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gene
Quote Terricca…………Good words, but it is better you do them then just quote them. You sit here it appears over and over as one who is Judging other but neglecting yourself. “Judge not that you be not Judged, for in the manor in which you Judge so you shall be Judge” , so who has made you a Judge among Us , Just becasue you can copy scripture means nothing anyone can do that, living them is what counts in my book, that is much harder then just copying them> IMO
“Judge not that you be not Judged, for in the MANOR in which you Judge so you shall be Judge”
LOOK AT THE WORD MANOR;
and remember each time you express your ideas and opinions if they are not true to scriptures they are then lies,NO
when you answer to other and disagree with them are you not judging them and their thoughts or understanding ,yes we do that all
but it is what you say that as to be true to Gods word ,NO
because it is by our words that we will be judge (saying truth or lies )
Terricca…………Like i said better YOU do them YOURSELF then tell others and try to pass YOUR OWN worthless Judgment on them. IMO
Why say unto thy brother, let me remove the speck in your eye when you have a LOG in your own eye, first get the Log out of your own eye and then you can see how to remove the speck in you brothers eye.
Pierre you still have the LOG in YOUR own eye but are trying desperately to remove the speck from other eyes. IMO
peace and love…………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 04 2011,09:14) Terricca…………Like i said better YOU do them YOURSELF then tell others and try to pass YOUR OWN worthless Judgment on them. IMO Why say unto thy brother, let me remove the speck in your eye when you have a LOG in your own eye, first get the Log out of your own eye and then you can see how to remove the speck in you brothers eye.
Pierre you still have the LOG in YOUR own eye but are trying desperately to remove the speck from other eyes. IMO
peace and love…………………………………………………gene
geneand I am sure you would be the one to take the LOG out of my eye ?? right ?
Terricca…………….No it will take more then me to do that i am afraid, if Jesus' could not do it to the Pharisees i doubt if I can do it to you, but God the Father can i do believe and will some day, hopefully, and in that day i would like to see all your icons and insulting remarks you make then. Pierre your insulting words do draw a accurate picture of your heart, just like Mike's insulting word do also. IMO
peace and love……………………………………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 29 2011,12:03) T8………………if i am following you right you simply do not believe in a resurrection of our Bodies. Even though scripture say that we will witness the redemption of our BODIES. (ROM 8:23…..> T8, why witness the redemption of our bodies if our bodies are no longer needed. and again this scripture, “if the Spirit that raised Christ Jesus from the grave abide (IN) you (IT) shall also (now notice) “QUICKEN” YOUR “MORTAL” BODIES. Now what does it say it will 'QUICKEN? is it not OUR BODIES ?. Here is where i see your problem lies, Our bodies are a product of our DNA, that DNA can replicate it self again and again without ever ceasing . God has shown in scripture that it is truly a PHYSICAL resurrection of OUR BODIES at the valley of Dry bones that take place, No where does it show there is a different Body But a replica of our same bodies. Jesus same body was resurected also, That is why i tried to show you the illustration of the Pepper Plant even that exact physical body can be replicated so (IT) still remains alive becasue of the seed and that same Body can be reconstructed from that seed. So can Man .
Job 19:26…..> And though after my skin worms destory the body, “yet in MY FLESH” shall I see God.
T8…..> why do you think Jesus toled his disciples that ever hair on their hear was numbered. If their Bodies were not need again then why even number them?
Tell me T8 what do you have against Humans retaining their Physical Bodies?> You have no scripture that say we are going to have a different body do you. I know it say that which is Planted is NOT the BODY that Shall Be. I agree with that, But that BODY Which Shall be is exactly like the Body that was Planted before it died except it has eternal life (IN) it>
T8……..produce all the scriptures that say we are not going to have Physical Bodies in the resurrection I have post many to you showing we will have Physical bodies . I have shown that a “LIVING SOUL” is a Body that has the Spirit of Life (IN) it. clearly shown in Genesis. So i think it is up to you to prove me wrong by scriptures . IMO
Peace and love………………………………..gene
Gene.I am asking you a direct question.
Please do not try and divert his time. I am happy to answer any questions you have including these, but before I possibly go on a wild goose chase, I want to clarify your understanding on something which I have asked in a number of different ways.You believe that man is spirit and body.
You are also aware that man will get a new body and a new spirit.So what part of the man is saved? None?
I made the point that when I was saved, I was sure that I was still me, albeit with a new spirit that desires not to sin. However, I am still in my body of death, but one day will be given a new body. Yet I will still be me.
So what is me if I am still me, but I have a new spirit and body. How can I be me, if all of me is replaced? Which part of me remains me in this exchange of old to new?
Do you see what I am asking?
