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Gen! What about all these scriptures
John 17:5 “And now, O Father, glory Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the WORLD WAS.John 6:62 ” What then if you should see THE SON OF MAN ASCEND WHERE HE WAS BEFORE. (He WAS THERE BEFORE)
Col. 1: 15 ” He is the image of the invisible God, the FIRSTBORN over all creation.
verse 16 ” For by Him all things were created that are visible and invisible, whether thrones or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.verse 17 ” And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.”
verse 18 ” And He is the head of the Church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead,
THAT IN ALL THINGS HE MAY HAVE THE PREEMINENCE. (meaning first)HEBREW 1: 2 ” Has in the last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has APPOINTED HEIR OF ALL THINGS, THROUGH WHOM ALSO HE MADE THE WORLDS;
Rev. 3:14 ” …. THESE THINGS SAYS THE AMEN, THE FAITHFUL AND TRUE WITNESS, THE BEGINNING OF THE CREATION OF GOD.
Gen I have given these scriptures before and please look at them a little closer, I know I did not want to except this either, but these are clear cut scriptures, how can you or anybody else say that that is just a thought in God's mind. I just read that at all that way. No disrespect intended, Gen.
Abraham knew the Messiah. He celebrated His coming. Abraham knew Y'shua was his salvation.
How did Abraham know these things? They were given to him to know through faith and worshiping our Creator, on His appointed days and seasons.
Quote (Laurel @ Aug. 22 2007,12:13) Abraham knew the Messiah. He celebrated His coming. Abraham knew Y'shua was his salvation. How did Abraham know these things? They were given to him to know through faith and worshiping our Creator, on His appointed days and seasons.
Right on Laurel,This is how Abraham knew:
Gen 22:8 Abraham said, “God will provide for Himself the lamb for the burnt offering, my son.” So the two of them walked on together.
Gen 22:9 Then they came to the place of which God had told him; and Abraham built the altar there and arranged the wood, and bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood.
Gen 22:10 Abraham stretched out his hand and took the knife to slay his son.
Gen 22:11 But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.”
Gen 22:12 He said, “Do not stretch out your hand against the lad, and do nothing to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me.”
Gen 22:13 Then Abraham raised his eyes and looked, and behold, behind him a ram caught in the thicket by his horns; and Abraham went and took the ram and offered him up for a burnt offering in the place of his son.
Gen 22:14 Abraham called the name of that place The LORD Will Provide, as it is said to this day, “In the mount of the LORD it will be provided.”
Gen 22:15 Then the angel of the LORD called to Abraham a second time from heaven,
Gen 22:16 and said, “By Myself I have sworn, declares the LORD, because you have done this thing and have not withheld your son, your only son,
Gen 22:17 indeed I will greatly bless you, and I will greatly multiply your seed as the stars of the heavens and as the sand which is on the seashore; and your seed shall possess the gate of their enemies.
Gen 22:18 “In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice.”Gen 22:18 was the promise of the Messiah, because Yahshua died for ALL THE NATIONS OF THE WORLD (John 3:16). And note that Abraham said God would provide the lamb, but a ram took Isaac's place that day. The lamb came 2000 years ago and forever took the place on Isaac and all other people that have walked the earth.
Laurel…..Kejonn is right on this sister. think about it.that's how Abraham saw Jesus' day, it wasn't because Jesus acqually was there. He hadn't been born yet, but the plan was from the beginning of the foundations of the earth.
peace sister……geneMany souls slain for the word of God; lambs to the salughter ;these are of the dust creation; In their chambers (souls preserved; by the word of God delivered from the one called faithful and true; the Loin from the tribe Judah; amongest the Lambs;whom gave the covenent of new Life; Only for the hope in the coming of salvation; and the Christ is the first of the new creation; salvation come; making an end also to the power of death; which he shall be the first born of the dead;That shall rise again; and show the power of death he destroyed.
