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Hi Tim,
Repentance: The word means to turn around from the way one is doing; (Matt.4:17)
… John preached repentance to those who sinning against God's Laws. (2Tim. 2:26)
The baptism John the Baptist administered symbolized remission of sin. (1Peter 4:6)
God showed his mercy on us that while we WERE STILL SINNERS, Christ died for us.Matthew 7:1-5 Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge,
ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam
that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of
thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out
of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.The 'law' that was done away with was ceremonial law:
like animal sacrificing; as the final sacrifice was Christ. (Eph.2:15)The adversary is the devil, walking about, seeking whom he may devour. (1Peter 5:8)
You say:
Quote Yet if I hear words spoken today that would seem to change my spiritual philosophy I am ready willing and able to change.
Really? I have repeatedly shown you “The Truth” of God, yet you continually seem to just ignore God's truth.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgTim,
The Bible is truth. The whole Bible is truth. Thats where the confusion you profess begins. One cannot take certain sentances an create doctrines out of it. One must discern the context and point of teaching in relation to the events of the times written. I feel that if you say some of the bible is wrong, you have blasphemed the word, which is God. There is no reasoning with you if you do not accept that.
John's baptism was “turning from sin”, and it is the same today. The world needs to turn from sin by admitting that what it does is sinful and they need to stop. And be reborn in Christ. And live in his Grace.
Perfect-a : being entirely without fault or defect : flawless
This is God's perfect. He is perfect. We are not and need his forgiveness and mercy. I am not degrading you. I am stating what my heart tells me. Keep in mind that I am imperfect though, and ask for God's guidance and mercy on a continual basis. He warned me about “new doctrines” and “False teachers”, and since you obviously spring from the doctrines of that video, you appear to be a likely candidate, in that they go against centurys of christian teaching. Even when the church was new and run by the apostles, this kind of thinking was dangerous and preached against. Godbless-Mark
Quote (Baker @ Jan. 24 2011,07:21) Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 23 2011,20:33) Quote (Baker @ Jan. 22 2011,22:29) Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 21 2011,20:26) Pierre: For me, a first resurrection and a second resurrection are the most foolish doctrines I've ever heard. Jesus said that….whosoever shall believe in me should not perish (die) but shall have eternal life. Jesus words are the resurrection to new life in Christ. The dead works of the law are passed. John 3:16….For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life…! V17….for God sent not his son into the world to condemn the world: but that the world through him (his words) may be saved…..V18…he that believeth on him is not condemned(cleansed from sin): HE THAT BELIEVETH NOT IS CONDEMNED ALREADY…..!
If it is appointed to a man once to die then how can there be two or three resurrections? TK
TKYou obviously type with your fingers, not with your mind; read what you said yourself.
“””whosoever believeth in him should not perish,”””
What does “”perish”” mean to you?
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
“””second death hath no power”””, have noticed this part in that scripture?
Before you make a fool of yourself, you should start reading the Bible.Georg
George: You might want to look in the mirror to get that beam out of your eye so that you can see clearly the scriptures of God. Right now you might see a fool. That was a quote from John3:16, KJV Bible.“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that, whosoever believeth in him SHOULD NOT PERISH, BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE.”
No typos! Thats a true copy! KJV, John 3:16–
Do you read the Bible? You might want to bone-up before you call others fools. TK
It would be hard to type with your mind! I admit I do use my fingers.
You forgot to address the “”second death””; not that that surprises me.
