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Hi,
We talk a lot about “the gospel” but we don't really define it.
In the New Testament it is also said that we should preach;Jesus, and Jesus as the Christ
Christ crucified.
The gospel of the Kingdom.
The Word.
The gospel of God
The gospel of Christ
The Lord Jesus
The word of faith
The kingdom.And these all are the same and they centre around the person of Jesus.
The Jews knew about God and the scriptures so Paul preached to them Christ crucified. He told them Jesus, whom they had crucified, was the Messiah, and in him was eternal life.
If you look at the story of the eunuch he knew about God, he knew about the scriptures and so Phillip preached to him Christ. When he said
” I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God ”
he was baptised into Jesus.The point is the message is simple. Believe in God and the bible and receive that Jesus is the Son of God and be reborn into him through obedience to the Word.
Doctrines like trinity destroy the simple message and thus prevent people from receiving that salvation.
What do others think?Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 18 2005,09:12) Hi,
We talk a lot about “the gospel” but we don't really define it.
NH,
Paul defines the gospel in 1 Cor 15:1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.
That is the Gospel. Its not so much about who God is but what he has done for us.
Sure Is-Christ crucified-and risen.
But unless you know about God and have some knowledge that He is revealed in the Holy Scriptures are you ready to know about His son?
Hi,
As mentioned in the first post here the gospel is about Christ. He is the good news sent from the Father and to live we must eat his flesh and drink his blood, for those who can grasp these things.There is salvation in no other name. He is the gate and the gatekeeper and all must be born again into him to reach the safe place on the rock.
The gospel was presented in different ways to different groups as the Spirit led.
Jews were told of the Messiah and the fulfillment of prophecy and the Law, but gentiles, such as the jailor and the roman emperor, were given a message appropriate to them. Paul's attempts to reach the Athenians needed a vastly different approach again and as usual the work of God brought forth some fruit. All these were presentations of the gospel of Jesus Christ. It was the work of the Spirit in the words spoken in faith that produced that fruit. That is why we are told not to worry about what to say because the Spirit will give us the wisdom we need at the time we need it.Here is the Gospel of the Apostle Paul:
2 Timothy 1:8-11
“Don't be ashamed therefore of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me, his prisoner; but suffer hardship with the gospel according to the power of God, who saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before times eternal, but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who abolished death, and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. For this, I was appointed as a preacher, an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.”Paul preached to the Greeks that Jesus Christ 'abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the Gospel'.
This is the reason Paul tells us he was appointed as an Apostle — this was his message.
The Gospel of Paul is FAR, FAR DIFFERENT than the Gospel of Rome.
This is the Gospel of Rome:
“Christ Jesus, who brought escape from the place called hell to light through the gospel.”
Here again is the Gospel of the Apostle Paul:
“Christ Jesus, who abolished death, and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel.”
Which Gospel shall we preach? The Gospel of Rome, or the Gospel of Paul?
Today, the majority of Christians are proclaiming the Gospel of Rome.
In Jesus,
Berean2005
Hi B,
Are you saying that death was abolished for all or just those in the kingdom-to whom the letters of Paul were addressed? Certainly after the judgement death and hades are cast into the lake of fire. But that must mean the first death as the Lake of Fire is the second death?Hi Nick,
True 'death' is death you never come back from — death you are never resurrected from.
The death at the Judgment will destroy the very 'life' of a man forever. Jesus saves us from the Second Death — those who believe in Him.
Jesus died, so we may live.
The first death would be 'death' if there were no resurrection. But there is a resurrection for both the righteous and the wicked. Thus, the first death is desribed as a 'sleep'.
The punishment for sin is death — the end of life.
The 'true' punishment for sin is not you die and then come back again. The true punishment for sin is you DIE and you STAY DEAD — your name being blotted out forever and ever.
The Second Death is permanent. The second death is eternal. There is no resurrection from the Second Death.
The Gospel is all about the punishment for sin.
Think of the animal sacrifices of the Jews — the very sacrifices that demonstrated the sacrifice of the Messiah. The pure animal without blemish was 'killed' to take the penalty of the guilty sinner. The animal was killed — it was killed dead — the innocent animal's life ended — the innocent life in exchange for the guilty. Jesus Christ died on the cross — His life was ended, just as the animals lives were ended. The wages of sin is death. Christ paid the wages for us, and now we need not die, but may live — the death penalty that hung over us has now been abolished by Christ — Christ Jesus, who abolished death, and brought life and immortality to light through the Gospel.
Christ died to offer eternal life as a 'gift' to all those who would repent and believe.
Life and immortality is a gift — and none can posses it without Jesus Christ.
This is foolishness to the world, because the majority of the world already believes they posses immortality — just as the Greeks.
What was the Devil's first lie?
“You won't surely die.”
This first lie of Satan is being believed by the whole world.
