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Quote (Not3in1 @ July 05 2008,13:32) Quote (chosenone @ July 05 2008,13:06) OOPS, thanks also theodorej, I Enjoyed your viewpoint. Thanks for participating. God Bless.
Hey, don't forget me!!
I suppose my views are simple enough.
If the thief was under the old covenant, please show me where the “requirements” for salvation changed?
Someone please show:
Requirements for salvation under the OT
Requirements for salvation under the NT
Hi not3in1.
I'll try to answer your questions…Salvation under the OT.
In Old Testament times, God was God of the Jews only, not the gentiles.
See Eph.2:11-12 Wherefore, remember that once you, the nations in flesh — who are termed 'Uncircumcision' by those termed 'Circumcision,' in flesh, made by hands —
12 that you were, in that era, apart from Christ, being alienated from the citizenship of Israel, and guests of the promise covenants, having no expectation, and without God in the world.
Their salvation was an earthly one, to reign with Christ the King for a thouthand years. But they rejected their Messiah and crusified Him, but will yet in the future realise this event, when Christ returns and makes a “New Covenant whith them.
See Heb.8:10-12. Also prophesied in the OT Jer.31-31.
“For this is the covenant which I shall be covenanting with the house of Israel after those days,” the Lord is saying: “Imparting My laws to their comprehension, On their hearts, also, shall I be inscribing them, And I shall be to them for a God, And they shall be to Me for a people.
11 And by no means should each be teaching his fellow citizen, And each his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord!' For all shall be acquainted with Me, From their little to their great,
12 For I shall be propitious to their injustices, And of their sins and their lawlessnesses should I under no circumstances still be reminded.”
They will reign with Christ their king for the millenium.Salvation Under the NT. Qualifications? NONE.
All mankind has been justified by the death and ressurrection of our Lord and Saviour Christ Jesus. God will perfect everyone thru His work. See Eph.2:4-10.
… yet God, being rich in mercy, because of His vast love with which He loves us
5 (we also being dead to the offenses and the lusts), vivifies us together in Christ (in grace are you saved!)
6 and rouses us together and seats us together among the celestials, in Christ Jesus,
7 that, in the oncoming eons, He should be displaying the transcendent riches of His grace in His kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
8 For in grace, through faith, are you saved, and this is not out of you; it is God's approach present,
9 not of works, lest anyone should be boasting.
10 For His achievement are we, being created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God makes ready beforehand, that we should be walking in them.See 1Cor.15:21-28. for “Salvation of all”.
21 For since, in fact, through a man came death, through a Man, also, comes the resurrection of the dead.
22 For even as, in Adam, all are dying, thus also, in Christ, shall all be vivified.
23 Yet each in his own class: the Firstfruit, Christ; thereupon those who are Christ's in His presence;
24 thereafter the consummation, whenever He may be giving up the kingdom to His God and Father, whenever He should be nullifying all sovereignty and all authority and power.
25 For He must be reigning until He should be placing all His enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy is being abolished: death.
27 For He subjects all under His feet. Now whenever He may be saying that all is subject, it is evident that it is outside of Him Who subjects all to Him.
28 Now, whenever all may be subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also shall be subjected to Him Who subjects all to Him, that God may be All in all.)Also, please remember that I am not infallible, prone to error, as we all do not completely understand Gods ways. This is my understanding of scripture, the Word of God.
Hope this will give you some better understanding.
God Bless, Jerry
Hi brother Jerry,
Those are some wonderful truths what I also believe in respect to our salvation.
Thanks and blessings.
AdamJerry, thank you so much.
I wonder though, in the OT, why were us gentiles “without God in the world”? How come we had no God? Why did God just choose some of his creation over other's? Why were we abandoned?
Quote (seekingtruth @ July 05 2008,14:21) Jerry,
In my opinion1) Salvation is obtained when you recieve the revelation of what the Father has done through His Son and you determine to place your trust in it at the expense of your desires for your life.
2) Seeking further revelations of God and His Son
3) Departing from the faith through a total disregard of God's righteousness by knowingly determining to sin (losing your trust in God).
I believe it is only the grace of God that allows us to have access to this salvation
Wm
Hi ST,
I agree that the way is of grace.
God has not given the grace of repentance unto salvation to all.
He is the potter and men are His clay and the choices are all His.Hi GM,
Those who deny free will seem to come to believe man has no will at all.
Even Jesus had to fight his own will and obey.