What happens to the once that don't believe in Jesus?Georg
George: You are very positive about what you believe in the revelation of Jesus given to John. I don't care to try to change you or anyone else. And I really don't appreciate being ridiculed for my faith. Now, you have asked twice what about the or (a) second death! I will answer what I believe.There is an option to every human being to learn experientially in this earth realm of duality or when the time is right the spirit or God within will begin to call them home to what we call heaven. For a man to come to God or find his way home (by awareness) he must put off the physical(learning) and take on the spirit/truth, awareness of God. Paul referred to it as, “I died, it is no longer me that liveth but Christ/knowledge of God in me….! This is how the new creation is formed. We put off the old physical ways and take on the spitit truth given through Jesus.We establish his kingdom in earth, us. His words are the words of God recreating our awareness of who and what we have always been, as sons of God. Being born again not physically but spiritually through the spirit words of God. Corrupt takes on incorruptability, at 1Cor.15:43,…so also it the resurrection of the dead. The physical body is sown in corruption and it is raised incorruptable. Sown in dishonour, raised in glory…V44.it is sown a natural body and raised a spiritual body….!
Being born again is the first metaphoric death from earthly physical training to spiritual dreams, visions & mental pictures created by the word of God/Jesus! The second death could only be the cessation of a physical body at the will of the person. In Christ there is no death as in cessation of life. We are eternal beings that move through one door into another world but we never cease to function as life.
Im not sure but doesn't it say that he has part in the first resurrection doesn't even experience a second death? Thats because you only have to die (or put yourself off) once and then the judgment by the words of Jesus. (clean, pure, forgiven, loved, holy, perfect in the eyes of God) That is being born again by the spirit/words of God. IMO, TK
If you continue to call me a fool or any names I will cease to give you my opinion the the subject.
REPENT: Grk. Word “metanoeo”….to think differently or afterwords, i.e. reconsider, repent!! Strongs Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible!
HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH….DOING OR NOT DOING ANYTHING…!! John the Baptist said to the people going to the temple to worship, repent or turn around from the error your thinking, FOR THE REMISSION OF SIN!
REMISSION: Grk. Word: “aphesis”….freedom, pardon, deliverence, forgiveness, liberty, or remission!!
The he offered them Baptism with water to wash away their incorrect thinking of sin! To wash away our sin!!
Some people call truth lies and lies truth. TK
Mark: When you hear the truth from anyone it resonates within your spirit/being. It feels good. Without some effort you cannot feel good telling another human being that he is an imperfect sinner and unclean unto God! The whole Bible is made up of true statments. But the statments are not all true. The Pharisees said Jesus had a demon. That is a true statment but not a statement of truth. He did not have a demon. Saying something in the Bible is wrong is not blasphemy. Saying something God or Jesus said is wrong would blaspheme the Holy Spirit.Johns teaching was a cessation of the old covenant and an effectuating of a new covenant. The New Testament by Spirit
Please answer these questions:
1) What were the sins that the people were to turn from?
List Please:2) What did they need to stop doing to turn from sin?
3) What did they need to stop and what do you mean by being reborn in Christ?
4) What is living in his grace?
Do you consider that be saved from sin and being cleansed by his blood is a false doctrine?
So let me get this straight. If I profess that I am saved from sin, which would make me perfect unto God I have heard a lie. We should say, however, that we are sinners, unclean, absolutely non-christian, separated from God by sin. Then we would be true teachers?
Can we be Christian or Christ like or like Jesus and be un-holy, un-clean sinners?
If Jesus didn't save us from sin and he has to come again to finish his work for God then we are waiting our time. We are sinners with no covering for our sin, whatever that might be!Sinfree teaching is dangerous, am I correct?
So being a Christian or saved from sin is a lie and false doctrine from church? You can't be christ-like and be a sinner!
To believe what you have been saying Jesus might as well just stayed home. According to you what he came to do he did not do, save us and cleanse us a nation unto God. Thats not what I believe!!!!!!! TK
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 25 2011,00:14) Quote (Baker @ Jan. 24 2011,07:21) Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 23 2011,20:33) Quote (Baker @ Jan. 22 2011,22:29) Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 21 2011,20:26) Pierre: For me, a first resurrection and a second resurrection are the most foolish doctrines I've ever heard. Jesus said that….whosoever shall believe in me should not perish (die) but shall have eternal life. Jesus words are the resurrection to new life in Christ. The dead works of the law are passed. John 3:16….For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life…! V17….for God sent not his son into the world to condemn the world: but that the world through him (his words) may be saved…..V18…he that believeth on him is not condemned(cleansed from sin): HE THAT BELIEVETH NOT IS CONDEMNED ALREADY…..!
