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Quote WOW !!!….Nick…For the desd no nothing….They are just dead….until the ressurection….
The Hell spoken of in scripture,refers to the grave….
PS….Don't get hung up on “The Devine Comedy” commonly known as Dantes' Inferno–theo
I actually agree with an astounding amount of things that you guys are saying. The trinity, hell, the immortal soul…..etc.
I must ask you what you think of this scripture:
JOHN 13:35
“By this all will know that YOU are my disciples, if YOU have love among yourselves.””Imagine that you were of the COG for example and that there is someone of the COG in another country. He is your brother, spiritually. Yet, you are on this side and he is on that side.
Really, you should both be on the side of God's government, the only true solution for peace. And if I were to look at the two of you, on opposite sides, helping your countries military machines, I don't know that I could say I see the “love” between you two.
So what am I to think?
Greetings David…..Iam sorry if I disappointed you with my last post..and appreciate the tone of your rebuke….and I miust say that given the spirit of your post I hit a nerve and if my
observation is correct please except my apology…..Hi Theodorej.
I'm not actually quite sure what you are apologizing for. Or why you would be apologizing to ME.
It's not really a “nerve” that you hit, it's just something that seems so obvious to me. And I don't know your exact situation, but when I see a priest on one side blessing his troups and a bishop on the other side blessing his side of the war, I can only fathom that they are both on Satan's side. God does not fight among himself. And Jesus followers do not engage in battle and kill their brothers. And despite this seeming obvious to me, many on here say that I should not say such things.Quote (david @ Mar. 06 2008,13:36) Quote WOW !!!….Nick…For the desd no nothing….They are just dead….until the ressurection….
The Hell spoken of in scripture,refers to the grave….
PS….Don't get hung up on “The Devine Comedy” commonly known as Dantes' Inferno–theo
I actually agree with an astounding amount of things that you guys are saying. The trinity, hell, the immortal soul…..etc.
I must ask you what you think of this scripture:
JOHN 13:35
“By this all will know that YOU are my disciples, if YOU have love among yourselves.””Imagine that you were of the COG for example and that there is someone of the COG in another country. He is your brother, spiritually. Yet, you are on this side and he is on that side.
Really, you should both be on the side of God's government, the only true solution for peace. And if I were to look at the two of you, on opposite sides, helping your countries military machines, I don't know that I could say I see the “love” between you two.
So what am I to think?
David….As I see it and I could be wrong,not withstanding the fact that God determines the out come of earthly wars….
There is only one side to be on and that is the side that you know to be true……When Jesus returns he is not coming as a lamb….He is coming with a force that is incomprehencable to
puny man….and I don't know about you but I am scared…Quote God determines the out come of earthly wars…. If Jesus 3 times called Satan the “ruler of the world” and the book of Revelation says that Satan is “misleading the entire inhabited earth” and if 2 Cors called Satan the “god of this world” then I would say Satan is behind the horrific terror of war that we see and not God. Also, Satan offered him “all the kingdoms of the world.” Satan could not tempt Jesus with something he didn't have!
It is God who will step in and put an end to these human governments. He will crush them all with his kingdom. (Dan 2:44)
But God is not on one side or the other. I know nationalism and pride can be a deceptive thing. But it is just that thinking that leads people into thinking that going to war with a lesser country is not so bad–killing people in that other country that God hasn't blessed–isn't so bad.Quote There is only one side to be on and that is the side that you know to be true
God's government, his kingdom. It is the only side that will be left standing. (dan 2:44) It is his government we pray for.Quote When Jesus returns he is not coming as a lamb….He is coming with a force that is incomprehencable to puny man. Yes, that's true. God has every right to do this and no one can question him. I am certainly not. I am completely for God's war of armageddon.
But I'm not sure how any of this is connected with the idea in this scripture for example:
JOHN 13:35
“By this all will know that YOU are my disciples, if YOU have love among yourselves.””
Imagine you didn't know what country I was in and I didn't know your country, but we serve the same God and believe the same things and our countries go to war and I kill you….. wait. That scenerio should never even arise for a Christian. They are “no part of the world.”1 JOHN 3:11-12
“For this is the message which YOU have heard from [the] beginning, that we should have love for one another; not like Cain, who originated with the wicked one and slaughtered his brother. And for the sake of what did he slaughter him? Because his own works were wicked, but those of his brother [were] righteous.”I believe that as a Christian, you have to be on the outside.
