Stop prophesying what jesus couldn't know

[bodhitharta]

Jesus said he did not know the Hour of his return, that only His Father knew and yet we get tons of failed prophecies including the first of the failed prophecies starting with Jesus although he did admit he did not know but look at the list:

Failed prophecies:
About 30 CE: The Christian Scriptures (New Testament), when interpreted literally, appear to record many predictions by Jeshua of Nazareth (Jesus Christ) that God's Kingdom would arrive within a very short period, or was actually in the process of arriving. For example, Jesus is recorded as saying in Matthew 16:28: “…there shall be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.” In Matthew 24:34, Yeshua is recorded as saying: “…This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” Since the life expectancy in those days was little over 30 years, Jesus appears to have predicted his second coming sometime during the 1st century CE. It didn't happen. More details.
About 60 CE: Interpreting the Epistles of Paul of Tarsus literally, his writings seem to imply that Jesus would return and usher in a rapture during the lifetime of persons who were living in the middle of the 1st century. More details.
About 90 CE: Saint Clement 1 predicted that the world end would occur at any moment.
2nd Century CE: Prophets and Prophetesses of the Montanist movement predicted that Jesus would return sometime during their lifetime and establish the New Jerusalem in the city of Pepuza in Asia Minor.
365 CE: A man by the name of Hilary of Poitiers, announced that the end would happen that year. It didn't.
375 to 400 CE: Saint Martin of Tours, a student of Hilary, was convinced that the end would happen sometime before 400 CE.
500 CE: This was the first year-with-a-nice-round-number-panic. The antipope Hippolytus and an earlier Christian academic Sextus Julius Africanus had predicted Armageddon at about this year.
968 CE: An eclipse was interpreted as a prelude to the end of the world by the army of the German emperor Otto III.
992: Good Friday coincided with the Feast of the Annunciation; this had long been believed to be the event that would bring forth the Antichrist, and thus the end-times events foretold in the book of Revelation. Records from Germany report that a new sun rose in the north and that as many as 3 suns and 3 moons were fighting. There does not appear to be independent verification of this remarkable event.
1000-JAN-1: Many Christians in Europe had predicted the end of the world on this date. As the date approached, Christian armies waged war against some of the Pagan countries in Northern Europe. The motivation was to convert them all to Christianity, by force if necessary, before Christ returned in the year 1000. Meanwhile, some Christians had given their possessions to the Church in anticipation of the end. Fortunately, the level of education was so low that many citizens were unaware of the year. They did not know enough to be afraid. Otherwise, the panic might have been far worse than it was. Unfortunately, when Jesus did not appear, the church did not return the gifts. Serious criticism of the Church followed. The Church reacted by exterminating some heretics. Agitation settled down quickly.
1000-MAY: The body of Charlemagne was disinterred on Pentecost. A legend had arisen that an emperor would rise from his sleep to fight the Antichrist.
1005-1006: A terrible famine throughout Europe was seen as a sign of the nearness of the end.
1033: Some believed this to be the 1000th anniversary of the death and resurrection of Jesus. His second coming was anticipated. Jesus' actual date of execution is unknown, but is believed to be in the range of 27 to 33 CE.
1147: Gerard of Poehlde decided that the millennium had actually started in 306 CE during Constantine's reign. Thus, the world end was expected in 1306 CE.
1179: John of Toledo predicted the end of the world during 1186. This estimate was based on the alignment of many planets.
1205: Joachim of Fiore predicted in 1190 that the Antichrist was already in the world, and that King Richard of England would defeat him. The Millennium would then begin, sometime before 1205.
1284: Pope Innocent III computed this date by adding 666 years onto the date the Islam was founded.
1346 and later: The black plague spread across Europe, killing one third of the population. This was seen as the prelude to an immediate end of the world. Unfortunately, the Christians had previously killed a many of the cats, fearing that they might be familiars of Witches. The fewer the cats, the more the rats. It was the rat fleas that spread the black plague.
1496: This was approximately 1500 years after the birth of Jesus. Some mystics in the 15th century predicted that the millennium would begin during this year.
1524: Many astrologers predicted the imminent end of the world due to a world wide flood. They obviously had not read the Genesis story of the rainbow.
1533: Melchior Hoffman predicted that Jesus' return would happen a millennium and a half after the nominal date of his execution, in 1533. The New Jerusalem was expected to be established in Strasbourg, Germany. He was arrested and died in a Strasbourg jail.
1669: The Old Believers in Russia believed that the end of the world would occur in this year. 20 thousand burned themselves to death between 1669 and 1690 to protect themselves from the Antichrist.
1689: Benjamin Keach, a 17th century Baptist, predicted the end of the world for this year.
1736: British theologian and mathematician William Whitson predicted a great flood similar to Noah's for OCT-13 of this year.
1792: This was the date of the end of the world calculated by some believers in the Shaker movement.
1794: Charles Wesley, one of the founders of Methodism, thought Doomsday would be in this year.
1830: Margaret McDonald, a Christian prophetess, predicted that Robert Owen would be the Antichrist. Owen helped found New Harmony, IN.
1832?: Joseph Smith (1805-1844) was the founder of the Church of Christ, which became the Restorationist movement after many schisms. It now includes The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints — a.k.a. the Mormons, and about a hundred other denominations and sects. He heard a voice while praying. He wrote, in Doctrines and Covenants section 130:

14: “I was once praying very earnestly to know the time of the coming of the Son of Man, when I heard a voice repeat the following:”

15: “Joseph, my son, if thou livest until thou art eighty-five years old, thou shalt see the face of the Son of Man; therefore let this suffice, and trouble me no more on this matter.”

16: “I was left thus, without being able to decide whether this coming referred to the beginning of the millennium or to some previous appearing, or whether I should die and thus see his face.”

17: “I believe the coming of the Son of Man will not be any sooner than that time.” 14
The year in which this event occurred is not recorded. However, one commentator suggested 1832 or earlier. 16 Smith is later recorded as having said:
“I prophesy in the name of the Lord God, and let it be written–the Son of Man will not come in the clouds of heaven till I am eighty-five years old.” 17

Smith would have reached the age of 85 during 1890. Unfortunately, by that year, Smith had been dead for almost a half century, having been assassinated by a mob. Note that his prophecy is ambiguous. It can be interpreted that:

Jesus would return during 1890 (which did not materialize) or that
1890 would pass without Jesus' return (which did come to pass).

1843-MAR-21: William Miller, founder of the Millerite movement, predicted that Jesus would come on this date. A very large number of Christians accepted his prophecy.
1844-OCT-22: When Jesus did not return, Miller predicted this new date. In an event which is now c
alled “The Great Disappointment,” many Christians sold their property and possessions, quit their jobs and prepared themselves for the second coming. Nothing happened; the day came and went without incident.
1850: Ellen White, founder of the Seven Day Adventists movement, made many predictions of the timing of the end of the world. All failed. On 1850-JUN-27 she prophesized that only a few months remained before the end. She wrote: “My accompanying angel said, 'Time is almost finished. Get ready, get ready, get ready.' …now time is almost finished…and what we have been years learning, they will have to learn in a few months.” 10
1856 or later: At Ellen White's last prediction, she said that she was shown in a vision the fate of believers who attended the 1856 SDA conference. She wrote “I was shown the company present at the Conference. Said the angel: 'Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.” 11 That is, some of the attendees would die of normal diseases; some would die from plagues at the last days, others would still be alive when Jesus came. “By the early 1900s all those who attended the conference had passed away, leaving the Church with the dilemma of trying to figure out how to explain away such a prominent prophetic failure.” 12
1891: Mother Shipton, a 16th century mystic predicted the end of the world: “…The world to an end shall come; in eighteen hundred and eighty-one.”
1891 or before: On 1835-FEB-14, Joseph Smith, the founder of the Mormon church, attended a meeting of church leaders. He said that the meeting had been called because God had commanded it. He announced that Jesus would return within 56 years — i.e. before 1891-FEB-15. (History of the Church 2:182)
1914 was one of the more important estimates of the start of the war of Armageddon by the Jehovah's Witnesses (Watchtower Bible and Tract Society). They based their prophecy of 1914 from prophecy in the book of Daniel, Chapter 4. The writings referred to “seven times”. The WTS interpreted each “time” as equal to 360 days, giving a total of 2520 days. This was further interpreted as representing 2520 years, measured from the starting date of 607 BCE. This gave 1914 as the target date. When 1914 passed, they changed their prediction; 1914 became the year that Jesus invisibly began his rule.
1914, 1915, 1918, 1920, 1925, 1941, 1975 and 1994, etc. were other dates that the Watchtower Society (WTS) or its members predicted. Since late in the 19th century, they had taught that the “battle of the Great Day of God Almighty” (Armageddon) would happen in 1914 CE. It didn't.
The next major estimate was 1925. Watchtower magazine predicted: “The year 1925 is a date definitely and clearly marked in the Scriptures, even more clearly than that of 1914; but it would be presumptuous on the part of any faithful follower of the Lord to assume just what the Lord is going to do during that year.” 6
The Watchtower Society selected 1975 as its next main prediction. This was based on the estimate “according to reliable Bible chronology Adam was created in the year 4026 BCE, likely in the autumn of the year, at the end of the sixth day of creation.” 8 They believed that the year 1975 a promising date for the end of the world, as it was the 6,000th anniversary of Adam's creation. Exactly 1,000 years was to pass for each day of the creation week. This prophecy also failed.
The current estimate is that the end of the world as we know it will happen precisely 6000 years after the creation of Eve. 9 There is no way of knowing when this happened.
More details on the WTS predictions.