If it is appointed to a man once to die then how can there be two or three resurrections? TK
TKYou obviously type with your fingers, not with your mind; read what you said yourself.
“””whosoever believeth in him should not perish,”””
What does “”perish”” mean to you?
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
“””second death hath no power”””, have noticed this part in that scripture?
Before you make a fool of yourself, you should start reading the Bible.Georg
George: You might want to look in the mirror to get that beam out of your eye so that you can see clearly the scriptures of God. Right now you might see a fool. That was a quote from John3:16, KJV Bible.“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that, whosoever believeth in him SHOULD NOT PERISH, BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE.”
No typos! Thats a true copy! KJV, John 3:16–
Do you read the Bible? You might want to bone-up before you call others fools. TK
It would be hard to type with your mind! I admit I do use my fingers.
You forgot to address the “”second death””; not that that surprises me.
What happens to the once that don't believe in Jesus?Georg
George: You are very positive about what you believe in the revelation of Jesus given to John. I don't care to try to change you or anyone else. And I really don't appreciate being ridiculed for my faith. Now, you have asked twice what about the or (a) second death! I will answer what I believe.There is an option to every human being to learn experientially in this earth realm of duality or when the time is right the spirit or God within will begin to call them home to what we call heaven. For a man to come to God or find his way home (by awareness) he must put off the physical(learning) and take on the spirit/truth, awareness of God. Paul referred to it as, “I died, it is no longer me that liveth but Christ/knowledge of God in me….! This is how the new creation is formed. We put off the old physical ways and take on the spitit truth given through Jesus.We establish his kingdom in earth, us. His words are the words of God recreating our awareness of who and what we have always been, as sons of God. Being born again not physically but spiritually through the spirit words of God. Corrupt takes on incorruptability, at 1Cor.15:43,…so also it the resurrection of the dead. The physical body is sown in corruption and it is raised incorruptable. Sown in dishonour, raised in glory…V44.it is sown a natural body and raised a spiritual body….!
Being born again is the first metaphoric death from earthly physical training to spiritual dreams, visions & mental pictures created by the word of God/Jesus! The second death could only be the cessation of a physical body at the will of the person. In Christ there is no death as in cessation of life. We are eternal beings that move through one door into another world but we never cease to function as life.
Im not sure but doesn't it say that he has part in the first resurrection doesn't even experience a second death? Thats because you only have to die (or put yourself off) once and then the judgment by the words of Jesus. (clean, pure, forgiven, loved, holy, perfect in the eyes of God) That is being born again by the spirit/words of God. IMO, TK
If you continue to call me a fool or any names I will cease to give you my opinion the the subject.
The active roll you take on most of the topics, shows, you have a greater interest then just voicing your opinions.
That is why I challenge you with “scriptures”, otherwise they would only be my opinions.
All you will do with your (believes), is confuse the confused.Georg
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Jan. 25 2011,00:47) REPENT: Grk. Word “metanoeo”….to think differently or afterwords, i.e. reconsider, repent!! Strongs Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible! HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH….DOING OR NOT DOING ANYTHING…!! John the Baptist said to the people going to the temple to worship, repent or turn around from the error your thinking, FOR THE REMISSION OF SIN!
REMISSION: Grk. Word: “aphesis”….freedom, pardon, deliverence, forgiveness, liberty, or remission!!
The he offered them Baptism with water to wash away their incorrect thinking of sin! To wash away our sin!!
Some people call truth lies and lies truth. TK
Hi Tim,I'm glad you decided to check things out, but you should have researched a little deeper.
Greek #3340 μετανοέω (mĕtanŏĕō) met-an-o-eh'-o: from 3326 and 3539
to think differently or afterwards reconsider (morally feel compunction):- repent.compunction: –noun
1. a feeling of uneasiness or anxiety of the conscience
caused by regret for doing wrong or causing pain; contrition; remorse.2. any uneasiness or hesitation about the rightness of an action.
