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Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 16 2013,12:56) Mike it seems to me that many do not believe in the scriptures ,because they do not look for the truth of God ,only their own satisfaction because in their mind and heart they have already established that their is no truth in scriptures beside what they have accepted in it ,
we can see that by the effort they put in to search the truth of God ,so that what they know would be the truth ,and preach what is true ,
but men like that have been around for centuries time of old ,
they do not understand the scriptures ,
T.Yea;but so far no one can proof anything.
Own interpretation can be proven wrong with scriptures.
But no one can produce any scripture for evidence.
This is evidence that I am right.I can not expect any scriptures coming from you.
And so far there is still none. The jar is empty,the pot is dry.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,15:37) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 16 2013,12:56) Mike it seems to me that many do not believe in the scriptures ,because they do not look for the truth of God ,only their own satisfaction because in their mind and heart they have already established that their is no truth in scriptures beside what they have accepted in it ,
we can see that by the effort they put in to search the truth of God ,so that what they know would be the truth ,and preach what is true ,
but men like that have been around for centuries time of old ,
they do not understand the scriptures ,
T.Yea;but so far no one can proof anything.
Own interpretation can be proven wrong with scriptures.
But no one can produce any scripture for evidence.
This is evidence that I am right.I can not expect any scriptures coming from you.
And so far there is still none. The jar is empty,the pot is dry.wakeup.
wto a carpenter, carpentry as a meaning
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,00:19) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,15:37) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 16 2013,12:56) Mike it seems to me that many do not believe in the scriptures ,because they do not look for the truth of God ,only their own satisfaction because in their mind and heart they have already established that their is no truth in scriptures beside what they have accepted in it ,
we can see that by the effort they put in to search the truth of God ,so that what they know would be the truth ,and preach what is true ,
but men like that have been around for centuries time of old ,
they do not understand the scriptures ,
T.Yea;but so far no one can proof anything.
Own interpretation can be proven wrong with scriptures.
But no one can produce any scripture for evidence.
This is evidence that I am right.I can not expect any scriptures coming from you.
And so far there is still none. The jar is empty,the pot is dry.wakeup.
wto a carpenter, carpentry as a meaning
T.A spiritually desolate person will hide behind,
a wall of empty words.
You are on parched ground,with no rivers flowing.
There is no water to quench the thirst.
Any muddy water will do.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,20:50) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,00:19) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,15:37) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 16 2013,12:56) Mike it seems to me that many do not believe in the scriptures ,because they do not look for the truth of God ,only their own satisfaction because in their mind and heart they have already established that their is no truth in scriptures beside what they have accepted in it ,
we can see that by the effort they put in to search the truth of God ,so that what they know would be the truth ,and preach what is true ,
but men like that have been around for centuries time of old ,
they do not understand the scriptures ,
T.Yea;but so far no one can proof anything.
Own interpretation can be proven wrong with scriptures.
But no one can produce any scripture for evidence.
This is evidence that I am right.I can not expect any scriptures coming from you.
And so far there is still none. The jar is empty,the pot is dry.wakeup.
wto a carpenter, carpentry as a meaning
T.A spiritually desolate person will hide behind,
a wall of empty words.
You are on parched ground,with no rivers flowing.
There is no water to quench the thirst.
Any muddy water will do.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 15 2013,17:22) Mikeb. Happy hunting for precepts of men……….
Wakeup,In the post to journey a page ago, which version of Isaiah did Jesus quote in Mark 7:7?
The LXX version? Or the MT version?
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 15 2013,19:56) Mike it seems to me that many do not believe in the scriptures ,because they do not look for the truth of God ,only their own satisfaction because in their mind and heart they have already established that their is no truth in scriptures beside what they have accepted in it ,
I'm confused by this entire thread, Pierre.I'm not even sure how pretending the LXX doesn't exist would help out the KJV Bible.
I don't know why journey needs to eliminate the LXX for the sake of the KJV. How does the LXX prove the KJV faulty, so that it should be “pretended” out of existence?
At any rate, there are clear SCRIPTURAL examples where the writers of the NT quoted the LXX version instead of the MT version. That PROVES the LXX was around BEFORE the NT was written.
I just don't get it. It's like someone up and decided the pyramids of Egypt never really existed, and went around claiming that nonsense despite the clear and undeniable evidence to the contrary.
I'm about done with Wakeup. We keep posting the proof, only for him to completely IGNORE IT, and keep saying, “So far, no one has proofed anything”.
Huh?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 17 2013,11:00) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 15 2013,17:22) Mikeb. Happy hunting for precepts of men……….