Quote (david @ Mar. 06 2008,14:24) Hi Theodorej. I'm not actually quite sure what you are apologizing for. Or why you would be apologizing to ME.
It's not really a “nerve” that you hit, it's just something that seems so obvious to me. And I don't know your exact situation, but when I see a priest on one side blessing his troups and a bishop on the other side blessing his side of the war, I can only fathom that they are both on Satan's side. God does not fight among himself. And Jesus followers do not engage in battle and kill their brothers. And despite this seeming obvious to me, many on here say that I should not say such things.
David…..Your observation is accurate and for that reason
organized religion as we know it today has failed….Do you think
the Catholic Church could explain the paradox of a priest on bothsides blessing the troops as they go into battle against each other…(eg.German/American).David my apology is directed to your dissapointment with
respect to the worldlynis of my recon post….
On the lighter side to Err is human to forgive is devine….Quote David my apology is directed to your dissapointment with
respect to the worldlynis of my recon post….
On the lighter side to Err is human to forgive is devine….But you don't agree with me, do you? Yet you apologize? Or you do agree with me, and you continue on this path of …”worldliness.”? I'm not sure I understand that.
Quote David…..Your observation is accurate and for that reason
organized religion as we know it today has failed…Someone who was at a door that we approached once said: “You JW's. What would the world be like if everyone was like you? Who would go to war?”
She was stating that there would be no one to fight the wars if everyone believed as we do. It took her a moment, but she eventually realized what she said. Indeed “what would the world be like?” There'd be no war.
You don't have to wait for armageddon to beat your swords in plowshares. You won't need to fight for God on armageddon. He's got it covered.REVELATION 19:17-18
““Come here, be gathered together to the great evening meal of God, that YOU may eat the fleshy parts of KINGS and the fleshy parts of MILITARY COMMANDERS and the fleshy parts of strong men and the fleshy parts of horses and of those seated upon them, and the fleshy parts of all, of freemen as well as of slaves and of small ones and great.””Jesus once said something about fruits and how many would produce rotten fruitage and how these are false.
I believe the Bible points to one particular bad fruitage:
“The children of God and the children of the Devil are evident by this fact: Everyone who does not carry on righteousness does not originate with God, neither does he who does not love his brother. For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should have love for one another; not like Cain, who originated with the wicked one and slaughtered his brother.”—1 John 3:10-12.
Question: Since this is a thread on Ron Weinland, I'm wondering what his ideas are on war. Anyone?
David….I know that God determines the outcome of earthly wars…..Lets look at the record…
Our revolutionary war….we were rag tag army of settlers against The English Empire..we
were out gunned out maned and out numbered…It was Gods purpose for this nation to prevail…WW11…We were broke and devided and not interested in the problems of Europe
as well as Japan….There were more reasons for us loosing that war than winning it….God saw fit to give us victory…As Winston Churchill stated before the US house of Representatives….” There is Purpose being worked out here that trancends our understanding.
God hates war …..But he knows the nature of man….and that reason …better days are coming and I have it from a very reliable source…David….Iam a man and Iam in this world….I struggle with the nature that is I…and that is why I need a savior…
Quote I know that God determines the outcome of earthly wars While I believe the U.S. is playing it's role in prophecy, I don't believe that God cheers for soccar games or human wars. I believe he knew what would happen and prophesied certain things regarding nations, but I dont' believe God is on the battlefield. It is Satan that is on the battlefield. It is Satan this is definitely ruling the kingdoms of the world. (Mat 4) He could not have offered them as a 'temptation' if they were not his to offer. It is Satan that is pitting man against man, not God. It is Satan that would like us all to follow him in his violent course, not God.
Yes, better days are coming. God will remove Satan, the “ruler of this world.”
Sure He Could !!! He is a Liar !!…..God is not on the battlefield…but he does know the nature
of man…and for his own purposes he will allow one to prevail against the other…..Look At Gideon….Look at King David….The bible is repleat with war…P.S………Our very salvation will be the result of a war…..What do you think is going to happen on the last great day of The Lord…
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 06 2008,08:27) Hi TJ,
This term ” ceasing to exist” does not seem to appear in scripture.
All who die before the second resurrection will be raised after the 1000 year reign to judgement.
Greetings Nick….Your post regarding the term I used with respect to the end of life( cease to exist ).
The term may not appear verbatum in scripture however the
principal is intimated in the scripture as follows We are to fear the one who has the ability to destroy both body and soul in
the lake of fire…..
