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Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:56) Quote (georg @ Oct. 27 2009,08:50) Why would God want to say that the Sabbath is a sign between the children of Israel and then says it is for all. That makes no sense. Two times He did that. We are under a new covenant in His Blood and grace.
Luke 2:20 and Math. 22:36-40,Ephesians 2:8-9
Irene
Why would he say that? He did quote it. Maybe most people just don't understand. But then again it's between you and God.Maybe because the Sabbath is a perpetual covenant all by itself, and has no bearing on the old or the new.
Ask God, or TT. Your choice.
Not just the Sabbath…ALL THE LAWS are fufilled in Jesus Christ…So you no longer need to keep them and practice.If you believe in Jesus Christ the laws will be fufilled in you.
Just like our sins are paid for by belief in Jesus, therefore we do not have to perform the sacrifical ceremony of slaying a lamb to be forgiven for our sins…we can just believe.
We no longer need to burn fish eggs to drive out demons if we call on The Lord's name…
Therefore we no longer need to seek peace on The Sabbath if we have it eternally with Jesus Christ.
All the OT laws were fufilled in Jesus, remember he technically didn't keep the Sabbath either.
Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,08:56) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
So Jesus did not keep the Sabbath when he performed miracles on that day, because he was made a serveant to the sick.So where do you keep your understanding constitutionalist?
In the OT laws that you were never under, or in the new covenant in which all men are under.
Old covenants were for Jews only, gentile has only received Jesus' Blood as our promise to salvation.
And in “HIM” are all the laws fufilled.
Amen
You missed Jesus whole message, Jesus kept the Sabbath, but he kept it in the light it was to be kept, he did good on the sabbath, he did not do carpenter work on the sabbath, but he did heal the sick. Therin lies the difference.A farmer may not toil in the field but he can rescue his ox if it falls in a pit.
You may not pick crops for market but you can take enough to fill your belly.
You just don't get.
The pharasees would let a man die, because they lived by the letter and not the spirit of it.
Jesus would let a man live because he lived by the spirit of it and not the letter.
Someday you will see, instead of just tossing out your hate.
Many people argue that Jesus routinely broke the Sabbath, and by His example the Sabbath was abolished.
The Pharisees accused Jesus of breaking the Sabbath on a number of occasions.
Jesus almost always responded in a way that identified the Pharisees as legalists who claimed righteousness based upon their own works.
In His rebukes to the Pharisees, did Jesus effectively abolish the Sabbath commandment?
Matt 12:1-8
1 At that time Jesus went on the Sabbath through the grainfields, and His disciples became hungry and began to pick the heads of grain and eat.
2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said to Him, “Behold, your disciples do what is not lawful to do on a Sabbath.”
3 But He said to them, “Have you not read what David did, when he became hungry, he and his companions;
4 how he entered the house of God, and they ate the consecrated bread, which was not lawful for him to eat, nor for those with him, but for the priests alone?
5 “Or have you not read in the Law, that on the Sabbath the priests in the temple break the Sabbath, and are innocent?
6 “But I say to you, that something greater than the temple is here.
7 “But if you had known what this means, 'I desire compassion, and not a sacrifice,' you would not have condemned the innocent.
8 “For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.”Mark 3:1-6
1 And He entered again into a synagogue; and a man was there with a withe .
2 And they were watching Him to see if He would heal him on the Sabbath, in order that they might accuse Him.
3 And He said to the man with the withe , “Rise and come forward!”
4 And He said to them, “Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do harm, to save a life or to kill?” But they kept silent.
5 And after looking around at them with anger, grieved at their hardness of heart, He said to the man, “Stretch out your hand.” And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.
6 And the Pharisees went out and immediately began taking counsel with the Herodians against Him, as to how they might destroy Him.Luke 13:10-17
10 And He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath.
11 And behold, there was a woman who for eighteen years had had a sickness caused by a spirit; and she was bent double, and could not straighten up at all.
12 And when Jesus saw her, He called her over and said to her, “Woman, you are freed from your sickness.”
13 And He laid His hands upon her; and immediately she was made erect again, and began glorifying God.
14 And the synagogue official, indignant because Jesus had healed on the Sabbath, began saying to the multitude in response, “There are six days in which work should be done; therefore come during them and get healed, and not on the Sabbath day.”
15 But the Lord answered him and said, “You hypocrites, does not each of you on the Sabbath untie his ox or his donkey from the stall, and lead him away to water him?
16 “And this woman, a daughter of Abraham as she is, whom Satan has bound for eighteen long years, should she not have been released from this bond on the Sabbath day?”
17 And as He said this, all His opponents were being humiliated; and the entire multitude was rejoicing over all the glorious things being done by Him.Luke 14:1-5
1 And it came about when He went into the house of one of the leaders of the Pharisees on the Sabbath to eat bread, that they were watching Him closely.
2 And there, in front of Him was a certain man suffering from dropsy.
3 And Jesus answered and spoke to the lawyers and Pharisees, saying, “Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath, or not?”
