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Quote You seem to team up with those who attacks us, regardless of their theology. That says something does it not? Soxan for example has not given a reason for what he believes nor explained what he believes. Neither has he given a reason for why he disbelieves the scriptures we quote here often, regarding God being the Father and God having a son. Soxan attacks and persecutes those who give scripture as their creed, yet you are happy to encourage him.
Please show me where I encouraged him? (I assume you mean his approach)Quote He he, very good work David! I'm impressed. It reminded me of the relativist's who state that there is no objective truth. Is that a true statement?
This post was addressed to David, not Soxan. It had nothing to do with Soxan what-so-ever. Hmmmm…I'm beginning to tire of your endless misrepresentations of me t8.Quote Matthew 26:63 But Jesus held his peace, And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God. 26:64
Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven. 26:65
Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.John 10:33
The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God
When asked was he the son of god they were asking whether he was god because they were trying to have him killed for blasphemy.
Being a child of god is not blasphemy.
John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.Liljohn,
Very good points! “Son of God” and “God” are not antithetical terms. Jesus calling Himself God’s Son in the first century Judea culture equated to Him claiming equality with God, or calling Himself God. At least in the eyes of the Jews:John 5:18
“For this cause therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God,”Hi Is 1.18 and liljon,
Should we also grasp the false interpretations of the first century Jews?
Are they our teachers now?
Do you believe in them?You claim that Jesus is the equal of the Father in a trinity.
Does that not make you too guilty of blasphemy in their eyes?
Since you follow them how can you too escape their condemnation?
Are you sure you like their interpretations?
Quote (liljon @ Nov. 22 2005,21:49) When they asked was he the son of god what do you think they were asking him?
Hi,
If they were not asking him if he was the Son of God it is too mysterious for me.Quote (soxan @ Nov. 22 2005,06:31) nick you hate the truth! you hate letting the bible interpret itself, you love to take that responsibility! nick i hate the way you and your ilk twist the scriptures . nick you hate exposure, it feels yucky doesn`t? nick you hate a lot.
Hi Soxan,Do you mean to distract, vent or are you simply bored?
Could you put your efforts to better use as you are picking on the wrong bunch: wrong bunch because we do not deserve your hatred even if you think we do; wrong bunch because as followers of Christ and preachers of his gospel, your hatred works for our good; wrong bunch because your hatred misses its goal by utterly failing to incite us to anger… hilarity on occasion, perhaps, but we can't even begin to take you seriously. I wish to invite you, to lay aside your anger and come to a place of living water, joy and refreshment in Christ with us.
Be blessed as you do this or else as David says, let my peace return to me.
Hi,
Trinity is not taught by Jesus or the apostles.
It was not taught by Moses or the prophets.
So how does one show faithfulness to God?
Should we accept these new teachings or not?2Jn 1.9
“..the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son”It seems safer to avoid this traffic snarl.
now you guys resort to intimidation. Is 1:18 never condoned my methods but because yous can`t contend with him on an intellectaul level you resort to intimidation and false accusations![nice work t8, keep letting your darkness swallow light] Christ-like? i don`t think so! Peace? you don`t know what it is! Philistines!
molecules and atoms are not mentioned by Jesus or the bible, yet He knew that they exsisted since He was is and always will be God! He knew because He made them and everything else. Nick your logic or lack of, never fails to amaze me! Bird! let me get my animals correct; ah yes! Wolf!
And just as they did not approve of holding God in accurate knowledge, God gave them up to a DISAPPROVED MENTAL STATE, to do the things not fitting, FILLED AS THEY WERE with all unrighteousness, wickedness, covetousness, badness, being full of envy, murder, STRIFE, deceit, MALICIOUS DISPOSTION, being whisperers, BACKBITERS, haters of God, insolent, HAUGHTY, self-assuming, INVENTORS OF INJURIOUS THINGS, disobedient to parents, without understanding, false to agreements, having no natural affection, MERCILESS. Although these know full well the righteous decree of God, that those practicing such things are deserving of death. . . .
Quote wrong bunch because we do not deserve your hatred even if you think we do
Cubes, Jesus wasn't well liked because he told the truth. He was hated “without cause.” (John 15:25) His early followers were treated the same, even as Jesus said they would be repeatedly. It was to be expected. They actually rejoiced when they were treated badly because of their faith.
Saxan or Satan don't want us to know the truth. Truth bothers them. It means they are responsible for their actions. Such ones are happy listening to the pope or their mom who told them everything would be ok.
Can they defend their beliefs with the Bible? No.
Does that bother them? I think it does greatly.What can they do? What is their only course of action? Sadly, it's acting out much of the things quoted above.
