Reason and Religion

[terraricca]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,14:56)

By the way God can say “WE” and refer to Himself or Himself and others because that is the nature of the word ALMIGHTY in other words God is ALL the powers that be. Just like YHVH has a meaning such as the Self Existing One to be such a being you would uniquely have to have ALL that is Powerful. So God is not a Man or a Woman and He transcends life and death God is The Powers i.E.  Elohim http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim Elohim (אֱלהִים) is a grammatically singular or plural noun for “god” or “gods” in both modern and ancient Hebrew language. When used with singular verbs and adjectives elohim is usually singular, “god” or especially, the God. ……………………………………………….. Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God

bod

Quote

Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God

yeah you just forgot the word FALLS in front of it ,

like I told you, you can talk for years to come BUT YOU NEVER WILL BE ABLE TO MAKE THE LIES OF MUHAMMAD INTO A TRUTH OF JEHOVAH GOD,THE GOD OF ABRAHAM ,ISAAC,JACOBS,ISRAEL,DAVID,JESUS THE TRUE MESSIAH AND SON OF GOD,

Pierre

[bodhitharta]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 01 2012,09:49)

bod Quote Moses is the Apostle in that story. first this is falls Moses his a prophet not a apostle  look up your history,dictionary,and what not , you also mist one “and who is “OUR SIGNS”  so who is “OUR” and who are the “SIGNS” you can lie and show BS. because the truth is not in you , you are the deceiver ,I want all to see it , Pierre

An apostle is a (religious) messenger and ambassador so every prophet is also an Apostle of God but I guess you didn't know that

[bodhitharta]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 01 2012,10:06)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,14:56) By the way God can say “WE” and refer to Himself or Himself and others because that is the nature of the word ALMIGHTY in other words God is ALL the powers that be. Just like YHVH has a meaning such as the Self Existing One to be such a being you would uniquely have to have ALL that is Powerful. So God is not a Man or a Woman and He transcends life and death God is The Powers i.E.  Elohim http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim Elohim (אֱלהִים) is a grammatically singular or plural noun for “god” or “gods” in both modern and ancient Hebrew language. When used with singular verbs and adjectives elohim is usually singular, “god” or especially, the God. ……………………………………………….. Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God bod Quote Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God yeah you just forgot the word FALLS in front of it , like I told you, you can talk for years to come BUT YOU NEVER WILL BE ABLE TO MAKE THE LIES OF MUHAMMAD INTO A TRUTH OF JEHOVAH GOD,THE GOD OF ABRAHAM ,ISAAC,JACOBS,ISRAEL,DAVID,JESUS THE TRUE MESSIAH AND SON OF GOD, Pierre

I will not be responding to your posts any longer unless God directs me to and the reason is you have called me a liar and have ignored any reasonable attempts to communicate with love and honesty.

God Bless you and may God help you learn the truth that I have shared with you.

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 31 2011,13:26)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 30 2011,14:36) Hi BD, Do you now accept that Jesus was dead, and that YHVH resurrected him? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Will you please answer my question; OK? B'shem YHVH

Hi BD,

Are you going to answer my question now?

B'shem
YHVH

[terraricca]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,17:33)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 01 2012,09:49) bod Quote Moses is the Apostle in that story. first this is falls Moses his a prophet not a apostle  look up your history,dictionary,and what not , you also mist one “and who is “OUR SIGNS”  so who is “OUR” and who are the “SIGNS” you can lie and show BS. because the truth is not in you , you are the deceiver ,I want all to see it , Pierre An apostle is a (religious) messenger and ambassador so every prophet is also an Apostle of God but I guess you didn't know that

bod

Quote

An apostle is a (religious) messenger and ambassador so every prophet is also an Apostle of God but I guess you didn't know that

tell me when was the word “APOSTLE “was invented ??