Rev 6:9 ¶ And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they [were], should be fulfilled. 12 ¶ And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
My thoughts of Abrahams suffering; and his cause of actions before God.
Abraham”s promise was that the Nations would come from him
He sent one child into the desert; with his mother; at the Hand of Gods mercy;they be saved; a great sacrifice; and he clave to Sarah,
Abraham came to the knowledge from one mother would come seed; good and bad e.g.; Jacob I love; Esau I hate; in this he put Isaac on the alter; before hand
Offering Him to God to take him; his Life even; in this asurrance would come confidence; be so ;he did not want to destroy the earth contributing; as he had seen the width of the breach and wickedness nation to rise from The father of Lies; whom from the beginning had joined him self with eve to have Inheritance in the Nations to come;THAT God flooded the earth; in great sorrow regreating; due to from the daughters of men having children;(the giants)
Abraham's dieing wish was that; God chose his sons wife; not in the Land he had come unto(cainaan) but from the Land of his Fathers house; and there at the well as they prayed; God brought her forward to join them; Taking care to hear God over the seed to come; and she was united with Isaac;
Jacob was not so lucky; he was deceived into a wife first; and from him came the twelve mixed seed tribes; to war; for the fights over the inheritance; Esau gave Jacob some of his seed to go with him; they mixed again; but the grace of God each one has the promise; to be as Abraham; and understand this great evil; and be saved and purified by the truth.Quote (t8 @ Aug. 21 2007,16:57) To Gene. Yes he was foreordained to have first place in all things.
But that is not why I think he pre-existed.
I think so because of a number of other scriptures.
I'll give you a good one now..
John 8:58
“I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”“I am” is used by Trinitarians to equate one with YHWH. I think this is false because “I am” is used by Gabriel and men in scripture. It simply means something like “I exist”. Or “that is me”.
Jesus said that he was or existed before Abraham. He didn't say that the memory existed before Abraham, but that he existed.
Jesus said it himself. In fact the reply come after the Jews said:
“You are not yet fifty years old,” the Jews said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”
t8. Maybe you think it is just a coincidence. (Wishful thinking)
Look at Jesus's words.Joh 8:58 Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham came into being, I AM!
Jesus used the words “I AM” not “I was.” If you had even a basic understanding of grammar you would know that “I AM” is not the same as I was. So don't put the twist on Jesus's words.
Exo 3:14 And God said to Moses, I AM THAT I AM. And He said, So you shall say to the sons of Israel, I AM has sent me to you.
There you are. Jesus is the Lord God; the great I AM.
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
.
Jesus said:
Joh 8:24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins.
(MKJV)Exo 3:14 And God said to Moses, I AM THAT I AM. And He said, So you shall say to the sons of Israel, I AM has sent me to you
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
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CB;
Since you believe that Jesus is the Great I am, how is it that Jesus said God was his Father? Christ said, perhaps more than any other statement, that the Father sent him. What you are saying contradicts what Jesus said because you are stating that God came himself, he did not send his son. Do you see how what you believe contradicts what the gospel teaches? The fact that Christ was sent from the Father is a central truth in the New Testament. In order for a person to be sent at least two parties are necessary; the sender and the person sent. Your perspective on the Godhead contradicts a multitude of scriptures. The Son pre-existed with the Father, but is not the Father. You need to let the scriptures do the talking. I would appreciate a nice cut and paste on scriptures which talk about Christ being sent from God the Father. If you notice I don't just say how incorrect you are, but show you specifically how you are incorrect and summarize what the scriptures say.
Take care.
Steven
Quote (Mr. Steve @ Aug. 28 2007,11:34) CB; Since you believe that Jesus is the Great I am, how is it that Jesus said God was his Father? Christ said, perhaps more than any other statement, that the Father sent him. What you are saying contradicts what Jesus said because you are stating that God came himself, he did not send his son. Do you see how what you believe contradicts what the gospel teaches? The fact that Christ was sent from the Father is a central truth in the New Testament. In order for a person to be sent at least two parties are necessary; the sender and the person sent. Your perspective on the Godhead contradicts a multitude of scriptures. The Son pre-existed with the Father, but is not the Father. You need to let the scriptures do the talking. I would appreciate a nice cut and paste on scriptures which talk about Christ being sent from God the Father. If you notice I don't just say how incorrect you are, but show you specifically how you are incorrect and summarize what the scriptures say.