I will rephrase one more time in the hope that this time you get it.
I am saved, not replaced. So what part of me is saved after I get my new spirit and my new body?
Do you comprehend what I am asking. If not, I will have another go.
But please try and not divert me away from this point. It is important before I can move on in this topic with you.Quote (t8 @ Oct. 04 2011,11:20) I am asking you a direct question.
Please do not try and divert his time. I am happy to answer any questions you have including these, but before I possibly go on a wild goose chase, I want to clarify your understanding on something which I have asked in a number of different ways.You believe that man is spirit and body.
You are also aware that man will get a new body and a new spirit.So what part of the man is saved? None?
I made the point that when I was saved, I was sure that I was still me, albeit with a new spirit that desires not to sin. However, I am still in my body of death, but one day will be given a new body. Yet I will still be me.
So what is me if I am still me, but I have a new spirit and body. How can I be me, if all of me is replaced? Which part of me remains me in this exchange of old to new?
Do you see what I am asking?
I will rephrase one more time in the hope that this time you get it.
I am saved, not replaced. So what part of me is saved after I get my new spirit and my new body?
Do you comprehend what I am asking. If not, I will have another go.
But please try and not divert me away from this point. It is important before I can move on in this topic with you.
T8…………You are asking a lot of questions here, but i will try to answer them.1…..You said you are saved not replaced right? That flies in the face of not believing in the resurrection (notice) of the dead So i would have to ask you do you even believe in the resurrection at all?, and if so what kind of resurrection is it?, does it” witness the redemption of your “body”?, My example of the Pepper plant was to show that we can be exactly replaced with an exact same kind of body. You also seen to think a Physical bodies can not live forever, which has been disproved in Genesis. Adam could have never died had he taken of the tree of Life, GOD said clearly. Our bodies can and are going to be regenerated with most of the same active DNA that we now and for ever will Posses. That DNA contains everything about you as far as you personality and personal characteristics has your complete demeanor it is loaded into your DNA> The way you look the way you walk the way you carry yourself, left handed or right handed you very personality is all there to. If you were to be cloned your clone would have every identical cell you have and look and act Just like you do Now. The only difference would be the Spirit ( intellect) it receives into it memory cells. Which stores it in the cells of you brain billions of them When a child is born it starts loading its cells with information , but the capacity is already their, it simply uses what it already has to accumulate that Knowledge which gives it its intellect (spirits) which it processes its Physical Brain.
2……No i do not believe a “MAN” is Spirit and a BODY, I believe a MAN is a BODY with the Breath of LIFE (IN) HIM. God made Adam as a Man formed him out of the dust or clay of the ground before He came to life , But once God breathe life into his Nostrils He (THEN) Became a LIVING SOUL, a body + Breath = A “LIVING SOUL”, with the capacity to absorb SPIRIT or (intellect) either good or evil into Himself. So if you ask does a Man “Contain Spirit” i would say Yes and that spirit can be taken away and and replaced if all spirit were taken He simply would be a zombie void of all thought much like a little Baby when it is Born is. That “living soul” would Die if left to find for itself and so would any physical created being whether Man or an Animal. There is no rational thought in any new born baby it must be loaded into it over time. Why do you think it say we must Sow to the Spirit of GOD, becasue if we take in GOD Spirit we will reap Life eternal, not temporary as we have now.
3….> So what part of Man is saved?, (ALL) of MAN is SAVED the complete MAN is. Just as Jesus was and Is. GOD simply takes out of us some Spirits and adds new Spirit into us that gives eternal life. We become a “New Person” when that takes Place we must be Born “AGAIN” with WATER “AND” SPIRIT. All physical Life forms must have “WATER “in them in order to exist as a Physical entity. But a “BODY” still is useless unless Spirit is also add to it, causing it to animate itself. WE must be born “AGAIN” of water and spirit. Not of just Spirit as you and others assume, but WATER and SPIRIT. Both are needed in this life and the life to come. Therefore he says “AGAIN” not “DIFFERENT” but “AGAIN”>
4………Yes we will be given a “NEW BODY” exactly like the one you now have with perhaps some slight modifications (IN) it . It will be exactly like the Body Jesus had after his resurrection from the Grave, IMO, Though it was a “SPIRITUAL” Body it was NOT a “SPIRIT BODY” as He said it was not. There exist no such thing as a “SPIRIT BODY”. Spirit is what is (IN) Bodies.
5…> What part of us is saved after we get our mew Spirit and New Body. First you have already recieved your New Spirit if you are indeed saved, the only thing lacking is the New Body. Which you will receive at the resurrection, Until then once you die it is lights out brother, for ever until a resurrection , that witness the redemption of your Body takes place. The spirit in you does not die just your body dies and with it your “LIVING SOUL”. The big problem here is, and mostly ever where, is people do not understand what Spirit IS> It is NOT the PERSON it is What is (IN) the PERSON.