Moses was a prophet says the scriptures ,would you try to be better than the scriptures ??

do you know the difference between a Apostle and a prophet

you deal with Imams right what is a Imam

Pierre

[terraricca]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,17:37)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 01 2012,10:06) Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,14:56) By the way God can say “WE” and refer to Himself or Himself and others because that is the nature of the word ALMIGHTY in other words God is ALL the powers that be. Just like YHVH has a meaning such as the Self Existing One to be such a being you would uniquely have to have ALL that is Powerful. So God is not a Man or a Woman and He transcends life and death God is The Powers i.E.  Elohim http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim Elohim (אֱלהִים) is a grammatically singular or plural noun for “god” or “gods” in both modern and ancient Hebrew language. When used with singular verbs and adjectives elohim is usually singular, “god” or especially, the God. ……………………………………………….. Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God bod Quote Notice how I have already stated here that ALLAH also means The God yeah you just forgot the word FALLS in front of it , like I told you, you can talk for years to come BUT YOU NEVER WILL BE ABLE TO MAKE THE LIES OF MUHAMMAD INTO A TRUTH OF JEHOVAH GOD,THE GOD OF ABRAHAM ,ISAAC,JACOBS,ISRAEL,DAVID,JESUS THE TRUE MESSIAH AND SON OF GOD, Pierre I will not be responding to your posts any longer unless God directs me to and the reason is you have called me a liar and have ignored any reasonable attempts to communicate with love and honesty. God Bless you and may God help you learn the truth that I have shared with you.

Bod

my answer on this is ;;

2Co 11:13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ.
2Co 11:14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.

Pierre

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 01 2012,11:01)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 31 2011,13:26) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 30 2011,14:36) Hi BD, Do you now accept that Jesus was dead, and that YHVH resurrected him? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Will you please answer my question; OK? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Are you going to answer my question now? B'shem YHVH

Ed

It only appeared that Jesus was Crucified and Killed it was not this way as it was so revealed

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,13:33)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 01 2012,11:01) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 31 2011,13:26) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 30 2011,14:36) Hi BD, Do you now accept that Jesus was dead, and that YHVH resurrected him? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Will you please answer my question; OK? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Are you going to answer my question now? B'shem YHVH Ed It only appeared that Jesus was Crucified and Killed it was not this way as it was so revealed

Hi my friend:

Please read, and may God give you understanding:

1Cr 15:1 ¶ Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;  

1Cr 15:2   By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.  

1Cr 15:3   For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;  

1Cr 15:4   And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:  

1Cr 15:5   And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:  

1Cr 15:6   After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.  

1Cr 15:7   After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.  

1Cr 15:8   And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.  

1Cr 15:9   For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.  

1Cr 15:10   But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which [was bestowed] upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.  

1Cr 15:11   Therefore whether [it were] I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.  

1Cr 15:12 ¶ Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?  

1Cr 15:13   But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:  

1Cr 15:14   And if Christ be not risen, then [is] our preaching vain, and your faith [is] also vain.  

1Cr 15:15   Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.  

1Cr 15:16   For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:  

1Cr 15:17   And if Christ be not raised, your faith [is] vain; ye are yet in your sins.  

1Cr 15:18   Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.  

1Cr 15:19   If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.  

1Cr 15:20 ¶ But now is Christ risen from the dead, [and] become the firstfruits of them that slept.  

1Cr 15:21   For since by man [came] death, by man [came] also the resurrection of the dead.  

1Cr 15:22   For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.  

1Cr 15:23   But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.  

1Cr 15:24   Then [cometh] the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.  

1Cr 15:25   For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.  

1Cr 15:26   The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.  

1Cr 15:27   For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under [him, it is] manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.  

1Cr 15:28   And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.  

1Cr 15:29 ¶ Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?  

1Cr 15:30   And why stand we in jeopardy every hour?  

1Cr 15:31   I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.  

1Cr 15:32   If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.  

1Cr 15:33   Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.  

1Cr 15:34   Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak [this] to your shame.  

1Cr 15:35 ¶ But some [man] will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?  

1Cr 15:36   [Thou] fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:  

1Cr 15:37   And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other [grain]:  

1Cr 15:38   But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.  

1Cr 15:39   All flesh [is] not the same flesh: but [there is] one [kind of] flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, [and] another of birds.  

1Cr 15:40   [There are] also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial [is] one, and the [glory] of the terrestrial [is] another.  

1Cr 15:41   [There is] one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for [one] star differeth from [another] star in glory.  

1Cr 15:42   So also [is] the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:  

1Cr 15:43   It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:  

1Cr 15:44   It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.  

1Cr 15:45   And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.  

1Cr 15:46   Howbeit that [was] not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.  

1Cr 15:47   The first man [is] of the earth, earthy: the second man [is] the Lord from heaven.  

1Cr 15:48   As [is] the earthy, such [are] they also that are earthy: and as [is] the heavenly, such [are] they also that are heavenly.  

1Cr 15:49   And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.  