Take care.
Steven
Steven.Those statements are only in the context of Christ's incarnation and his office as Messiah. The following still applies.
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Jesus said:
Joh 8:24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins.
(MKJV)Exo 3:14 And God said to Moses, I AM THAT I AM. And He said, So you shall say to the sons of Israel, I AM has sent me to you
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
.
John 18:5-6 “They answered Him, “Jesus the Nazarene.” He said to them, “I am.” And Judas also, the one who betrayed Him, was standing with them. Therefore when He said to them, “I am,” they went backwards and fell upon the ground.”
Why did they fall over backwards when Jesus used the name of Almighty God as His own? The divine name of “I AM”. And why would the soldiers fall backwards if not for the awesomeness of the words of Jesus?
Look again! It's in your face!
Therefore when He said to them, “I am,” they went backwards and fell upon the ground.”
What did Jesus say to them that forced them backward onto the ground. He used the divine name I AM in reference to Himself.
He was telling them that He was God, using the name Jehovah Himself had revealed to Moses at the burning bush, “I AM.” He could have made no stronger claim of deity.
As these words were uttered by Jesus, the mob staggered back; and the priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, dropped powerless to the ground. Their wicked hearts filled with terror. They could not for a moment stand upon their feet in the presence of the Divine Glory, and they fell like dead men to the ground.Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Jesus said
John 8:24 …for if ye believe not that I am, ye shall die in your sins.Jesus Himself laid down the line – unless one believes Him for whom He says He is – the great I AM – one will die in one's sins. There is no salvation in a false Christ. If we are to be united with Christ to have eternal life, then we must be united with the true Christ, not a false representation. It is out of love that Christ uttered John 8:24. We would do well to heed His words.
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
CB;
When Christ said “I am he” and they fell down to the ground, he purposely released his power and caused them to be blown away. There are many times in the gospel when Jesus said I am and no one moved.
With respect to scriptures that refer to Christ's incarnation and his office as Messiah, Christ makes no such clarification. Such clarification is man's interpretation to make the scriptures fit mans doctrine.
Christ is the Son of God. He was incarnated. He is the messiah. Before either of the later two he was the Son of God.
Remember all the times when the demons called Christ the Son of God, the Holy One of God. Are you telling me that they only said he was the Son of God in context to Christ as Messiah?
When Christ prayed to the Father and said he longed to be with the Father again in the glory he had before the world was, Jesus makes it clear that he existed with God as the Son of God before the world was.
In another place Christ said ye shall see the Son of man ascended to where he (the Son of God) was before. Jesus also said he is the only one that has ever seen God. John 6:46.
Jesus also said I (the Son of God) came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him who sent me. You like to accuse me of twisting, but how can you make any other interpretation other than Christ existed with the Father and was sent by him? Where is the twist. You are twisting when you add you reasoning to what Christ said and state he only said that because he was the Messiah or because he was incarnated. That is because the trinity teaches that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit have co-existed for eternity and are equal in all respects. Such claims deviate substantially from what the scriptures teach. Christ taught just the opposite that God the Father was his God. That truth is everywhere in the New Testament. You have to twist and twist to make Christ eternally equal with the Father. It's just not there. Christ is the Son of God. He is begotten by God the Father sometime before the foundation of the world. Otherwise, he cannot be the Son, he would be God himself. We know he is not God himself because he said God was his Father, making himself the Son of God. The Father himself said this is my Son. The Father did not say this is myself. If God wanted to reveal himself he could have by saying what he said to Abraham, I am the Almighty God. Or when he spoke to Moses, tell them I am that I am hath sent you. God spoke himself in times past and by his prophets but in the last times he spoke to us through his Son.