1919: Meteorologist Albert Porta predicted that the conjunction of 6 planets would generate a magnetic current that would cause the sun to explode and engulf the earth on DEC-17.
1936: Herbert W Armstrong, founder of the Worldwide Church of God, predicted that the Day of the Lord would happen sometime in 1936. Nothing much happened that year, except for the birth of the compiler of this list — who has been referred to as an Anti-Christ. When the prediction failed, he made a new estimate: 1975.
1940 or 1941: A Bible teacher from Australia, Leonard Sale-Harrison, held a series of prophesy conferences across North America in the 1930's. He predicted that the end of the world would happen in 1940 or 1941. 7
1948: During this year, the state of Israel was founded. Some Christians believed that this event was the final prerequisite for the second coming of Jesus. Various end of the world predictions were made in the range 1888 to 2048.
1953-AUG: David Davidson wrote a book titled “The Great Pyramid, Its Divine Message”. In it, he predicted that the world would end in 1953-AUG.
1957-APR: The Watchtower magazine quoted 6 a pastor from California, Mihran Ask, as saying in 1957-JAN that “Sometime between April 16 and 23, 1957, Armageddon will sweep the world! Millions of persons will perish in its flames and the land will be scorched.'
1959: Florence Houteff's, who was the leader of the Branch Davidians faith group, prophesied that the 1260 days mentioned in Revelation 11:3 would end and the Kingdom of David would be established on 1959-APR-22. Followers expected to die, be resurrected, and transferred to Heaven. Many sold their possessions and moved to Mt. Carmel in anticipation of the “end time”. It didn't happen. The group almost did not survive; only a few dozen members remained.

Most Branch Davidians did die on 1993-APR-29 as a result of arson apparently ordered by their leader, David Koresh. They were not bodily resurrected — on earth at least.
1960: Piazzi Smyth, a past astronomer royal of Scotland, wrote a book circa 1860 titled “Our Inheritance in the Great Pyramid.” It was responsible for spreading the belief in pyramidology throughout the world. This is the belief that secrets are hidden in the dimensions of the great pyramids. He concluded from his research that the millennium would start before the end of 1960 CE.
1967: During the six day war, the Israeli army captured all of Jerusalem. Many conservative Christians believed that the rapture would occur quickly. However, the final Biblical prerequisite for the second coming is that the Jews resume ritual animal sacrifices in the temple at Jerusalem. That never happened.
1970's: The late Moses David (formerly David Berg) was the founder of the Christian religious group, The Children of God. He predicted that a comet would hit the earth, probably in the mid 1970's and destroy all life in the United States. One source indicated that he believed it would happen in 1973.
1972: According to an article in the Atlantic magazine, “Herbert W. Armstrong's empire suffered a serious blow when the end failed to begin in January of 1972, as Armstrong had predicted, thus bringing hardship to many people who had given most of their assets to the church in the expectation of going to Petra, where such worldly possessions would be useless.” 3 According to an article in Wikipedia:

“The failure of this prophetic scenario to take place according to this Co-Worker letter scenario, which was often repeated over the years in print by Armstrong, may have been one of the initial reasons why the church organization began to decline as unfulfilled expectations led to great disappointment. As events unfolded, it became obvious 1972 did not have the biblical significance that the church had anticipated for nearly two decades.” 15

1974: Charles Meade, a pastor in Daleville, IN, predicted that the end of the world will happen during his lifetime. He was born circa 1927, so the end will probably come early in the 21st century.
1975: Many Jehovah's Witness predicted this date. However, it was not officially recognized by the leadership.
1978: Chuck Smith, Pastor of Calvary Chapel in Cost Mesa, CA, predicted the rapture in 1981.
1980: Leland Jensen leader of a Baha'i F
aith group, predicted that a nuclear disaster would happen in 1980. This would be followed by two decades of conflict, ending in the establishment of God's Kingdom on earth.
1981: Arnold Murray of the Shepherd's Chapel taught an anti-Trinitarian belief about God, and Christian Identity. Back in the 1970's, he predicted that the Antichrist would appear before 1981.
Rev. Sun Myung Moon, founder of the Unification Church predicted that the Kingdom of Heaven would be established this year.

1982: Pat Robertson predicted a few years in advance that the world would end in the fall of 1982. The failure of this prophecy did not seem to adversely affect his reputation.
1982: Astronomers John Gribben & Setphen Plagemann predicted the “Jupiter Effect” in 1974. They wrote that when various planets were aligned on the same side of the sun, tidal forces would create solar flares, radio interruptions, rainfall and temperature disturbances and massive earthquakes. The planets did align as seen from earth, as they do regularly. Nothing unusual happened.
1984 to 1999: In 1983, Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh, later called Osho, teacher of what has been called the Rajneesh movement, is said to have predicted massive destruction on earth, including natural disasters and man-made catastrophes. Floods larger than any since Noah, extreme earthquakes, very destructive volcano eruptions, nuclear wars etc. were to happen. Tokyo, New York, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Bombay will all disappear. Actually, the predictions were read out by his secretary; their legitimacy is doubtful.
1985: Arnold Murray of the Shepherd's Chapel predicted that the war of Armageddon will start on 1985-JUN 8-9 in “a valley of the Alaskan peninsula.”
1986: Moses David of The Children of God faith group predicted that the Battle of Armageddon would take place in 1986. Russia would defeat Israel and the United States. A worldwide Communist dictatorship would be established. In 1993, Christ would return to earth.
1987 to 2000: Lester Sumrall, in his 1987 book “I Predict 2000 AD” predicted that Jerusalem would be the richest city on Earth, that the Common Market would rule Europe, and that there would be a nuclear war involving Russia and perhaps the U.S. Also, he prophesized that the greatest Christian revival in the history of the church would happen: all during the last 13 years of the 20th century. All of the predictions failed.
1988: Hal Lindsey had predicted in his book “The Late, Great Planet Earth” that the Rapture was coming in 1988 – one generation or 40 years after the creation of the state of Israel. This failed prophecy did not appear to damage his reputation. He continues to write books of prophecy which sell very well indeed.
Alfred Schmielewsky, a psychic whose stage name was “super-psychic A.S. Narayana,” predicted in 1986 that the world's greatest natural disaster would hit Montreal in 1988. Sadly, his psychic abilities failed him on 1999-APR-11 when he answered the door of his home only to be shot dead by a gunman.

1988-MAY: A 1981 movie titled “The man who saw tomorrow” described some of Nostradamus predictions. Massive earthquakes were predicted for San Francisco and Los Angeles.
1988-OCT-11: Edgar Whisenaut, a NASA scientist, had published the book “88 Reasons why the Rapture will Occur in 1988.” It sold over 4 million copies.
About 1990: Peter Ruckman concluded from his analysis of the Bible that the rapture would come within a few years of 1990.