4 But they kept silent. And He took hold of him, and healed him, and sent him away.
5 And He said to them, “Which one of you shall have a son or an ox fall into a well, and will not immediately pull him out on a Sabbath day ?”John 7:21-24
21 Jesus answered and said to them, “I did one deed, and you all marvel.
22 “On this account Moses has given you circumcision (not because it is from Moses, but from the fathers), and on the Sabbath you circumcise a man.
23 “If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath that the Law of Moses may not be broken, are you angry with Me because I made an entire man well on the Sabbath?
24 “Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.”Notice in each of these accounts, the discussion is not about whether to keep the Sabbath day, but about how to keep it.
Over and over again, we see Jesus and the Pharisees disputing what is lawful to do on the Sabbath.
Over and over again we see Jesus demonstrating that it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath.
He even reminds the Pharisees that as God's Son, He is Lord of the Sabbath.
He ordained the purpose of the Sabbath from its very inception, and so He alone should be allowed to interpret what activities were consistent with that purpose.
God's fourth commandment said simply for the people to keep the Sabbath day holy, to refrain from secular work, and to turn their attentions to God.
The Pharisees had taken that simple instruction and blown it up into several hundred laws that specified exactly what one could and could not do on the Sabbath.
This was common of most of the laws that God had given them.
It was a point that Jesus admonished them for on a number of occasions.
Luke 11:46
46 But He said, “Woe to you lawyers as well! For you weigh men down with burdens hard to bear, while you yourselves will not even touch the burdens with one of your fingers.Matt 23:2-5
2 saying, “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the chair of Moses;
3 therefore all that they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds; for they say things, and do not do them.
4 “And they tie up heavy loads, and lay them on men's shoulders ; but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.
5 “But they do all their deeds to be noticed by menMatt 23:23-28
23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you tithe mint and dill and cummin, and have neglected the weightier provisions of the law: justice and mercy and faithfulness; but these are the things you should have done without neglecting the others.
24 “You blind guides, who strain out a gnat and swallow a camel!
25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you clean the outside of the cup and of the dish, but inside they are full of robbery and self-indulgence.
26 “You blind Pharisee, first clean the inside of the cup and of the dish, so that the outside of it may become clean also.
27 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness.
28 “Even so you too outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.Mark 7:6-13
6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written, 'This people honors Me with their lips, but their heart is far away from me.
7 'But in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.'
8 “Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You nicely set aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition.
10 “For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother'; and, 'He who speaks evil of father or mother, let him be put to death';
11 but you say, 'If a man says to his father or his mother, anything of mine you might have been helped by is Corban (that is to say, given to God) ,'
12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mo
ther;
13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”Jesus' point about the Sabbath was the same as in these other circumstances.
The burdensome laws that the Pharisees levied on the people were actually contrary to the laws of God that they were supposed to uphold.
What a tragedy!
The Sabbath was intended to be a day of rest and delight in the Lord.
Instead, the religious leaders had turned it into a day of burden for God's people.
This is the true error and sign of legalism.
The legalists are always interested in the minimum standard, because their hearts are not true.
Jesus reminds them over and over again that if they would get their hearts right with God, then obeying God's commandments would be a joy not a burden.
God's commandments were never meant to restrict us, but to bring us joy and peace.
Imagine what our world would be like if everyone obeyed all of God's Ten Commandments out of a sense of love toward God and each other.
What a wonderful world this would be! God's commandments are not burdensome.
God's Sabbath is not burdensome.
The Sabbath is a delight.
Isa 58:13-14
13 “If because of the sabbath, you turn your foot from doing your own pleasure on My holy day, and call the sabbath a delight, the holy day of the LORD honorable, and shall honor it, desisting from your own ways, from seeking your own pleasure, and speaking your own word,
14 Then you will take delight in the LORD, and I will make you ride on the heights of the earth; and I will feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father, for the mouth of the LORD has spoken.”I Jn 5:3
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.God's commandments have always been for our good.
The first four commandments tell us how to build and maintain our relationship with God.
The last six tell us how to build and maintain our relationships with each other.
God's commandments are not a burden; they are a delight.
God's Sabbath day is not a burden; it is a delight.
Did Paul or the other Apostles or Disciples abolish the Sabbath with their instructions or teachings?
Col 2:14, 16-17
14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us and which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
16 Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day–
17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.Some people use this text to argue that the Sabbath was abolished, and that Paul was instructing the Gentile believers not to keep the Sabbath.
In fact, these people argue that not just the Sabbath, but all of the Ten Commandments were abolished and 'nailed to the cross'.
But is that what the verse says?
Col 2:8-17
8 See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.
9 For in Him all the fulness of Deity dwells in bodily form,
10 and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority;
11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;
12 having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.
13 And when you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions,
14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us and which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
15 When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.
16 Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day–
17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.Let me show you a number of problems with this argument.
First of all, although many Christians will argue that the whole law was 'nailed to the cross', they still consider things like stealing, lying, murder, and adultery to be sins.