So if you're going to accuse me of twisting, please prove it by showing my error and correcting me by scripture.
Steven
Take Care
Steven
Quote When Christ said “I am he” and they fell down to the ground, he purposely released his power and caused them to be blown away. There are many times in the gospel when Jesus said I am and no one moved. Christ did not say “I am he”. Christ said I AM.
The word he is in italics in some Bibles, meaning that it was supplied by the translators and do not belong in the original Greek.Look again
Joh 18:5 They answered Him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus said to them, I AM! And Judas who betrayed Him also stood with them.
Joh 18:6 Then as soon as He had said to them, I AM, they went backward and fell to the ground.
(MKJV)Why did they fall over backwards when Jesus used the name of Almighty God as His own? The divine name of “I AM”. And why would the soldiers fall backwards if not for the awesomeness of the words of Jesus?
Look again! It's in your face!
Joh 18:6 Then as soon as He had said to them, I AM, they went backward and fell to the ground. (MKJV)
What did Jesus say to them that forced them backward onto the ground. He used the divine name I AM in reference to Himself.
He was telling them that He was God, using the name Jehovah Himself had revealed to Moses at the burning bush, “I AM.” He could have made no stronger claim of deity.
As these words were uttered by Jesus, the mob staggered back; and the priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, dropped powerless to the ground. Their wicked hearts filled with terror. They could not for a moment stand upon their feet in the presence of the Divine Glory, and they fell like dead men to the ground.Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
(MKJV)Jesus said
Joh 8:24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins.
(MKJV)Jesus Himself laid down the line – unless one believes Him for whom He says He is – the great I AM – one will die in one's sins. There is no salvation in a false Christ. If we are to be united with Christ to have eternal life, then we must be united with the true Christ, not a false representation. It is out of love that Christ uttered John 8:24. We would do well to heed His words.
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
when they the soldiers as who was Jesus , Jesus said I AM, and the reason they fell back had nothing to do with the word I AM , they fell back in a defencieve mode, remember Jesus had the deciples with Him, the soldiers were expecting a Battle. It say they came out against Him slaves and Swords they fully expected a battle, in fact Peter even cut the ear of of one of them. If Jesus was meanning He was God He would have simply said it. You trinitarinas always try to make a Mystery out of things. When Jesus said I am he simple meant thats who he was. but again another twisting of scritpure to force the text to come out that Jesus was God.
Cultbuster……> you need to apply 2PETER 3:16 to yourself , because your the one twisting things up not US.
Your are so blind you can't even realize that a matter so important as Jesus being God would not have been neglected by Jesus or the deciples in their writtings. You have to rely on vage and unspecific scriptures to force your Lies. It only shows your blindness to the simple truth.
Go bust your own cult you belong to up, you would be doing all of us a service as well as God and Jesus. YOU use 2Peter3:16 to accuse us error, but then satan always was an accuser of the brethern wasn't he. Your trinitarian brain wash job won't work here, for greater is the truth in us than in you. ….geneGene wrote:Quote when they the soldiers as who was Jesus , Jesus said I AM, and the reason they fell back had nothing to do with the word I AM , they fell back in a defencieve mode, remember Jesus had the deciples with Him, the soldiers were expecting a Battle. It say they came out against Him slaves and Swords they fully expected a battle, in fact Peter even cut the ear of of one of them. If Jesus was meanning He was God He would have simply said it. You trinitarinas always try to make a Mystery out of things. When Jesus said I am he simple meant thats who he was. but again another twisting of scritpure to force the text to come out that Jesus was God.
Gene. That is funny
Do you really believe that the highly trained battle hardened Roman soldiers would take fright at a small group of humble Galileans. That's JW stuff!
I'm sorry, but I have to laugh
LOOK AGAIN!