ALL COMPLETELY WRONG! We should really give it up and worship God Almighty and always be ready.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
How can anyone be ready outside of rebirth into Jesus?
Your own righteousness can only be as filthy rags.
Let God dress you in clean garments.

Zech 3, lk15

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hey Moderators

Seriously, this should be posted in the unbelievers threads.

Unbelievers should not be able to post in the truth and tradition thread! IMO

WJ

[GeneBalthrop]

WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO

peace and love ……………………..gene

[GeneBalthrop]

DB…….we are given though sure words of the return of Jesus. It will takes place as described in Luk 21: 25- 28…> AND THERE SHALL BE SIGNS IN THE SUM, AND UPON THE EARTH DISTRESS OF NATIONS, WITH PERPLEXITY; THE SEA WAVES ROARING; MEN'S HEARTS FAILING THEM FOR FEAR, AND LOOKING AFTER THOSE THINGS WHICH ARE COMMING ON THE EARTH: FOR THE POWERS OF HEAVEN SHALL BE SHAKEN. aND THEN SHALL THEY SEE THE SON OF MAN COMMING IN A CLOUD WITH POWER AND GREAT GLORY, AND WHEN YOU SEE (THESE THINGS) BEGIN TO COME TO PASS, (THEN) LOOK UP AND LIFT UP YOURS HEADS; FOR YOUR REDEMPTION DRAWS NEAR. This is from Jesus of what will be taking place just before he returns. The powers of Heave and the Gravitational pulls between the planets,some thing is going to come through our solar system the is going to disrupt it.IMO

peace and love to you and yours…………………………….gene

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,06:56)

Hey Moderators Seriously, this should be posted in the unbelievers threads. Unbelievers should not be able to post in the truth and tradition thread! IMO WJ

Why Judge? The fact is this thread is valid and it is true everyday we have people predicting what Jesus himself said could not be known by any other than God now you believe that Jesus is God but you don't accept that even though he admitted it could not be known to him, he did in-fact make a prediction about the day and hour and he was incorrect proving that he cannot be God and also that no one else should try to make such a prediction that has failed continuously but has disrupted the lives of many going according to these failed dates.

You, WJ

have always buckled when I spoke about the failed prediction of Jesus but what you don't understand is God allowed him to make that prediction forever showing that they are not one in the same or that Jesus is not God. What can you say to dispute this matter other than to complain that I have read the Quran so I can't be right if I am not right you should be able to show me how have any of these predictions have helped humanity.

Seriously you do not want to debate with me so you avoid me. The Word of God comes with Power so there is no doubt why you avoid me.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,16:37)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,06:56) Hey Moderators Seriously, this should be posted in the unbelievers threads. Unbelievers should not be able to post in the truth and tradition thread! IMO WJ Why Judge? The fact is this thread is valid and it is true everyday we have people predicting what Jesus himself said could not be known by any other than God now you believe that Jesus is God but you don't accept that even though he admitted it could not be known to him, he did in-fact make a prediction about the day and hour and he was incorrect proving that he cannot be God and also that no one else should try to make such a prediction that has failed continuously but has disrupted the lives of many going according to these failed dates. You, WJ have always buckled when I spoke about the failed prediction of Jesus but what you don't understand is God allowed him to make that prediction forever showing that they are not one in the same or that Jesus is not God. What can you say to dispute this matter other than to complain that I have read the Quran so I can't be right if I am not right you should be able to show me how have any of these predictions have helped humanity. Seriously you do not want to debate with me so you avoid me. The Word of God comes with Power so there is no doubt why you avoid me.

Hi BD

I am not in the least afraid of you or debate. But to debate with an unbeliever is vain.

When I say Unbeliever, I mean someone who does not hold to the basic tenets of Biblical faith including the “Death, Burial and resurrection of Jesus. It is also vain to debate scriptures with someone who does not believe them or believes they are corrupt and that the Koran corrects them.

Not to mention your continued efforts to belittle our Lord by your proposed inconsistencys and accusations of Jesus being a false Prophet.

Go and learn what a false prophet is according to the scritpures and you will see that if what you say is true, then Jesus would be classified a false prophet.