Wakeup,In the post to journey a page ago, which version of Isaiah did Jesus quote in Mark 7:7?
The LXX version? Or the MT version?
Mikeb.Isaiah 29:13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
Mark 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
COMMANDMENTS OF MEN = LIP SERVICE;EMPTY;HOT AIR;
GREAT WORDS,BUT OF NO VALUE.NOT FROM THE HEART,
JUST MOUTH SERVICE;
THEY TEACH GOD IS GREAT,BUT DO THE OPPOSITE.BTW: In isaiah was the *Word* speaking. So Jesus quoted himself.
What THEY have done with that version only God knows.
For men has always been corrupt in anything they do.
The most important thing is that every bible that contradict
itself in translation;is not to be touched,nor swallowed.
That bible has been mixed/fused with confusion.wakeup.
Wakeup,
On that post to journey, I've posted the Hebrew version of Isaiah 29:13.
And I've posted the LXX version of Isaiah 29:13.
Which one of those two versions did Jesus actually QUOTE in Mark 7:7?
(Which one of those two versions have the words, “in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men” ? )
The ANSWER, since I know you'll just keep beating around the bush and PRETENDING you can't see the black and white truth right in front of your face, is The LXX Version.
Are you man enough to look at that post and admit this, Wakeup?
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 13 2013,15:17) Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 13 2013,13:05) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 06 2013,06:43) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 06 2013,10:59) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 04 2013,20:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 05 2013,11:33) What are the NAMES of these divine men who produced the KJV? It is YOU who has equated them with Moses and the Apostles. So please tell us their names, so we can revere them and hold them in awe.
Mike b.Their names were not mentioned.
So they were just ordinary men, and not apostles or anything, right?Were these men infallible?
Mike B.We should not look up to the prophets nor apostles,nor angels.For they also are our brethren.
But we must respect them, and honour them as brothers
in the family. Honour your father and mother.
Call no man father on earth,for one is your father in heaven.
I call my father,dad or pap.wakeup.
Wakeup,You seem to misunderstand as one of the ones who heard those instructions called the sire of others their father for it is written.
Matthew 4:22
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)22 And they immediately left the ship and their father, and followed him.
That nowhere near the only passage where it is done. Test your doctrine.
Kerwin.The scripture also says: He who love father mother brother
sister more than me is not worthy of me.
Jesus also said to one of them,come follow me.
And he said: Lord let me burry my father first the I will come.
Jesus said: Come; let the dead burry their dead.wakeup.
Wakeup,You are correct that Jesus was calling those who were not God father. Is he and later his student violating Jesus' instruction not to call any man their father?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 17 2013,11:36) Wakeup, On that post to journey, I've posted the Hebrew version of Isaiah 29:13.
And I've posted the LXX version of Isaiah 29:13.
Which one of those two versions did Jesus actually QUOTE in Mark 7:7?
(Which one of those two versions have the words, “in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men” ? )
The ANSWER, since I know you'll just keep beating around the bush and PRETENDING you can't see the black and white truth right in front of your face, is The LXX Version.
Are you man enough to look at that post and admit this, Wakeup?
Mike b>What was BEFORE the LXX VERSION?
Was the lxx first?
Why are you so obsessed with the lxx?
just to proof the kjv
has many words wrongly translated.
Have you fully understood the kjv?I have found the kjv a book of harmony,
or I would not have touched it.
God's lingo is wonderful in the kjv.
The words chosen and used is piercing to the bone.Jesus lingo is the same.
You can choose your own favourite bible,
and study that. But you will find in most of them
contradictions,and that is not healthy for the soul.
It can not lead you to the truth.wakeup.
w
Quote It can not lead you to the truth. you need truth to lead someone to it ,and of what I can read you hardly have any ,much useless and destructive argument about nothing that is your expertise,well developed ,
you are clinging to the kjv as a child hold on his mother hand ,it shows that you are more attached to men made scriptures copy, than the true content ,
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,12:39) w Quote It can not lead you to the truth. you need truth to lead someone to it ,and of what I can read you hardly have any ,much useless and destructive argument about nothing that is your expertise,well developed ,
you are clinging to the kjv as a child hold on his mother hand ,it shows that you are more attached to men made scriptures copy, than the true content ,
T.Man made scriptures;you say.
You see;you dont know the scriptures.2 Timothy 3:16 **All scripture** is given
**by inspiration of God**,
and **is profitable for doctrine**,
**for reproof, **for correction**,
**for instruction in righteousness**:
The eyes are made to see earthly things.
The spirit is to see spiritual things.
Your eyes can not even see what is written in scripture.
