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Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:04 ) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,05:41)
All things are not persons, but all persons are things.
Hi Mike,Is God 'a thing' to you, you do call him 'a person' right? …please answer
Ed, my answer is in the very post you quoted.Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:04 ) Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Did all of these things become flesh and dwell on earth with the glory of ONE only begotten of God?
This question is utter nonsense!1) The HolySpirit is “The Word”
2) Jesus and the HolySpirit are not things
3) The Glory of the HolySpirit was seen in his Son Jesus.You are not 'Hitler', no-one has to bow to your slighted questions.
If they do, then T8 said we can say “I don't know”! …so STOP your abusive nonsense!
I agree it is nonsense Ed, but not MY nonsense. It is YOU who said GOD HIMSELF became flesh. Remember? You even tried to quote 1 Timothy as support, right?And it was YOU who said the Holy Spirit became flesh, right?
And it was YOU who said Jesus became flesh, right?
And it was YOU who said the Word became flesh, right?
Now that's four different things that became flesh Ed. But since you think the Word IS the Holy Spirit, then it leaves three things that became flesh, right?
Oh, but you also think God IS the Holy Spirit OF God, who IS the Word OF God, right? So now we're down to only two things that became flesh: Jesus Christ, and his Father, who apparently is: God, the Holy Spirit of God, and the Word of God all in one.
Do I have it right yet, Ed? Only two things became flesh and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten, but one of those two things is really three things in and of itself? Is that it?
Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:06) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,05:43)
And do you suppose that God was “dead” in the beginning? Or just having an “out of body experience”?
Hi Mike,Neither
Then there was no reason to state that God's essence was with God in the beginning, was there?Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26) It is YOU who said GOD HIMSELF became flesh. Remember?
Hi Mike,I said no such thing.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,05:43) Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,12:24) Hi Mike, 1) Jesus: “I came out from God” (John 16:27)
2) The Comforter: “I will send unto you from the Father” (John 15:26)God bless
Ed J
THE COMFORTER said those words, Ed? Or was it JESUS saying he would SEND the comforter?
Hi Mike,Jesus
Then why did you list it as if Jesus said #1, and the comforter said #2?Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26) (1)And it was YOU who said the Holy Spirit became flesh, right? (2)And it was YOU who said Jesus became flesh, right?
(3)And it was YOU who said the Word became flesh, right?
(4) Now that's four different things that became flesh Ed. (5)But since you think the Word IS the Holy Spirit, then it leaves three things that became flesh, right?
Hi Mike, thank you this approach is much better!1) Yes
2) Yes
3) I said the HolySpirit was the word. …covered in question #14) Only two, and they are not things, remember.
5) NopeGod bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26) (1)Oh, but you also think God IS the Holy Spirit OF God, who IS the Word OF God, right? (2)So now we're down to only two things that became flesh: Jesus Christ, and his Father, who apparently is: (3)God, the Holy Spirit of God, and the Word of God all in one. (4)Do I have it right yet, Ed? (5)Only two things became flesh and dwelled on earth with the glory of God's only begotten, (6)but one of those two things is really three things in and of itself? Is that it?
Hi Mike,1) Are we not in agreement here?
2) Jesus and God's HolySpirit.
3) Please explain?4) Not yet
5) You're back to nonsensical questions again.
6) Huh?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:28) Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,05:43) Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,12:24) Hi Mike, 1) Jesus: “I came out from God” (John 16:27)
2) The Comforter: “I will send unto you from the Father” (John 15:26)God bless
Ed J
THE COMFORTER said those words, Ed? Or was it JESUS saying he would SEND the comforter?
Hi Mike,Jesus
Then why did you list it as if Jesus said #1, and the comforter said #2?
Hi Mike,Sorry, I didn't mean it to be taken that way.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ June 11 2012,13:08) Quote (terraricca @ June 11 2012,06:06) who quoted 1Tm 3;16 ?
Me, why?
eddywhat are we dancing here
??Hi MB,
Are you surprised at the complexity of the Spirit of God?
Does it not satisfy your yet carnal mind?hi MB,
The complexity of the Spirit does give you the opportunity to appear clever using verses against each other.
But is that wise?Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26) (1)Oh, but you also think God IS the Holy Spirit OF God, who IS the Word OF God, right?
1) Are we not in agreement here?
Ed, how can you seem to know what I'm saying in #1, but then play dumb about the same thing later:Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26)
(6)but one of those two things is really three things in and of itself?
6) Huh?Do you think that God IS the Holy Spirit of God? YES.
Do you think that the Word IS the Holy Spirit of God? YES.
Do you think that God is the Word of God? YES.
Therefore, your understanding is that TWO became flesh. ONE of those TWO was Jesus Christ.