I hope i did not divert to far brother but you have posed a lot of questions IMO
peace and love to you and yours T8………………………………….gene
T8……………I am still waiting for your response to my post on this if we need to take it one step at a time lets do so, i would like to dialog with you on this topic brother.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………………..gene
Terricca………..No, that body will decay and go back to the earth, but with that same DNA God will produce another. This is called the resurrection , that wittiness the redemption of our “BODIES”. and again It (that present body) is sown in corruption; it (that replicated body) is raised in incorruption: It is t(hat body) is sown in dishonor ; it (that replicated body) is raised in glory; it (this body) is sown in weakness; it (the new replicated body) is raised in power: It (this body) is sown a Natural (a earth functioning body) It (the body to be ) is raised a Spiritual driven (BODY). This is all about our Bodies and Spirit are not BODIES. Spirits are what is (IN) “BODIES”. IMO
peace and love………………………………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 15 2011,09:04) Terricca………..No, that body will decay and go back to the earth, but with that same DNA God will produce another. This is called the resurrection , that wittiness the redemption of our “BODIES”. and again It (that present body) is sown in corruption; it (that replicated body) is raised in incorruption: It is t(hat body) is sown in dishonor ; it (that replicated body) is raised in glory; it (this body) is sown in weakness; it (the new replicated body) is raised in power: It (this body) is sown a Natural (a earth functioning body) It (the body to be ) is raised a Spiritual driven (BODY). This is all about our Bodies and Spirit are not BODIES. Spirits are what is (IN) “BODIES”. IMO peace and love………………………………………………..gene
genewhy is it you do not answer Mike question ??
T8………….> I am still waiting for you response to my Posts , let continue our discussions , do you even believe in the resurrection that will “witness the redemption of “OUR BODIES” What does this “OUR BODIES” mean to you T8?
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 04 2011,17:38) Terricca…………….No it will take more then me to do that i am afraid, if Jesus' could not do it to the Pharisees i doubt if I can do it to you, but God the Father can i do believe and will some day, hopefully, and in that day i would like to see all your icons and insulting remarks you make then. Pierre your insulting words do draw a accurate picture of your heart, just like Mike's insulting word do also. IMO peace and love……………………………………………………………….gene
geneI did not insult you ,I just pointing out that what you say is not scriptural and you stand in you falls believe so it become ridiculous to pursue this discussion any further ,it is already do not make sens ,
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 17 2011,08:55) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 04 2011,17:38) Terricca…………….No it will take more then me to do that i am afraid, if Jesus' could not do it to the Pharisees i doubt if I can do it to you, but God the Father can i do believe and will some day, hopefully, and in that day i would like to see all your icons and insulting remarks you make then. Pierre your insulting words do draw a accurate picture of your heart, just like Mike's insulting word do also. IMO peace and love……………………………………………………………….gene
geneI did not insult you ,I just pointing out that what you say is not scriptural and you stand in you falls believe so it become ridiculous to pursue this discussion any further ,it is already do not make sens ,
Pierre
Pierre……….So get out of it then OK>
T8……….Still waiting but still no response from you are you considering what i have posted to you?
peace and love………………………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 18 2011,07:06) Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 17 2011,08:55) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 04 2011,17:38) Terricca…………….No it will take more then me to do that i am afraid, if Jesus' could not do it to the Pharisees i doubt if I can do it to you, but God the Father can i do believe and will some day, hopefully, and in that day i would like to see all your icons and insulting remarks you make then. Pierre your insulting words do draw a accurate picture of your heart, just like Mike's insulting word do also. IMO peace and love……………………………………………………………….gene
geneI did not insult you ,I just pointing out that what you say is not scriptural and you stand in you falls believe so it become ridiculous to pursue this discussion any further ,it is already do not make sens ,
Pierre
Pierre……….So get out of it then OK>
T8……….Still waiting but still no response from you are you considering what i have posted to you?
peace and love………………………………………………gene
geneI was talking of you not the topic
Pierre
Terricca…………..Right, that is your problem here you talk about the person and have little or no understanding about the topic in discussion, You have said that right at least. You jump over the topics being discussed to make personal insults like you brother Mike does, Thank God T8 not like you two idiots. IMO
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 21 2011,08:40) Terricca…………..Right, that is your problem here you talk about the person and have little or no understanding about the topic in discussion, You have said that right at least. You jump over the topics being discussed to make personal insults like you brother Mike does, Thank God T8 not like you two idiots. IMO
genethis is not called for
Terricca………………Yes it is Pierre. IMO So Go cry to you monitor friend maybe he can hand out another tile for you. Between you and him you can get everyone kicked of this site except those who agree with your false Preexistences views of course. IMO
Gene.