Yea, why would anyone call it 'a lie' to follow God's Laws?
Especially considering what Jesus said in Matt.19:16-19!Matthew 19:16…17 And, behold, one came and said unto him,
Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
…if thou wilt enter into (everlasting) life, keep the commandments(The Law).The 10 commandments are “The Law” of God!
Matthew 19:18-19 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said,
Thou shalt do no murder(#6), Thou shalt not commit adultery(#7),
Thou shalt not steal(#8), Thou shalt not bear false witness(#9), Honor
thy father and thy mother(#5): and, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself(#10).Witnessing to a worldwide audience in behalf of YHVH!
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14 / Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16)To All: Those who follow the law are judged by the law! The law could never make the worshippers perfect. Those who accept grace, peace and total salvation through the words of Jesus are given the gift of perfection in the eyes of God. They are judged by the word of
God as perfect. It is each persons individual choice to either follow the law for acceptance unto God or believe that Jesus paid the price and gave us the gift of perfecion unto God! If you believe that the law cannot make you perfect you cannot be in perfect union with God.
One comes to God by faith!…..One can only loose his connection to God by unbelief or sin. Sin is unbelief that Jesus took away sin! If you believe you have sin you are separated from God in your thinking. Not in truth, God never leaves us, we just believe we are separated. The temple followers of the Jews performed the law to the best of their ability yet they still had to offer sacrifices for sin.
So the law did not take away nor cover their sin. If one is in sin he has no part with God!! God has no sin. So the law doesn't cleanse the worshipper. Only faith in the works of Jesus given to us will cleanse and make one whole!! For all, whosoever will believe!
Only liars and deceivers will tell you that the law can make perfect! If one wishes to be free in the love of Jesus to walk head up as a perfect son of God with their Father in Heaven it can only be done by faith! Faith that Jesus did the work and gave us the gift. IMO, TK
Hi Tim,
It's our faith that brings us to Christ, (Ephesians 2:8)
and it's our walk of faith what perfects us. (2Thess.2:12)
Rom.1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed
from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgTim,
There is no revealing anything to you if you doubt scripture. John's whole ministry was baptising to prepare for Jesus, telling people “Reform your lives”. The sins then are the same today. Greed. selfishness, adultry, pride(self-rightiousness, believing one's self is perfect and not sinful), etc, etc. In The opening of Mark, he said “reform your lives”. He also says all over the gospels that the love of money, impurity, drunkenness and the like are against God. If what you say is true then the gospels are a waste of time to read. Why bother reading about what Jesus wants from us. It doesn.t matter. Only being perfect no matter what you do matters. No commands to fulfill, no baptism( cause according to you all churches are wrong, and I do not know of anyone baptising anyone outside of a church right now around here) no need to go there.No charity, no love of ones enemys, no need of being forgiven because you do no wrong once you are perfect. But Tim, as God lives, thats not right. To take apart the bible to only what agrees with you is not right. John prepared humanity by baptising with water, a symbol of turning from ones sinful nature and turning to God, REBORN A CHILD OF GOD. John 3:5″ I solemnly assure you no one can enter God's kingdom without being begotton (born) of water and Spirit”. “Do not be surprised that I tell you you must all be begotten from above” BORN AGAIN!
Matthew 28:19 “Baptise them in the name of the Father, and of the son, and of the Holy Spirit”
And then the verse that makes me feel that you mislead-
Matthew 28:20 “Teach them to CARRY OUT EVERYTHING I HAVE COMMANDED YOU” (emphasis added)Not “believe in me and you cannot sin” definately without a doubt, do what he says.You can't twist that. It can't be changed without deception.