IMO, you are not even a Christian but rather a Muslim trying to have it both ways. I do not judge you but your own words judge you.

As far as the word of God having power, true, but the power you have is not enough to blow the fuzz off of a peanut IMO.

WJ

[NickHassan]

Hi WJ,
What is a believer?
One who preaches a strange and unbiblical trinity god?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13)

WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene

Hi Gene

Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet?

BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures.

But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice!

Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM?

”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 29 2009,17:03)

Hi WJ, What is a believer? One who preaches a strange and unbiblical trinity god?

NH

What are you saying, that having a Trinitarian view means you cannot be a believer?

I thought that being saved and being a believer means you believe in the death, burial and resurection of Jesus and repenting and being baptised, not that baptism saves?

Doesn't that make the Christian faith different from all the rest, that Jesus shed his blood for our sins and was resurected?

WJ

[Douglas]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 30 2009,08:37)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,06:56) Hey Moderators Seriously, this should be posted in the unbelievers threads. Unbelievers should not be able to post in the truth and tradition thread! IMO WJ Why Judge? The fact is this thread is valid and it is true everyday we have people predicting what Jesus himself said could not be known by any other than God now you believe that Jesus is God but you don't accept that even though he admitted it could not be known to him, he did in-fact make a prediction about the day and hour and he was incorrect proving that he cannot be God and also that no one else should try to make such a prediction that has failed continuously but has disrupted the lives of many going according to these failed dates. You, WJ have always buckled when I spoke about the failed prediction of Jesus but what you don't understand is God allowed him to make that prediction forever showing that they are not one in the same or that Jesus is not God. What can you say to dispute this matter other than to complain that I have read the Quran so I can't be right if I am not right you should be able to show me how have any of these predictions have helped humanity. Seriously you do not want to debate with me so you avoid me. The Word of God comes with Power so there is no doubt why you avoid me.

A few points.

Firstly, why would he be an unbeliever? When are you a believer and when are you not?

I assume at a minimum you need to credit God with a probability of existence, to be a “believer”.

But do you need to believe in Jesus as the son of God?
Do you need to believe in everything written within the Bible?
Do you need to believe in an omnipotent and omniscient God?
Do you need to disbelieve (or believe) in specific things like the trinity?
Do you need to agree with a majority of those present on this site?

BD is more a believer than I am – or than I ever will be – simply because I believe in what I have evidence for, not in what I am willing to put faith in (if I was pushed into the Non believer category I would most likely stop bothering with the site, I have to admit).

I thought that he(?) had a fair and interesting point that people have often predicted the end is nigh throughout history. Being generally ready is a sound strategy if you lack specific intelligence or data to plan around, and arguably better than listening to people who have no solid basis for their claims.

I'm going to make a prediction now (for your list, as it were):

201x AD: End of the Holocene, peak of the 6th great mass extinction, end of current human civilisation on a global scale. The world will certainly not literally end, but for most people it might as well have.

If I'm wrong, you get to have a chuckle about it in 2020, and if I'm right not only will there not be an internet for you to chuckle over, but most of you and everyone you know or ever knew – will be dead.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17)

Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ

Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved.