I will try and make it clearer for you.
If we are not a soul in a body and with a spirit in the soul, then when we are given a new body and spirit, then we are replaced because there is nothing of us left.
If YOU are merely the combination of 2 things, then when those 2 things are replaced, then you no longer exist.
e.g., if I chop my arm off I am still me. If I get a heart transplant, I am still me. The body appears to be replaceable and we know we are given a new body.If you make the argument that we are the body, and the spirit which is part of God gives us life, then you also have to make the argument that we will have the same body after death. Is this where you are coming from.
I am trying to clarify your position, otherwise I cannot see any logic in what you are saying.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 21 2011,12:59) Terricca………………Yes it is Pierre. IMO So Go cry to you monitor friend maybe he can hand out another tile for you. Between you and him you can get everyone kicked of this site except those who agree with your false Preexistences views of course. IMO
genefor your info I am not an Idiot =
id·i·ot
[id-ee-uht] Show IPAnoun
1.
Informal . an utterly foolish or senseless person.2.
Psychology . (no longer in technical use; considered offensive) a person of the lowest order in a former and discarded classification of mental retardation, having a mental age of less than three years old and an intelligence quotient under 25.I would never call you that ,God forbid ,
Pierre
Quote (t8 @ Nov. 21 2011,09:11) Gene. I will try and make it clearer for you.
If we are not a soul in a body and with a spirit in the soul, then when we are given a new body and spirit, then we are replaced because there is nothing of us left.
If YOU are merely the combination of 2 things, then when those 2 things are replaced, then you no longer exist.
e.g., if I chop my arm off I am still me. If I get a heart transplant, I am still me. The body appears to be replaceable and we know we are given a new body.If you make the argument that we are the body, and the spirit which is part of God gives us life, then you also have to make the argument that we will have the same body after death. Is this where you are coming from.
I am trying to clarify your position, otherwise I cannot see any logic in what you are saying.
T8………..I think we both agree with Spirit being (IN) us all and when we die (IT) goes back to who gave (IT)> Now if God gave it it is ours right?. even if it returns to him who gave it. remember when Jesus said He commended His Spirit to GOD. What he was dong was placing his mental intellect or Spirit into the hands of GOD that was His Spirit (intellects) given by GOD to him. Now lets deal with what is left, the Body/Soul, this is a living being it is much like a Plane that sits on the tarmac but goes no where unless the engines are running but the man who flies it is the Pilot i.e. the Spirit, it can leave the Body or like the Plot can leave the plane , but the plane will go no where even if the engines are running it has no (INTELLECT) it self even if its power to run and all thing function in it. it is useless without the Pilot.Mow lets look at a man …> He has a Body (like a Plane does) He has a Motor that can run, Now when the Body starts to function it is like starting the engine of the Body or Plan in my example. God make a Body i.e a Plane but it had not life (in it) until the motor was started (God breathed in the man and he became a “LIVING SOUL” The man was not a LIVING SOUL untill He was Started up so to Speak. Much like a Plane is dead untill it is started up, but it still is a Plane Just as a Body is still a B ody rather it is running or not It just is Not ALIVE until it is STARTED UP and then the Man or Plane is considered Living or running in the case of a Plane, Now a Plan is a Plane rather it is running or Not so is a Body a soul rather it is alive or not, but once the plane is running it is alive so-to speak, the same with a man once he is alive he is a “LIVING SOUL” and if he is dead he is a Dead Soul and he is completely non existent, there for it say God can destory us in the Grave How by not resurrecting us from that State and in order for that to happen He must restore a new Body and start us again and then we again Become a “LIVING SOUL” as apposed to a dead one. Then He adds Spirit back into us again and we piloted by those spirits (IN) us much like a Pilot controls and Pilots his plane.
Therefore God can destory us by simply leaving us in the grave . If the plane is destoryed it can no longer fly it is gone for ever its engine and all part are gone. But a New Plane can be built and if the pilot can come again and fly it.
Remember Jesus said don't fear him who can destory the body, and after that can do no more, why because God can rebuild it again, but fear him who can destory both body and soul, Where? in the grave , How by just not resurrection a Body and adding Spirit back into it again.
T8………..Show us one resurrection in scripture that did not contain a Body, go read the valley of dead Bones and see what is written there and remember what Jesus was raised with in fact all resurrections in scriptures contained bodies.
so i believe a Soul is a body and a LIVING SOUL is a LIVE BODY and the Spirit is Like the Pilot of the LIVING BODY/SOUL.
peace and love to you and yours T8……………………………….gene
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