You are trying to teach that one can do whatever they want to in thier own Kingdom, and they are King of that Kingdom,IMO herecy, Only God is self-ruled King. Nowhere in the Bible, is anything close to that, cover to cover. Show me one place that states that man is his own King and not subject to sin(in those words, the same way you profess it)
Peace my friend- MarkPsalm 97:1
“The Lord is King; let the earth rejoice;”
Tim
Once you believe in the messiah, you are king. NOT!
Psalm 99:4 “The King in his might loves justice;you have established equity; justice and judgement in Jacob you have wrought. Extol the Lord, our God, and worship at his footstool; holy is he!
Tim
You are your own king in your own kingdom. Nothing to do because you are perfect once you believe in Jesus. Holy are you in your own Kingdom. NOT!
Quote (mikeangel @ Jan. 25 2011,22:58) Tim, There is no revealing anything to you if you doubt scripture. John's whole ministry was baptising to prepare for Jesus, telling people “Reform your lives”. The sins then are the same today. Greed. selfishness, adultry, pride(self-rightiousness, believing one's self is perfect and not sinful), etc, etc. In The opening of Mark, he said “reform your lives”. He also says all over the gospels that the love of money, impurity, drunkenness and the like are against God. If what you say is true then the gospels are a waste of time to read. Why bother reading about what Jesus wants from us. It doesn.t matter. Only being perfect no matter what you do matters. No commands to fulfill, no baptism( cause according to you all churches are wrong, and I do not know of anyone baptising anyone outside of a church right now around here) no need to go there.No charity, no love of ones enemys, no need of being forgiven because you do no wrong once you are perfect. But Tim, as God lives, thats not right. To take apart the bible to only what agrees with you is not right. John prepared humanity by baptising with water, a symbol of turning from ones sinful nature and turning to God, REBORN A CHILD OF GOD. John 3:5″ I solemnly assure you no one can enter God's kingdom without being begotton (born) of water and Spirit”. “Do not be surprised that I tell you you must all be begotten from above” BORN AGAIN!
Matthew 28:19 “Baptise them in the name of the Father, and of the son, and of the Holy Spirit”
And then the verse that makes me feel that you mislead-
Matthew 28:20 “Teach them to CARRY OUT EVERYTHING I HAVE COMMANDED YOU” (emphasis added)Not “believe in me and you cannot sin” definately without a doubt, do what he says.You can't twist that. It can't be changed without deception.
You are trying to teach that one can do whatever they want to in thier own Kingdom, and they are King of that Kingdom,IMO herecy, Only God is self-ruled King. Nowhere in the Bible, is anything close to that, cover to cover. Show me one place that states that man is his own King and not subject to sin(in those words, the same way you profess it)
Peace my friend- Mark
Mark: The scriptures say John came preaching repentance…You are saying he came to reform lives! The scriptures do not say that!Another general statement from you, “all over the gospels”…in one scripture he said, the LOVE, of money, is the root of all evil, not money itself. The patriarchs and God fearing men were quite wealthy.
The first miracle recorded by Jesus was at the wedding when the wine had run out, the people were “well drunken” or intoxicated, yet he made the equivlent of 120 gallons of wine that was better/stronger than the wine they had consumed. There is no sin in drinking anything, or Jesus aided their sins with temptation for more. Don't hand me any of that fruit juice crap, when fruit juice ferments into alchohol it is then termed wine!
Please understand you can give anything you want to Jesus. You can do anything you want for Jesus. Your freedom to love Jesus/God is unrestricted. Even if you choose to burden yourself for Jesus or suffer pain, it is ok, it is your gift to Jesus. But of all the things you may or may not do for Jesus, it is not the deeds or works that connect you to him. Faith in him connects you, then do as you wish to show him love.
Absolutely there is a Baptism! Where did you get that? Its not a water Baptism like John's it is the greater Baptism of the Holy Spirit from God through Jesus. A spirit/word Baptism!
What churches are you talking about? I am writing to a true church. The true church is the body of Christ/words of God. You are the true church. You are also the temple of the living God, and the Priest of your Temple. Jesus is High Priest.