Secondly, Paul was talking primarily about Jewish traditions, which were added above and beyond the commandments of God.
Notice he draws the same distinction that Jesus did between the commandments of God and the 'traditions of men'.
Finally, note what was 'nailed to the cross'.
Was it the Ten Commandments?
No.
It was a 'certificate of debt' consisting of 'decrees' which were 'against us' and 'hostile to us'.
Are the Ten Commandments against us or hostile to us?
No.
Paul was referring to many of the tenets, or 'decrees', of the Mosaic ceremonial law – the law of sacrifices.
This fact becomes more evident in verses 16 and 17.
Here Paul speaks about food and drink offerings and festivals and then he calls all of these things 'shadows of what is to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.'
There were seven annual feasts in the Jewish ceremonial law which were called sabbaths, but which were distinct and different from the weekly Sabbath.
All of these festivals pointed forward to Christ and His part in the plan of salvation. Below is a description of one of these feasts – the annual Day of Atonement, or Yom Kippur.
Lev 23:27-28, 32
27 “On exactly the tenth day of this seventh month is the day of atonement; it shall be a holy convocation for you, and you shall humble your souls and present an offering by fire to the LORD.
28 “Neither shall you do any work on this same day, for it is a day of atonement, to make atonement on your behalf before the LORD your God.
32 “It is to be a sabbath of complete rest to you, and you shall humble your souls; on the ninth of the month at evening, from evening until evening you shall keep your sabbath.”But notice as we continue on in the same scripture passage that these ceremonial sabbaths were different and distinct from the weekly Sabbaths.
It says 'besides' or apart from the 'Sabbaths of the Lord', which are the weekly Sabbaths.
Notice that it also talks about food and drink offerings, or grain offerings and libations, just like Paul did in Col. 2:16.
Lev 23:37-38
37 'These are the appointed times of the LORD which you shall proclaim as holy convocations, to present offerings by fire to the LORD– burnt offerings and grain offerings, sacrifices and libations, each day's matter on its own day–
38 besides those of the Sabbaths of the LORD, and besides your gifts, and besides all your votive and freewill offerings, which you give to the LORD.These ceremonial sabbaths, along with their sacrifices, were shadows or symbols that pointed forward to Jesus.
Jesus was our Passover sacrificial Lamb.
He was also the First Fruits offering and is the one whose blood made atonement for our sins.
These sacrificial offerings ceased to have any significance when they were 'nailed to the cross' with Christ, who was the One true Sacrifice.
But the Sabbath was primarily a memorial to creation, not a shadow of something that pointed forward to Jesus.
We can see the truth of this in Paul's actions. He never offered another sacrifice after he became a Christian, however, he kept the Sabbath regularly (see Acts 13:42-44, 17:2).
Here is another scripture passage that people use to argue that the Sabbath has been done away with in the New Testament.
Rom 14:4-6
4 Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls; and stand he will, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
5 One man regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Let each man be fully convinced in his own mind.
6 He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God.Sometimes it is good no notice what a verse does not say, before we go reading too much into it.
Notice that this scripture passage says nothing about worship or about the Sabbath.
Is it safe to infer that Paul was talking about the Sabbath day here?
Probably not, especially when you consider the context.
First of all, Paul's main point deals with judging one another.
In His Sermon on the Mount, Jesus said that we shouldn't judge one another e
ven about sinful actions.It is God's job to judge, no ours.
We cannot be absolutely certain, but when Paul talks here about esteeming one day above another, he is probably referring to days of fasting which the Pharisees had established.
God had not commanded these fast days; they were a tradition of the Pharisees.
Notice the attitude of the Pharisees towards these traditional days of fasting in the following texts.
Luke 5:33
33 And they said to Him, “The disciples of John often fast and offer prayers; the disciples of the Pharisees also do the same ; but Yours eat and drink.”Luke 18:11-12
11 “The Pharisee stood and was praying thus to himself , 'God, I thank Thee that I am not like other people: swindlers, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax-gatherer.
12 'I fast twice a week; I pay tithes of all that I get.'It is very likely that Paul is talking about these days of fasting that the Pharisees held as a tradition.
Paul is certainly not talking about the Sabbath day.
If he were going to do away with one of God's Ten Commandments, surely he would have used more direct language, and a well-developed argument.
He does neither in this case.
People also argue that the Sabbath was simply a symbol of God's grace, and that the symbol was fulfilled in Christ.
This argument is taken from the fourth chapter of the book of Hebrews.
I have included almost the whole chapter here for you to read.
Heb 4:1-16
1 Therefore, let us fear lest, while a promise remains of entering His rest, any one of you should seem to have come short of it.
2 For indeed we have had good news preached to us, just as they also; but the word they heard did not profit them, because it was not united by faith in those who heard.
3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said, “As I swore in My wrath, they shall not enter My rest,” although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For He has thus said somewhere concerning the seventh day “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”;
5 and again in this passage “They shall not enter My rest.”