But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Douglas @ Aug. 30 2009,09:22)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 30 2009,08:37) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,06:56) Hey Moderators Seriously, this should be posted in the unbelievers threads. Unbelievers should not be able to post in the truth and tradition thread! IMO WJ Why Judge? The fact is this thread is valid and it is true everyday we have people predicting what Jesus himself said could not be known by any other than God now you believe that Jesus is God but you don't accept that even though he admitted it could not be known to him, he did in-fact make a prediction about the day and hour and he was incorrect proving that he cannot be God and also that no one else should try to make such a prediction that has failed continuously but has disrupted the lives of many going according to these failed dates. You, WJ have always buckled when I spoke about the failed prediction of Jesus but what you don't understand is God allowed him to make that prediction forever showing that they are not one in the same or that Jesus is not God. What can you say to dispute this matter other than to complain that I have read the Quran so I can't be right if I am not right you should be able to show me how have any of these predictions have helped humanity. Seriously you do not want to debate with me so you avoid me. The Word of God comes with Power so there is no doubt why you avoid me. A few points. Firstly, why would he be an unbeliever? When are you a believer and when are you not? I assume at a minimum you need to credit God with a probability of existence, to be a “believer”. But do you need to believe in Jesus as the son of God? Do you need to believe in everything written within the Bible? Do you need to believe in an omnipotent and omniscient God? Do you need to disbelieve (or believe) in specific things like the trinity? Do you need to agree with a majority of those present on this site? BD is more a believer than I am – or than I ever will be – simply because I believe in what I have evidence for, not in what I am willing to put faith in (if I was pushed into the Non believer category I would most likely stop bothering with the site, I have to admit). I thought that he(?) had a fair and interesting point that people have often predicted the end is nigh throughout history. Being generally ready is a sound strategy if you lack specific intelligence or data to plan around, and arguably better than listening to people who have no solid basis for their claims. I'm going to make a prediction now (for your list, as it were): 201x AD: End of the Holocene, peak of the 6th great mass extinction, end of current human civilisation on a global scale. The world will certainly not literally end, but for most people it might as well have. If I'm wrong, you get to have a chuckle about it in 2020, and if I'm right not only will there not be an internet for you to chuckle over, but most of you and everyone you know or ever knew – will be dead.

Just the fact the you have faith in what you have evidence for is Honesty and God loves Honesty and hates hypocrisy, so I see anyone on the same grounds of honesty and love as people I am proud to stand with.

I see some people preaching door to door that no one should drink wine or beer and when you point out that Jesus drank wine and probably beer too they then claim that it was non-alcoholic beer. What a dishonest bunch that want's to be even better than the Master himself.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead.

Hi BD

I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word.

That is defined as a false prophet…

”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him. Deut 18:20-22

WJ

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ

Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God.

Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:13)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God. Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth.

Hi BD

Jesus said…

The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” John 8:29

It would not please the Father for Jesus to speak false prophesies in his name. Jesus claimed that he always did and said what the Father wanted. Jesus never failed in a word or a deed to do the Fathers will!

WJ

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:17)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:13) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God. Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth. Hi BD Jesus said… The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” John 8:29 It would not please the Father for Jesus to speak false prophesies in his name. Jesus claimed that he always did and said what the Father wanted. Jesus never failed in a word or a deed to do the Fathers will! WJ

He does always what pleases the Father just like this scripture?

1 Kings 22

19And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left.

20And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner.

21And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him.

22And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.

In other words God did not tell him of this prediction nor did Jesus displease God but if he said something that did not occur if it was inspired for a purpose.

Still you have not shown that this prophecy did not fail, whereas I have shown you that Jesus is not God based upon his failure to predict his coming.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:17) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:13) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God. Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth. Hi BD Jesus said… The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” John 8:29 It would not please the Father for Jesus to speak false prophesies in his name. Jesus claimed that he always did and said what the Father wanted. Jesus never failed in a word or a deed to do the Fathers will! WJ He does always what pleases the Father just like this scripture? 1 Kings 22 19And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. 20And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. 21And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. 22And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. In other words God did not tell him of this prediction nor did Jesus displease God but if he said something that did not occur if it was inspired for a purpose. Still you have not shown that this prophecy did not fail, whereas I have shown you that Jesus is not God based upon his failure to predict his coming.

Did Jesus believe he was speaking the Fathers words or not?

He said….

Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. Matt 24:34, 35

He said his words will not pass away, so if they were false then they passed away and according to the scritpures he was presuming to speak the Fathers words!

Therfore the following words apply to him…

”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22

But those who know the truth know this is not true of Jesus!

WJ

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:46)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:33) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:17) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:13) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God. Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth. Hi BD Jesus said… The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” John 8:29 It would not please the Father for Jesus to speak false prophesies in his name. Jesus claimed that he always did and said what the Father wanted. Jesus never failed in a word or a deed to do the Fathers will! WJ He does always what pleases the Father just like this scripture? 1 Kings 22 19And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. 20And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. 21And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. 22And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. In other words God did not tell him of this prediction nor did Jesus displease God but if he said something that did not occur if it was inspired for a purpose. Still you have not shown that this prophecy did not fail, whereas I have shown you that Jesus is not God based upon his failure to predict his coming. Did Jesus believe he was speaking the Fathers words or not? He said…. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. Matt 24:34, 35 He said his words will not pass away, so if they were false then they passed away and according to the scritpures he was presuming to speak the Fathers words! Therfore the following words apply to him… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou sh alt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 But those who know the truth know this is not true of Jesus! WJ

He was not speaking on behalf of the Father but if you insist that he was then what are you saying? Because for a ceratinty it did not happen.