Jesus is King of kings. You are a king of your kingdom of God within. The words of God/Spirit within.As anyone hears and accepts these truthes/words there is great freedom felt with joy in the holy ghost. That love given to all from Jesus creates thanksgiving within. Since it comes by faith only, the same for all, there is no boasting of who did this or who did that.
There was no Baptism in the old testament. I guess they were just doomed. Jesus said you must be born of water and spirit. We are born in/of water from our mothers womb to enter this earth realm leagally. Now we must be born of spirit to return.
Being born again is being recreated mentally to a new way of thinking, by the spirit words of God through Jesus. Born again from above.
Matt:28:19…..Baptise in the name(the authority,power annointing)….of the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit.
Matt.28:20…(A message for everyone from Jesus)….go ye therefore, and teach all nations baptizing them in the NAME/authority of Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.. A spirit/word baptizm!
..teaching then to observe (carry out) all things (logos;words) I have commanded you:I'm not trying to make you believe. Thats your choice. I'm just showing a congruent way where scripture follows suit.
IMO, TK
Quote (mikeangel @ Jan. 25 2011,23:30) Psalm 97:1 “The Lord is King; let the earth rejoice;”
Tim
Once you believe in the messiah, you are king. NOT!
Psalm 99:4 “The King in his might loves justice;you have established equity; justice and judgement in Jacob you have wrought. Extol the Lord, our God, and worship at his footstool; holy is he!
Tim
You are your own king in your own kingdom. Nothing to do because you are perfect once you believe in Jesus. Holy are you in your own Kingdom. NOT!
Mark:
Jesus is without a doubt the King of Kings!! Who are the Kings he is King of?Jesus is Lord of Lords, without a doubt. Who is Jesus lord of?
Those who make him lord! I made him Lord of my life and follow him only. If other writers in the Bible align with Jesus, I listen and follow. Jesus always first!!I havn't established ANYTHING from myself or for myself. Self righteous is righteousness claimed by oneself, Jesus made me righteous with his words, I only repeat what Jesus has said and done for us all. For all who believe.
I wouldn't say nothing to do because I accept the perfection of Christ by faith. I spend hours a day trying to show many others like you the truth that I have been given. I don't get a penny for it. Freely it was given and freely I have received! TK
But Tim, what about doing what Jesus ask? Where in all of that is following what he commanded like mentioned above in scripture? In fact, no one can totally do it. It is impossible for mere mortals to be perfect. That is what the law was ment for, to show how much we needed that savior. And so we could be so intensely greatful for grace. and I get your point and agree, that ones own works or deeds can NOT save ones self. BUT, the kicker is that if you do nothing for Jesus you are in disbelief, because if you believed in him you would do as he ask you, or at least attempt to. It's like a dog chasing its tail this arguement is. It's the main disagreement I have with my wife, we no longer discuss it. Its not works that save you , but if you believe in him you will do them. If you don't you don't really believe. If you don't really believe you won't do the deeds. If you don't do the deeds than you don't really believe……………infinity……… Duh-I know that no matter what I do I cannot be Jesus and suffer and die as the true perfect sacrifice that saves humanity. In that I am powerless. But I do not have to, because he did.
But he asked me to follow his and his fathers commands……And I try, and sometimes I fail, but the spirit of God in me convicts me and forgives me and heals me. And I get up the next day and try to do better. But, no matter what I do, I cannot take any claim to earn any part of his sacrifice on Calvary. But since I really believe in him I will try to do as he ask me to because I believe and love him very, very much. Not think of myself as King in my Kingdom and perfect.