6 Since therefore it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience,
7 He again fixes a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, “Today if you hear His voice, do not harden your hearts.”
8 For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that.
9 There remains therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God.
10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.
11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall through following the same example of disobedience.
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.
14 Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession .
15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.
16 Let us therefore draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and may find grace to help in time of need .The Sabbath is indeed a symbol of grace.
The Sabbath is symbolic of many things – grace, sanctification, justification, obedience.
The Sabbath is also a memorial of creation and our Creator God.
Actually, it is not a symbol of all of those things, but a reminder of them.
The sin sacrifices of the Old Testament were a symbol of Jesus' sacrifice on our behalf.
After Jesus came and died, the symbols ceased to have meaning.
In fact, to keep offering sacrifices would be to deny the sufficiency of Christ's sacrifice.
So in place of the animal sacrifices, Jesus instituted two reminders of His sacrifice – baptism and communion.
By holding communion services, do we deny the sufficiency of Christ's sacrifice on our behalf?
Certainly NOT!
Rather, we reaffirm our faith in His sacrifice.
This is also true of the Sabbath.
The Sabbath is not a symbol of grace, but a reminder of it.
As we observe the weekly Sabbath, we do not deny God's grace; we reaffirm our faith in His grace.
The author of Hebrews says as much in verse 9. 'There remains therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God.'
Finally, I want to note something very significant.
The word 'Sabbath' appears in the New Testament 62 times.
Sixty of those times are in the Gospels and the book of Acts.
Every one of these references speaks, either directly or indirectly, about Jesus, the disciples, or the apostles keeping the Sabbath holy.
Only two times does the New Testament use the word 'sabbath' in any other way.
I would like you to take a moment to compare the issue of the Sabbath with the issue of circumcision.
The issue of circumcision raised such a dispute among the apostles that they all came together for a council in Jerusalem to settle the matter within the church.
And circumcision was not even one of God's Ten Commandments.
Do you think that it would be realistic to believe that the apostles would get so worked up over a secondary issue that involved breaking a Jewish tradition, and yet remain virtually silent if someone were attempting to do away with one of God's Ten Commandments?
It doesn't make any sense.
Yet, nowhere in the New Testament do we see the record of any such dispute about the Sabbath among Jesus' followers.
Paul had a lot to say about the relationship between the Law and Grace, as did the other Bible authors.
His primary concern was to demonstrate which was the cause and which was the result.
He rightly espouses that obedience to the Law is the result of God's Grace.
You do not earn God's Grace through the works of the Law.
But in all of his writings, Paul never throws away any of God's Ten Commandments.
In fact he repeatedly uplifts the Law of God, calling it 'holy, righteous, and good.'
Neither does Paul, Jesus, or any of the other disciples or apostles ever even insinuate that the Sabbath day has been eradicated from the Ten Commandments. God's Ten Commandments never became the Nine Commandments.
The Ten Commandments are just as true and valid today as they ever were.
And Jesus is still the 'Lord of the Sabbath'.
Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,04:09) Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,08:56) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
So Jesus did not keep the Sabbath when he performed miracles on that day, because he was made a serveant to the sick.So where do you keep your understanding constitutionalist?
In the OT laws that you were never under, or in the new covenant in which all men are under.
Old covenants were for Jews only, gentile has only received Jesus' Blood as our promise to salvation.
And in “HIM” are all the laws fufilled.
Amen
You missed Jesus whole message, Jesus kept the Sabbath, but he kept it in the light it was to be kept, he did good on the sabbath, he did not do carpenter work on the sabbath, but he did heal the sick. Therin lies the difference.A farmer may not toil in the field but he can rescue his ox if it falls in a pit.
You may not pick crops for market but you can take enough to fill your belly.
You just don't get.
The pharasees would let a man die, because they lived by the letter and not the spirit of it.
Jesus would let a man live because he lived by the spirit of it and not the letter.
Someday you will see, instead of just tossing out your hate.
First off, I don't hate anyone or anything but sin…If I am ignorant to sin then that is my folly, so use your intellect to open my eyes if they are closed.Second off, I agree completely with what you say, but who is man to understand what is good and evil?
You would not go to a restaurant to eat when you are hungry, because you are making the man work.
Although in this day and age, that man would work whether you're there or not…So regardless he's not keeping the sabbath.
And as for you, you are not working (therefore keeping the sabbath). So I guess the proper thing to do would be to make food for yourself…and not go anywhere for you are “making someone cook for you” which I guess to you is not keeping the sabbath.
Well what about your wife, who's stay at home job is to cook and clean…On the sabbath do the roles reverse and you cook instead of her? Cause if not you wouldn't be keeping the sabbath.
What about hospitals that are open…They are a business and yet they do good work and save lives…
Tho not by christian methods, they do save lives nonetheless…
Are they violating the sabbath?
The reason God made a new covenant is because the old ones were flawed.
We were never meant to live by the law, we were meant to be condemned by it.
And on the flip side, we are meant to live by christ.
A new covenant was made purposeful for our times. If not for our times, then it would of been established as the first covenant.