So what say you.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:55)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:46) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:33) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:17) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,18:13) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,10:09) Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 29 2009,17:55) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 30 2009,09:17) Quote (Gene @ Aug. 29 2009,15:13) WJ………what DB posted is true , so how is it you say post it in the unbelievers thread. History is full of false Prophets and Prophetess , we all know that. WJ, it seem like your targeting DB, because He disagree with us at times. I could be wrong, I hope so. IMO peace and love ……………………..gene Hi Gene Are you saying that Jesus is a false prophet? BD is. For if what he is saying is true then Jesus is a liar and a false prophet according to scriptures. But, I understand why you guys would come after me rather than one who does not believe in the scriptures, especially the death and burial and ressurection of our Lord. I greatly rejoice! Gene according to scriptures, BD is not a Christian and yet you call him brother. HMMM? ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Now you have made a staement but you have not shown me to be wrong. I never said that Jesus was a false prophet as he cannot be a false prophet because he had already stated that no one knows the hour but God, saying that he pre-emptied anyone saying they knew so him saying he knew doesn't prove he is a false prophet(God forbid) what it does prove is that he is not God and no one else should try to predict what they cannot predict because as he said it will be as in the days of Noah, they couldn't know either but only who God guided was saved. But you cannot address what I am actually saying because your trinitarian beliefs will explode right before your own eyes, so you prefer to close them instead. Hi BD I said “If what you say is true about Jesus” then Jesus according to the scriptures was making false predictions and presuming to speak Gods word. That is defined as a false prophet… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 WJ Yes, But Jesus did not say that God told him to say the prediction , in -fact he said he could not know the prediction so the verse you used could not apply because Jesus never said “Thus say The Lord God” Jesus was not speaking in the name of YHWH he therefore cannot be held accountable, but at the same time it proves that Jesus is not God. Please don't run away this time but either disprove me or accept the truth. Hi BD Jesus said… The one who sent me is with me; he has not left me alone, for I always do what pleases him.” John 8:29 It would not please the Father for Jesus to speak false prophesies in his name. Jesus claimed that he always did and said what the Father wanted. Jesus never failed in a word or a deed to do the Fathers will! WJ He does always what pleases the Father just like this scripture? 1 Kings 22 19And he said, Hear thou therefore the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing by him on his right hand and on his left. 20And the LORD said, Who shall persuade Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramothgilead? And one said on this manner, and another said on that manner. 21And there came forth a spirit, and stood before the LORD, and said, I will persuade him. 22And the LORD said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so. In other words God did not tell him of this prediction nor did Jesus displease God but if he said something that did not occur if it was inspired for a purpose. Still you have not shown that this prophecy did not fail, whereas I have shown you that Jesus is not God based upon his failure to predict his coming. Did Jesus believe he was speaking the Fathers words or not? He said…. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. Matt 24:34, 35 He said his words will not pass away, so if they were false then they passed away and according to the scritpures he was presuming to speak the Fathers words! Therfore the following words apply to him… ”But the prophet, which shall PRESUME to speak a word in my name”, which “I HAVE NOT COMMANDED HIM TO SPEAK”, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, EVEN THAT PROPHET SHALL DIE. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LOR D hath not spoken? “When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass”, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.   Deut 18:20-22 But those who know the truth know this is not true of Jesus! WJ He was not speaking on behalf of the Father but if you insist that he was then what are you saying? Because for a ceratinty it did not happen. So what say you.

Hi BD

In your mind it did not happen.

Maybe you do not understand as much as you think you do!

Ask Jack or George on this sight if they believe what Jesus spoke happened!

I do not claim to be an expert in Biblical Prophesy, but I know that Jesus was not speaking falsehoods and not a single word of his fell to the ground.

WJ

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