Satan contradicted God's punishment for sin. God said the punishment was death — Satan lied and said it was not true. Today, the whole world is believing there is no such thing as death — the whole world is believing they “won't surely die”. In fact, it was in believing this very lie of Satan, “You shall not surely die”, that brought death into the world. As the Apostle Paul tells us in Romans 5:12:
“Therefore, as sin entered into the world through one man, and death through sin; and so death passed to all men, because all sinned.”The Egyptians — the Greeks — oriental religions — American Indians — Muslims — practically all of the pagan world religions believe that they are immortal and there is no such thing as death, making the cross of Christ to be 'foolishness'.
The Gospel is so simple — so pure. But it has been corrupted by Pope's and councils and protestant theologians who still clung to Romish error.
We are all STARVING and THIRSTING to death. If we do not get FOOD and DRINK in our selves we will surely die.
JOHN CHAPTER 6:
“47Most assuredly, I tell you, he who believes in me has eternal life. 48I am the bread of life. 49Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50This is the bread that comes down out of heaven, that a man may eat of it, and not die. 51I am the living bread which came down out of heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. Yes, the bread which I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world.”
Take and eat the flesh of the Son of God.
Take and drink the blood of the Son of God.
Then, you will have life in yourself, and you will not perish — you shall live.
Immortality is a precious gift given to those who accept the Lord Jesus Christ. Apart from the Lord Jesus Christ, there is no life or immortality.
As Paul proclaimed:
“Christ Jesus, who abolished death, and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel. For this, I was appointed as a preacher, an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.”
In Jesus,
Berean2005
Hi B,
Rev 20.14f
“and death and Hades were thrown in the Lake of fire. This is the second death the Lake of fire. And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the Lake of fire”
Is death referred to as sleep for any but the saved? I will have to look it up.
What is the 'death' thrown in the Lake of fire in your view?What is this salvation by accepting the lord Jesus Christ? Is that the same as being born again of water and the Spirit?
Hi Nick,
The Apostle Paul tells us in I Corinthians 15:24-25:
24Then the end comes, when he will deliver up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he will have abolished all rule and all authority and power. 25For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
The Lake of fire and sulfur ABOLISHES all that is thrown into it.
In Revelation we see DEATH being ABOLISHED — the last enemy to be abolished.
There will be no more death after death is abolished.
Never again will anyone die.
Never again will anyone perish.
Death will no longer exist.
Death will be no more.
DEATH according to Scripture is THE END OF LIFE.
God has the power to GIVE LIFE.
And God has the power to END LIFE.
If you are a rebellious, un-repentant sinner, God will put a complete end to you.
The wages of sin is death.
When Scripture says 'death', it 'really' means it.
The first death is a 'sleep' to both the wicked and the righteous because BOTH the wicked and the righteous will be resurrected back to life on the Last Day.
All men will stand before God.
Those on the right will receive eternal life.
Those on the left will perish.
Deuteronomy 30:19
19I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse: therefore choose life, that you may live, you and your seed;Ezekiel 18:23
23”Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked?” says the Lord Yahweh; “and not rather that he should return from his way, and live?”In Jesus,
Berean2005
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 15 2005,01:02) Hi B,
Rev 20.14f
“and death and Hades were thrown in the Lake of fire. This is the second death the Lake of fire. And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the Lake of fire”
Is death referred to as sleep for any but the saved? I will have to look it up.
What is the 'death' thrown in the Lake of fire in your view?What is this salvation by accepting the lord Jesus Christ? Is that the same as being born again of water and the Spirit?
Hi B,
I get your message but can you throw some light on the verse in Revelation here as both death and then the unsaved are cast into the Lake of Fire.Why death first if it means the second death, and why people as well if there is then no more death after death is destroyed. It seems to written in that order for a reason?Hi Nick,
Does DEATH 'R E A L L Y' means DEATH?
or does DEATH 'N O T' really mean DEATH?
I believe when God says DEATH that He 'R E A L L Y' means it.
I believe when God says His wrath CONSUMES SINNERS that He REALLY means it.
DEATH = END OF LIFE
Bob is born.
Bob dies (the first death).
Bob gets resurrected back to life again.
Bob is not covered with the blood.
Bob get's killed a SECOND TIME (the second death)
Bob is NEVER resurrected again…………ever. This is Bob's eternal punishment — this is the penalty he had to pay — this is the wages of sin — death. Bob's name has been BLOTTED OUT forever and ever.
Exodus 12:23
23For Yahweh will pass through to strike the Egyptians; and when he sees the blood on the lintel, and on the two side-posts, Yahweh will pass over the door, and will not allow the destroyer to come in to your houses to strike you.God says that when He sees the blood of the lamb, He will not destroy life, but will pass over that life. That life will be saved and not destroyed. In the same way, when God sees the blood of His Son on a sinner, He will pass over that sinner, and will not destroy him.
Exodus 15:7
7In the greatness of your excellency, you overthrow those who rise up against you: You send forth your wrath. It consumes them as stubble.Here we see that God is teaching us, in His Word, that His wrath consumes men as stubble. His wrath consumes.