Joh 18:5 They answered Him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus said to them, I AM! And Judas who betrayed Him also stood with them.
Joh 18:6 Then as soon as He had said to them, I AM, they went backward and fell to the ground.
(MKJV)Why did they fall over backwards when Jesus used the name of Almighty God as His own? The divine name of “I AM”. And why would the soldiers fall backwards if not for the awesomeness of the words of Jesus?
Look again! It's in your face!
[/b]Joh 18:6 Then as soon as He had said to them, I AM, they went backward and fell to the ground. [/B] MKJV
What did Jesus say to them that forced them backward onto the ground. He used the divine name I AM in reference to Himself.
He was telling them that He was God, using the name Jehovah Himself had revealed to Moses at the burning bush, “I AM.” He could have made no stronger claim of deity.
As these words were uttered by Jesus, the mob staggered back; and the priests, elders, soldiers, and even Judas, dropped powerless to the ground. Their wicked hearts filled with terror. They could not for a moment stand upon their feet in the presence of the Divine Glory, and they fell like dead men to the ground.Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. MKJV
Jesus said
Joh 8:24 Therefore I said to you that you shall die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins MKJVJesus Himself laid down the line – unless one believes Him for whom He says He is – the great I AM – one will die in one's sins. There is no salvation in a false Christ. If we are to be united with Christ to have eternal life, then we must be united with the true Christ, not a false representation. It is out of love that Christ uttered John 8:24. We would do well to heed His words.
2Pe 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable pervert, as also they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Gene Balthrop
Quote Your are so blind you can't even realize that a matter so important as Jesus being God would not have been neglected by Jesus or the deciples in their writtings. You have to rely on vage and unspecific scriptures to force your Lies. It only shows your blindness to the simple truth. Gene. Maybe you are blind and vague to the following:
Isa 9:6 For to us a Child is born, to us a Son is given; and the government shall be on His shoulder; and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us,JOHN 5:17-18 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. (18) Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
MATTHEW 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Compare
Psa 45:6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre
With
Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever:a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.Compare
Psa 41:13 Blessed be the LORD (Jehovah) God of Israel from everlasting, and to everlasting. Amen, and Amen.
With
MICAH 5:2 But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, {though} thou be little among the thousands of Judah, {yet} out of thee shall he come forth unto me {that is} to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth {have been} from of old, from everlasting.JOHN 5:23 That all {men} should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father.
JOHN 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.
John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am
Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.Compare
1 CHRONICLES 28:9 . . . the Lord searcheth all hearts, and understandeth all the imaginations of the thoughts:
With
MATTHEW 9:4 And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, Wherefore think ye evil in your hearts?
MATTHEW 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, . . .
REVELATION 2:23 . . . I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: . . .Compare
DANIEL 9:9 To the Lord our God {belong} mercies and forgivenesses, though we have rebelled against him;
LUKE 5:21 And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, Who is this which speaketh blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?
With
LUKE 5:20 And when he saw their faith, he said unto him, Man, thy sins are forgiven thee.
MARK 2:5-10 When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee. (6) But there were certain of the scribes sitting there, and reasoning in their hearts, (7) Why doth this {man} thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?Compare
Isa 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.
With
Mat 3:3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.Compare
1Sa 2:2 There is none holy as the LORD (Jehovah): for there is none beside thee: neither is there any rock like our God.
Psa 78:35 And they remembered that God was their rock, and the high God their redeemer.
With
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.Mal 3:6 For I am the LORD (yhovah), I change not;
Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.PSALM 148:1-2 Praise ye the Lord. Praise ye the Lord from the heavens: praise him in the heights. (2) Praise ye him, all his angels : praise ye him, all his hosts.