Quote molecules and atoms are not mentioned by Jesus or the bible, yet He knew that they exsisted since He was is and always will be God!
Yes, I agree Soxan.ooops…. I just encouraged Soxan!! What was I thinking!! No trinitarians are allowed encouragement at heaven.net!! It's a breach of t8's protocol!!
No seriously, Soxan you are 100% correct, the Bible does indeed affirm that Jesus created the entire universe. I am in fact writing about that very thing to David.
David, i'm doing my best to get this beast finished this week as I promised my wife I would stay off theological message boards from next week onwards (for a spell), but I have social committments every night this week and into the weekend, so its going to take some late nights.
Quote (soxan @ Nov. 23 2005,05:23) molecules and atoms are not mentioned by Jesus or the bible, yet He knew that they exsisted since He was is and always will be God! He knew because He made them and everything else. Nick your logic or lack of, never fails to amaze me! Bird! let me get my animals correct; ah yes! Wolf!
Hi soxan,
Molecules and atoms related to created matter. I am sure God loves us studying to figure out how He put together all the intricacies of His creation.His nature is entirely another issue.
Dare we go beyond what He has told us about Himself through Jesus and the apostles, Moses and the prophets? Are we clever enough to put God in a box and brave enough to define Him according to our simple minds.
That is arrogance of the clay towards the Potter.
Fear God.
Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 23 2005,16:50) Hi t8,
I have never condoned Soxan's approach, actually I told him not long ago that its far more productive to reason with people from scripture (or words to that effect). I'm just being friendly to him because no one else is.
Great, then you to admit that Saxon' approach is out of line and therefore he is not doing the right thing in that area. I can accept that.
Yes t8, and your assessment of has again proven to be unfounded and unfair. I would like an apology please.
Quote (soxan @ Nov. 23 2005,01:14) you ever read a dictionary? look it up. Twit!
Soxan,Have you ever looked up this verse?
Matthew 5:22
But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca, ' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.You tell us to read scripture, when that is pretty much what this site is about. Yet it seems that you have been found wanting in the area that you accuse us of neglecting.
I guess if you carry on with your usual slander and calling us fools, then remember Matthew 5:22 and let it be a thorn in your conscience everytime you call someone a fool or Raca.
Quote (Is 1:18 @ Nov. 24 2005,03:26) Yes t8, and your assessment of me has again proven to be unfounded and unfair. I would like an apology please. Is 1:18,
Certainly, you have my deepest apology. The way the speech was quoted it appeared to me that you were encouraging Soxan with his work. Must have been late. Very sorry.
I remember further back when you encouraged other(s) who was/were against us and I thought you were doing it again. Perhaps I got the wrong end of the stick there too?
thx
Quote Is 1:18, Certainly, you have my deepest apology. The way the speech was quoted it appeared to me that you were encouraging Soxan with his work. Must have been late. Very sorry.
OK, I accept that. Forgiven and forgotten.Quote I remember further back when you encouraged other(s) who was/were against us and I thought you were doing it again. Perhaps I got the wrong end of the stick there too?
Hmmmm, I can't recall any occasions when you have encouraged a non-unitarian either, but PLENTY of encouragement for those with like-minded theology. I understand that that's the way it is in places like this, any encouragement for those who hold a percieved false doctrine might somehow validate their views. That would be counter productive.Quote Yes t8, and your assessment of has again proven to be unfounded and unfair. I would like an apology please.
I see you deleted my double post, only the wrong one. I forgot to add an important word (i bold) the first time but because my editing function was revoked I have to do this sometimes.Hi,
Jn 8.54f
“…it is my Father who glorifies me, of whom you say 'He is our God'”This verse is a watershed one for trintarians.
Jesus says the Father is the God of the Jews.
Trintarians say the Father is part of a trinity God.
If so then only the Father was worshipped by the Jews.
Jesus does not say they were wrong to do so.
He never says that things now change and a trinity become their God.
But that is what trintarians must now believe.
They must now say that to continue to worship God as the Father only is evil.
They must now judge Moses and the prophets as ill informed at least.
They were inspired by the Spirit too so the Spirit is divided.
Jesus worshipped with the Jews giving no indication they were deceived.
It divides the OT as inadequate, from the different New Testament.
It calls all of the Old Testament into question if only part information was shown there.
It divides the OT people from the “more enlightened” NT bondservants.
Now a new God becomes the object of worship made of three parts.
Yes OT worship must have been to the wrong God if trinity is true.
Funny thing he told them true worshippers will worship the Father in spirit and truth.
Strange too there was so little fanfare about such a dramatic change.
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