almighty and the Most High God. But I need a scripture that says Jesus and the Holy Spirit are also Almighty. ***I know that the scriptures say that Jesus is the Mighty God in (Isaiah 9:6) and I believe this***. But almighty means to be the mightiest of the mighty. This is scriptural because even though Jesus is great, his Father is greater. One scripture each to prove that Jesus and the Holy Spirit are Almighty would be helpful.

Now you will see a verse where the Greek word “theos” is used to describe Jesus. John 20:28-29 (English-NIV)  
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God! (theos)”
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

Next I will show you a verse where the Hebrew word “eloah” is used to describe Jesus.
Isaiah 9:6 (English-NIV)
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God (el), Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Well first of all it is not incorrect to say that the Word was god…..

So we humans were intended to share in the divine nature too, we are gods, but we are not the God. John 1:1 shows us that the Word was god (divine)….

So who is Jesus. The following Statements are from the scriptures, and should be the words that we trust in in order to understand who Jesus really is.
7. He is worthy to be worshipped by Angels.
See Hebrews 1:1-6

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
It is so easy to muddy the water and find scriptures that are slightly different or do not show the simplest truths but we are not on a dodo hunt but rather looking for the plainest and simplest things that children can grasp.
Scripture says in the mouth of Jesus that the Father is whom we call God and he is the Son of God.
That is enough for me.
How about you?

[Adam Pastor]

WJ or Nick
I am curious

In which thread, on which page, did Nick say
“Well first of all it is not incorrect to say that the Word was god…..

So we humans were intended to share in the divine nature too, we are gods, but we are not the God. John 1:1 shows us that the Word was god (divine)…”

I am looking for the post. Thanks

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi W, It is so easy to muddy the water and find scriptures that are slightly different or do not show the simplest truths but we are not on a dodo hunt but rather looking for the plainest and simplest things that children can grasp. Scripture says in the mouth of Jesus that the Father is whom we call God and he is the Son of God. That is enough for me. How about you?

NH These are t8s quotes!

[Worshipping Jesus]

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WJ or Nick I am curious In which thread, on which page, did Nick say “Well first of all it is not incorrect to say that the Word was god….. So we humans were intended to share in the divine nature too, we are gods, but we are not the God. John 1:1 shows us that the Word was god (divine)…” I am looking for the post. Thanks

AP

Most of it is in the beginning of this thread. The rest is in the statement in the article on the trinity for this forum..

Also NH sorry Some of that may not be t8 because I dont know who wrote the statement for this forum!

[NickHassan]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 29 2006,09:26)

Hi W, It is so easy to muddy the water and find scriptures that are slightly different or do not show the simplest truths but we are not on a dodo hunt but rather looking for the plainest and simplest things that children can grasp. Scripture says in the mouth of Jesus that the Father is whom we call God and he is the Son of God. That is enough for me. How about you?

Hi W,
Was that a NO?

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 29 2006,09:26) Hi W, It is so easy to muddy the water and find scriptures that are slightly different or do not show the simplest truths but we are not on a dodo hunt but rather looking for the plainest and simplest things that children can grasp. Scripture says in the mouth of Jesus that the Father is whom we call God and he is the Son of God. That is enough for me. How about you? Hi W, Was that a NO?

NH

No.

What about the Spirit of God?

[NickHassan]

Hi w,
God's Spirit is poured out from God through His Son and throughout the Body of Christ uniting us with Himself.

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 30 2006,04:16)

Quote Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 29 2006,09:26) Hi W, It is so easy to muddy the water and find scriptures that are slightly different or do not show the simplest truths but we are not on a dodo hunt but rather looking for the plainest and simplest things that children can grasp. Scripture says in the mouth of Jesus that the Father is whom we call God and he is the Son of God. That is enough for me. How about you? Hi W, Was that a NO? NH No. What about the Spirit of God?

Hi w,
Why can you not accept the plain teaching of the scriptures about the relationship between God and His Son?
Have the teachings and traditions of men overshadowed the importance of the words of God to you?
Has human wisdom supplanted the wisdom of God?

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi w, Why can you not accept the plain teaching of the scriptures about the relationship between God and His Son? Have the teachings and traditions of men overshadowed the importance of the words of God to you? Has human wisdom supplanted the wisdom of God?

NH

NH you say about the words of Jesus….

“Inference is a poor witness to truth.”

I gave you the following scriptures…

Jesus speaks of the Holy Spirit as a person.

John 14:16
And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17 Even] the Spirit of truth; whom [hos] the world cannot receive, because it seeth him [autos] not, neither knoweth him [autos]: but ye know him [autos]; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

Notice he says “seeth him [autos] not, neither knoweth him [autos]”.

The word for “ him” is autos {ow-tos'}
1) himself, herself, themselves, itself
2) he, she, it
3) the same
It was translated AV – him 1952, his 1084, their 318, he 252, her 242, they 121.
That’s over 3000 times in the New Testament “autos” is used referring to a person.

There are many other scriptures pointing to the Spirit of God as a person.

Can it be any plainer?

And this was your response…“Inference is a poor witness to truth.”

And now you ask me…
“Why can you not accept the plain teaching of the scriptures about the relationship between God and His Son?
Have the teachings and traditions of men overshadowed the importance of the words of God to you?
Has human wisdom supplanted the wisdom of God?”

Stop being a Popinjay NH.

[NickHassan]

Hi w.
You say
“There are many other scriptures pointing to the Spirit of God as a person.

Can it be any plainer? “

Well yes actually.
If any scriptures existed that said God's Spirit is another person from God Himself.

None exist and none could as God cannot be separate from His own Spirit any more than we can live without ours.

Jas 2
“26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.”

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi w. You say “There are many other scriptures pointing to the Spirit of God as a person. Can it be any plainer? “ Well yes actually. If any scriptures existed that said God's Spirit is another person from God Himself. None exist and none could as God cannot be separate from His own Spirit any more than we can live without ours. Jas 2 “26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.”

There you go again. Dance, Dance, Dance around the truth NH.

Stop being a Popinjay.

Practice what you preach.

You say…..

Quote

“the last Adam was made a quickening spirit”. Indeed he was MADE a quickening Spirit by the outpouring of the Spirit of Christ to his body on earth after his ascension to glory.

Show me a scripture where it says Jesus was made MADE a quickening Spirit by the outpouring of the Spirit of Christ to his body on earth after his ascension to glory.

NH you say about the words of Jesus….

“Inference is a poor witness to truth.”

Should I believe any inferences that you make to the scriptures?

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
When was the Spirit of Christ poured out by God in the name of Jesus?

Jn 7
” 37In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.

38He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

39(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)”

Lk 24
” 45Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

46And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:

47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

48And ye are witnesses of these things.

49And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.”

Acts 1
” 5For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

6When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

7And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

8But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. “

Acts 2
” 1And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.

2And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.

3And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.

4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. “

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi W, When was the Spirit of Christ poured out by God in the name of Jesus? Jn 7 ” 37In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. 38He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. 39(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)” Lk 24 ” 45Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48And ye are witnesses of these things. 49And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.” Acts 1 ” 5For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence. 6When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 7And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. 8But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. “ Acts 2 ”  1And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. 2And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. 4And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. ”

NH

I dont see the scripture where it says…..

“Jesus was made MADE a quickening Spirit by the outpouring of the Spirit of Christ to his body on earth after his ascension to glory. “

I think you are making an inferrence here.

Now you are being a Ninnyhammer!

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