1Cr 15:50 ¶ Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth co
rruption inherit incorruption.  

1Cr 15:51   Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,  

1Cr 15:52   In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.  

1Cr 15:53   For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality.  

1Cr 15:54   So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.  

1Cr 15:55   O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?  

1Cr 15:56   The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.  

1Cr 15:57   But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.  

1Cr 15:58   Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,13:33)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 01 2012,11:01) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 31 2011,13:26) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 30 2011,14:36) Hi BD, Do you now accept that Jesus was dead, and that YHVH resurrected him? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Will you please answer my question; OK? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Are you going to answer my question now? B'shem YHVH Ed It only appeared that Jesus was Crucified and Killed it was not this way as it was so revealed

Hi BD,

Why do you believe such deception?

“evil men and seducers shall wax worse
and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.” (2Tm.3:13)

B'shem
YHVH

[bodhitharta]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 01 2012,13:55)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 01 2012,13:33) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 01 2012,11:01) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 31 2011,13:26) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 30 2011,14:36) Hi BD, Do you now accept that Jesus was dead, and that YHVH resurrected him? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Will you please answer my question; OK? B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Are you going to answer my question now? B'shem YHVH Ed It only appeared that Jesus was Crucified and Killed it was not this way as it was so revealed Hi my friend: Please read, and may God give you understanding: 1Cr 15:1 ¶ Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;   1Cr 15:2   By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.   1Cr 15:3   For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;   1Cr 15:4   And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:   1Cr 15:5   And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:   1Cr 15:6   After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.   1Cr 15:7   After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.   1Cr 15:8   And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.   1Cr 15:9   For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.   1Cr 15:10   But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which [was bestowed] upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.   1Cr 15:11   Therefore whether [it were] I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.   1Cr 15:12 ¶ Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?   1Cr 15:13   But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:   1Cr 15:14   And if Christ be not risen, then [is] our preaching vain, and your faith [is] also vain.   1Cr 15:15   Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.   1Cr 15:16   For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:   1Cr 15:17   And if Christ be not raised, your faith [is] vain; ye are yet in your sins.   1Cr 15:18   Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.   1Cr 15:19   If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.   1Cr 15:20 ¶ But now is Christ risen from the dead, [and] become the firstfruits of them that slept.   1Cr 15:21   For since by man [came] death, by man [came] also the resurrection of the dead.   1Cr 15:22   For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.   1Cr 15:23   But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.   1Cr 15:24   Then [cometh] the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.   1Cr 15:25   For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.   1Cr 15:26   The last enemy [that] shall be destroyed [is] death.   1Cr 15:27   For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under [him, it is] manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.   1Cr 15:28   And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.   1Cr 15:29 ¶ Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?   1Cr 15:30   And why stand we in jeopardy every hour?   1Cr 15:31   I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.   1Cr 15:32   If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.   1Cr 15:33   Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.   1Cr 15:34   Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak [this] to your shame.   1Cr 15:35 ¶ But some [man] will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?   1Cr 15:36   [Thou] fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:   1Cr 15:37   And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other [grain]:   1Cr 15:38   But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.   1Cr 15:39   All flesh [is] not the same flesh: but [there is] one [kind of] flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, [and] another of birds.   1Cr 15:40   [There are] also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial [is] one, and the [glory] of the terrestrial [is] another.   1Cr 15:41   [There is] one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for [one] star differeth from [another] star in glory.   1Cr 15:42   So also [is] the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:   1Cr 15:43   It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:   1Cr 15:44   It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.   1Cr 15:45   And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.   1Cr 15:46   Howbeit that [was] not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.   1Cr 15:47   The first man [is] of the earth, earthy: the second man [is] the Lord from heaven.   1Cr 15:48   As [is] the earthy, such [are] they also that are earthy: and as [is] the heavenly, such [are] they also that are heavenly.   1Cr 15:49   And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.   1Cr 15:50 ¶ Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.   1Cr 15:51   Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,   1Cr 15:52   In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.   1Cr 15:53   For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality.   1Cr 15:54   So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.   1Cr 15:55   O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?   1Cr 15:56   The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.   1Cr 15:57   But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.   1Cr 15:58   Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord. Love in Christ, Marty

This entire piece you have here is concerned whther the dead rise from the grave and those who doubt it. Many people had already risen from the dead so this was a matter of talking about faith, don't you remember Lazarus? Apparently Paul had never heard of that miracle

[terraricca]

Bod

Look at the scriptures in red,but you still would not accept scriptures because your falls book comes first,just like Mormons ,and their Joseph smith ,and the Jews there traditions ,men made corruption

We all pick according to what is in our hearts is it ,

Pierre

[942767]

Hi BD:

The scripture states that the wages of sin is death which means spiritual separation from God, and all men have sinned, and so what we will have earned by breaking God's Laws is spiritual separation from Him. If Jesus had not obeyed God without sin even unto death, and was not consequently raised from the dead by God then there is no resurrection from the dead.