But can only see what you want to see.wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 17 2013,09:08) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,12:39) w Quote It can not lead you to the truth. you need truth to lead someone to it ,and of what I can read you hardly have any ,much useless and destructive argument about nothing that is your expertise,well developed ,
you are clinging to the kjv as a child hold on his mother hand ,it shows that you are more attached to men made scriptures copy, than the true content ,
T.Man made scriptures;you say.
You see;you dont know the scriptures.2 Timothy 3:16 **All scripture** is given
**by inspiration of God**,
and **is profitable for doctrine**,
**for reproof, **for correction**,
**for instruction in righteousness**:
The eyes are made to see earthly things.
The spirit is to see spiritual things.
Your eyes can not even see what is written in scripture.
But can only see what you want to see.wakeup.
WThat is just quoting the scripture you do , lip service ,believing it and put the instructions in your heart is showing love for the things God had given ,apply them to you life and teach them to your children and others is render a service as a servant to God,for God,s glory ,not yours
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,18:21) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 17 2013,09:08) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,12:39) w Quote It can not lead you to the truth. you need truth to lead someone to it ,and of what I can read you hardly have any ,much useless and destructive argument about nothing that is your expertise,well developed ,
you are clinging to the kjv as a child hold on his mother hand ,it shows that you are more attached to men made scriptures copy, than the true content ,
T.Man made scriptures;you say.
You see;you dont know the scriptures.2 Timothy 3:16 **All scripture** is given
**by inspiration of God**,
and **is profitable for doctrine**,
**for reproof, **for correction**,
**for instruction in righteousness**:
The eyes are made to see earthly things.
The spirit is to see spiritual things.
Your eyes can not even see what is written in scripture.
But can only see what you want to see.wakeup.
WThat is just quoting the scripture you do , lip service ,believing it and put the instructions in your heart is showing love for the things God had given ,apply them to you life and teach them to your children and others is render a service as a servant to God,for God,s glory ,not yours
T.I dont have any glory.
All glory belongs to God.
The SPIRIT in the scriptures IS the WORD OF GOD.
Which is JESUS, HIS FLESH.If we reject that spirit which are in the scriptures; we reject
Christ. Rejecting HIS flesh.
Christ is spirit;his flesh is spirit,and is in the scriptures.wakeup.
Wakeup,
This the verse that is the main topic of our conversation.
Matthew 23:9
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Your words made it sound you chose to take it literally. I pointed out that at least one of Jesus student who wrote a book of the bible did not take it literally. You then quoted a passage where used the word father to refer to men on earth. At this point taking the words of Matthew 23:9 literally does not seem reasonable as Jesus and at least one of his students violated a literal interpretation of it.
Here the same passage is in context.
Matthew 23:1-12
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat: 3 all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. 4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. 5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments, 6 and love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues, 7 and greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi. 8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. 9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. 10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ. 11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
Key clauses I believe reveal the what he was addressing are ” But all their works they do for to be seen of men” and “to be called of men, …” Just like these men love to be called Rabbi, Rabbi, they like to be called Father, Father or any other title you care to mention that leads them to feel better than their fellows. One more phrase that I believe reveals the context and confirms what I surmised is “whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted”
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,19:09) Mike b> 1. What was BEFORE the LXX VERSION?
2. Was the lxx first?
3. Why are you so obsessed with the lxx?
4. just to proof the kjv
has many words wrongly translated.
1. The Hebrew MT.2. No. The LXX is the Greek translation OF the Hebrew MT.
3. I'm not. I just thought it was strange for journey to start a thread saying it never existed, when the majority of NT quotes of the OT are from the LXX version of the OT – and not the Hebrew MT.
4. I wasn't aware that anyone used the LXX to fault the KJV. That's why I was asking Pierre what this thread is all about in the first place.
But if there ARE things in the LXX that show faults in the KJV, the natural thing to do is to accept those faults in the KJV, and work around them………….. NOT to pretend the LXX never existed in the first place. Wouldn't you agree?
Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 18 2013,00:39) Wakeup, This the verse that is the main topic of our conversation.
Matthew 23:9
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Your words made it sound you chose to take it literally. I pointed out that at least one of Jesus student who wrote a book of the bible did not take it literally. You then quoted a passage where used the word father to refer to men on earth. At this point taking the words of Matthew 23:9 literally does not seem reasonable as Jesus and at least one of his students violated a literal interpretation of it.
Here the same passage is in context.