Having said that we can cease to exist….
What do you think…..Question if after WWII the founders of the state of Isreal decided to call their new country by any other name then Isreal, would we even be having this discussion? The Isreali founding fathers were no fools, they knew the name “Isreal” had associations with both the Diaspora and Christianity that could not but help their cause. Many Christians today freely proclaim that to bless Isreal will result in God's favor and those cursing Isreal will in turn be cursed. The government of the U.S.A. has since the 1970s sent billions upon billions to the state with little or no return for such investment. The U.S.A. has likewise sent billions to Isreal's neighbors so as to discourage them from attacking the jewish state. The U.S.' unwaivering support of Isreal has returned however, no small measure of anomosity from the Islamic world. So is the state of Isreal the reincarnation of Biblical Isreal blessed by the Allmighty, or is it just a masterful public relations coup from 60 years ago that still reaps tremendous dividends today from Jews and Christians alike who see what they want to see?
Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 07 2008,00:23) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 06 2008,08:27) Hi TJ,
This term ” ceasing to exist” does not seem to appear in scripture.
All who die before the second resurrection will be raised after the 1000 year reign to judgement.
Greetings Nick….Your post regarding the term I used with respect to the end of life( cease to exist ).
The term may not appear verbatum in scripture however the
principal is intimated in the scripture as follows We are to fear the one who has the ability to destroy both body and soul in
the lake of fire…..
Having said that we can cease to exist….
What do you think…..
Hi TJ,
Yes.
The fire made for satan and his angels
The second death after the judgement.Quote (Cato @ Mar. 07 2008,02:50) Question if after WWII the founders of the state of Isreal decided to call their new country by any other name then Isreal, would we even be having this discussion? The Isreali founding fathers were no fools, they knew the name “Isreal” had associations with both the Diaspora and Christianity that could not but help their cause. Many Christians today freely proclaim that to bless Isreal will result in God's favor and those cursing Isreal will in turn be cursed. The government of the U.S.A. has since the 1970s sent billions upon billions to the state with little or no return for such investment. The U.S.A. has likewise sent billions to Isreal's neighbors so as to discourage them from attacking the jewish state. The U.S.' unwaivering support of Isreal has returned however, no small measure of anomosity from the Islamic world. So is the state of Isreal the reincarnation of Biblical Isreal blessed by the Allmighty, or is it just a masterful public relations coup from 60 years ago that still reaps tremendous dividends today from Jews and Christians alike who see what they want to see?
Greetings Cato….I ask ….What is in a name…Israel was the name chosen by the almighty in place of the name Jacob for
the the patriarch of 12 men latter to evolve into the 12 tribes
of Israel….10 of which were banished from the sight of the
Eternal for persistant embracing of Idolatry….consequently
they lost their Identity…..
The other 3 tribes Indentified as Judah,Levi and benjamin
found favor with the Eternal because of their keeping of
Law…(eg.sabbath and holy days Lev:23 and the commandments)….Judah which is the name the remaining
three tribes identify as today also fell from favor and the
eternal saw fit to allow them to be taken captive in Babylon
(ref:Book of Daniel).
The people of modern day Israel as we know it today are the
decendents of Judah (eg.The Jews)….
The answer to question is yes….The arab worlds vitriel hatred
for the Jews would exist even if they named their new state
disnyland….Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 07 2008,05:05) Quote (theodorej @ Mar. 07 2008,00:23) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 06 2008,08:27) Hi TJ,
This term ” ceasing to exist” does not seem to appear in scripture.
All who die before the second resurrection will be raised after the 1000 year reign to judgement.
Greetings Nick….Your post regarding the term I used with respect to the end of life( cease to exist ).
The term may not appear verbatum in scripture however the
principal is intimated in the scripture as follows We are to fear the one who has the ability to destroy both body and soul in
the lake of fire…..
Having said that we can cease to exist….
What do you think…..
Hi TJ,
Yes.
The fire made for satan and his angels
The second death after the judgement.
Nick…what about the second death for those who choose
not to live under the law..Quote Hi david,
Christ was apolitical.
But you would give political advice to people of the world?Look a little closer nick. I'm doing exactly the opposite. My “political advice” as you put it is to suggest that Christians should be for God's government and not fighting sides in man's wars. Nick, I find that you misrepresent what I say more than everyone else combined on here. Why is that?
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