And the OTHER of those TWO was the entity that is all THREE of the following:
1) God
2) The Holy Spirit OF God
3) The Word OF GodAm I understanding you correctly yet?
Nick,
When you're able to acknowledge the undeniable FACT that John 1:1c can be faithfully translated as “God”, or “a god”, I'll be ready to move on with you.
Until then, leave me alone. Your posts are mindless fluff.
Hi MB,
The WORD is OF the Spirit of God.
God is more than the Word.All who expose your shallowness speak mindless fluff?
Nick,
The following is a post I made to Ed yesterday. Read the first supersized, bolded part. That is what I'm still waiting for from you: Your acknowledgment of something you can't possibly deny, because it is a simple, undeniable FACT of Greek to English translation.
Then, read the last supersized, bolded part. This is my challenge to you. I've briefly outlined my understanding of Jesus being the Word who became flesh, and how it aligns PERFECTLY with all the other scriptures in the Bible. Can you read my outline and show me SCRIPTURALLY where I am in error?
Hi Ed,
Even though you didn't come right out and answer my question, I gather that you understand and accept that there are three ways to translate John 1:1c.
And that is all I was after from you and Nick in the first place. Because once you acknowledge that it CAN be faithfully translated as “a god”, then it comes down to which translation makes the most sense and aligns with the rest of the scriptures.
For me, the Word being a god who was with the God in the beginning makes perfect sense and aligns with every scripture in the Bible. It explains how the Word was MADE flesh, meaning he was existing not as flesh, but then was made flesh. And that matches PERFECTLY with Phil 2, where Paul speaks of Jesus existing in the form of God before being made into a human being.
It also explains how Jesus could have had glory alongside his God before the world even began. And how he could say, “I came down from heaven”. And how scripture can speak of the universe being created through him – invisible things in heaven, and visible things on earth.
It matches Micah 5, which speaks of his origins being “from the ancient past”. It matches him saying that no man has seen God except for the man who came from God. It matches Paul saying, “The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven”.
In fact, my understanding aligns PERFECTLY will all 50 scriptures we've listed in the Pre-Existent Database thread.
But what about YOUR understanding? First, it calls for God to have become flesh. Second, it calls for the “flesh God” to have the glory of the Son of God – as if God begot HIMSELF. Third:
John 6
38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me.How could “God” have come down from heaven, NOT to do God's will, but to do God's will?
These are just off the top of my head, Ed. In a matter of two minutes, I have proved your understanding to not only be nonsensical, but unscriptural as well.
Let's see you do that with MY understanding. List any single scripture in the entire Bible that would refute my understanding of Jesus being the Word who became flesh and had the glory of God's only begotten.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,09:40) Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26) (1)Oh, but you also think God IS the Holy Spirit OF God, who IS the Word OF God, right?
1) Are we not in agreement here?
Ed, how can you seem to know what I'm saying in #1, but then play dumb about the same thing later:Quote (Ed J @ June 10 2012,13:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,06:26)
(6)but one of those two things is really three things in and of itself?
6) Huh?(A)Do you think that God IS the Holy Spirit of God? YES.
(B)Do you think that the Word IS the Holy Spirit of God? YES.
(C)Do you think that God is the Word of God? YES.
(D)Therefore, your understanding is that TWO became flesh. (E)ONE of those TWO was Jesus Christ.
(F)And the OTHER of those TWO was the entity that is all THREE of the following:
1) God
2) The Holy Spirit OF God
3) The Word OF GodAm I understanding you correctly yet?
Hi Mike,A) Yes
B) Yes
C) “The Word” was God (Past tense)D) The HolySpirit and Christ
E) Christ was ChristF) 2 & 3 are God's HolySpirit
1 “The Word” was God (Past tense)Do you understand my post?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,10:00) Hi Ed, Even though you didn't come right out and answer my question, I gather that you understand and accept that there are three ways to translate John 1:1c.
Hi Mike,Not so.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,10:00) John 6
38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me.How could “God” have come down from heaven, NOT to do God's will, but to do God's will?
Hi Mike,John 6:38 is about Christ.
John 1:1 is about God's HolySpiritQuote (mikeboll64 @ June 11 2012,10:00)
Let's see you do that with MY understanding. List any single scripture in the entire Bible that would refute my understanding of Jesus being the Word who became flesh and had the glory of God's only begotten.
Hi Mike,“The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his(HolySpirit's)
glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father” (John 1:14)“And the glory which thou(Father) gavest me I have given them;
that they may be one, even as we are one” (John 17:22)the glory as of the only begotten of the Father (John 1:14) com-
pared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. (Romans 8:18)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
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