Yes, there have been some who have been raised from the dead but not unto eternal life.

In the scriptures pertaining to Lazarus Jesus stated:

Quote

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: Jhn 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

Christians die a physical death every day.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Ed J]

Hi BD, here is why you need you own personal Pentecost…

Romans 8:11 But if the [HolySpirit] of him(YHVH) that raised up [Jesus Christ] from the dead dwell in you, he(YHVH) that
raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his [HolySpirit] that dwelleth in you.
“Thy dead men shall live, together with my(Jesus') dead body shall they arise.” (Isaiah 26:19)

B'shem (in the Name of)
YHVH (the everlasting God)

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 02 2012,15:00)

Hi BD, here is why you need you own personal Pentecost… Romans 8:11 But if the [HolySpirit] of him(YHVH) that raised up [Jesus Christ] from the dead dwell in you, he(YHVH) that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his [HolySpirit] that dwelleth in you. “Thy dead men shall live, together with my(Jesus') dead body shall they arise.” (Isaiah 26:19) B'shem (in the Name of) YHVH (the everlasting God)

ED

Do you believe in an actual resurrection? You seem to think of resurrection as symbolic I believe in an actual resurrection and I believe the Holy Spirit goes to dwell where it chooses as Jesus said:

John 3:8
The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Now is this what you mean by personal pentecost? If so I have already had it years ago

[terraricca]

bod

Quote

so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Now is this what you mean by personal pentecost? If so I have already had it years ago ————–

a Muslim ? this would mean that all the Sadducee in Jesus time receive the holy spirit as well

were is that written

Pierre

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 02 2012,15:00)

Hi BD, here is why you need you own personal Pentecost… Romans 8:11 But if the [HolySpirit] of him(YHVH) that raised up [Jesus Christ] from the dead dwell in you, he(YHVH) that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his [HolySpirit] that dwelleth in you. “Thy dead men shall live, together with my(Jesus') dead body shall they arise.” (Isaiah 26:19) B'shem YHVH

Hi BD,

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57)

ED (1)Do you believe in an actual resurrection? (2)You seem to think of resurrection as symbolic (3)I believe in an actual resurrection and (4)I believe the Holy Spirit goes to dwell where it chooses as Jesus said: John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

1) 1Cor.15:12-17
2) You seem to think Christ (according to BD) wasn't resurrected, NOT ME!
3) Yet Christ's resurrection, you are taught to reject because of the 'book of fraud'; right ?
4) John 3:8 is referring to God's spirit filled children (Rom.8:16); something else you are taught to reject.

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57)

(5)Now is this what you mean by personal pentecost? If so I have already had it years ago

5) You obviously have no clue as to what it means to have YHVH tabernacling in you. (2Cor.6:16)

B'shem (in the Name of)
YHVH (the everlasting God)

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 03 2012,09:29)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 02 2012,15:00) Hi BD, here is why you need you own personal Pentecost… Romans 8:11 But if the [HolySpirit] of him(YHVH) that raised up [Jesus Christ] from the dead dwell in you, he(YHVH) that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his [HolySpirit] that dwelleth in you. “Thy dead men shall live, together with my(Jesus') dead body shall they arise.” (Isaiah 26:19) B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57) ED (1)Do you believe in an actual resurrection? (2)You seem to think of resurrection as symbolic (3)I believe in an actual resurrection and (4)I believe the Holy Spirit goes to dwell where it chooses as Jesus said: John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. 1) 1Cor.15:12-17 2) You seem to think Christ (according to BD) wasn't resurrected, NOT ME! 3) Yet Christ's resurrection, you are taught to reject because of the 'book of fraud'; right ? 4) John 3:8 is referring to God's spirit filled children (Rom.8:16); something else you are taught to reject. Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57) (5)Now is this what you mean by personal pentecost? If so I have already had it years ago 5) You obviously have no clue as to what it means to have YHVH tabernacling in you. (2Cor.6:16) B'shem (in the Name of) YHVH (the everlasting God)