Do you own any personal possesions? You are not perfect. He said to the man who even claimed to follow the commandments, (fulfilling what Jesus said he needed to do to enherit eternal life),when the man tried to justify himself, he said “then you must do one thing more, sell what you have, give it to the poor, and come and follow me” Do you own anything Tim? Car? House? You need to sell them and go proclaim the Gospel, you would be closer to perfect. Even then you will never attain it. You are not a king. Neither is Elvis. Peace my friend-Mark
Quote (mikeangel @ Jan. 26 2011,01:45) But Tim, what about doing what Jesus ask? Where in all of that is following what he commanded like mentioned above in scripture? In fact, no one can totally do it. It is impossible for mere mortals to be perfect. That is what the law was ment for, to show how much we needed that savior. And so we could be so intensely greatful for grace. and I get your point and agree, that ones own works or deeds can NOT save ones self. BUT, the kicker is that if you do nothing for Jesus you are in disbelief, because if you believed in him you would do as he ask you, or at least attempt to. It's like a dog chasing its tail this arguement is. It's the main disagreement I have with my wife, we no longer discuss it. Its not works that save you , but if you believe in him you will do them. If you don't you don't really believe. If you don't really believe you won't do the deeds. If you don't do the deeds than you don't really believe……………infinity……… Duh-I know that no matter what I do I cannot be Jesus and suffer and die as the true perfect sacrifice that saves humanity. In that I am powerless. But I do not have to, because he did. But he asked me to follow his and his fathers commands……And I try, and sometimes I fail, but the spirit of God in me convicts me and forgives me and heals me. And I get up the next day and try to do better. But, no matter what I do, I cannot take any claim to earn any part of his sacrifice on Calvary. But since I really believe in him I will try to do as he ask me to because I believe and love him very, very much. Not think of myself as King in my Kingdom and perfect.
Do you own any personal possesions? You are not perfect. He said to the man who even claimed to follow the commandments, (fulfilling what Jesus said he needed to do to enherit eternal life),when the man tried to justify himself, he said “then you must do one thing more, sell what you have, give it to the poor, and come and follow me” Do you own anything Tim? Car? House? You need to sell them and go proclaim the Gospel, you would be closer to perfect. Even then you will never attain it. You are not a king. Neither is Elvis. Peace my friend-Mark
Mark: It is my perception that you have deep, loving and willing heart to know the truth. The promise from God is you will. When you find the truth it will make you free.I have tried to tell you things I have learned in thirty five years. I appologize for the frustration. I din't have a clue to these things thirty years ago. When I found God I was alone at home and I gave him my life. My stopped anything and everything I was taught was bad or should or shouldn't do and started doing everything for the church building I could do. Even became missionary president of a denominational church which is the most worthless and degrading, hipocritical
position a young man could force himself to do. I didn't complain I just kept studying and praying for God to teach me the truth.One thing that might help you and your wife about the works we do. Your perfection unto God is by faith in what Jesus did and resting from you own works for salvation. Now to express that deep love you feel for Jesus, his work, his sacrifice, his total gift of salvation go and do anything nice and good for anyone, anywhere to show Jesus your love. Never do the works to be better or worse. You must accept perfection from his/Jesus works. All to him we owe.
Once again if you will look at Revelation 1:6…Jesus…has washed us from our sins and hath made us kings and priests unto God…..If I agree with scriptures and what they say about everyone who believes, please don't tell me I am not a king if he says we are. You can deny yourself as a king but you cannot deny me from accepting his truth!
King: A ruler in supreme command! Since you can do anything you want to do whether right or wrong at any time you choose. Wouldn't that classify as a King of himself?
The only request by God and Jesus for us to do is love your bretherin, as you have been loved by them and rest in the finished work of Jesus. IMO, TK
Tim! The New Covenant is in Jesus blood, but He also gave us the great commandment to keep…,.You don't keep that? Since you say that the law has been done away…..Jesus told us it hasn't….I question why Jesus in one hand gives us the great commandments and then says that we are no longer under that, is that what you are saying????We all have fallen short of the glory of God….
Peace IreneIrene: Bless you, The line on the post I did to Mark right above your post states: The only request by God and Jesus for us to do is love our bretherin, as we have been loved by God/Jesus and rest in the finished work of Jesus for our salvation. Why would you say that I don't keep the great commandment which is to Love the lord God with all your heart? Is that wording that hard to understand. I know I was not quoting word for word but it should have been understandable.