HEBREWS 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.DEUTERONOMY 10:17 For the Lord your God {is} God of Gods, and Lord of Lords, a great God, . . . {cf. Ps 136:2-3, 1 Tim 6:15}
REVELATION 17:14 . . . the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: . . .{cf. Rev 19:16}PSALM 62:12 . . . unto thee, O Lord, {belongeth} mercy: for thou renderest to every man according to his work. {cf. Is 40:10}
MATTHEW 16:27 For the Son of man shall . . . reward every man according to his works.ROMANS 7:22 . . . the law of God . . . {cf. Ps 19:7}
GALATIANS 6:2 . . . fulfil the law of Christ.ROMANS 8:9 . . . the Spirit of God. . .
+ROMANS 8:9 . . . the Spirit of Christ, .. .*TITUS 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
+ACTS 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.*ISAIAH 43:11 I, {even} I, {am} the Lord (Jehovah); and beside me {there is} no saviour.
*LUKE 1:47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
+LUKE 2:11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.
2 PETER 1:1 . . . God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
Mat 1:21 And she shall bear a son, and you shall call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins*ISAIAH 40:10 Behold, the Lord God will come with strong {hand}, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward {is} with him, and his work before him.
2 THESSALONIANS 1:7-8 . . . the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, (8) In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:Psa 50:6 And the heavens shall declare his righteousness; For God is judge himself. Selah
Psa 7:8 The LORD (Jehovah) shall judge the people: judge me, O LORD, according to my righteousness, and according to mine integrity that is in me.
ECCLESIASTES 12:14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether {it be} good or whether {it be} evil.
JOHN 5:22,27 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son . . . (27) And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.Act 7:59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.
Act 7:60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep. (Stephen kneeling and praying to Jesus)Phi 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phi 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Phi 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.Joh 7:42 Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out
of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
2Ti 2:8 Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:
Jer 23:5-6 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch (Jesus), and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD (Jehovah)OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.COLOSSIANS 2:9-10 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:TITUS 2:13 awaiting our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Saviour Jesus Christ
CB If Jesus would be God the Almighty all other scriptures that say that the Father is greater then the Son, that the Head of the Church is Christ, and the Head of Christ is the Father, would contradict each other. That I do not believe. You will have to remember that God is a Title and I have said that before, but you seem to want to believe what you think and give a lot of scriptures that tells us to. Worship Jesus because He is King of Kings and Lord of Lords, but not to the degree that we will worship our Heavenly Father. And I don't believe Christ would ever want us to.
You also really not quoting the right way when you say in
Romans 8:9 The spirit of Christ…..
There is only one Holy Spirit the Spirit of God the Father.
Ephesians 4:4-6 ONE BODY, ONE SPIRIT,(HOLY) ONE LORD, (JESUS) ONE FAITH, ONE BAPTISM,
ONE FATHER OF ALL, WHO IS ABOVE ALL AND THROUGH US ALL, AND IN US ALL.If you put Jesus above the Father, that is wrong to do, as far as I can see.
Peace and Love Mrs.:(
Quote (Cult Buster @ Aug. 27 2007,01:00) t8. Maybe you think it is just a coincidence. (Wishful thinking)
Look at Jesus's words.
Joh 8:58 Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham came into being, I AM!Jesus used the words “I AM” not “I was.” If you had even a basic understanding of grammar you would know that “I AM” is not the same as I was. So don't put the twist on Jesus's words.
“I am” is a translation from Greek words “ego eimi”. Is the mere utterance of “ego eimi” a blasphemy? Does the use of “ego eimi” automatically identify the speaker as Yahweh, the I AM?In Luke 1:19, the angel Gabriel said, “Ego eimi Gabriel.” In John 9:9, the blind man whose sight was restored by Jesus said, “Ego eimi.” In Acts 10:21, Peter said, “Behold, ego eimi (I am) he whom ye seek.” Obviously, the mere use of “ego eimi” does not equate one to the “I Am” of Exodus 3:14.
According to your theory, you also have to believe that Gabriel, Peter, and a blind man were God too. So that adds 3 more members to your Trinity. You now have a Sextinity.
The more you try to teach your heresy the more confusion you create for yourself. One lie leads to another and so on.
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