Lazarus was resurrected, right? Before the time you say that Jesus was resurrected right?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 29 2011,21:26)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 30 2011,10:36) Asana, I feel exactly the same about Revelation.  In fact, I've posted that it seems each generation is able to fill in the blanks according to what is happening in their own time period.   And this goes on and on, generation after generation.  For all we know, this stuff might not happen for another 10,000 years. Anyway, that seems a weak reason to deny Jesus meant it when he said “I was dead”.  I don't see where that statement of past fact would have any bearing on the following visions of things to come. Okay , I can accept that but that would mean I still can't know the context of time in which Jesus would make the statement or the symbolism of his statement

We know that the churches to whom Jesus was speaking were in existence at the time wrote down the revelation, right?

If he spoke to an already existing church, and identified himself as the one who was dead, but is now alive, then I'd guess that he was speaking of being dead, past tense, in the lifetime of John.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 03 2012,11:29)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 29 2011,21:26) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 30 2011,10:36) Asana, I feel exactly the same about Revelation.  In fact, I've posted that it seems each generation is able to fill in the blanks according to what is happening in their own time period.   And this goes on and on, generation after generation.  For all we know, this stuff might not happen for another 10,000 years. Anyway, that seems a weak reason to deny Jesus meant it when he said “I was dead”.  I don't see where that statement of past fact would have any bearing on the following visions of things to come. Okay , I can accept that but that would mean I still can't know the context of time in which Jesus would make the statement or the symbolism of his statement We know that the churches to whom Jesus was speaking were in existence at the time wrote down the revelation, right? If he spoke to an already existing church, and identified himself as the one who was dead, but is now alive, then I'd guess that he was speaking of being dead, past tense, in the lifetime of John.

That is true so I will concede that the vision is centered around that time from there I can only say that if John had the preconceived notion that Jesus was dead his vision would also reflect that but I would also conclude that if we hold it within that context all talk of the Antichrist, beast and False prophet was within the mind of John as certain people at that time and could not apply to the future.

But let me make one thing really clear I don't believe that salvation relies on Jesus being dead, killed or crucified. I believe that Salvation comes by the Grace of God and I believe that believing in Jesus means to believe in what he said his mission was to do:

Matthew 9:13
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Mark 2:17
When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 5:32
I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 24:47

King James Version (KJV)

47And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

This is what the Quran teaches and what I believe

We gave Moses the Book and followed him up with a succession of apostles; We gave Jesus the son of Mary Clear (Signs) and strengthened him with the holy spirit. Is it that whenever there comes to you an apostle with what ye yourselves desire not, ye are puffed up with pride?- Some ye called impostors, and others ye slay!
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #87)

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,09:59)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 03 2012,09:29) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 02 2012,15:00) Hi BD, here is why you need you own personal Pentecost… Romans 8:11 But if the [HolySpirit] of him(YHVH) that raised up [Jesus Christ] from the dead dwell in you, he(YHVH) that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his [HolySpirit] that dwelleth in you. “Thy dead men shall live, together with my(Jesus') dead body shall they arise.” (Isaiah 26:19) B'shem YHVH Hi BD, Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57) ED (1)Do you believe in an actual resurrection? (2)You seem to think of resurrection as symbolic (3)I believe in an actual resurrection and (4)I believe the Holy Spirit goes to dwell where it chooses as Jesus said: John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. 1) 1Cor.15:12-17 2) You seem to think Christ (according to BD) wasn't resurrected, NOT ME! 3) Yet Christ's resurrection, you are taught to reject because of the 'book of fraud'; right ? 4) John 3:8 is referring to God's spirit filled children (Rom.8:16); something else you are taught to reject. Quote (bodhitharta @ Jan. 03 2012,03:57) (5)Now is this what you mean by personal pentecost? If so I have already had it years ago 5) You obviously have no clue as to what it means to have YHVH tabernacling in you. (2Cor.6:16) B'shem (in the Name of) YHVH (the everlasting God) Lazarus was resurrected, right? Before the time you say that Jesus was resurrected right?

Hi BD,

So now you do admit that Jesus was resurrected? (1Cor.15:17)

1Cor.15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain;
ye are yet in your sins.

B'shem (in the Name of)
YHVH (the everlasting God)

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