Keeping the sabbath is too particular for such an economy driven world, and in such a world…for some people…a day of work is required to feed your family….
[/B]Now according to Jesus if you were in a position to where you needed more money than usual, to keep food on the table for your family…would you work?
Cuz I sure as hell don't have cows and goats to do feed them from the fruits of my imaginary farm.
Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
Con,
Looking for an argument! You were disproved long ago. Paul said that the sabbath was a “shadow” and that Christ is the “substance.” Hebrews 10 says that the shadow is not the “image.” Christ is the “image”, that is, the fulfillment of all the shadows.The sabbath is kept today by resting in Christ. This is the spirit of the law to which we are under in the new covenant age.
THE SABBATH WAS A SIGN AND AS SUCH WAS ABOLISHED AS ALL OTHER SIGNS WERE ABOLISHED
1. When God made a covenant with Abraham, the sign of the covenant was circumcision:
Quote “This is my covenant with you and your descendants after you, the covenant you are to keep: Every male among you shall be circumcised. You are to undergo circumcision, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and you. For the generations to come every male among you who is eight days old must be circumcised, including those born in your household or bought with money from a foreigner—those who are not your offspring. Whether born in your household or bought with your money, they must be circumcised. My covenant in your flesh is to be an everlasting covenant. Any uncircumcised male, who has not been circumcised in the flesh, will be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant” (Genesis 17:10-14). 2. And when God made a covenant with Moses and Israel the sign was the Sabbath day:
Quote “Then the LORD said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites, ‘You must observe my Sabbaths. This will be a sign between me and you for the generations to come, so you may know that I am the LORD, who makes you holy.” ”‘Observe the Sabbath, because it is holy to you. Anyone who desecrates it must be put to death; whoever does any work on that day must be cut off from his people. For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death.The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested’” (Exodus 31:12-17, NIV).
http://godstenlaws.com/ten-commandments/sabbath-day.htmlExplain how the one “sign” was discontinued without the other “sign” also being discontinued. Signs were meant to be temporary dude!
thinker
It's funny you post that TT, because I just posted something to Lightenup about Shadows and Real Images…and how it helped me to understand God and Jesus' identity.
To understand Jesus is to understand the law, but once u figure it out…you can bypass the shadow and go to Jesus.
In the same way, when you figure out Jesus (who is the Shadow of God) it elevates you on over to the father.
Remember Jesus is the bridge, we're not meant to stay on the bridge when we are on our journey to a destination.
Read the “My Eyes Opened topic” for better understanding of what i'm talking about.
The Sabbath is a covenant that God made with Israel. It is a sign between God and Israel. As simple as that. Period………..
IreneTo All,
Romans 14:5-8(NIV) reads:
Quote One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives to himself alone and none of us dies to himself alone. If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.
“To the Lord” does not sound like a Gentile backsliding into pagan beliefs. It sounds to me like each person has their own way to serve God. A Jew would serve God by following Jewish customs while a Roman would serve him by following Roman customs.
On the other hand I cannot state that this passage is even speaking about the Sabbath since any religious holiday dedicated to God is considered sacred.
Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,04:09) Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,08:56) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
So Jesus did not keep the Sabbath when he performed miracles on that day, because he was made a serveant to the sick.So where do you keep your understanding constitutionalist?
In the OT laws that you were never under, or in the new covenant in which all men are under.
Old covenants were for Jews only, gentile has only received Jesus' Blood as our promise to salvation.
And in “HIM” are all the laws fufilled.
Amen
You missed Jesus whole message, Jesus kept the Sabbath, but he kept it in the light it was to be kept, he did good on the sabbath, he did not do carpenter work on the sabbath, but he did heal the sick. Therin lies the difference.A farmer may not toil in the field but he can rescue his ox if it falls in a pit.
You may not pick crops for market but you can take enough to fill your belly.
You just don't get.
The pharasees would let a man die, because they lived by the letter and not the spirit of it.
Jesus would let a man live because he lived by the spirit of it and not the letter.
Someday you will see, instead of just tossing out your hate.
Was Jesus a Jew? Yes, He was and therefore He kept the Sabbath just like any other Jew would. Sometimes I wonder why that is so hard to understand. What does Exodus 31:16-17 say:” Therefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe it throughout their generation as a perpetual covenant.
verse 17 It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever.Do you know any Jewish person? I do, and they keep the Sabbath. They are just as strict today as they were when Jesus walked this earth. And They should, it says throughout their generation forever. Good for them. But we are not under that covenant. We are under grace by faith.
you know we use to keep the Sabbath too, but God has in His mercy openend our eyes. And I am forever thankful to Him for that.
Ephesians 2:8
“For by grace you have been saved and that not of yourselves, it is a gift from God.verse 9
not of works lest anyone should boast.verse 10 For we are His workmanship create in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
Galatians tell us this
5:4 You have become estranged from Christ, you attempt to be justified by law; You have fallen from grace.As far as I a concerned I rather be under grace then keep ALL OF THE LAW.