Romans 5:19
For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.Nick….Adam nor i ever said or implied the we don't have wills your reading into things we and others said, no one to my knowledge ever said man does not have a Will, the only thing i and others have said, Man does not Have a (FREE) Will. so get you story straight and quite misrepresenting the truth about what been said or implied. Please show us one person that denied (FREE) Will that came to a conclusion that people don't have a WILL. Just name ONE>
Hi GB,
Check back and I have said all along that the will of man is not utterly free.
He is under the control of Satan till God sets him free and then the gentle wind of the Spirit can lead.If man lets the Spirit of course.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 06 2008,16:17) Hi GM,
Those who deny free will seem to come to believe man has no will at all.
Here is the quote of yours. Sorry to point out again.Quote (Not3in1 @ July 06 2008,14:29) Jerry, thank you so much. I wonder though, in the OT, why were us gentiles “without God in the world”? How come we had no God? Why did God just choose some of his creation over other's? Why were we abandoned?
Greetings Mandy….In my humble opinion…I would think that God made the knowledge of himself available to all and in the case of some he made himself available….He choose Israel(at that time all 12 tribes)as a result of the rightousness of Abraham,to give his law and statutes because Israel was Abrahams'seed…Having said that God also made a promise to Hagar that she would bring forth many generations comprising great nations….Someday we may all be surprised to learn that we are not gentiles at all,but members of the geneolgy of the still un accounted for lost 10 tribes of Israel…Who were removed from Gods sight because of Idolatry…Jesus was mindfull of the Lost Tribes and commissioned two of his apostles to minister to them….I believe Paul and John were those apostles…I could be wrong about which apostles but none the less the tribes were sought out…theodore…….I also believe that there are way more Israelites the people even imagaine there are, If you look at the blessings you can tell a lot about where they are today, for instance lets look at the tribe of Ephraim the youngest son of Joesph. When Jacob blessed him He said he would be a common wealth of nations, and the only nation to have ever done was England. And another one was the tribe of Dan, it says every where Dan went He left a mark, i.e. Denmark. the blessings were prophesies of the tribes future another interesting thing is that the united stated had 13 original colonies and Manasseh was conceder the 13th tribe of Israel. I think there are far more desidents of Israel the people realize. Interesting subject.
Quote (theodorej @ July 07 2008,01:25) Quote (Not3in1 @ July 06 2008,14:29) Jerry, thank you so much. I wonder though, in the OT, why were us gentiles “without God in the world”? How come we had no God? Why did God just choose some of his creation over other's? Why were we abandoned?
Greetings Mandy….In my humble opinion…I would think that God made the knowledge of himself available to all and in the case of some he made himself available….He choose Israel(at that time all 12 tribes)as a result of the rightousness of Abraham,to give his law and statutes because Israel was Abrahams'seed…Having said that God also made a promise to Hagar that she would bring forth many generations comprising great nations….Someday we may all be surprised to learn that we are not gentiles at all,but members of the geneolgy of the still un accounted for lost 10 tribes of Israel…Who were removed from Gods sight because of Idolatry…Jesus was mindfull of the Lost Tribes and commissioned two of his apostles to minister to them….I believe Paul and John were those apostles…I could be wrong about which apostles but none the less the tribes were sought out…
Interesting. Insightful.Thanks so much. Looking forward to hearing more about this. I've never studied the lost tribes….
Jesus said he had “other sheep” do you think this is what he was refering to?
Hi all, Good to read the various opinions, thanks all for contributing in an unjudgemental way. We may all agree on some things, but not all agree on everything. The way you have presented yours in as a personal opinion is a delight to hear. Keep expressing your opinions as it comes to mind.
Blessings.
PS. Nick, no opinion on what is neccessary for salvation?
Hi CO,
Nothing is necessary except the mercy of God.
That mercy is specified in the gospel.
The gospel of Jesus is written.
Have you not heard it?Nick.
For one who is so critical of many others who express their opinions on this site, why is it that you are so against publishing your opinion on what is required for salvation? Is it that you are not sure? Or are you afraid you really don't know, and don't want to
reveal your ignorance of scripture. Don't be shy, step up to the plate, we won't bite you.Blessings.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 07 2008,13:54) Hi CO,
Nothing is necessary except the mercy of God.
That mercy is specified in the gospel.
The gospel of Jesus is written.
Have you not heard it?
Nick…I thought the mercy of God was not enough, you have got to obey by your own self and then God will save you. Now you say nothing is necessary but the Mercy of God is that not what we are saying Nick also.WE are saved by (GRACE) and that (NOT) of ourselves, it is a gift of God. That pretty much sums it up.
peace…….gene
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