A commandment is a direct order of something. Love comes from the heart as a gift from inside a person willingly applying their dedicated devotion to another. You cannot command love. It would then be fear. If you command a child to get on your lap, hug you and tell you that they love you what you get will not be love it will be obediance through fear or retribution. I feel the word command was mistranslated when translation was done. I suggest that you love as you have been loved would be better. There is no punishment for not loving. How could there be, it is a gift from within a person. If there is a punishment then it is done by fear! IMO, TK
King: A ruler in supreme command! Since you can do anything you want to do whether right or wrong at any time you choose.
Quote from Tim
BUT LISTEN TO YOURSELF! you can do anything you want to do whether right or wrong at any time you choose.
This is evil! This is deception! This is not right! You are not allowed to do wrong!!!! SHOW ME ONE PLACE IN THE BIBLE WHERE IT STATES YOU CAN DO WRONG!!!!!!!!!!! WAKE UP!!!! That is the same thing Alester Crowley professed, the most evil man I know of second to Elvis, self professed 666″ Do what you want to”. also the masons and anarchist “do what thou wilst”, and then YOU DARE PUT JESUS' BLESSING ON IT? I am not biting bro. You do as you feel bro. Seya at the gate. Peace-Mark
Mark: What I meant was you are capable of doing anything whether right or wrong at any time you choose, there is nothing stopping you. You could choose to kill me for my beliefs in Jesus and no one would stop you. You could rob a bank and no one would stop you. Try to stop hating me long enough to at least read and hear what I am trying to say. You believe in love thy neighbor and I believe in love
thy neighbor. You believe God will whip you or punish you some way if you don't follow his rules. I believe I will reap exactly what I sow in life. My heavenly father teaches me he does not spank me. I believe that if I do good things from my heart, not based on fear of retrobution then I have loved. I believe if I perform up to par or up to rules and laws, set by a powerhead figure, its is from fear not love!
I give my love because he first loved me. He made me free of any rules because he trusted in me and I will not let him down. You hate my freedom in Christ because you don't understand. I hold myself to a much higher order that any law requires, anywhere! But I do good for love not fear of breaking a law and being punished.
You won't see me at the gate because I have moved on well into the Kingdom prepared for the righteous by faith. Though it sounds like we won't be communicating any more, one day as you move forward in the understanding of the truth of God through Jesus you will remember my words, I only hope they help, that is what they were intended to do. Peace, love and joy unto you and yours, TK
No Tim, I do not hate you. I never said that. You, to me , are like passing a horrible accident. You know you shouldn't but you can't keep from looking, and I wish there was something I could do to help. I do not hate you. I extremely do not like some of the things you say, because they go against what I have written on my heart. I also do not judge you, God will do that. Want to or not you will stand before God. That is another example of something that is black and white in the bible, needing no intrepretation, and hard to twist, that you state does not apply to you “The King (Jesus not Elvis) will sit on his throne, and separate the sheep from the goats”. Then those who have merely professed it, the “Lord Lord” people (problibly like those who hurt you from where you went to church) will go to eternal punishment, and those who did not neglect even the least of Jesus' brothers will go to eternal life. All I am saying is that I have over the course of the last year shown you that we do have rules, and we are not free to do wrong as we choose, using scriptures from Jesus himself as well as Paul and others.You have professed the same skewed philosophy as some of the most evil people on earth, as well as the misled “New Age” movement, which you won't distance yourself from.You say some of the scriptures are wrong and you are right. That is heresy, like the false teachers of old tried to mislead the church with. It is just incredibly plain to see with me. You say the churchs are all wrong , and you can do wrong if you want to as you want to, then brand them as hypocritical and bad for what they did to you.
. I honestly I am praying for you Tim. I pray that God sends the world a clear message of what is good and what is bad. The waters have been so mucked up by philosophys like yours and that video(although there is no differance as far as I know) Peace-Mark
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