Because that is what it says you must do.
verse 2 Indeed I, Paul, say to you that if you become circumcised Christ will profit you nothing.
verse 3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that He is a debtor to keep the whole law.
Peace and Love Irene
Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 28 2009,04:23) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,04:09) Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,08:56) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
So Jesus did not keep the Sabbath when he performed miracles on that day, because he was made a serveant to the sick.So where do you keep your understanding constitutionalist?
In the OT laws that you were never under, or in the new covenant in which all men are under.
Old covenants were for Jews only, gentile has only received Jesus' Blood as our promise to salvation.
And in “HIM” are all the laws fufilled.
Amen
You missed Jesus whole message, Jesus kept the Sabbath, but he kept it in the light it was to be kept, he did good on the sabbath, he did not do carpenter work on the sabbath, but he did heal the sick. Therin lies the difference.A farmer may not toil in the field but he can rescue his ox if it falls in a pit.
You may not pick crops for market but you can take enough to fill your belly.
You just don't get.
The pharasees would let a man die, because they lived by the letter and not the spirit of it.
Jesus would let a man live because he lived by the spirit of it and not the letter.
Someday you will see, instead of just tossing out your hate.
First off, I don't hate anyone or anything but sin…If I am ignorant to sin then that is my folly, so use your intellect to open my eyes if they are closed.Second off, I agree completely with what you say, but who is man to understand what is good and evil?
You would not go to a restaurant to eat when you are hungry, because you are making the man work.
Although in this day and age, that man would work whether you're there or not…So regardless he's not keeping the sabbath.
And as for you, you are not working (therefore keeping the sabbath). So I guess the proper thing to do would be to make food for yourself…and not go anywhere for you are “making someone cook for you” which I guess to you is not keeping the sabbath.
Well what about your wife, who's stay at home job is to cook and clean…On the sabbath do the roles reverse and you cook instead of her? Cause if not you wouldn't be keeping the sabbath.
What about hospitals that are open…They are a business and yet they do good work and save lives…
Tho not by christian methods, they do save lives nonetheless…
Are they violating the sabbath?
The reason God made a new covenant is because the old ones were flawed.
We were never meant to live by the law, we were meant to be condemned by it.
And on the flip side, we are meant to live by christ.
A new covenant was made purposeful for our times. If not for our times, then it would of been established as the first covenant.
Keeping the sabbath is too particular for such an economy driven world, and in such a world…for some people…a day of work is required to feed your family….
[/B]Now according to Jesus if you were in a position to where you needed more money than usual, to keep food on the table for your family…would you work?
Cuz I sure as hell don't have cows and goats to do feed them from the fruits of my imaginary farm.
Hi RokkaMan:As you say, there are many things to take into consideration relative to observing the Sabbath in the modern day world.
Thing like the mode of travel, and the hospitals that you mentioned are examples. Hospitals have restruarants and these by necessity have to be open. Restruarants along the interstates and those in the airports need to be open as well.
As a born again Christian, if I had a business, I would give my employees the day off so that they could rest and go to church if they wanted to do this.
Because of all of these considerations, I believe that it is the principle of the Sabbath that matters. It is a day of rest. Certainly, there should not be any argument that this is a good thing. All of God's principles that He gives us for living are meant for our good.
It should not be meant to be a drudgery saying I can't do this or I can't do that because it is the Sabbath, but if something can be put off until another day because it is the Sabbath, then it would seem to me that God would know the motives and the intent of the heart.
Love in Christ,
MartyTo All……..What is the (sign) of the sabbath, it is to shows that we are GOD'S People. The sign is eternal and shows the very process of salvation. WE are saved by entering into rest (putting our WILLS to death) as Jesus did His, this is (NOT) a Single day a week, GOD was teaching Israel about the salvation process introducing them into the Idea of (ceasing for (THEIR) works) this sign (IS) the sign of the salvation process, that (ONLY) ONE (WILL), will be done. When we inter into (REST) by not doing our WILL and letting GOD'S Will be done we are keeping a Sabbath we have entered into a rest from our wills. the sabbath will never be done away with as well as all commandments of GOD , they will all be fulfilled in us all, and that includes the sabbath rest it will always show that GOD is SAVING us.
gene
Hi:
There are also those professions where people have to work on the Sabbath day i.e. policeman, fireman, security guard, the guy that milks the cow etc.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,09:00) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:56) Quote (georg @ Oct. 27 2009,08:50) Why would God want to say that the Sabbath is a sign between the children of Israel and then says it is for all. That makes no sense. Two times He did that. We are under a new covenant in His Blood and grace.
Luke 2:20 and Math. 22:36-40,Ephesians 2:8-9
Irene
Why would he say that? He did quote it. Maybe most people just don't understand. But then again it's between you and God.Maybe because the Sabbath is a perpetual covenant all by itself, and has no bearing on the old or the new.
Ask God, or TT. Your choice.