Matthew 23:1-12
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat: 3 all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. 4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. 5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments, 6 and love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues, 7 and greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi. 8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. 9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. 10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ. 11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
Key clauses I believe reveal the what he was addressing are ” But all their works they do for to be seen of men” and “to be called of men, …” Just like these men love to be called Rabbi, Rabbi, they like to be called Father, Father or any other title you care to mention that leads them to feel better than their fellows. One more phrase that I believe reveals the context and confirms what I surmised is “whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted”
Kerwin.Quote 8. But be not *YE* called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and **all ye are brethren**. 9 **And call no man your father upon the earth**: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. WE SHALL NOT CALL ANY SO CALLED GREAT SPIRITUAL TEACHERS,MASTER NOR FATHER.
WE SHALL NOT CALL THE PROPHETS AND APOSTLES MASTER. WE ARE ALL BROTHERS/SIST. IN THE FAITH.wakeup.
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,18:21) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 17 2013,09:08) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 17 2013,12:39) w Quote It can not lead you to the truth. you need truth to lead someone to it ,and of what I can read you hardly have any ,much useless and destructive argument about nothing that is your expertise,well developed ,
you are clinging to the kjv as a child hold on his mother hand ,it shows that you are more attached to men made scriptures copy, than the true content ,
T.Man made scriptures;you say.
You see;you dont know the scriptures.2 Timothy 3:16 **All scripture** is given
**by inspiration of God**,
and **is profitable for doctrine**,
**for reproof, **for correction**,
**for instruction in righteousness**:
The eyes are made to see earthly things.
The spirit is to see spiritual things.
Your eyes can not even see what is written in scripture.
But can only see what you want to see.wakeup.
WThat is just quoting the scripture you do , lip service ,believing it and put the instructions in your heart is showing love for the things God had given ,apply them to you life and teach them to your children and others is render a service as a servant to God,for God,s glory ,not yours
T.YES TERRA, THEY ARE JUST SCRIPTURES; DONT WORRY ABOUT IT.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 18 2013,07:32) Quote (kerwin @ Dec. 18 2013,00:39) Wakeup, This the verse that is the main topic of our conversation.
Matthew 23:9
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Your words made it sound you chose to take it literally. I pointed out that at least one of Jesus student who wrote a book of the bible did not take it literally. You then quoted a passage where used the word father to refer to men on earth. At this point taking the words of Matthew 23:9 literally does not seem reasonable as Jesus and at least one of his students violated a literal interpretation of it.
Here the same passage is in context.
Matthew 23:1-12
Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)23 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, 2 saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat: 3 all therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not. 4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. 5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments, 6 and love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues, 7 and greetings in the markets, and to be called of men, Rabbi, Rabbi. 8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. 9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. 10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ. 11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
Key clauses I believe reveal the what he was addressing are ” But all their works they do for to be seen of men” and “to be called of men, …” Just like these men love to be called Rabbi, Rabbi, they like to be called Father, Father or any other title you care to mention that leads them to feel better than their fellows. One more phrase that I believe reveals the context and confirms what I surmised is “whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted”
Kerwin.Quote 8. But be not *YE* called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and **all ye are brethren**. 9 **And call no man your father upon the earth**: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. WE SHALL NOT CALL ANY SO CALLED GREAT SPIRITUAL TEACHERS,MASTER NOR FATHER.
WE SHALL NOT CALL THE PROPHETS AND APOSTLES MASTER. WE ARE ALL BROTHERS/SIST. IN THE FAITH.wakeup.
Wakeup,Yes, I agree tiltes are not to be used among those of the true faith less some come to think of themselves more than they ought.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 18 2013,12:06) Quote (Wakeup @ Dec. 16 2013,19:09) Mike b> 1. What was BEFORE the LXX VERSION?
2. Was the lxx first?
3. Why are you so obsessed with the lxx?
4. just to proof the kjv
has many words wrongly translated.
1. The Hebrew MT.2. No. The LXX is the Greek translation OF the Hebrew MT.
3. I'm not. I just thought it was strange for journey to start a thread saying it never existed, when the majority of NT quotes of the OT are from the LXX version of the OT – and not the Hebrew MT.
4. I wasn't aware that anyone used the LXX to fault the KJV. That's why I was asking Pierre what this thread is all about in the first place.
But if there ARE things in the LXX that show faults in the KJV, the natural thing to do is to accept those faults in the KJV, and work around them………….. NOT to pretend the LXX never existed in the first place. Wouldn't you agree?
MikeB.Journey 42 must have got it from the same source
as yours.
This only proves that they can not be taken too
seriously.Jewish rabbies are anti Christ.I tell you:I can not fault the kjv.
There is no need to try to correct the kjv for it's sake.
Going about the bush,playing with words to protect it.This is self destruction.
wakeup.
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