Can anyone say that God's wrath DOES NOT consume men as stubble?
The lake that burns with fire and sulfur is a picture of God's fierce wrath that devours and consumes sinners.
Psalm 97:3
3A fire goes before him, and burns up his adversaries on every side.Psalm 90:7
7For we are consumed in your anger. We are troubled in your wrath.Psalm 104:35
35Let sinners be consumed out of the earth. Let the wicked be no more. Bless Yahweh, my soul. Praise Yah!Psalm 106:18
18A fire was kindled in their company. The flame burned up the wicked.Psalm 112:10
10The wicked will see it, and be grieved. He shall gnash with his teeth, and melt away. The desire of the wicked will perish.Psalm 145:20
20Yahweh preserves all those who love him, But all the wicked he will destroy.In Jesus,
Berean2005
Revelation 20:12-15
12I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne. Books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged out of the things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13The sea gave up the dead who were in it. Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them. They were judged, each one according to his works. 14Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.FIRST, the dead are judged.
THEN, DEATH and HADES (the grave) are cast into the fire.
Then, John explains what the image of a lake burning with fire and sulfur actually is. John explains this symbol to be DEATH, the Second Death.
Then John states that if anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire (which he just explained was death).
You are having difficulty understanding why John states “15If anyone was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire.” ?
The order ?
Paul tells us the LAST ENEMY to be abolished is DEATH.
Is the Apostle Paul correct?
In Jesus,
Berean2005
Hi B, 1Cor 15.20
” But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep. For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die so in Christ all will be made alive. But each in his own order;Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ's at his coming, then comes the end, when he hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when he has abolished all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. The last enemy that will be defeated is death”So Christ's resurrection is the first and at his return will come the resurrection of the saved into the millenial kingdom. Then will come the rule of Christ and those who are his till all order is restored under him and all enemies are defeated. The kingdom is then handed over to God, who is his God. The last enemy to be defeated in this 1000yr reign is death.
Then is the second resurrection and the white throne judgement of Rev 20 followed by the casting of death[the first death] and Hades[the waiting place of torment as in Lk16] into the lake of fire which is the second death and is not shown to be destroyed.HiB,
And who can understand the second death? Are they the same ? Who knows? We should not presume that it is the same as the first because the first is all we know much about.So you think the Bible is unclear as to what 'death' means?
You think the Bible is 'unclear' as to what the punishment — the wages — the penalty — for sin is?
Has God been so unclear as to how he punishes sin and sinners?
Is the penalty a mystery?
The punishment for sin is taught from the beginning of Genesis all the way through to the end of Revelation.
Two of the most powerful and crystal clear examples of how God deals with sin and sinners is the Flood and Sodom and Gommorah.
BTW, the Rich Man and Lazarus parable has been BADLY mis-interpreted by the pagan theologians. The parable must be interpreted through Scripture, and not through the philosophy of the Greeks and Roman theologians.
When God said He was SORRY that He had created man, and then DESTROYED them off the face of the earth, the pagan teaching is that God DID NOT REALLY DESTROY THEM, He just MOVED them from ONE LOCATION to ANOTHER LOCATION.
The Flood was about the DESTRUCTION — THE END OF LIFE — because of sin.
The Flood was NOT about RELOCATION and CONTAINMENT.
Sinners are NEVER 'contained' by God's wrath.
Sinners are ALWAYS 'consumed' — 'devoured' — 'destroyed' by God's fierce wrath.
Moses knows what the punishment for sin is. Just look to his writings and not to the Roman Cathecism.
Human Tradition has BADLY perverted the pure teachings of Scripture.
In Jesus,
Berean2005
Yes
Tradition fought against and killed the Son of God and continues to raise itself above the gospel of Jesus Christ. Many are drawn after such folly, blinded and entrapped they confidently march deeper into the swamps of confusion comfortable in the knowledge that they are not alone and follow leaders they can see.
“Come out of her my people”Hi
Lk 13.1f
“Now on the same occasion there were some present who reported to him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. And Jesus said to them
'Do you suppose that these Galileans were greater sinners than all other Galileans because they suffered this fate? I tell you no, but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.Or do you suppose that those 18 on whom the tower fell and killed them in Siloam were worse culprits than all who live in Jerusalem? I tell you no, but unless you repent you will all likewise perish'”In the prevuious chapter Jesus had said to the listeners
“You hypocrites…Why do you not analyse this present time?”
Luke recalled it was at this same time that Jesus said these words. I am sure the story told to Jesus was to show the shock/horror of the event-Pilate dishonoring the sacrifice and the Jewish priests and God himself by his actions.But Jesus turned it around to show them the importance of today in our relationship with God. If we have not yet been put right with God by repentance and baptism tomorrow may be too late. God is in charge of how long we live and when our opportunity runs out and death closes the gate of that chance for salvation. To die is also to either live or die eternally. God is able to bless us now and forever if we will only come to Him through Jesus but that door will close.
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