Not just the Sabbath…ALL THE LAWS are fufilled in Jesus Christ…So you no longer need to keep them and practice.If you believe in Jesus Christ the laws will be fufilled in you.
Just like our sins are paid for by belief in Jesus, therefore we do not have to perform the sacrifical ceremony of slaying a lamb to be forgiven for our sins…we can just believe.
We no longer need to burn fish eggs to drive out demons if we call on The Lord's name…
Therefore we no longer need to seek peace on The Sabbath if we have it eternally with Jesus Christ.
All the OT laws were fufilled in Jesus, remember he technically didn't keep the Sabbath either.
Uh huh, sure Rokka
Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,09:23) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,04:09) Quote (RokkaMan @ Oct. 27 2009,08:56) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 28 2009,03:52) Quote (thethinker @ Oct. 27 2009,08:17) Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 27 2009,23:20) Also basically what Sabbath also refers to gates is also like, if you observe Sabbath you wont go to a restaruant and have someone cook for you or serve you because in doing so your being there makes them work. Or you get gas on another day, because you make others work for you (register person, attendant, etc.). Even if the other person is an athiest, you as a Sabbath keeper, you ensure you don't make others work by your hand.
You're adding to the word of God regarding the sabbath. It referred only to God's covenantal people and extended only to their servants, beasts of burden and those “within YOUR gates.”So I may eat at a restaurant because I am not putting my servants to work or my cattle or anyone within my “gates” (house).
Your adding your own commandments to the law like the pharisees did. If you say that I can't travel to a restaurant then you are adding again. And your requirement that gentiles must keep the sabbath is also an addition for they were never under the sabbath or anything of Moses. They were under the law of the revelation of God in nature.
You become more a pharisee with every post.
thinker
You missed the point TT as a Sabbath keeper, I would not go to a resturaunt and have you cook for me, because by your cooking for me makes you my servant. Whether you observe it or not is not the issue, it is all about me and my rest. This does not add or take from it.Your just looking for argument.
I make no man my servant upon my Sabbath.
So Jesus did not keep the Sabbath when he performed miracles on that day, because he was made a serveant to the sick.So where do you keep your understanding constitutionalist?
In the OT laws that you were never under, or in the new covenant in which all men are under.
Old covenants were for Jews only, gentile has only received Jesus' Blood as our promise to salvation.
And in “HIM” are all the laws fufilled.
Amen
You missed Jesus whole message, Jesus kept the Sabbath, but he kept it in the light it was to be kept, he did good on the sabbath, he did not do carpenter work on the sabbath, but he did heal the sick. Therin lies the difference.A farmer may not toil in the field but he can rescue his ox if it falls in a pit.
You may not pick crops for market but you can take enough to fill your belly.
You just don't get.
The pharasees would let a man die, because they lived by the letter and not the spirit of it.
Jesus would let a man live because he lived by the spirit of it and not the letter.
Someday you will see, instead of just tossing out your hate.
First off, I don't hate anyone or anything but sin…If I am ignorant to sin then that is my folly, so use your intellect to open my eyes if they are closed.Second off, I agree completely with what you say, but who is man to understand what is good and evil?
You would not go to a restaurant to eat when you are hungry, because you are making the man work.
Although in this day and age, that man would work whether you're there or not…So regardless he's not keeping the sabbath.
And as for you, you are not working (therefore keeping the sabbath). So I guess the proper thing to do would be to make food for yourself…and not go anywhere for you are “making someone cook for you” which I guess to you is not keeping the sabbath.
Well what about your wife, who's stay at home job is to cook and clean…On the sabbath do the roles reverse and you cook instead of her? Cause if not you wouldn't be keeping the sabbath.
What about hospitals that are open…They are a business and yet they do good work and save lives…
Tho not by christian methods, they do save lives nonetheless…
Are they violating the sabbath?
The reason God made a new covenant is because the old ones were flawed.
We were never meant to live by the law, we were meant to be condemned by it.
And on the flip side, we are meant to live by christ.
A new covenant was made purposeful for our times. If not for our times, then it would of been established as the first covenant.
Keeping the sabbath is too particular for such an economy driven world, and in such a world…for some people…a day of work is required to feed your family….
[/B]Now according to Jesus if you were in a position to where you needed more money than usual, to keep food on the table for your family…would you work?
Cuz I sure as hell don't have cows and goats to do feed them from the fruits of my imaginary farm.
Quote Second off, I agree completely with what you say, but who is man to understand what is good and evil? You can't tell the difference?
Quote You would not go to a restaurant to eat when you are hungry, because you are making the man work. Why would I be hungry my food would be made and readily available from the preparation day, the day prior tp the Sabbath.
I would not make another man work on the Sabbath whether he believes or not.
Quote Although in this day and age, that man would work whether you're there or not…So regardless he's not keeping the sabbath. Again, My issue is not his choice, I will not make him work to serve me on God's Sabbath day.
Quote And as for you, you are not working (therefore keeping the sabbath). So I guess the proper thing to do would be to make food for yourself…and not go anywhere for you are “making someone cook for you” w
hich I guess to you is not keeping the sabbath.Food is made on the preparation day for the Sabbath Day.
Quote Well what about your wife, who's stay at home job is to cook and clean…On the sabbath do the roles reverse and you cook instead of her? Cause if not you wouldn't be keeping the sabbath. Again, the food is made on the preparation day, neither works on the Sabbath Day.
Quote What about hospitals that are open…They are a business and yet they do good work and save lives… Tho not by christian methods, they do save lives nonetheless…
Are they violating the sabbath?
In the Torah, doctors, policemen, firemen, etc are exempt, they do a good service on the Sabbath, there calling is a higher calling.
In the Torah they are not Sabbath breakers.
Quote The reason God made a new covenant is because the old ones were flawed. We were never meant to live by the law, we were meant to be condemned by it.
The Sabbath is not flawed.
And how are you condemed by keeping the Sabbath.
Quote A new covenant was made purposeful for our times. If not for our times, then it would of been established as the first covenant. The Sabbath Covenant is seperate from any other covenant.
Quote Keeping the sabbath is too particular for such an economy driven world, and in such a world…for some people…a day of work is required to feed your family…. Is the economy (mammon) your God?
Quote Now according to Jesus if you were in a position to where you needed more money than usual, to keep food on the table for your family…would you work? You do not believe God will provide?
Quote Cuz I sure as hell don't have cows and goats to do feed them from the fruits of my imaginary farm. By this statement you would not keep the Sabbath even if you wanted too.
To All,
It is true that God told the 12 tribes of Israel that the Sabbath one be a sign between him and them. It is obvious that he was not including Gentiles when stated that despite Jesus stating the Sabbath was made for man. Of course that is not a contradiction for the tribes of Israel are men.
The question is what is it a sign of?
It seems to me it is a sign of creation for he states such in verse 17.
The “for ever” may actually just be “for time” if I am correct and the word translated “ever” is the Hebrew word “Yowm”.
Still, We should remember that the spirit of the Law is love your neighbor as yourself and ask in what ways the Sabbath Law kept that Law, at least in part or if it was just a custom established to show that the Hebrew people are different than those around them.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 28 2009,00:25) To All, It is true that God told the 12 tribes of Israel that the Sabbath one be a sign between him and them. It is obvious that he was not including Gentiles when stated that despite Jesus stating the Sabbath was made for man. Of course that is not a contradiction for the tribes of Israel are men.
The question is what is it a sign of?
It seems to me it is a sign of creation for he states such in verse 17.
The “for ever” may actually just be “for time” if I am correct and the word translated “ever” is the Hebrew word “Yowm”.
Still, We should remember that the spirit of the Law is love your neighbor as yourself and ask in what ways the Sabbath Law kept that Law, at least in part or if it was just a custom established to show that the Hebrew people are different than those around them.
How is a COMMAND from God “just a custom”. Why do you trounce upon God?The Sabbath is a sign between God and Man forever.
The Sabbath is a sign of the Sabbath Covenant between God and Man forever.
The Sabbath is a sign of the relationship between God and Man forever.
The Sabbath is a sign that points to Him AS GOD, and to us AS HIS PEOPLE.
Deuteronomy 5, Hebrews 4, Revelation 14
The Sabbath is a sign that we are His people and will be kept in the future kingdom.
The Sabbath is a sign between Yahweh and His people forever.
And not just Israel, but for all who enjoin themselves unto the blessings and promises of Israel by accepting Jesus the Messiah.
Isai 56:3 (NKJV) Do not let the son of the foreigner Who has joined himself to Yahweh Speak, saying, “Yahweh has utterly separated me from His people”; Nor let the eunuch say, “Here I am, a dry tree.” 4 For thus says Yahweh: “To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, And choose what pleases Me, And hold fast My covenant, 5 Even to them I will give in My house And within My walls a place and a name Better than that of sons and daughters; I will give them an everlasting name That shall not be cut off. 6 “Also the sons of the foreigner Who join themselves to Yahweh, to serve Him, And to love the name of Yahweh, to be His servants–Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath, And holds fast My covenant-
The Sabbath will also be kept when Jesus returns:
Isai 66:22 (NKJV) “For as the new heavens and the new earth Which I will make shall remain before Me,” says Yahweh, “So shall your descendants and your name remain. 23 And it shall come to pass [That] from one New Moon to another, And from one Sabbath to another, All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says Yahweh.
Exod 31:13 (NKJV) “Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: `Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it [is] a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that [you] may know that I [am] Yahweh who sanctifies you.
Constitutionalist wrote:
Quote How is a COMMAND from God “just a custom”. Why do you trounce upon God?
Acts 21:21(NIV) reads:
Quote They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs.
That would be this statue from the Law of Moses which is being called a custom by a “leader” of the church in Jerusalem.
Leviticus 12:1-3(NIV) reads:
Quote The LORD said to Moses, “Say to the Israelites: 'A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period. On the eighth day the boy is to be circumcised.
It is never the less a custom established by God.
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